Thread: Charley Burley on Sugar Ray Robinson

"Ray ducked me. George Gainford (Ray's manager) admitted that much. But, I can't say I blame him. There wasn't no money in us fighting each other. All we would have done is knock each other off."

"You know, to me the most remarkable thing about Ray's career is that he didn't even get a shot at the welterweight title til he was 26- or the middleweight title til' he was 30! You think he was the greatest? What do you think he'd a been if he'd gotten his chances when he deserved them? You wanna know the truth? If I coulda' got my shot, I wouldn't have risked it fighting someone like Ray."


It's from the chapter "Robinson Ducks" in this book:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...gL._SS260_.jpg

So true about Robinson not getting what was due to him till his later years..

It still saddens me that there is no footage of him while he was in his peak. Fuck. It must have been some of the most brutal yet graceful boxing footage of all time.

Originally Posted by Thread Stealer

"Ray ducked me. George Gainford (Ray's manager) admitted that much. But, I can't say I blame him. There wasn't no money in us fighting each other. All we would have done is knock each other off."

"You know, to me the most remarkable thing about Ray's career is that he didn't even get a shot at the welterweight title til he was 26- or the middleweight title til' he was 30! You think he was the greatest? What do you think he'd a been if he'd gotten his chances when he deserved them? You wanna know the truth? If I coulda' got my shot, I wouldn't have risked it fighting someone like Ray."


It's from the chapter "Robinson Ducks" in this book:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...gL._SS260_.jpg

Charley was an amazing fellow. He really told it like it was.

People give modern day fighters shit when they think they're ducking someone, but "ducking" has been around as long as the sport of boxing has.

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

People give modern day fighters shit when they think they're ducking someone, but "ducking" has been around as long as the sport of boxing has.

It's funny when people act like a lot of the stuff that happens nowadays is limited to modern times and it didn't happen in the past. The "good old days" of boxing had a LOT of serious problems with corruption, worthy fighters being avoided, etc...

The whole thing about "ducking" is that it needs to be clearly defined. There's a lot of things going on behind closed doors that he won't know about anyway.

I posted these quotes because I liked the honesty of Burley.

I would love to know if those stories about Burley KO'ing Robinson twice in sparring while being gym sweeper is true.

Originally Posted by ICB

I would love to know if those stories about Burley KO'ing Robinson twice in sparring while being gym sweeper is true.

No, they are not.

Eddie Futch Told me, why He should lie I dont Know. Yet Harry Otty said He never heard the Story. Robinson wanted Triple the money He was getting at the time to Fight Charlie, thats certain. Also anyone who made it in that era was connected no two ways about it. Robinsons Manager was a numbers Man for the Mob, theres a clue.Ive heard some wonderfull tales, but telling them would get certain people in trouble, some Porkys amongst them but a few truths are in there. Isnt History wonderfull

People actually didn't like Ray Robinson in his prime for the same reasons people didn't like RJJ or Mayweather, he was cocky, arrogant, and he is perhaps the fighter who carried opponents the most across the finish line, and he was too much better than the opposition. His being old made Turpin, Fulmer as good as they were, not them being as good as they are made out to be. Robinson in his prime actually trying would have destroyed them. Many people don't know that he carried Lamotta most of their fights, and that he wasn't going to in the last fight, and that along with other things was the reason why he wasn't allowed to box in the states and made him go to Europe.

Originally Posted by Scrap

Eddie Futch Told me, why He should lie I dont Know.

For years Eddie Futch also told the story about how Burley took the Archie Moore fight on less than a days notice. Not true.

Burley did work in an aircraft factory at the time and it is possible that he did a days work before the night of the fight (unlikely though). So, that part of Futch's story may be correct. The fact was the fight was signed weeks in advance.

If Burley and Robinson met in a gym and Burley knocked Robinson out, why is it that no one talked about it before? If it was true, then Robinson may be disinclined to tell, but there must have been other people there! Burley never once mentioned it - though he appeared to have a good deal more class than SRR. Eddie Futch seems to be the only person that knew of it, yet it took him years to tell the story! I don't buy it.

Cocoa Kid put Robinson down in sparring - once (and documented in contemporary newspaper accounts). If anyone at that time was giving SRR fits in the gym it would have been Artie Towne.

Originally Posted by Scrap

...some Porkys amongst them but a few truths are in there. Isnt History wonderfull

Amen to that Scrap!

Originally Posted by Taeth

People actually didn't like Ray Robinson in his prime for the same reasons people didn't like RJJ or Mayweather, he was cocky, arrogant, and he is perhaps the fighter who carried opponents the most across the finish line, and he was too much better than the opposition. His being old made Turpin, Fulmer as good as they were, not them being as good as they are made out to be. Robinson in his prime actually trying would have destroyed them. Many people don't know that he carried Lamotta most of their fights, and that he wasn't going to in the last fight, and that along with other things was the reason why he wasn't allowed to box in the states and made him go to Europe.

All hail the almighty SRR.

Pity he didn't decide to display his wares for us mere mortals against the likes of Burley, Lytell and Towne (to name a select few).