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Thread: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

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    Default What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    This thread is to serve as a center of discussion to talk about different tactics, techniques, and strategies that you may use in various situations in the ring. Do you have any thoughts on how a particular fighter’s techniques, or how they set up their punches? Do you have something that you’ve wondered about or your own bag of tricks that you’d like to get feedback on? If not it would be in your interests to explore these dark areas and adding this to your thoughts to this discussion we can all shed some light on how different things work.

    Now if you’ve sparred enough or have had a good share of fights you should have already found out that there are things that you’ll face more than once, and things that you gotta be ready for. As you progress in the fight game you’ll be pitted against people with different styles, techniques, and their own bag of tricks some of which you may have not have seen before. Your learning experiences from fighting, and sparring to get the best of them is where preparation that meets opportunity.

    If you need a little help getting over writer’s block then here are a few things that you can talk about:
    -Why do certain moves work in certain situations and others don’t work due to a style or situation?
    -When dealing with a particular punch…
    -When fighting a particular kind of an opponent… (height/weight/reach/speed/strength/styles)
    -How do you set up your best punches/combinations
    -What do you do when your opponent does what…
    -How to neutralize an opponent’s counter…
    -Nifty moves that you’ve seen done by a particular fighter…
    -What works for you?


    _________________________________________________

    Andre:
    I’ll start off with tall opponent outreaching me, fighting side on with fast straight jab.

    Hard to get around and outpoint someone who turns on the spot, follows you around with their best shot like that!

    You can disrupt their thinking by slightly leaning back as it comes simultaneously checking their fist with a light glove shove across the front of your face with your rear hand while attacking their extended arm, right at the point underneath where the bicep joins the triceps just above the elbow with angled hook or uppercut as you lean back.
    This sets you up to instantly follow the wounded arm back in and get inside him or over the top of that arm from the outside.

    _________________________________________________

    Andre:
    When someone is raining blows into you and your tightened up, squat, covering with no way out.
    You can take your front leg back through on a 45% angle right through to where its now the rear foot (SO you have ducked slightly down and out)
    while you do this the rear arm becomes the front and swings up "attacking his arms from underneath" (it swings up little finger up with the palm of the glove facing out and attacks with the forearms outer blade) and it covers your centre line as you retreat, your other hand stays near your own lead arms elbow through the move for rear back up.
    As you do this, watch for his openings as he is forced to readjust.

    You are then only open to a hook or swing and he still has to step in to make contact, so you have gained time and position.

    You end in a bent knee recoiled position with your guard up to either continue moving back or to the side or continue with a counter from underneath or whatever you choose.

    You have given your self time and an escape with safety.

    _________________________________________________

    Andre:
    Fighting a guy in the same stance; A right cross over the top of his left jab after you adjust your foot work and body to avoid it, works well, as his own arm covers your cross from his own line of sight,(especially the case with someone the same height or just slightly larger than you, as these tend to stick a jab out continually and you can read the next time its coming easily.
    Nice to pull that lead foot back to make him miss ,go out to the side and forward with your right foot and right cross over the top of his retracting arm all at the same time.
    (Happens all in just under one second)your face goes around his outstretched glove, but you are on the move as its coming ;
    your head follows a u shape around his glove ,out with foot work then around with weight change to right side and back up the out side with the right foot.
    Your right hand and hip turn on the cross ,your punch follows his glove back just as your right foot lands so does the punch, it follows his jab back home so he don’t see it.

    _________________________________________________

    Andre:
    This is a rare one but useful towards an end fight situation especially if the opponent and you are tiring but going for it!
    When someone is getting into you with swings to the head (either because you deserved it; or maybe you sneakily left that opening for them ).. Try dropping your lead glove down and raising your elbow as you slightly face the inside of the incoming hook so you hide behind and use it to attack the inside of their attack.
    Their forearm comes to a dead halt up against the outside of your elbow. IT takes balls and timing as you don’t budge you actually can even move forward slightly and face the point of contact (This kills the overcommitted, heavy, take your head off type of swing shot).
    You are open to their other hand once the original one is spent so keep tight and check it when it comes in with your free hand. You are right on the inside here and he has unexpected major arm pain and a big doubt in his mind, so finish the job.

