Thread: Pretty boy Mayweather and Cory Spinks won their fight because of Clean Punches

Pretty boy Mayweather and Cory spinks Won because of Clean Punches
By Mortz Marcelo Ortigoza

Philippines – Had Cory Spinks unbridled the mystery of Jermain Taylor that Bernard Hopkins and Winky Wright’s failed to do?
Most of the crowd that cordoned the ring and the boob tubes’ spectators thought so.
However, two of the three judges synonymously gave Taylor 115-113 split decision to retain his Junior Middleweight’s diadem.
In the said tussle, one could see the foxy Spinks outsmarted Taylor in most of the rounds by either hitting him with combination in a guerrilla mode of ambush, or by his unpredictable footwork as complimented by his weaving and bobbling.
It was déjà vu to what Floyd “Pretty boy” Mayweather, Jr. had done to Oscar dela Hoya last May 6, 2007.
Only the latter won, while the former lost.
However, the furor on both of these fights would forever haunts the way the roller-skate’s bugaboo of Sugar Ray Leonard-Roberto Duran and Sugar Ray Leonard-Marvin Haggler keeps the discussion among boxing aficionados’ alive.

Now here’s my query: Does the pugilist’s aggressiveness made the day, or it is the boxer’s defense and clean punches?
Taylor and dela Hoya were the predator in most of the rounds, but all the punches they unleashed were mostly duds.
While Spinks and Pretty boy whose defensive maneuvering made them the real dude because most of their volleys were clean punches.
The HBO’s compubox on the acrimonious Dela-Hoya-Mayweather’s post fight would attest on this.
The same story, I believed, with the Taylor-Spink’s brouhaha.
Clean Punches, Aggressiveness, Ring Generalship, and Defense (that I abbreviated as CARD) are the Ceteris Paribus ( All things are equal) of scoring.

If we oblige Spinks and Mayweather Jr. to fight tit-for-tat their opponent by disregarding defense through footwork and stick-and run, then Spinks and Mayweather (and even Roy Jones when he fought the bigger John Ruiz in the Heavyweight Division) would be instantly annihilated in the opening round, this at the expense of ticket and pay-per-view’s buyers.
Then the excitement of boxing as a mind game would never be the same again when smaller fighter out hustled the bigger ones.
Gee whiz, if we just bowed to the fist-waving advocates of all-aggressiveness’ crap, then boxing would become a mechanical game at the expense of intelligence.
Thus, pugilism will be no different to bar brawl.
It’s like banning foreplay in bed scenes. Man, we could not just go for the bull’s eye. We have first to savor excitement.

All aggressiveness boxing?
Boy, I could not do anythin’ but to rephrase Don McLean’s in American Pie: “But something touched me deep inside, the day the boxing game die, so… bye-bye Miss American Pie…

(Send comments at totomortz@yahoo.com)

No offense dude. But, you really don't know what you're talking about. First of all, you don't even know what the punch stats were for the Taylor/Spinks fight yet you claim that Spinks landed more clean punches. The fight was boring so I could see how you wouldnt really be paying attention. But, that was a really heart felt post you just wrote. As a matter of fact Cory Spinks only landed about 27% of his punches and he did'nt throw a whole lot. Jermain Taylor landed something like 43% of his punches he didnt throw alot either but he was by far the more accurate puncher of the two. Spinks makes it look nice but he really isnt doing anything and if you were really paying attention it was'nt that hard to see. I agree with you on the whole aggressiveness verse finesse school of thought. But, I would say that a combination of both is what makes a truly a good fighter and a truly good fight. Cory Spinks should fight opponents that he is not so afraid of getting hit by. Taylor should fight bigger guys. I watched the fight and I would say Cory Spinks can't beat anyone fighting that way. He can survive that way, but there is a reality television series for survivors. Even comparing Spinks weak effort to Floyd Mayweather's boxing clinic that he put on De La Hoya is an insult to Floyd's accomplishments. Floyd did'nt run, he exhibited great defensive skills and masterful punching accuracy. Floyd clocked De La Hoya and buckled his knees twice. He stood right in front of De La Hoya and beat him to the punch. Cory Spinks was not landing clean punches against Taylor. Floyd Mayweather was landing clean all night. Jermain Taylor did not look great in the Spinks fight, but he clearly won the fight. Anyone who thinks that Floyd Mayweather did'nt clearly and decisevly beat, out box, and out perform De La Hoya is in denial. The same is true for those who think that Spinks deserved the decision over Taylor.

