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Thread: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

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    Default The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    With his impending induction into the International Boxing Hall of Fame, I feel it apt to air my views on where Duran will ultimately be remembered. It is a little unfortunate that Duran's name is inextricably linked these days with Leonard, Hagler and Hearns (due in part to the excellent DVD "The Fabulous Four"). It is understandable then that some may compare the four and look at Duran's performances as being not so great... he lost 2/3 to Leonard, lost to Hagler and got knocked out (in spectacular fashion) by Hearns. His only redemption was in his epic introduction to the 'middle' weight (not middleweight!!) divisions against Ray Leonard in 'The Brawl in Montreal' (still one of the most exciting fights ever IMO!!). What sometimes escapes notice is that when he bagen fighting at welter weight (and higher) Duran was mixing in company 2 weight divisions higher and 10 years after his peak. He is guilty of complicating his legacy even further by going on to win 'world' titles at Junior Middleweight and Middleweight (he claims a 5th weight - Super Middleweight.. but it was only the NBA title he won), and fighting into his 50's (he reamains the only boxer to fight professionally in 5 different decades!!!).

    When remembering Roberto Duran I believe ultimately he will be remembered as the number one lightweight of all time.

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Does anyone have a link to the first SRL-Duran fight?

    Oh, Dav, Duran was a beast.

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Yes i will find it for you tommorow Unknowndonor as for Duran great Lightweight but he sometimes lost to fighters he shouldn't have like Kirkland Laing he totally outboxed Duran and Simms beat Duran aswell imo he is right where he should be in the opinions of the fans and where he is ranked.

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
    Yes i will find it for you tommorow Unknowndonor as for Duran great Lightweight but he sometimes lost to fighters he shouldn't have like Kirkland Laing he totally outboxed Duran and Simms beat Duran aswell imo he is right where he should be in the opinions of the fans and where he is ranked.
    Yeah... but that's exactly my point Ice! Duran lost to Kirkland Laing just after he lost to Wilfred Benitez... which was at Light Middleweight!! Duran was a lightweight -and the only guy he lost to at lightweight was Esteban de Jesus (which he later avenged). He lost alot of fights after he moved through the wieghts.... which is why I believe tha he will ultimately be remembered as a great (the greatest??) lightweight.

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav
    With his impending induction into the International Boxing Hall of Fame, I feel it apt to air my views on where Duran will ultimately be remembered. It is a little unfortunate that Duran's name is inextricably linked these days with Leonard, Hagler and Hearns (due in part to the excellent DVD "The Fabulous Four"). It is understandable then that some may compare the four and look at Duran's performances as being not so great... he lost 2/3 to Leonard, lost to Hagler and got knocked out (in spectacular fashion) by Hearns. His only redemption was in his epic introduction to the 'middle' weight (not middleweight!!) divisions against Ray Leonard in 'The Brawl in Montreal' (still one of the most exciting fights ever IMO!!). What sometimes escapes notice is that when he bagen fighting at welter weight (and higher) Duran was mixing in company 2 weight divisions higher and 10 years after his peak. He is guilty of complicating his legacy even further by going on to win 'world' titles at Junior Middleweight and Middleweight (he claims a 5th weight - Super Middleweight.. but it was only the NBA title he won), and fighting into his 50's (he reamains the only boxer to fight professionally in 5 different decades!!!).

    When remembering Roberto Duran I believe ultimately he will be remembered as the number one lightweight of all time.
    I agree.

    Duran was the greatest lightweight of all time.

    Lotsa people will remember him for "No Mas" but there morons. I will remember him for kicking the crap outta of Davy Moore after looking like a shot fighter losing against Kirkland Lang. And that obviously wasnt even his best weight or prime era.

    The Hearns KO was just brutal...like chopping a tree , but Duran just epitomized the great Latino fighter and his body of work is long and legendary. Congratulations "Manos De Piedra"
    you were one of a kind.

    I wouldn't give a cent for the other fighters. I saw Saad Muhammed and Julian Jackson and with all due respect the should just induct Duran.

