Originally Posted by mattboxingfan

Originally Posted by Snakey

Im not sure whether Lacy does hit harder than anyone in MMA...he hasnt knocked anyone out in a while. No doubt Wlad Klit would hit harder than ANYONE in MMA, put 4 ounce gloves on him and see the damage that would be done. The question is does Diaz hit hard enough with bigger gloves?

How on earth can you know? Do you know every fighter in MMA? Do you know the level of there power? You can't possibly make accusations like that without the facts. We would have to do a some form of power test to see if that would be true. It's just crazy.

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves? What your saying is like...Do you know every boxer in the world, they may have better ju jitsu or wrestling you just dont know. Well lets work on whats more likely, a guy whos sport is to punch and has an extremely high knockout record with it is probably going to be better at it then someone whos sport is to punch, kick, wrestle, grapple (ju jitsu).

Most MMA fighters dont even have a proper boxing stance, they have wider stance and are more square so they have a better chance of stopping a takedown. Even Dana White says that boxing is completely different. Next thing your going to tell me is that these guys could of hit harder than Mike Tyson in his prime.

Im not even anti MMA, I buy every PPV, Ive seen the UFC live...i like watching it, I am a MMA fan. But lets be real: boxings hardest puncher would punch harder than MMAs...boxers technique is way better than an MMA punchers.

Originally Posted by Snakey

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves?

Also, Wlad is knocking out people who know how to defend punches. Put any of Wlads championship knockout/stoppage victims in with any of those MMA names under boxing rules with 10 ounce gloves and watch how powerfull their punches are

Originally Posted by ross

Originally Posted by Snakey

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves?

Also, Wlad is knocking out people who know how to defend punches. Put any of Wlads championship knockout/stoppage victims in with any of those MMA names under boxing rules with 10 ounce gloves and watch how powerfull their punches are

Also the other thing is...define punching power. Say we measure Junior Dos Santos's punching power, if he loads up a massive hook...and I mean brings it right back to the point it would be way too obvious to use in a fight and it measures at an incredible amount of power do we still count it? Wlad punches powerfully with good technique, MMA fighters have horrible technique. They dont know how to use their hips when punching and their stance is too front on to carry any real power. The 4 ounce gloves is what makes theirs punches powerful, if they had to use 8 ounce gloves without swinging like a rusty gate theyd lose a shit load of force.

fuks sake cant martial arts turn it in with the whole "we are better than boxers" thing

washed up boxer gets his arse handed to him by big ufc star, BORRRRRRIIIIIIINNNNG

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by mattboxingfan

Originally Posted by Snakey

Im not sure whether Lacy does hit harder than anyone in MMA...he hasnt knocked anyone out in a while. No doubt Wlad Klit would hit harder than ANYONE in MMA, put 4 ounce gloves on him and see the damage that would be done. The question is does Diaz hit hard enough with bigger gloves?

How on earth can you know? Do you know every fighter in MMA? Do you know the level of there power? You can't possibly make accusations like that without the facts. We would have to do a some form of power test to see if that would be true. It's just crazy.

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves? What your saying is like...Do you know every boxer in the world, they may have better ju jitsu or wrestling you just dont know. Well lets work on whats more likely, a guy whos sport is to punch and has an extremely high knockout record with it is probably going to be better at it then someone whos sport is to punch, kick, wrestle, grapple (ju jitsu).

Most MMA fighters dont even have a proper boxing stance, they have wider stance and are more square so they have a better chance of stopping a takedown. Even Dana White says that boxing is completely different. Next thing your going to tell me is that these guys could of hit harder than Mike Tyson in his prime.

Im not even anti MMA, I buy every PPV, Ive seen the UFC live...i like watching it, I am a MMA fan. But lets be real: boxings hardest puncher would punch harder than MMAs...boxers technique is way better than an MMA punchers.

