Thread: ATTN: Floyd Haters The Proof is in the Pudding Folks The Numbers Dont Lie!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by jbirdy

which is bassically what i just said though isn't it mate. i'm not denying mayweather's skill and all the tallent and all the rest of the bull shit i've talked about a thousand times (i do regard him as the best boxer in the world at the moment). and i just ten minutes ago in the post you just tried to use against me stated that mayweather did 'school' baldomir and he did come out with the win the way that most thought he would (via massive UD). but the point i'm making is that mayweather likes to big himself up as the man but he didn't show much in terms of balls in doin exactly what i thought he would do and beating a man that no one ever even gave a chance to.

Maybe you are looking for the roots, where two guys sit on rocks and take turns hitting each other until one of the falls over and repeat. Me personally, I think PBF showed what he's best at...............BOXING.

Ok Majesty, i see your point,

But would you rather watch a PRIME Tyson or Lennox ?

Say, Riddick Bowe was the opponent!

Or would you prefer to watch Juan manuel Marquez? or Paquiao ?

My pick would be Paq & Tyson.

This is my taste though, although i appreciate the 'sweet science' too, my feelings are that i'm in the majority.

Originally Posted by Majesty

Originally Posted by JT Rock

Originally Posted by zhubin

Originally Posted by Gyrokai

Bragging about a Carlos Baldomir win is just horrible in boxing.

It really is. When supposed P for P is counting for his fanatics to support a Baldomir win.
Floyd did what he was supposed to do. What would have been surprising is knock Carlos out.

Pitter Pat your way to a victory and EXPECT criticism.
Tiger Woods leaves when your still fighting... expect it.
Charles leaves, expect it.
Crowd boos, expect it.
PPV numbers low, expect it.

Floyd can con his fans, but he won't con me. I know what an elite fighter is... Floyd Mayweather.
But I also know what a true B*d*ss is too. Let me just say Pernell Whitaker is above Floyd.
Roy is above Floyd. Hell, I'd even rate the careers of Morales above Floyd. hahaaha
I know I got a few stomachs turning with that one. But I can name many great names on
Morales' resume. And let me just say, I love Castillo but he ain't no Barrera or Pacquiao...
and may the boxing gods look down on you if you compare Castillo to Chavez or Duran.

Someone who speaks the truth. What some people are failing to realize is that almost everyone can agree Floyd is talented. He just doesn't have the resume to be considered anywhere close to an all time great. People keep bringing up Gatti and Baldo. Two fighters who where perfect for Floyd....slow and not particularly skilled. Anyone with some knowledge knew they didn't have a chance. It's a joke for anyone, including Floyd, to point to these wins as a major accomplishment. The man has been coasting recently...and he and his fans think that most of us are STUPID enough to seriously think he is an all time great. You can show me a million stats JT...it boils down to the level of your competition. Floyd is trying so hard to be an all time great, an icon, a legend.....but he just does not have anything to back it up. He isn't particularly popular, doesn't have the humour or charisma, has no defining point to his career....and most importantly...unlike the true all time greats...he simply has not fought great fighters. Whether that's his fault or not is debatable. But he has no right to think he can be mentioned in the same breath as a Sugar Ray Robinson or an Ali or so many other greats. RIGHT NOW, he is just a very talented fighter. End of.

Yes sir!!! I'm stupid sir!!!!

Since we bring up resume's.

Floyd wasnt and isnt around in a time where there are Duran's running around the divisions or Leonards' or Hearns' and he shouldnt NOT be considered a great because of the time he's in.

Facts are this, he fought who he had to beat in the divisions and came up and fought everyone that people said would beat him. And I say unless there has been one opponent that 100 percent of people watching the event would say "Floyd is going to win this so easily" Then hush about how he hasn't fought anyone. There were people picking against him in his last 8 or so fights and he won. Nobody nowhere put 100 to none odds that Floyd would win. And most of the time it was because they wanted that "one punch" to land and when it doesn't they say that Floyd fought a nobody.

Floyd's era in this era Floyd has fought hte best the divisions had to offer.

People say Hatton the only name on his resume is Tszyu and when he went up to MAKE a fight with Mayweather he nearly got dethrowned by Collazo.

Margarito is just getting annoying.

Baldomir was the Undisputed champ and regardless on how Floyd made him look the guy still beat Judah and stopped Gatti. And unless every person at the crowd and the betting tables was putting money on Floyd then they felt he would or could be beaten by Baldomir, and when he started dominating Baldomir so easily they got upset at Floyd.

For what? WINNING!?!

