Originally Posted by Mark TKO

Although I assumed this was a Pele Reid thread when I opened it

Nearly pissed myself...

Originally Posted by JonnyFolds

Great vid. Blinding reflexes big, small, heavy, built, lanky, they all come crashing down!

Were did you get that photo of Floyd Mayweather sr ?

Pernell Whitaker
Donald Curry
Sugar Ray Leonard
Ricardo Lopez
James Toney
Terry Norris

All deserve a mention aswell.

Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Just cant have him up there with the true 21st century greats (lewis, pacquiao, mayweather) because of the fact he got found out a few too many times in the prime of his career.

On his day he truly is up there as one of the most talented boxers to have ever fought. The schooling he gave toney that night will always live long in my memory.

But getting knocked out by tarve and johnson just diminished the accomplishments of the man. He was in his mid 30s and was hardly looking like a shot fighter when those KO`s came.

Seeing him take the battering calzaghe gave him was a very sad sight for everyone who has had the joy of bringing roy jones jr into their lives!!

Whoa there... Jones was weight depleted and 33 years old when he finally lost. To say he was in his prime is crazy considering 33 is old for a guy who spent his career relying on his speed and reflexes.

Originally Posted by Numa

Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Just cant have him up there with the true 21st century greats (lewis, pacquiao, mayweather) because of the fact he got found out a few too many times in the prime of his career.

On his day he truly is up there as one of the most talented boxers to have ever fought. The schooling he gave toney that night will always live long in my memory.

But getting knocked out by tarve and johnson just diminished the accomplishments of the man. He was in his mid 30s and was hardly looking like a shot fighter when those KO`s came.

Seeing him take the battering calzaghe gave him was a very sad sight for everyone who has had the joy of bringing roy jones jr into their lives!!

Whoa there... Jones was weight depleted and 33 years old when he finally lost. To say he was in his prime is crazy considering 33 is old for a guy who spent his career relying on his speed and reflexes.

Roy was 35 when he lost actually. 15 years into his career. At that point I don't think his heart was in boxing anymore. After the Ruiz fight, he said he wanted to fight one more megafight against Mike Tyson at HW then retire.

Roy fucked himself over when he chose to gain all that bulk and then struggle to burn 20lbs of muscle off to fight Tarver, especially at his age. Look what happened to Chris Byrd when he burned off a simliar amount of weight at a simliar age to go down to 175. He was slow, weak, and his once great chin was gone and he got knocked down repeatedly and finally KO'd by a no-name LHW with like 8 KOs in 18 fights. He was never the same after that, physically or mentally.

Its hard for regular people to understand because if you or I lose 20lbs, thats awesome. We feel great because we could afford to lose 20lbs. But when you're 200lbs of chisled, ripped muscle, losing 20lbs is going to hurt you physically, especially at an older age.

Look at PBF today compared to what he looked like when he was fight at 130. He's packed on a LOT of bulk. Imagine what would happen if he tried to shave himself back down to 130. He wouldn't look like the guy who dominated Marquez a few weeks ago I gaurentee you.

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Originally Posted by Numa

Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Just cant have him up there with the true 21st century greats (lewis, pacquiao, mayweather) because of the fact he got found out a few too many times in the prime of his career.

On his day he truly is up there as one of the most talented boxers to have ever fought. The schooling he gave toney that night will always live long in my memory.

But getting knocked out by tarve and johnson just diminished the accomplishments of the man. He was in his mid 30s and was hardly looking like a shot fighter when those KO`s came.

Seeing him take the battering calzaghe gave him was a very sad sight for everyone who has had the joy of bringing roy jones jr into their lives!!

Whoa there... Jones was weight depleted and 33 years old when he finally lost. To say he was in his prime is crazy considering 33 is old for a guy who spent his career relying on his speed and reflexes.

Roy was 35 when he lost actually. 15 years into his career. At that point I don't think his heart was in boxing anymore. After the Ruiz fight, he said he wanted to fight one more megafight against Mike Tyson at HW then retire.

Roy fucked himself over when he chose to gain all that bulk and then struggle to burn 20lbs of muscle off to fight Tarver, especially at his age. Look what happened to Chris Byrd when he burned off a simliar amount of weight at a simliar age to go down to 175. He was slow, weak, and his once great chin was gone and he got knocked down repeatedly and finally KO'd by a no-name LHW with like 8 KOs in 18 fights. He was never the same after that, physically or mentally.