Originally Posted by PL

No offense dude. But, you really don't know what you're talking about. First of all, you don't even know what the punch stats were for the Taylor/Spinks fight yet you claim that Spinks landed more clean punches. The fight was boring so I could see how you wouldnt really be paying attention. But, that was a really heart felt post you just wrote. As a matter of fact Cory Spinks only landed about 27% of his punches and he did'nt throw a whole lot. Jermain Taylor landed something like 43% of his punches he didnt throw alot either but he was by far the more accurate puncher of the two. Spinks makes it look nice but he really isnt doing anything and if you were really paying attention it was'nt that hard to see. I agree with you on the whole aggressiveness verse finesse school of thought. But, I would say that a combination of both is what makes a truly a good fighter and a truly good fight. Cory Spinks should fight opponents that he is not so afraid of getting hit by. Taylor should fight bigger guys. I watched the fight and I would say Cory Spinks can't beat anyone fighting that way. He can survive that way, but there is a reality television series for survivors. Even comparing Spinks weak effort to Floyd Mayweather's boxing clinic that he put on De La Hoya is an insult to Floyd's accomplishments. Floyd did'nt run, he exhibited great defensive skills and masterful punching accuracy. Floyd clocked De La Hoya and buckled his knees twice. He stood right in front of De La Hoya and beat him to the punch. Cory Spinks was not landing clean punches against Taylor. Floyd Mayweather was landing clean all night. Jermain Taylor did not look great in the Spinks fight, but he clearly won the fight. Anyone who thinks that Floyd Mayweather did'nt clearly and decisevly beat, out box, and out perform De La Hoya is in denial. The same is true for those who think that Spinks deserved the decision over Taylor.

A real boxing fan doesn't look at punchstats he uses his eyes

Originally Posted by toto

Pretty boy Mayweather and Cory spinks Won because of Clean Punches
By Mortz Marcelo Ortigoza

Philippines – Had Cory Spinks unbridled the mystery of Jermain Taylor that Bernard Hopkins and Winky Wright’s failed to do?
Most of the crowd that cordoned the ring and the boob tubes’ spectators thought so.
However, two of the three judges synonymously gave Taylor 115-113 split decision to retain his Junior Middleweight’s diadem.
In the said tussle, one could see the foxy Spinks outsmarted Taylor in most of the rounds by either hitting him with combination in a guerrilla mode of ambush, or by his unpredictable footwork as complimented by his weaving and bobbling.
It was déjà vu to what Floyd “Pretty boy” Mayweather, Jr. had done to Oscar dela Hoya last May 6, 2007.
Only the latter won, while the former lost.
However, the furor on both of these fights would forever haunts the way the roller-skate’s bugaboo of Sugar Ray Leonard-Roberto Duran and Sugar Ray Leonard-Marvin Haggler keeps the discussion among boxing aficionados’ alive.

Now here’s my query: Does the pugilist’s aggressiveness made the day, or it is the boxer’s defense and clean punches?
Taylor and dela Hoya were the predator in most of the rounds, but all the punches they unleashed were mostly duds.
While Spinks and Pretty boy whose defensive maneuvering made them the real dude because most of their volleys were clean punches.
The HBO’s compubox on the acrimonious Dela-Hoya-Mayweather’s post fight would attest on this.
The same story, I believed, with the Taylor-Spink’s brouhaha.
Clean Punches, Aggressiveness, Ring Generalship, and Defense (that I abbreviated as CARD) are the Ceteris Paribus ( All things are equal) of scoring.

If we oblige Spinks and Mayweather Jr. to fight tit-for-tat their opponent by disregarding defense through footwork and stick-and run, then Spinks and Mayweather (and even Roy Jones when he fought the bigger John Ruiz in the Heavyweight Division) would be instantly annihilated in the opening round, this at the expense of ticket and pay-per-view’s buyers.
Then the excitement of boxing as a mind game would never be the same again when smaller fighter out hustled the bigger ones.
Gee whiz, if we just bowed to the fist-waving advocates of all-aggressiveness’ crap, then boxing would become a mechanical game at the expense of intelligence.
Thus, pugilism will be no different to bar brawl.
It’s like banning foreplay in bed scenes. Man, we could not just go for the bull’s eye. We have first to savor excitement.