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav
    Quote Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
    Yes i will find it for you tommorow Unknowndonor as for Duran great Lightweight but he sometimes lost to fighters he shouldn't have like Kirkland Laing he totally outboxed Duran and Simms beat Duran aswell imo he is right where he should be in the opinions of the fans and where he is ranked.
    Yeah... but that's exactly my point Ice! Duran lost to Kirkland Laing just after he lost to Wilfred Benitez... which was at Light Middleweight!! Duran was a lightweight -and the only guy he lost to at lightweight was Esteban de Jesus (which he later avenged). He lost alot of fights after he moved through the wieghts.... which is why I believe tha he will ultimately be remembered as a great (the greatest??) lightweight.
    Agreed

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav
    With his impending induction into the International Boxing Hall of Fame, I feel it apt to air my views on where Duran will ultimately be remembered. It is a little unfortunate that Duran's name is inextricably linked these days with Leonard, Hagler and Hearns (due in part to the excellent DVD "The Fabulous Four"). It is understandable then that some may compare the four and look at Duran's performances as being not so great... he lost 2/3 to Leonard, lost to Hagler and got knocked out (in spectacular fashion) by Hearns. His only redemption was in his epic introduction to the 'middle' weight (not middleweight!!) divisions against Ray Leonard in 'The Brawl in Montreal' (still one of the most exciting fights ever IMO!!). What sometimes escapes notice is that when he bagen fighting at welter weight (and higher) Duran was mixing in company 2 weight divisions higher and 10 years after his peak. He is guilty of complicating his legacy even further by going on to win 'world' titles at Junior Middleweight and Middleweight (he claims a 5th weight - Super Middleweight.. but it was only the NBA title he won), and fighting into his 50's (he reamains the only boxer to fight professionally in 5 different decades!!!).

    When remembering Roberto Duran I believe ultimately he will be remembered as the number one lightweight of all time.
    10 years after his prime was when Duran fought at welterweight? So he was prime in 1969-1970 when he was 18 years old? This is more ridiculous nonsense about Duran. He was prime in about 1977/1978 or so I think which would make 10 years after his prime in 1987-1988.. And he fought Ray in 1980.. And was Ray prime when he fought Duran? No,, not either time, Ray was inexperienced when he fought Duran in 1980 and over the hill when he fought him in 1989..

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65
    Quote Originally Posted by Dav
    With his impending induction into the International Boxing Hall of Fame, I feel it apt to air my views on where Duran will ultimately be remembered. It is a little unfortunate that Duran's name is inextricably linked these days with Leonard, Hagler and Hearns (due in part to the excellent DVD "The Fabulous Four"). It is understandable then that some may compare the four and look at Duran's performances as being not so great... he lost 2/3 to Leonard, lost to Hagler and got knocked out (in spectacular fashion) by Hearns. His only redemption was in his epic introduction to the 'middle' weight (not middleweight!!) divisions against Ray Leonard in 'The Brawl in Montreal' (still one of the most exciting fights ever IMO!!). What sometimes escapes notice is that when he bagen fighting at welter weight (and higher) Duran was mixing in company 2 weight divisions higher and 10 years after his peak. He is guilty of complicating his legacy even further by going on to win 'world' titles at Junior Middleweight and Middleweight (he claims a 5th weight - Super Middleweight.. but it was only the NBA title he won), and fighting into his 50's (he reamains the only boxer to fight professionally in 5 different decades!!!).

