Thread: Roy JOnes Jr.

It's amazing I've been watching my dvd's of him again, and I am always flabbergasted by his abilities. Now a lot of people say that he was man who was unmatched as an athlete, but that he had very little technical skill in the ring. However, this isn't really true at all. While his style was hardly conventional he did all the rules that every great boxer does, he had footwork that equaled anyone's, he didn't square up, when he didn't have his hands up he hid behind his shoulder. Also another thing I noticed because Lampley said that Roy wasn't very effective off the ropes was that Roy was extremely effective off the ropes. Reflexes aside he always seemed to have his hands in the right position when he didn't have time to get out of the way, and he used his body movement on the ropes and his reflexes in a synchronized manner with his arms blocking him that made him almost impossible to hit, but as soon as his opponent missed he would retaliate with a furious flurry of punches that came as a blur, and yet every punch had concusive intent on it, and after that he was very adept at stepping off the ropes when he actually wanted to.
Next is Roy in the middle of the ring, and he was truly superman, I mean I've seen every phonemenal athlete who has become a great boxer, and nobody could do what Roy did in his prime. I was watching a fight with him against Telesco who isn't the next Evander Holyfield, but he was a big tough guy who looked like he outweighed Roy by abount 15 pounds on fight night. WHile almost every other boxer/counter puncher would have backed away or used the jab to keep the distance, what did Roy do? He came forward totally overwhelming Telesco not only with speed, but the savage power he seems to get even while throwing his punches in flight. Also the fight before that against Reggie Johnson who was a fast, very skilled southpaw who had never been down Roy Jones put on a virtuoso performance. In the first round Reggie couldn't get anything done and Roy was analyzing him, then all the sudden while the commentators are stating how impressed they are with Johnson's speed Roy counters Johnson as he is opening to throw a punch, and Johnson goes down from one hell of a right cross. The next round Johnson who fought at 154 was completely overwhelmed by Roy's speed, and then in the third round I saw the best counter I've ever seen... Johnson comes in with a jab and Roy with his inhuman speed comes overtop with a staggering left then a right cross, and then Johnson is one the ground. It was so fast and accurate that you wonder how it is physically possible, but look back Jones could always do things nobody has ever been able to do. Gill Clancy used to say that he only saw Robinson throw combinations like Roy, and that Ali was the only other guy who could get away with leaning back away from a right hand, and Roy could do both these things. Right now I am not comparing him to them, but the fact that he was compared to them and not Leonard makes me believe that they saw something more special in his abilities. IMO he's not only the most athletic fighter since Robinson in terms of his own era, but he also the most skilled fighter in the 90's, and yes I include technical skill along with that because though his technique wasn't conventional it worked and it was his. His punches were flawless in form, though he didn't throw combinations in the same way everyone else before him did, he still threw his combinations to kill. He had a jab when he wanted, he could throw every punch in the book as well as anyone I've ever seen but his best was a left hook that I am surprised isn't regarded more highly. The only thing in my mind that is why he isn't in the top 20 is he didn't fight everyone else out there, or to be more exact they wouldn't fight him, and guys like Benn, Eubanks, Calzaghe, Collins, Hopkins remtach all expected unrealistic demands to fight him, and that makes me feel that deep down they didn't want to test their mettle against him, except Hopkins.

Originally Posted by Taeth

It's amazing I've been watching my dvd's of him again, and I am always flabbergasted by his abilities. Now a lot of people say that he was man who was unmatched as an athlete, but that he had very little technical skill in the ring. However, this isn't really true at all. While his style was hardly conventional he did all the rules that every great boxer does, he had footwork that equaled anyone's, he didn't square up, when he didn't have his hands up he hid behind his shoulder. Also another thing I noticed because Lampley said that Roy wasn't very effective off the ropes was that Roy was extremely effective off the ropes. Reflexes aside he always seemed to have his hands in the right position when he didn't have time to get out of the way, and he used his body movement on the ropes and his reflexes in a synchronized manner with his arms blocking him that made him almost impossible to hit, but as soon as his opponent missed he would retaliate with a furious flurry of punches that came as a blur, and yet every punch had concusive intent on it, and after that he was very adept at stepping off the ropes when he actually wanted to.
Next is Roy in the middle of the ring, and he was truly superman, I mean I've seen every phonemenal athlete who has become a great boxer, and nobody could do what Roy did in his prime. I was watching a fight with him against Telesco who isn't the next Evander Holyfield, but he was a big tough guy who looked like he outweighed Roy by abount 15 pounds on fight night. WHile almost every other boxer/counter puncher would have backed away or used the jab to keep the distance, what did Roy do? He came forward totally overwhelming Telesco not only with speed, but the savage power he seems to get even while throwing his punches in flight. Also the fight before that against Reggie Johnson who was a fast, very skilled southpaw who had never been down Roy Jones put on a virtuoso performance. In the first round Reggie couldn't get anything done and Roy was analyzing him, then all the sudden while the commentators are stating how impressed they are with Johnson's speed Roy counters Johnson as he is opening to throw a punch, and Johnson goes down from one hell of a right cross. The next round Johnson who fought at 154 was completely overwhelmed by Roy's speed, and then in the third round I saw the best counter I've ever seen... Johnson comes in with a jab and Roy with his inhuman speed comes overtop with a staggering left then a right cross, and then Johnson is one the ground. It was so fast and accurate that you wonder how it is physically possible, but look back Jones could always do things nobody has ever been able to do. Gill Clancy used to say that he only saw Robinson throw combinations like Roy, and that Ali was the only other guy who could get away with leaning back away from a right hand, and Roy could do both these things. Right now I am not comparing him to them, but the fact that he was compared to them and not Leonard makes me believe that they saw something more special in his abilities. IMO he's not only the most athletic fighter since Robinson in terms of his own era, but he also the most skilled fighter in the 90's, and yes I include technical skill along with that because though his technique wasn't conventional it worked and it was his. His punches were flawless in form, though he didn't throw combinations in the same way everyone else before him did, he still threw his combinations to kill. He had a jab when he wanted, he could throw every punch in the book as well as anyone I've ever seen but his best was a left hook that I am surprised isn't regarded more highly. The only thing in my mind that is why he isn't in the top 20 is he didn't fight everyone else out there, or to be more exact they wouldn't fight him, and guys like Benn, Eubanks, Calzaghe, Collins, Hopkins remtach all expected unrealistic demands to fight him, and that makes me feel that deep down they didn't want to test their mettle against him, except Hopkins.