All aggressiveness boxing?
Boy, I could not do anythin’ but to rephrase Don McLean’s in American Pie: “But something touched me deep inside, the day the boxing game die, so… bye-bye Miss American Pie…

(Send comments at totomortz@yahoo.com)

What I bolded was BRILLIANT!!!!

Hey PL man, I didn't say there was a punchstats on the Cory Spinks- Jermain taylor brouhaha. Thus, where did you get your 47% hits for Taylor, 27 % hits for Spinks? Your conjecture. What I saw man was Spinks unleashed more punches and made them all landed against those from the apparently frustrated Taylor.

come on man. do you really believe that you have a point. I watched the fight and saw the punch stats. You said that Spinks landed the cleaner and more punches and that is not true. From what I observed Spinks only fought to survive and not to win. He expected to win because he survived and any "real boxing fan" would know that you don't win by merely surviving. You have to hit the guy you're fighting.

Well I feel that both Delahoya and Taylor deserved to keep their tittles. Taylor obviously did but Oscar was not as lucky. I think in close fights like these the champion deserves the benefit of the doubt espescialy when he is the one going forward and traying to make the fight. To sum it all up there is no way in hell that Spinks deserved to win the championship fighting the way he fought and any body who thinks otherwise should realy watch the fight again. As for oscar and Floyd it was a lot closer and fun to watch than the Taylor-spinks snoother but I felt as though Oscar should have atleast got the draw. I personaly had it 115-113 Delahoya but a draw would have been just. The bottom line is that in my oppinion it is the chalengers duty and responsability to go out and take the championship espescialy when you are dealing with two champions of the caliber of Jermaine and Oscar and I dont feel that neither Spinks or Mayweather did that.

Originally Posted by Majesty

Originally Posted by toto

Pretty boy Mayweather and Cory spinks Won because of Clean Punches
By Mortz Marcelo Ortigoza

Philippines – Had Cory Spinks unbridled the mystery of Jermain Taylor that Bernard Hopkins and Winky Wright’s failed to do?
Most of the crowd that cordoned the ring and the boob tubes’ spectators thought so.
However, two of the three judges synonymously gave Taylor 115-113 split decision to retain his Junior Middleweight’s diadem.
In the said tussle, one could see the foxy Spinks outsmarted Taylor in most of the rounds by either hitting him with combination in a guerrilla mode of ambush, or by his unpredictable footwork as complimented by his weaving and bobbling.
It was déjà vu to what Floyd “Pretty boy” Mayweather, Jr. had done to Oscar dela Hoya last May 6, 2007.
Only the latter won, while the former lost.
However, the furor on both of these fights would forever haunts the way the roller-skate’s bugaboo of Sugar Ray Leonard-Roberto Duran and Sugar Ray Leonard-Marvin Haggler keeps the discussion among boxing aficionados’ alive.

Now here’s my query: Does the pugilist’s aggressiveness made the day, or it is the boxer’s defense and clean punches?
Taylor and dela Hoya were the predator in most of the rounds, but all the punches they unleashed were mostly duds.
While Spinks and Pretty boy whose defensive maneuvering made them the real dude because most of their volleys were clean punches.
The HBO’s compubox on the acrimonious Dela-Hoya-Mayweather’s post fight would attest on this.
The same story, I believed, with the Taylor-Spink’s brouhaha.
Clean Punches, Aggressiveness, Ring Generalship, and Defense (that I abbreviated as CARD) are the Ceteris Paribus ( All things are equal) of scoring.

If we oblige Spinks and Mayweather Jr. to fight tit-for-tat their opponent by disregarding defense through footwork and stick-and run, then Spinks and Mayweather (and even Roy Jones when he fought the bigger John Ruiz in the Heavyweight Division) would be instantly annihilated in the opening round, this at the expense of ticket and pay-per-view’s buyers.
Then the excitement of boxing as a mind game would never be the same again when smaller fighter out hustled the bigger ones.
Gee whiz, if we just bowed to the fist-waving advocates of all-aggressiveness’ crap, then boxing would become a mechanical game at the expense of intelligence.
Thus, pugilism will be no different to bar brawl.
It’s like banning foreplay in bed scenes. Man, we could not just go for the bull’s eye. We have first to savor excitement.