    When remembering Roberto Duran I believe ultimately he will be remembered as the number one lightweight of all time.
    10 years after his prime was when Duran fought at welterweight? So he was prime in 1969-1970 when he was 18 years old? This is more ridiculous nonsense about Duran. He was prime in about 1977/1978 or so I think which would make 10 years after his prime in 1987-1988.. And he fought Ray in 1980.. And was Ray prime when he fought Duran? No,, not either time, Ray was inexperienced when he fought Duran in 1980 and over the hill when he fought him in 1989..
    He had been in the ring 13 years,and had gone up in weight to fight Leanord
    And he won
    He had all of 1 count em one loss at the lower weights
    And he avenged that loss twice

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    he started fighting at 16 years old in 1967, but he was not prime until 1977-1978. Which would make 10 years after his prime in 1987 and 1988.. 1980 was pretty close to Duran's prime, and how is fighting at welterweight after years at lightweight and not being able to make weight that high in weight to diminish him? Especially since he was a big enough lightweight. He fought great at welterweight against Palomino and Leonard the first time he did well although even an inexperienced Leonard fighting Duran's fight, Duran could not stop Ray., Duran just fought better guys when he lost in higher weights. and when Duran fought Hearns or Benitez, he was still young enough. If he lost it was not because of age or peak.. It was because of speed and those guys were good. I think his legacy is good just a bit overrated. He is overrated in my mind and always has been .Feet too wide apart. opponents at lightweight he should have beaten, I mean was there any doubt when he fought at lightweight that he was not better than his opponents? The real question was when he fought in the 80s. He had real challenges and did not come through.. He was 30 when he fought Benitez and 32 when he fought Hearns. And he later fought until he was 50 years old in 2001.. If he was a shot fighter he would have been beaten up by the late 1980s since that is how it works with washed up guys. They get beaten up and then it is easier to beat them and soon a guy 4-10 are beating them. I will say that after Leonard beat Duran in no mas in Nov. 1980, Duran had his invincibility stripped. That was the biggest damage to Duran not that his skills went down, just that the bully in him was tamed a little.. But if things went his way his attitude came and he would sneer and beat the guy into submission with combinations and power. If he had the person in front of him and they weren't moving he looked great even though his feet were so wide apart. When he had a boxer or fast guy like Leonard or Benitez or Hearns the tables turned. He quit like bullies do. Duran was a bully mentality anyway, and that is how it works with bullies.. It worked well with the lesser competition at lightweight, but when he moved up he was put to the test and sure he lost more and sure he has the excuse that he was old at 30 even though he fought 20 more years until the age of 50, and then he was fighting 2 divisions up when all the legends fought higher in weight yet didn't have the excuses. What great fighters did not move up usually? And most of them won. Robinson lost when he moved up and had excuses? Emile Griffith? Jones? Virgil Hill? Hearns moved up and fought at light heavyweight and won 2 titles there.. 30 pounds over his welt. division. When Tommy lost he was beaten badly, but if Duran lost the same way he had an excuse. I think what has to be reevaluated are Duran's opponents at lightweight.. And lets face it they were not the same quality as Leonard,Hearns,Hagler,Benitez. Who can say they were. Who will say Dejesus and Buchanan are the quality of Leonard and Hearns. We also have to reevaluated how washed up Duran was in 1980-1984.. 28-32 years old is washed up?? I know for a fact Duran has been given far too many excuses. And what backs my opinion up is his foot positioning. Anyone who fights that wide will punch hard but will not have mobility with a guy who can move. And if the guy is nailing Duran like Hearns did Duran cannot move to get out of there. Either way his positioning was bad. , and that same positioning was there at lightweight. Guys like Leonard and Benitez and Hearns would all beat a guy with that positioning. Pernell would have beaten Duran I have no doubt. Floyd?? Maybe, but Floyd gets roughed up more than Ray or Tommy would have. But stylewise he would have beaten Duran I think.

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    What I loved about Duran was that he was a real fighter. He came to fight and was not preoccupied with not getting hit. He had a good defence but he was willing to trade and really fight in trenches. Duran is and was a man who knows how to fight and for me he defined what is is to be a champion in this sport. Top 5 boxer ever imo, Top Lightweight ever next to Leonard.
    Psalm 144: Blessed be the LORD my Rock, who trains my hands for war, and my fingers for battle

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by BoomBoom
    What I loved about Duran was that he was a real fighter. He came to fight and was not preoccupied with not getting hit. He had a good defence but he was willing to trade and really fight in trenches. Duran is and was a man who knows how to fight and for me he defined what is is to be a champion in this sport. Top 5 boxer ever imo, Top Lightweight ever next to Leonard.
    Leonard beat great fighters to get that spot, Duran did not. As much as I like Duran's style, he did not beat great fighters to be top 5 boxer ever. He sure dominated, but the guys he dominated would have to be the lightweights, and are they really the caliber to warrant top 5 ever?? I thought the guys Chavez fought were better than Duran's caliber at lightweight with the exception of maybe Dejesus.