You talk about his resume, but honestly people, why fault Floyd for not being around in an era that produced 10 or potential champs a weight class like in Leonard and Hearns' days?

CC for being spot on.

Originally Posted by CityOfGod

Ok Majesty, i see your point,

But would you rather watch a PRIME Tyson or Lennox ?

Say, Riddick Bowe was the opponent!

Or would you prefer to watch Juan manuel Marquez? or Paquiao ?

My pick would be Paq & Tyson.

This is my taste though, although i appreciate the 'sweet science' too, my feelings are that i'm in the majority.

They all do what they do impressively and in their own style so I'd watch them all if I could.

Marquez and Lewis both do what they do very well and win their fights with it and have big wins because of it and each has the style neccessary to get those wins that they have.

Same is said for Tyson and Pacquiao.  I'd personally rather see someone win with their style to win rather then getting rid of all their advantages by trying to stand and trade and prove something and lose the fight.  You can look great but if you lose you won't be considered it. As long as they stay true to their style and win those defining fights with it they will always have my respect as a great fighter.

Know what I mean?

Originally Posted by jbirdy

shza i dunno how many hatton fights you've seen mate but it doesnt sound like youve followed him for a while because if you had you would know his chin, heart, work rate and pressure. mayweather hasnt got the firepower of tszyu and he hasnt got the firepower to keep hatton of him for 12 rounds.

collazo is not a puncher at all. 12 or 13 ko's. yet he deserved at least a draw with Hatton. why? because it's not "firepower" that you need to beat Hatton--it's technique. Collazo has reasonably good technique and no punching power and he was the better man that night. Mayweather is much faster, better technically, and better defensively than Collazo, and hits harder. Hatton's "chin" didn't look great against the feather-fisted Collazo either (nor did his face after the fight). Hatton is like an inferior version of Castillo, who will crush him if and when that fight happens.

Originally Posted by jbirdy

if youve followed floyd and hatton you would know that hatton would be all over him like a rash.
and if floyd was trying to become a legend he would be fighting the big boys out there.

I agree to some extent, but the unproven Ricky Hatton ain't "one of the big boys." He's got one victory against a name, a sloppy victory in a dirty and very close fight against an over-the-hill Kostya Tszyu, who had a shoulder injury going into the fight serious enough to require immediate surgery afterward, and who was coming off of a 2-year layoff. Castillo and Coralles were both bigger challenges. Mosely is the only fighter I can see being competitive with Floyd, but I think he's too old at this point. Other than him, I'm not sure what "big boys" you're talking about. More unproven guys with one good (but past his prime) name on their resume like Hatton? Margarito? Paul Williams? Cotto? Explain to me how beating any of those guys would make Floyd "great" if you don't believe he already is--none of them is as good as Castillo, who he's already beaten.

Originally Posted by shza

Originally Posted by jbirdy

shza i dunno how many hatton fights you've seen mate but it doesnt sound like youve followed him for a while because if you had you would know his chin, heart, work rate and pressure. mayweather hasnt got the firepower of tszyu and he hasnt got the firepower to keep hatton of him for 12 rounds.

collazo is not a puncher at all. 12 or 13 ko's. yet he deserved at least a draw with Hatton. why? because it's not "firepower" that you need to beat Hatton--it's technique. Collazo has reasonably good technique and no punching power and he was the better man that night. Mayweather is much faster, better technically, and better defensively than Collazo, and hits harder. Hatton's "chin" didn't look great against the feather-fisted Collazo either (nor did his face after the fight). Hatton is like an inferior version of Castillo, who will crush him if and when that fight happens.

Originally Posted by jbirdy

if youve followed floyd and hatton you would know that hatton would be all over him like a rash.
and if floyd was trying to become a legend he would be fighting the big boys out there.

I agree to some extent, but the unproven Ricky Hatton ain't "one of the big boys." He's got one victory against a name, a sloppy victory in a dirty and very close fight against an over-the-hill Kostya Tszyu, who had a shoulder injury going into the fight serious enough to require immediate surgery afterward, and who was coming off of a 2-year layoff. Castillo and Coralles were both bigger challenges. Mosely is the only fighter I can see being competitive with Floyd, but I think he's too old at this point. Other than him, I'm not sure what "big boys" you're talking about. More unproven guys with one good (but past his prime) name on their resume like Hatton? Margarito? Paul Williams? Cotto? Explain to me how beating any of those guys would make Floyd "great" if you don't believe he already is--none of them is as good as Castillo, who he's already beaten.