I don't think Jones was ever a great technical boxer, although when he used his jab to good effect like in the Pazienza fight, he did some things well technically. Unfortunately he rarely used his jab but i think if he would of used his jab more he would of been even more of a force. The thing is Taeth is that you are right that Jones did some things well technically, on the other hand his losses to Tarver and Johnson were because his reflexes were gone and because he was never a great technical boxer. You see Hopkins who is 40+ can still fight at a high level even though he has lost his speed and etc. And you know why ?? because he is an excellent technical fighter, and its the same Floyd Mayweather Jr he could win most of his fights with technical skill alone.

There isn't many fighters i would call unbeatable at 2 weight classes, but Jones was simply amazing in his prime. I have never seen a fighter dominate so many Hall Of Famers, and former World champions with such ease. Jones will always be one of my favorite fighters, i don't think we will ever see someone like Roy Jones again. His style was so unorthodox and at times he made you open your mouth wide open in disbelief, like putting his hands behind his back then KO Glen Kelley with a right hand to the temple that is unbelievable.

And as for top 20 of all time i would say that is questionable, if we are on about skill he would be top 10 without a doubt. But im not sure he would make it into top 20 of all time P4P and if he didn't he wouldn't be far off, Im not sure where i would have him ranked maybe just inside top 20 or just outside it, his wins and achievements could very well be top 20 material, when he won the Heavyweight title that achievement had not been done since the early 1900s. plus he has wins over 4 Hall Of Famers and he has beaten 15 or 16 Former World champions i believe, i guess its just how you look at his record.

I still think Eubank and Benn at their height wouldve given Jones all he could handle and more, Jones never knew how to get outa the way of punches and when taken to the ropes he would just cover his head and stand bolt upright like a dummy waiting for the opponent to slow down or stop punching like this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6d0WOk-QuU

Benn wouldve given him nightmares and no room to breath, Eubank would have dragged him somewhere deep

Jones relied on room to work, pressure him and he ran backwards to the ropes

I'm not sure if the guy was joking or not, but did some one just say Benn or Eubanks could have beaten Roy Jones Jr. in his Prime. Thats a completely ridiculous statement. Jones is a top 15 fighter all time and Benn might make some peoples top 100, but I doubt if Eubanks would make most experts top 150. Jesus, some people are delusional. These fights would've looked like sparring sessions for Jones, seriously.

Yeah Benn battered McClellan who beat Jones in the amatures and eubank battered Benn

Ha ha I win

... If he sucked on the ropes how come there were 4 or 5 times when Hopkins had him on the ropes and he made Hopkins look absolutely silly, or against Toney... He doesn't just block punches, he also slipped a lot ... Even against Brannon he was slipping a lot of those punches similar to what Floyd does to slip punches, If you notice he is moving with the punches which takes away most of the power. Also watch Roy JOnes Jr. against Merqui Sosa, a guy with an iron chin who came in tried to put pressure on Roy... he was stopped in the second round, and albiet a quick stoppage, Roy had him second guessing his plan of action with the first left hook he landed. You are the only person I've ever heard say that Eubanks or Benn would give Roy a run for his money because Roy is way too fast for either of them, and if Calzaghe gave Eubanks the troubles he did, Roy is much faster, punches straighter, counters better, and does pretty much everything Calzaghe does better.