All aggressiveness boxing?
Boy, I could not do anythin’ but to rephrase Don McLean’s in American Pie: “But something touched me deep inside, the day the boxing game die, so… bye-bye Miss American Pie…

(Send comments at totomortz@yahoo.com)

What I bolded was BRILLIANT!!!!

cc for that majesty i stopped reading halfway through nd spinks realy didnt land that many punches most just hit the gloves nd arms of taylor but then again taylor output was poor nd he could easily have lost his title nd as for the floyd he landed much more cleanly in the second half of the oscar fight although i though his output was quite poor aswell he was stepping up in weight unlike jermain who fighting the smaller man so i think both fights were hard to score nd one champ got the decision nd the other didnt .

First off,Spinks rarely landed,and almost never cleanly,he was out of his range for almost the entire fight
Secondly,the TV Talking Heads did NOT have Spinks winning the fight,they all had it going to Taylor

The Punch Stat connection percentage was actually 16% for Spinks and 32% for Taylor. And in my opinioin the fight between De La Hoya and Mayweather was not even close. Floyd spanked De La Hoya, he just isn't strong enough to really hurt him.

To drive my point that Spinks won that fight, allow me to quote dyed in the wool boxing experts' opinion:
This what Gabriel Montoya of DogHouse.com:
"Don’t get me wrong. Spinks boxed very well. In my opinion, he thoroughly outboxed Taylor who looked amateurish at times. But the fight was more frustrating than anything as Spinks provided the type of performance (sticking, moving, evading prolonged exchanges) that we all expected and Taylor seemed to barely show up. Standing flat-footed from start to finish and staring at a darting Spinks for prolonged periods of time through out the rounds, Taylor would barely assert himself enough to throw one or two punches at a time. He seemed frustrated, landing after the bell. In the corner, trainer Manny Steward kept urging Taylor on but to no avail. Taylor would always agree he had to let his hands go and then go straight back out and do the same thing he did in the previous round; stare at Spinks and try and hit him occasionally.

By the middle rounds, Taylor’s jab and right hand had made few appearances. When he did land on Spinks, it seemed to move Spinks and put him more on the defensive but it certainly wasn’t doing enough to set up a knock out or even solidify a decisive win.

The fight itself looked like a points sparring session with neither man really landing anything that mattered. It was perhaps the universes way of balancing out the carnage that was Pavlik/Miranda. It was so boring that I can’t even find enough violence in it to do a blow-by-blow report. Spinks boxed circles around Taylor to a point where Taylor seemed to stop fighting at times.

Now to be fair, when Taylor landed the shots were heavy. He did land some good right hands. And he moved forward all night while Spinks moved side-to-side, shoe shined with flurries, and fought Taylor off with combinations whenever Taylor got aggressive thus taming him a bit. In my opinion, Spinks was a puzzle unsolved by Taylor."

This what Steve Kim of Maxboxing.com had obeserved:
"Once again that seemed to be the case at the FedEx Forum in Memphis, TN, as many observers believed that Cory Spinks outboxed him over 12 rather dull and boring rounds that had the boo-birds flying around early.

Some of you can still call him 'Bad Intentions'. In my book - and many others’ - he's 1-4 in his last 5 outings. So I'll stick with 'Bad Decisions' for now. And no matter how badly his cheerleaders on HBO try and tell us how good he is or how it's never his fault his fights are unentertaining, the reality is that 'Bad Decisions' has stagnated, if not gone backwards, as a fighter.

Some will blame his Hall-of-Fame trainer, Emanuel Steward, whose voice went hoarse over the ineptitude and ineffectiveness he witnessed on Saturday night. But..."

And ohh, it's a pleasure for me to be furnished by stats from a compubox to justify my beef that Spinks won the fight.

i wish people would stop comparing spinks taylor to PBF DLH.

spinks as much as i wanted him to win did not land the cleaner punches in that fight. most of his shot were blocked and when did land there weren't that clean.

PBF landed more shots than DLH and landed the cleaner harder shots than DLH.