Its hard for regular people to understand because if you or I lose 20lbs, thats awesome. We feel great because we could afford to lose 20lbs. But when you're 200lbs of chisled, ripped muscle, losing 20lbs is going to hurt you physically, especially at an older age.

Look at PBF today compared to what he looked like when he was fight at 130. He's packed on a LOT of bulk. Imagine what would happen if he tried to shave himself back down to 130. He wouldn't look like the guy who dominated Marquez a few weeks ago I gaurentee you.

I agree. Some people really overlook the damage Roy did to himself coming back down in weight to fight Tarver. It certainly cannot be used as an excuse for all of his recent performances...but it had a negative effect at the least ideal time of his career (he wasn't a young buck who could just shrug off losing that much muscle and recover quickly). I also think it's a huge injustice to his enormous talent to say Roy Jones was just a great athlete. He certainly was that...but he was a smart fighter. Sure, he wasn't as technically brilliant like Whitaker or Mayweather...but he had great skills. He was never this raw, wild fighter. He was deadly accurate with his powerful and fast punches. And he wasn't a guy who just walked in a ring looking to knock his opponents head off with one punch. He was patient. He could toy with a fighter...blast them when he wanted too...or simply dance and take his time. Look at his fight with Toney. James was a more "skilled" fighter than Roy. He had a better defense than Roy, etc. etc.....yet Roy toyed with him (and please don't use the "Toney was weight drained" excuse). All i am saying is that Roy has not ended his career the way he should have...and maybe some of that is his fault. But at his prime...i still do not see any fighter that could have handled him.

Yeah I agree. Roy's detractors will always say he never fought anyone, and will always have an excuse for the greats he did beat (Toney was weight drained, Hopkins wasn't in his prime yet, ect). People who say that are either biased against him or just don't know their history. Guys like Sugarboy Malinga, Tate, Sosa, Griffen, Virgil Hill, ect were solid fighters. Reggie Johnson was a fantastic fighter, very underrated, who gave a lot of guys a lot of problems and Roy dominated him.

If you look back at his career, you'll see a ton of guys who gave other greats a lot of problems, or perhaps beat other greats, who were murdered or embarrassed by Roy Jones. Once in a lifetime fighter.

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Yeah I agree. Roy's detractors will always say he never fought anyone, and will always have an excuse for the greats he did beat (Toney was weight drained, Hopkins wasn't in his prime yet, ect). People who say that are either biased against him or just don't know their history. Guys like Sugarboy Malinga, Tate, Sosa, Griffen, Virgil Hill, ect were solid fighters. Reggie Johnson was a fantastic fighter, very underrated, who gave a lot of guys a lot of problems and Roy dominated him.

If you look back at his career, you'll see a ton of guys who gave other greats a lot of problems, or perhaps beat other greats, who were murdered or embarrassed by Roy Jones. Once in a lifetime fighter.

yea he wasn't like Calzaghe who finally jumped at the chance to fight the big names once they were past their best (aside Lacey and maybe Hopkins, who i felt beat Joe), but IMO he's not the most talented fighter that ever lived, there are plenty of others that can make the same claim, and there are different types of talent, i'd say Jones WAS the most athletically talented fighter ever, but terms of skill, power, strategy, or even speed, i wouldn't pick him

in short my top two are Robinson and Armstrong

I wonder how that fight vs Tyson would have turned out? RJJ vs Toney at heavyweight would have been nice and RJJ vs Holyfield at heavyweight would have also been nice.

Roy was a phenom who blinded with pure reflex,athleticism and instinct.Could have done well in other sports.But he was not the most talented and technically proficient fighter.He beat many who were better text book boxers than he with those qualities Toney,Hopkins,Johnson and granddaddy McCallum.I think Mayweather stands above as far as a skilled boxer.But Roy did not hesitate to close the distance and go for finish when he had a guy tenderized,the majority of the time.

Originally Posted by Lyle

I wonder how that fight vs Tyson would have turned out? RJJ vs Toney at heavyweight would have been nice and RJJ vs Holyfield at heavyweight would have also been nice.

I've always wondered that. I'm a Jones fan but i'm not delusional, Tyson in his prime would have destroyed Roy. But this was not prime Tyson, it was a Tyson that needed to get his opponent out quick or he just simply lost. I think my money would be on Tyson but I wouldn't have written Roy off!