    Where’s all the posts? What the Doesn’t anyone have any thoughts on why something in particular worked or didn’t?

    _________________________________________________

    Andre:
    Well, what about stuff you have all noticed on videos of fighters. What’s you favorite move someone has pulled off? OR the rarest one you have seen work on your favorite fight?

    I remember during Morales/ Barrera (no. 1 I think) it was? Barrera has a move he uses when he knows where an opponents body is but isn’t sure what he is doing.
    He puts up an arm like a hail Hitler sign but extended further out and just slightly turns into the opponent with it. This is smart because he uses it like an ariel!

    He has control then and can feel what the intention of the opponent is, as well as forcing the opponent to have to try and come around that feeler that’s out there.
    Barrera sometimes leaves it out there to stop over the top style shots landing by simply slightly turning it and making contact with the inside of the shot!
    That has so many benefits when in close because it deadens the shot, protects his own head from it and it allows him remain in close for an instant counter.

    _________________________________________________

    SP Killer:
    It is said that no two boxers have the same style but once in a while you find an opponent with very similar skills - defense and offense - how do you handle that with your style?

    Andre:
    At distance ,I'd go for interruptive moves and try to disrupt his timing by continually changing mine so that I can set up on new angles and make him turn into face my new position, so I can catch him doing it for added power.

    IF it was nose to nose I would try to do it by watching his timing and resetting my attacks and counters right in between his, so at least it doesn’t end up force meets force; I think personally that positioning gained through outsmarting them and getting yourself set properly for the added power on a shot (and catching them turning back into you) is the only way out of a head to head fight where either one of you may drop.

    (Someone is going to say head but again aren’t they.)

    How many times do you see great fights because both fighters have something to prove and slug it out like they are set in concrete blocks.
    When they both enter into that mindset;they either fight like that or go out to long range distance fighting before they get back to nose to nose, they never seem to use their skills to find new angles in close with half footwork and slight body shifts or ducking under and out to the side but remaining close and controlling etc.

    They are great fights to watch,(the best)but the fighters are ripping themselves off by having something to prove to the other, or the audience.

    _________________________________________________

    Quote Originally Posted by Andre
    Quote Originally Posted by greynotsoold
    Here is a very very simple way to shorten the arms of an opponent with long arms and a busy jab; the funny thing is that it is THE natural counter in boxing and very difficult for him to counter.
    Here is the premise: the motion you make to slip his jab so that it passes over your right shoulder- slipping it to the "inside" position- is the exact same motion as you make to throw a straight hand. He jabs, you step slightly forward and left with your left foot shifting the wt to your left leg, etc...Your step far enough to drop your body low enough so that you are able to drive a straight to his heart; in the early days of boxing this was a legitimate ko punch and still would be were the average "modern" fighter schooled well enough to throw it. Throw this punch and come back with a left uppercut or weave outside with a hook to the body or chin. However you do it this punch will discourage his jab in short order.
    That’s nice ,a natural move and a heart interrupter!

    Your head is moving towards his rear arm as you slip ,with practice you could extend that arm slightly to cover the path of his rear hand with your left glove while your executing the right to the heart for safe keeping.
    Specially if you do it more than once that way you may be choking out his next move already if he is just coming forward with a feint the second time around.

    A variation (IF he is really coming forwards hard); could be to pull your left leg back slightly which also places that jab over your right shoulder as you throw your straight right and then cover from his rear glove and correct your footwork instantly under your next move . That keeps you out of range of that rear arm and can give you distance to adjust and catch him with weight and movement off your next punch .
    _________________________________________________

    Andre on Switching/Changing-feet:
    Try this for a start, its the most under-rated /unused footwork for switching. IT is avoiding then /attacking with power.