They have the appropriate stance for the sport they are in. I think when Diaz boxes he is pretty likely to adopt a boxing stance no?

You are arguing against your own point. It's like arguing that you can run faster than a runner when he's running 26 miles and you're running 100 metres.

Chances are good that if the marathon runner was sprinting with you he'd run at a different pace.

Originally Posted by Bilbo

They have the appropriate stance for the sport they are in.

They are uselss with punches. Its like some of them never do any boxing sparring and if they do its only with other people who cant box.

I remember Ortiz against Lidell, it was pathetic. One fighter was throwing like some drunk in a carpark and the other looked like a sissy in the fetal position scared shitless

One thing boxing gives a fighter over any other sport is composure under pressure. It makes you alot more calm that you have the footwork, reflexes, movement and basic defending skills to avoid getting caught or hurt. A boxer would be less likely to panic or run on his feet.

Dana White wouldn't allow it but if Someone were to take a decent boxer as a proect and give them a couple of years training in MMA They would have good success. Boxing is a more disciplined combat sport because its only punches and the fighters are generally fitter and more aware for it. Id have loved to see a younger Mayorga cross over but with the money on offer its just not worth it for them to waste their time for months training for tens of thousands rather than hundreds of thousands or even millions.

For all the talk of MMA taking over boxing because of viewing figures, why arent the fighters paid better? Why dont they pay more, then they would get better class boxers willing to cross over. Why dont more MMA fighters make use of their name to have a stab at a high profile boxing name and earn a few million in the process?

I can see why a boxer wouldnt want it but I cant see why more MMA fighters dont cross over? Other than they are crap and they know they would have no real success.

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by mattboxingfan

Originally Posted by Snakey

Im not sure whether Lacy does hit harder than anyone in MMA...he hasnt knocked anyone out in a while. No doubt Wlad Klit would hit harder than ANYONE in MMA, put 4 ounce gloves on him and see the damage that would be done. The question is does Diaz hit hard enough with bigger gloves?

How on earth can you know? Do you know every fighter in MMA? Do you know the level of there power? You can't possibly make accusations like that without the facts. We would have to do a some form of power test to see if that would be true. It's just crazy.

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves? What your saying is like...Do you know every boxer in the world, they may have better ju jitsu or wrestling you just dont know. Well lets work on whats more likely, a guy whos sport is to punch and has an extremely high knockout record with it is probably going to be better at it then someone whos sport is to punch, kick, wrestle, grapple (ju jitsu).

Most MMA fighters dont even have a proper boxing stance, they have wider stance and are more square so they have a better chance of stopping a takedown. Even Dana White says that boxing is completely different. Next thing your going to tell me is that these guys could of hit harder than Mike Tyson in his prime.

Im not even anti MMA, I buy every PPV, Ive seen the UFC live...i like watching it, I am a MMA fan. But lets be real: boxings hardest puncher would punch harder than MMAs...boxers technique is way better than an MMA punchers.

They have the appropriate stance for the sport they are in. I think when Diaz boxes he is pretty likely to adopt a boxing stance no?

You are arguing against your own point. It's like arguing that you can run faster than a runner when he's running 26 miles and you're running 100 metres.

Chances are good that if the marathon runner was sprinting with you he'd run at a different pace.

Im not arguing against my own point. We are saying MMA fighters as they punch today (technique not changed, stance not changed) do not punch in a way that lets them have optimum punching power. Im simply stating why they wouldnt punch harder.

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by mattboxingfan

Originally Posted by Snakey

Im not sure whether Lacy does hit harder than anyone in MMA...he hasnt knocked anyone out in a while. No doubt Wlad Klit would hit harder than ANYONE in MMA, put 4 ounce gloves on him and see the damage that would be done. The question is does Diaz hit hard enough with bigger gloves?

How on earth can you know? Do you know every fighter in MMA? Do you know the level of there power? You can't possibly make accusations like that without the facts. We would have to do a some form of power test to see if that would be true. It's just crazy.