CC to anyone that can give me the following stats

In Hatton vs. Tszyu

How many times did Ricky Low Blow KT?
How many times did Ricky hold and hit KT?
How many times did Ricky clinch KT?
How many times did Ricky get arm locks on KT?

Originally Posted by JT Rock

So c'mon rake on them to but you wont cause your hating...C'mon admit it

I will admit I'm a Floyd "hater," if you admit your a Floyd Puppet.

I like Floyd's style better than roy jones jr's style. RJJ has loads of talent. but most of the time his fighting style bores me to death.

Originally Posted by killersheep

Originally Posted by shza

Originally Posted by jbirdy

shza i dunno how many hatton fights you've seen mate but it doesnt sound like youve followed him for a while because if you had you would know his chin, heart, work rate and pressure. mayweather hasnt got the firepower of tszyu and he hasnt got the firepower to keep hatton of him for 12 rounds.

collazo is not a puncher at all. 12 or 13 ko's. yet he deserved at least a draw with Hatton. why? because it's not "firepower" that you need to beat Hatton--it's technique. Collazo has reasonably good technique and no punching power and he was the better man that night. Mayweather is much faster, better technically, and better defensively than Collazo, and hits harder. Hatton's "chin" didn't look great against the feather-fisted Collazo either (nor did his face after the fight). Hatton is like an inferior version of Castillo, who will crush him if and when that fight happens.

Originally Posted by jbirdy

if youve followed floyd and hatton you would know that hatton would be all over him like a rash.
and if floyd was trying to become a legend he would be fighting the big boys out there.

I agree to some extent, but the unproven Ricky Hatton ain't "one of the big boys." He's got one victory against a name, a sloppy victory in a dirty and very close fight against an over-the-hill Kostya Tszyu, who had a shoulder injury going into the fight serious enough to require immediate surgery afterward, and who was coming off of a 2-year layoff. Castillo and Coralles were both bigger challenges. Mosely is the only fighter I can see being competitive with Floyd, but I think he's too old at this point. Other than him, I'm not sure what "big boys" you're talking about. More unproven guys with one good (but past his prime) name on their resume like Hatton? Margarito? Paul Williams? Cotto? Explain to me how beating any of those guys would make Floyd "great" if you don't believe he already is--none of them is as good as Castillo, who he's already beaten.

CC to anyone that can give me the following stats

In Hatton vs. Tszyu

How many times did Ricky Low Blow KT?
How many times did Ricky hold and hit KT?
How many times did Ricky clinch KT?
How many times did Ricky get arm locks on KT?

1,Ricky hit KT once below the belt line, and this was on purpose due to KT hitting Ricky twice below the belt up to that point. ( watch the fight again).
2, As many times as KT held and hit Ricky ( but did you see KT complain ? )
3, Again just as much as what KT did. ( i did see Floyd tie up Baldi too when in close )
4, As much as it took to win the fight ( i didnt like the fact PBF ran all night against Baldi, just the style of the fighter, but once again KT NEVER complained about any of the above after the fight)

When has PBF ever fought someone ranked in the top 3 P4P at the time of the fight ?
Ricky has, against KT.

The point was shza, that when Ricky went in with a naturally bigger guy, he actually went at him instead of running around the ring. Now i'm guessing you have never seen alot of Hatton's fight's. You probably have not seen the Tackie, Magee, Thaxton, Phillips fights, to name but a few. If you had then i dont think you would think as you do about him, unless of course your just a hater and carnt appreciate the boxing skills he has.

Originally Posted by Gyrokai

Bragging about a Carlos Baldomir win is just horrible in boxing.

It really is. When supposed P for P is counting for his fanatics to support a Baldomir win.
Floyd did what he was supposed to do. What would have been surprising is knock Carlos out.

He sure did...he beat the champion & that's what counts. I'll bet your'e a Margarito fan aren't you? Didn't he beat Santos? No...waitaminute...NEXT!

Originally Posted by Gyrokai

Pitter Pat your way to a victory and EXPECT criticism.
Tiger Woods leaves when your still fighting... expect it.
Charles leaves, expect it.
Crowd boos, expect it.
PPV numbers low, expect it.

Tiger Woods is a fwockin golfer...so let that bitch leave...true boxing fans knew that that was a good fight & that Floyd won.

Had Oscar fought the same fight everyone would cream in their pants...ko or not...you people should just admit to your hate.