    Your both in the same stance; they are left hand forward /left leg forward as they attack with a lunge at you with a jab ,(As its coming)remove your left leg ,place about 6 inches behind your rear (this makes them miss and gets you out of distance);
    (you have to control their arm at the elbow point with the outside of your left glove (like a German salute ,hail Hitler as you go around) then slide your right leg out so you come back into head punch contact range and attack with (now in the lead position right hand) backed up with your movements and body weight shifting in behind ,it should be devastating.

    They have to react to this bodily or they are caught.
    A great fighter will back out instantly, so just remain in the stance and shuffle after him throwing the whole time.

    Most try to turn bodily around to follow you and keep you in vision, which is to their end as they are turning into your right hand, Ba Boom.

    OFF the ropes

    Switching out from a square /neutral stance immediately after ducking their blows and sitting back into and on the middle rope is a great way to escape as no one is trained for that answer to being backed up and bombed out on the ropes.

    As you switch out, bomb them back to that off side as you go around ,stand your ground next to his head readjust your stance and let loose on him, its another winning move as he has to back out fast or turn in and down to face you again. The way to go is out and under which ever side he has just extended trying to get to you as you laid back/go that same way out, so your not running into anything. (the attacker has to be in a neutral square stance laying into you evenly with both hands pinning you there on the ropes for this to work and you time it by pulling your front foot back into rear position and taking off with the other foot and going under him. IT takes practice and great timing by feeling his intention and heading the weaker way. ITs well worth while to train this into your routine as every pro ends up in that position one time or another .

    You can even bring it on yourself and suck them into a commitment if you don’t have respect for their power and want to finish them off ,you can get a lot of added power off the rope and the movement once your timing is right; so you can even go back with the rope sit so your out of range and then throw a great low hook to the stomach or low walk through type of straight shot with full force/then switch out and bomb them over the top as they react.

    There’s many things you can do in the trapped situation,
    Most are waiting for the smother grab and the twisting throw around to change sides to get them on the ropes instead;
    So, you can out think their natural reaction and train to grab, pull in, (Their reaction is to pull back bodily) but you let go instead and then follow them out with power shots!

    _________________________________________________

    Quote from: HEsoNIce on December 18, 2004, 04:59:44 PM
    best way i know to nullify someone's left hand is to first test it out and try to figure out the speed and manner in which he will throw the left. Also I like working my way into the inside and keep the fight at close quarters, especially against taller fighters( I have relatively short arms). So basically I try to figure out and time my opponents punches(but this means getting caught with the shot(s) a couple of times at the very least) and taking a quick step to the other side, followed by a counter of my own. I been working on it and I'm nowhere near pro but it takes a great deal of effect of the punch, if it lands at all. I know it sounds pretty basic, but I find it to be very effective if you keep moving and never stand in front of the person. I try not to move straight back but it happens sometimes and I get caught. Just watch out for the uppercuts, trust me.

    Andre:
    Sounds good,

    You work on stretching your legs and you can go real low using them to revolve your head under his arms and look for the openings while your down there and then use the flex in your legs to put spite on your punches coming from down there its a finishers shot.

    You would be able to move in on some peoples attacks and choke them off (before the power is dispersed) getting you further inside them that way too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andre
    Quote Originally Posted by Confirm
    my trainer said it was a very good thing if you know how to pull it off correctly
    "1 mistake can get you on the canvas".
    i had to promis not to pull this of till i can do it 100% correct. (off/defence)

    my trainer told me to focus on my defence first during these moves. cuz i was thinking of a right straight or hook as my left foot goes back.

    but my trainer lold me just do defence for now, cus your liver is a easy target during this move if you dont have your defence right.

    and when i do this correct i can think about offence.

    i didn't spar monday nor last night, just spend alot of time on these moves.
    starts to feel good, but i know there has to be alot more then just feel good.

    i know when i start competing, the guy i will be fighting wont have alot of experience in the ring, just like me. but i just want to train a little more, so i can call home and say "mom i won."
    b4 i step in the ring, if you know what i mean.
    IT was just a suggestion, just one of many things you can try in the course of a fight.