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65
    Quote Originally Posted by BoomBoom
    What I loved about Duran was that he was a real fighter. He came to fight and was not preoccupied with not getting hit. He had a good defence but he was willing to trade and really fight in trenches. Duran is and was a man who knows how to fight and for me he defined what is is to be a champion in this sport. Top 5 boxer ever imo, Top Lightweight ever next to Leonard.
    Leonard beat great fighters to get that spot, Duran did not. As much as I like Duran's style, he did not beat great fighters to be top 5 boxer ever. He sure dominated, but the guys he dominated would have to be the lightweights, and are they really the caliber to warrant top 5 ever?? I thought the guys Chavez fought were better than Duran's caliber at lightweight with the exception of maybe Dejesus.
    He fought lots of all time greats at many different weights. Hes top 5 boxer in any class imo because of his ability to have sucess in many different divsions for decades and his accomplishments. Duran has fought far better opposition in his prime than Chavez. Benitez, De Jesus, Buchanan, Vuruet, Palomino he fought all while in his prime at Lightweight. And he fought the best at weights above that and won titles. No he was not a better lightweight than Leonard but he was just as good for different reasons imo.
    Psalm 144: Blessed be the LORD my Rock, who trains my hands for war, and my fingers for battle

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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    I think Legend makes some very good points cc even though I love Duran
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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65
    Quote Originally Posted by BoomBoom
    What I loved about Duran was that he was a real fighter. He came to fight and was not preoccupied with not getting hit. He had a good defence but he was willing to trade and really fight in trenches. Duran is and was a man who knows how to fight and for me he defined what is is to be a champion in this sport. Top 5 boxer ever imo, Top Lightweight ever next to Leonard.
    Leonard beat great fighters to get that spot, Duran did not. As much as I like Duran's style, he did not beat great fighters to be top 5 boxer ever. He sure dominated, but the guys he dominated would have to be the lightweights, and are they really the caliber to warrant top 5 ever?? I thought the guys Chavez fought were better than Duran's caliber at lightweight with the exception of maybe Dejesus.
    Lol.. Not that im arguing top five ever.. I think he makes top 15 at least..Possibly cracks top ten..

    But the point which you make saying aside from de jesus.. who did he fight to get to that point..

    Well who did anyone fight when they was building up a record and earning money when they were young.. The record and number of ranked fighters made up his ranking and thats how he got there..

    Tell me know..Could you name the top 30 fighters in any specific weight class as of right now..
    Well if you lived in durans time you probably couldnt say all the ranked lightweights then..
    But i'll bet a fair few of the people he fought were pretty fairly ranked..

    But all asumption aside.. None of it matters because when he got there you could have argued he didnt earn his way there.. But when he left he'd whooped Sugar ray..
    And from there on he never ducked a fighter and he fought great competition cos he actually had recognition..
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    Default Re: The REAL Legacy of Roberto Duran

    Quote Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
    Yes i will find it for you tommorow Unknowndonor as for Duran great Lightweight but he sometimes lost to fighters he shouldn't have like Kirkland Laing he totally outboxed Duran and Simms beat Duran aswell imo he is right where he should be in the opinions of the fans and where he is ranked.
    I see him as a HOF'er easily....but as for an all time great that's a big push for me...what makes someone an all time great is the fact that they make all the right decisions in their boxing career...Duran going up in weight because he was out of shape was not a good decision.....His lack of training for some of his fights was evident...he looked out of shape in quite a few fights in the 80's-retirement.....
    It feels good to be back home.

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