Originally Posted by Gyrokai

Floyd can con his fans, but he won't con me. I know what an elite fighter is... Floyd Mayweather.
But I also know what a true B*d*ss is too. Let me just say Pernell Whitaker is above Floyd.
Roy is above Floyd. Hell, I'd even rate the careers of Morales above Floyd. hahaaha
I know I got a few stomachs turning with that one. But I can name many great names on
Morales' resume. And let me just say, I love Castillo but he ain't no Barrera or Pacquiao...
and may the boxing gods look down on you if you compare Castillo to Chavez or Duran.

Floyd's not conning his fans...& I'm sure he's really out there pulling a Mission Impossible 4 & trying to con you. Christ...the guy won. He moved up & beat THE man...when & if he fights Margarito & beats him...what will you say then?

Love all those fighters you want. I love them too...but let's not forget he beat Castillo & Corrales & IWO...he'd beat the great Barrera.

Originally Posted by Mattyhitman

Bang on mate

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh blah! Your'e a Hatton fan...so just bang on & clap about Hatton beating 1 name fighter while he runs back down to 140 instead of ripping into Floyd's accomplishments & the many champions that he has defeated.

Thats quite right Wacko, i am a Hatton fan, among other's. And that is my opinion which im entitled too.
I also apprecite the slick boxing skills Floyd has and i dont hate him for that. What i dont like is the fact he calls himself P4P No1, when in fact he has never fought anyone in the P4P rankings or anyone even close to being in the P4P ranking's. He has not shown me the heart of a champion. He has shown me he can box on the back foot and and has great footwork. But im afraid that doesnt make him P4P no1 in MY book. Sorry dude

It make's me laugh that some people think Ricky is running away from the Welter division. He isnt. He does not belong there with the style he fights with. So call him as much as you want, but on the day he meets Floyd and beats him then we will see who is the true peoples Champion.

Originally Posted by Mattyhitman

Thats quite right Wacko, i am a Hatton fan, among other's. And that is my opinion which im entitled too.
I also apprecite the slick boxing skills Floyd has and i dont hate him for that. What i dont like is the fact he calls himself P4P No1, when in fact he has never fought anyone in the P4P rankings or anyone even close to being in the P4P ranking's. He has not shown me the heart of a champion. He has shown me he can box on the back foot and and has great footwork. But im afraid that doesnt make him P4P no1 in MY book. Sorry dude

It make's me laugh that some people think Ricky is running away from the Welter division. He isnt. He does not belong there with the style he fights with. So call him as much as you want, but on the day he meets Floyd and beats him then we will see who is the true peoples Champion.

Originally Posted by Mattyhitman

Thats quite right Wacko, i am a Hatton fan, among other's. And that is my opinion which im entitled too.
I also apprecite the slick boxing skills Floyd has and i dont hate him for that. What i dont like is the fact he calls himself P4P No1, when in fact he has never fought anyone in the P4P rankings or anyone even close to being in the P4P ranking's. He has not shown me the heart of a champion. He has shown me he can box on the back foot and and has great footwork. But im afraid that doesnt make him P4P no1 in MY book. Sorry dude

It make's me laugh that some people think Ricky is running away from the Welter division. He isnt. He does not belong there with the style he fights with. So call him as much as you want, but on the day he meets Floyd and beats him then we will see who is the true peoples Champion.

The funny thing is that you rate KT as p4p because he beat who? Zab Judah, Sharmba Mitchell and who?
Don't get me wrong, I have tons of respect for KT, one of my all-time faves. But come-on, floyd has fought the better competition overall.

Originally Posted by killersheep

Originally Posted by Mattyhitman

Thats quite right Wacko, i am a Hatton fan, among other's. And that is my opinion which im entitled too.
I also apprecite the slick boxing skills Floyd has and i dont hate him for that. What i dont like is the fact he calls himself P4P No1, when in fact he has never fought anyone in the P4P rankings or anyone even close to being in the P4P ranking's. He has not shown me the heart of a champion. He has shown me he can box on the back foot and and has great footwork. But im afraid that doesnt make him P4P no1 in MY book. Sorry dude

It make's me laugh that some people think Ricky is running away from the Welter division. He isnt. He does not belong there with the style he fights with. So call him as much as you want, but on the day he meets Floyd and beats him then we will see who is the true peoples Champion.

The funny thing is that you rate KT as p4p because he beat who? Zab Judah, Sharmba Mitchell and who?
Don't get me wrong, I have tons of respect for KT, one of my all-time faves. But come-on, floyd has fought the better competition overall.

KT was rated P4P by many in boxing at the time. Look back at the records and see for ya self. The guys KT beat were then beaten later by Floyd. Floyd took on KT's defeated fighters, Judah, Mitchell, and actually took longer to do it. Many people say KT was past it, over the hill etc after the fight with Hatton. But he managed to dispatch Judah and Mitchell quicker than what Floyd did.