    Defense can come with maintaining contact with his lead arm too!

    I used to use it only when someone overcommitted themselves with a lurch forward, leaning jab or even on a rear straight as they lean in.
    It can be used when someone has the upper hand and is pressing forward, done correctly you should be covered fully anyway.
    The move takes you out of range first, its up to you to keep those arms out front even to the extent of pinning their front arm at the elbow point, then you slip their reaction and counter.

    Consider which is their strong side so you head away from it, preferably to the outside of their lead arm.

    If you switch out the other way it can work too, but you have to have the path of his rear arm fully covered and you have go out on a sharper angle with your foot as you take it back.

    This move can also be utilized against a person in the reverse stance to you as well.

    Once they have thrown the lead jab and come forward ,you check it with your lead arm ,then you exchange contact as you have your rear arm come up underneath your lead arm so it makes contact on the out side of their lead arm at their elbow point, it happens right on the switch (as your lead leg heads back, your rear arm comes up),you have control (His other arm is no longer an immediate threat ,you have the outside position.
    So you follow their arm with yours and step in (close the gap)on the outside of it and reattack in safety;

    So, you have pulled the left leg right back behind the rear leg, taken control with the rear arm, then you have stepped back into the original forward stance closing the gap and you explode up or down over or under that arm of his that you have checked. You can feel which way he goes cause you have contact with him ;however he reacts you attack the opposite way if his arm comes up, you attack low, if it comes down, you go over it.

    If you attack over that elbow point of his from the outside like that, he has to readjust to your position or run.

    It’s a finishing move as you catch them coming, then turning in to see what’s up. And you can have that final blow with full forward force behind it.
    You can even practice going low on the second part and exploding upwards so his own arm hides what you are up to and so it’s a greater shock to him with more leg lift etc…

    Sometimes you have to add a little shuffle or slight twist of the feet on the end so you remain in the advantage position, but that’s all good for you to try out and teach yourself where to be, also where not to go too.
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andre
    Quote Originally Posted by AdamGB
    Your not screwed, just don't try and beat a guy by fighting him on the outside... once you get inside some one with long arms they're the ones who are screwed because they loose the space to punch.
    Yeah! Train to take your natural negatives into natural abilities.

    You beat anyone anytime if you tick all the boxes in your minds eye first.

    Practice stuff like throwing a straight shot simultaneously at their exposed ribs right underneath their underarm as they jab and you circle your head down under it and head out to the outside of their elbow point. Start on the bag duck and throw,then move while your down there further and play around with your own comfort zones;(you can move while your legs are bent with the shuffle and then twist in and rise once your out side and throw a shot into them that they are turning into if you practice it and catch them right.)

    Stretch a lot your legs and hips so you can add to the freedom of in fighting.

    Practice chocking the opponent down; by moving further in on their arm while throwing a shot over the top with your other arm while moving away from their free hand or firing right through their free hands path etc.

    Slight twists in ankle placement of only a quarter of a circle when in close can make them miss and you hit harder if you can adapt a simultaneous block and hit approach to in fighting.

    Shuffles or heel to toe front foot and slide up the rear foot gets you in there and has you set down correctly to throw hard instantly.

    Play around enjoy what you find.
    It takes imagination and practice from dry runs to bag drills to your sparing then to the ring but what the hell, if you don’t go there and find new ground who will?

    (The next champion).
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Here's a neat little trick to neutralize a right hand. Jab at their right glove. This will throw their timing off and give you a quick moment to land your own.

    One move that the Great Benny Leonard would use was a little push on his opponent's shoulder to break their concentration.
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Thinking about the push on shoulder trick I just remember another old-school move of the same note.