Also Ice COld... People say Robinson is great technically but he got hit more than Cotto does. Roy's problems with Glen Johnson have more to do with him lacking the power he used and the footspeed more than the reflexes... It was more the distance than the speed that troubled Roy, and he admitted himself he had no power. Against Tarver, what can I say in the first fight once he got his baring Tarver wasn't able to do a whole lot, but he did land one or two big lefts latter one that he wouldn't have landed earlier, but nothing super special. In the second fight it looked good for Roy, but he got caught by a counter left hook... So did Bernard against Tarver a few times, but Roy's chin isn't the same since he's come back down. In the third fight Roy was gun shy, the two rounds he fought Tarver was completely bewildered. Roy used great footwork, he mastered distance and timing and he got perfect leverage on his punches and in that sense he was technically great fighter. Hopkins leads in with his right while he is looking at his shoes, he also leads in head first and he didn't have a jab, that isn't conventional either, and I am certainly not arguing the conventionality of Roy just that he had a lot more technical skills, in his own way, than people give him credit for. I mean Mundine is otherwordly quick as well, but he can't do half the stuff Roy can and he is in a similar league to Jones in terms of hand speed, but he doesn't have the timing, the coordination, the angles, the combinations, the ring generalship, and to me at least those all tie into technique.

Also I am saying that had he foughten Benn, Collins, Hopkins again, Toney again, Eubanks, Calzaghe, Dariusz and in my mind they wouldn't have stood a chance(minus Hopkins) then I believe that Roy would be way higher up the bean pole. The biggest two problems people had is that he was in the one of the most talented crops of fighters people had seen in the long time, greatness was at his doorstep, but JOnes wouldn't grab it. I think this is false after watching before one of his fights were HBO said they couldn't get anybody to fight him that the fans wanted.

Also Ross Abdulaev beat Cotto in the amateurs, what happened in the pros? Or Tyrell Biggs against Mike Tyson? or Henry Tillman? Gerard was a great fighter, but he tried fight with Benn when he should have just outboxed him. Roy in amateurs was more of a guy who just threw a lot of punches and used his reflexes to avoid punches, but he had hardly any of the finesse he later developped as a pro.

Originally Posted by Taeth

He doesn't just block punches, he also slipped a lot

Yeah, he avoided darius

Got knocked out by Tarver and Johnson

I dont particularly like him and im ignorant and wont bother reading all your post, Jones got found out

Originally Posted by ross

Originally Posted by Taeth

He doesn't just block punches, he also slipped a lot

Yeah, he avoided darius

Got knocked out by Tarver and Johnson

I dont particularly like him and im ignorant and wont bother reading all your post, Jones got found out

Umm Jones offered Dariusz a fight in the USA and Dariusz didn't want no part of it. Jones beat 4 Hall Of Famers and over 10+ former world champions. Yep he got found out alright

Originally Posted by ross

Yeah Benn battered McClellan who beat Jones in the amatures and eubank battered Benn

Ha ha I win

And Thulani Malinga beat Benn and should of gone 2-0 against Benn, but Benn got a gift decision in there first fight. What happened when Jones fought Thulani Malinga ?? oh yea thats right he knocked him spark out

Originally Posted by ross

Originally Posted by Taeth

He doesn't just block punches, he also slipped a lot

Yeah, he avoided darius

Got knocked out by Tarver and Johnson

I dont particularly like him and im ignorant and wont bother reading all your post, Jones got found out

Jones got found out? Like when he beat Toney all of 2 except maybe 2 rounds, and beat Hopkins all except 2-4 rounds? Or maybe he got found out when he beat McCallum all 12 round or Reggie Johnson, or when he came back and ko'ed Montell Griffin in the first round, or maybe when he knock out Virgill HIll with a body shot, or when he went up to heavyweight and beat John Ruiz even though he started his career at 154.

Anoyone who thinks Benn could have beaten a prime RJJ needs counselling.

Ive just started watching Roy Jones Jnrs career set and I cant believe how quick his hands were for a super middle. His jab when he used it was second to none. Also his left hooks were amazing, he is the only boxer I have ever seen throw 7 left hooks in a row and land most of them. I do find his cockiness a bit frustrating at times but the hands down trick he used against James Toney to knock him out was something else!!

Ha ha Jones is a bum, fighting washed up welters, hes whoring himself pretending he matters

Originally Posted by Taeth

Also Ice COld... People say Robinson is great technically but he got hit more than Cotto does.

Ray was just a superrior being during his time.... Just like Roy.
But times were different back then... Ray liked a fight. They all did.

I put their greatness down to Athlectic ability more than anythig.

Thing is back then a loss didnt mean as much and they also didnt get big advertising contracts, they fought to earn, they didnt have big tv companys selling pay per view, they fought alot more often and learned their trade the hard way

Id love to see all the old greats fight the newer ones, the older I reckon would have an edge in stamina and heart whereas today they migth have a slight edge in skill, although not in all cases