Originally Posted by Mattyhitman

Originally Posted by killersheep

Originally Posted by Mattyhitman

Thats quite right Wacko, i am a Hatton fan, among other's. And that is my opinion which im entitled too.
I also apprecite the slick boxing skills Floyd has and i dont hate him for that. What i dont like is the fact he calls himself P4P No1, when in fact he has never fought anyone in the P4P rankings or anyone even close to being in the P4P ranking's. He has not shown me the heart of a champion. He has shown me he can box on the back foot and and has great footwork. But im afraid that doesnt make him P4P no1 in MY book. Sorry dude

It make's me laugh that some people think Ricky is running away from the Welter division. He isnt. He does not belong there with the style he fights with. So call him as much as you want, but on the day he meets Floyd and beats him then we will see who is the true peoples Champion.

The funny thing is that you rate KT as p4p because he beat who? Zab Judah, Sharmba Mitchell and who?
Don't get me wrong, I have tons of respect for KT, one of my all-time faves. But come-on, floyd has fought the better competition overall.

KT was rated P4P by many in boxing at the time. Look back at the records and see for ya self. The guys KT beat were then beaten later by Floyd. Floyd took on KT's defeated fighters, Judah, Mitchell, and actually took longer to do it. Many people say KT was past it, over the hill etc after the fight with Hatton. But he managed to dispatch Judah and Mitchell quicker than what Floyd did.

Firstly, there are no other p4p welters ATM

The ring's ratings

POUND-FOR-POUND
This
week Last
Week Weeks
in
Ratings Fighter Weight Class
1 1 410 FLOYD MAYWEATHER Welterweight
2 2 135 WINKY WRIGHT Middleweight
3 3 153 MANNY PACQUIAO Jr. Lightweight
4 4 21 JERMAIN TAYLOR Middleweight
5 5 22 BERNARD HOPKINS Lt. Heavyweight
6 6 353 MARCO ANTONIO BARRERA Jr. Lightweight
7 7 44 RAFAEL MARQUEZ Bantamweight
8 8 76 RICKY HATTON Jr. Welterweight
9 9 57 JOSE LUIS CASTILLO Jr. Welterweight <========FLOYD FOUGHT HIM TWICE AND LOOK p4p
10 10 36 JOE CALZAGHE Super Middleweight

Boxrec's ratings

Lb for Lb
1 Floyd Mayweather Welterweight
2 Rafael Marquez Bantamweight
3 O'Neil Bell Cruiserweight
4 Ronald Wright Middleweight
5 Jermain Taylor Middleweight
6 Joe Calzaghe Super Middleweight
7 Israel Vazquez Super Bantamweight
8 Jose Luis Castillo Light Welterweight <============AGAIN
9 Celestino Caballero Super Bantamweight
10 Pongsaklek Wonjongkam Flyweight
11 Manny Pacquiao Super Featherweight
12 Juan Manuel Marquez Featherweight
13 Lorenzo Parra Flyweight
14 Jorge Arce Super Flyweight
15 Shane Mosley Light Middleweight
16 Vic Darchinyan Flyweight
17 Chris John Featherweight
18 Marco Antonio Barrera Super Featherweight
19 Antonio Tarver Light Heavyweight
20 Eagle Kyowa Minimumweight
21 Omar Andres Narvaez Flyweight
22 Juan Diaz Lightweight
23 Hozumi Hasegawa Bantamweight
24 Clinton Woods Light Heavyweight
25 Glen Johnson Light Heavyweight

So why do you not rate PBF as high as KT?

Their big fights

PBF
----------------------------
Jose Luis Castillo (twice)
Diego Corrales
Zab Judah
Sharmba Mitchell
Arturo Gatti
Jesus Chavez
DeMarcus Corley

KT
----------------------------
Sharmba Mitchell (twice)
Zab Judah
Julio Cesar Chavez
Ben Tackie
Vince Philips (Lost)
Ricky Hatton (Lost)

Titles held

PBF
-------------------------
WBC Super Featherweight
WBC Lightweight
WBC Light Welterweight
IBF Welterweight
WBC Welterweight
IBO Welterweight
IBA Welterweight

KT
---------------------------
WBC Light Welterweight
WBA Light Welterweight
IBF Light Welterweight

Records

PBF
----------------------------
37-0-0 (24 KOs)

KT
----------------------------
31-1-0 (25 KOs) (At the time of fighting Hatton)

So tell me how you can rate KT p4p and not PBF?