    It's called switching the attack which is done after driving hard blows to the body. Straighten your body and drive a straight right into your opponent's right shoulder, this'll turn him to the right and into your left hook. Again you can drive a straight left into their left shoulder to turn them right into your right hook.
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    This is a nifty move that I noticed while watching Nicolino Locche:

    He'd duck low and to his left to draw a right-uppercut. When his opponent has thrown the uppercut he'd straighten out enough that the uppercut would miss, and then he'd be in a good position to counter with his own left to his opponent's head.

    It's a clever move that can be practiced in sparring. It'll work as so long as it's done properly and quickly enough to avoid their uppercut, and if your own counter thrown before they have a chance to recover.
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    When you are fighting in close and your opponent has his gloves up like ear muffs, and you have your left shoulder turned into him...
    Throw a very short right hand to his left glove-HARD- to move it out of the way. Throw a left "upper-hook" into the opening.
    Lots of varieties here. From a distance hit his left with your left hook to clear the way for your right hand.
    In clinches, away from the referee, bang the back of his thigh. Takes his legs.

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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    One little trick iv found (dangerous) but effective is to throw a slow jab whilst moving in, which drops to the waist before it lands, a right hand is released as you see his guard going up, allowing you to pick ur spot and land a straight right usually by the ear or high on the forehead.
    The step in will encourage him to raise guard rather than slip.

    A basic one for when u need to be defensive minded is jus to use "taps." This means simply tapping the lead glove off the forehead occasionaly so as to ensure the guard is high enough.
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Quote Originally Posted by hitmandonny
    One little trick iv found (dangerous) but effective is to throw a slow jab whilst moving in, which drops to the waist before it lands, a right hand is released as you see his guard going up, allowing you to pick ur spot and land a straight right usually by the ear or high on the forehead.
    The step in will encourage him to raise guard rather than slip.

    A basic one for when u need to be defensive minded is jus to use "taps." This means simply tapping the lead glove off the forehead occasionaly so as to ensure the guard is high enough.
    Not to criticize you, but why not just just feint while you're coming in? You can still good reaction out of your opponent this way, especially if you landed a few quick jabs while moving in prior to that. A dangerous move could be that you throw your jab out slow to draw a right hand from your opponent that you'd be ready to counter. This in itself could be dangerous because they might go for a counterjab, or go for the other openings.

    You could give them a tap on their head to bring their guard up and then go for the opening on their body where ever you see them. It might work too to feint higher than you would normally feint to make them bring their hands up to their forhead to give you many openings to choose from. You can throw a jab if that's what does the trick, or even hook up high.

    One thing that I liked when I watched the old time greats like Benny Leonard and Tommy Loughran is that they'd feint with their feet. They would take take a quick step forward often while incorporating a hand feint, and just as their opponent leads they take a step back. Sometimes the opponent would react to the feint by bringing their hands up. then Loughran or Leonard would go after the opening. It's like a mongoose provoking the snake, moving quickly away from it's deadly strike and biting it on the neck. Just like Grey said, "Make them lead, make them miss, and good luck.

    There's also another way that you can feint with your feet. This is done by a feint at side-stepping, make them think that you're shifting your attack to the right, and right when they buy it quickly side-step to the left. You then have them in a bad position and can attack to their side. There are many different variations of this that you can practice. I think this is a lot better than the stupid side to side movement that often leads to walking into a right hand.
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Feints are good, and while i realise they are a valuable assett to nearly all boxers i dont often use them, i find the move i describe very useful for me because if done in one motion with speed it can do a lot of damage.

    Dead right about lower body "feinting," its intimidating and a great alternative.

    Also a thing iv noticed a lot of our national coaches teaching is a fast yet weak right hand lead, followed by a much stiffer left straight again whilst moving in, the following through with the left in a slipping motion to end up in position for a right hook to the body
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Here are a couple of nifty things that many young guys don't practice...or should I say are not taught anymore but was something many old time fighters mastered....Though not on your list might be useful...Of course they take some practice in sparring first so...

    Punching Gloves--

    Very effective against a slower guy who likes to power punch a lot. or you know is just stronger then you in general........Instead of worrying about your jab landing in his face to keep him off balance and taking a chance at getting caught with a big shot. Punch his gloves every so often. Of course not during a flurry or during your offensive attack but as you are circling and you see he is looking to land.

    The punch does not need to be hard just enough to land and push his hand a bit. Is most effective when circling. The idea is to throw off his rythm and make him set again. even if you catch his glove just as he is about to throw a shot it will effect the intended traget and take off a bit of steam. It works in the same fashion as throwing jabs at a shoulder to force a guy to reset himself but the advantage is you are able to be further away since his hands are in front of him you get an extra 4 or so inches of distance to keep you safe. It is not something you use time and again but every so often. No serious damage is done of course but gives you time to get off right after before he is set. Also after a couple of times it will make the guy aware of it and help throw off his game by giving him something new to worry about



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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    You're right about that Daxx. It works especially well if they have their hands on their face. It can freeze them up long enough to get something in.

    I guess a little punch on the glove, or the forehead can be really distracting even more if your opponent is trying hard to figure your punches out.

    Another one that can achieve the same affect is stepping on their feet.
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris N.
    You're right about that Daxx. It works especially well if they have their hands on their face. It can freeze them up long enough to get something in.

    I guess a little punch on the glove, or the forehead can be really distracting even more if your opponent is trying hard to figure your punches out.

    Another one that can achieve the same affect is stepping on their feet.
    LoL CC at stepping on the feet...as an amateur I used to do that trick.....Problem is it is against the rules and only works a couple of times .....

    But I would make the most of it


    Gerry Cooney is the guy years and years ago who used to tell me to jab the shoulder....As time went on I found the gloves to work just as well and at times better for me...Plus the extra distance I created
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lords Gym
    I want to mess with their bio mechanics as mush as possible. in close I press. get the opponent to resist a bit. then nudge them slightly with shoulder. use their forward momentum which is the natural body reaction to fighting the pressure , I call it recoil . catch them moving in on the recoil from the slight shoulder nudge , toss the ole left hook out there .and see what happens.
    If you hear a voice within you saying that I am not a painter, then by all means paint and that voice will be silenced.

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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    Moving in on the rear hand ,chokeing it out before any real power is expended through it.
    Bit like Ricky did to Kostyas famous right hand but not just doing it with your tuff head moving in like he did!
    Stop it with your front glove moving in and throw your other shot straight at his face simultaniuosly which covers the pathway of his other hand as you move away bodily from it in towards his rear arm which is stopped now or going backwards.
    All in one complete movement; block, move and hit; two hands working at once while your legs take you out to freedom.
    You have to time it for when he is on the right angle or create that angle yourself or at least realize it as you go through.
    He will turn in further to you and be punished or back off and you chase his openings as he does, becuase in the extreme that can happen here ;you have changed his rear hand into his lead hand if he doesnt move his legs.

    On the other side of the coin If someone does it to you !
    The greatest escape if your not over commited is to not resist the push and remove your leg thats under the shot that has been choked out , back out underneath you ,or around behind your lead leg on a 45/ angle so that your head moves out of range of his shot and your original lead hand then comes further into range on him as you have made time and saftey margin so you can reset your leg position and stance to where he now is .
    Takes practice with a partner many times to get your mind used to the reaction; doing it slow allows you to see where and when you go in and out of range and where you can utilize your shift in weight for the best reply shot.
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    I can explain it.
    But I cant understand it for you.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: What works for you in Sparring/Fighting?

    I like that idea, it's smothering their punches. You just don't want to reach out to catch it, just catch it while you're coming in. You can do it with a left hook too I think. I believe you also catch their left hook with a hand on their bicep, or just smother the hook by moving into it before it gets going.

    I haven't given much thoughts to those moves, I guess it can work out differently than if you decide to slip their punch. That's something neat to think about though.
    If you hear a voice within you saying that I am not a painter, then by all means paint and that voice will be silenced.

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