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves? What your saying is like...Do you know every boxer in the world, they may have better ju jitsu or wrestling you just dont know. Well lets work on whats more likely, a guy whos sport is to punch and has an extremely high knockout record with it is probably going to be better at it then someone whos sport is to punch, kick, wrestle, grapple (ju jitsu).

Most MMA fighters dont even have a proper boxing stance, they have wider stance and are more square so they have a better chance of stopping a takedown. Even Dana White says that boxing is completely different. Next thing your going to tell me is that these guys could of hit harder than Mike Tyson in his prime.

Im not even anti MMA, I buy every PPV, Ive seen the UFC live...i like watching it, I am a MMA fan. But lets be real: boxings hardest puncher would punch harder than MMAs...boxers technique is way better than an MMA punchers.

They have the appropriate stance for the sport they are in. I think when Diaz boxes he is pretty likely to adopt a boxing stance no?

You are arguing against your own point. It's like arguing that you can run faster than a runner when he's running 26 miles and you're running 100 metres.

Chances are good that if the marathon runner was sprinting with you he'd run at a different pace.

Im not arguing against my own point. We are saying MMA fighters as they punch today (technique not changed, stance not changed) do not punch in a way that lets them have optimum punching power. Im simply stating why they wouldnt punch harder.

It makes no sense Snakey, it's like saying one swimmer doing breaststroke is a slower swimmer than somebody doing front crawl. You can't accurately say which one would be faster unless they were both doing the same stroke.

Who will be the puncher between Lacy and Diaz, I don't know for sure but giving Lacy's recent performances I'll go with Nick.

Not really sure what this accomplishes for either guy. In an ideal scenario they would match two top guys who were still on top level in respected sports. Of course Lacy would give all to have been effective there at all. Both could pulverize the other into powder then go into foes arena and experience the same fate. Lacys toast and his power has always been overstated, turned him into a unrealized injury pron one trick pony. Not familiar with Diaz really, heard he's quite the asshole and has a brother. Bout it.

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by mattboxingfan

Originally Posted by Snakey

Im not sure whether Lacy does hit harder than anyone in MMA...he hasnt knocked anyone out in a while. No doubt Wlad Klit would hit harder than ANYONE in MMA, put 4 ounce gloves on him and see the damage that would be done. The question is does Diaz hit hard enough with bigger gloves?

How on earth can you know? Do you know every fighter in MMA? Do you know the level of there power? You can't possibly make accusations like that without the facts. We would have to do a some form of power test to see if that would be true. It's just crazy.

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves? What your saying is like...Do you know every boxer in the world, they may have better ju jitsu or wrestling you just dont know. Well lets work on whats more likely, a guy whos sport is to punch and has an extremely high knockout record with it is probably going to be better at it then someone whos sport is to punch, kick, wrestle, grapple (ju jitsu).

Most MMA fighters dont even have a proper boxing stance, they have wider stance and are more square so they have a better chance of stopping a takedown. Even Dana White says that boxing is completely different. Next thing your going to tell me is that these guys could of hit harder than Mike Tyson in his prime.

Im not even anti MMA, I buy every PPV, Ive seen the UFC live...i like watching it, I am a MMA fan. But lets be real: boxings hardest puncher would punch harder than MMAs...boxers technique is way better than an MMA punchers.

They have the appropriate stance for the sport they are in. I think when Diaz boxes he is pretty likely to adopt a boxing stance no?

You are arguing against your own point. It's like arguing that you can run faster than a runner when he's running 26 miles and you're running 100 metres.

Chances are good that if the marathon runner was sprinting with you he'd run at a different pace.

Im not arguing against my own point. We are saying MMA fighters as they punch today (technique not changed, stance not changed) do not punch in a way that lets them have optimum punching power. Im simply stating why they wouldnt punch harder.

It makes no sense Snakey, it's like saying one swimmer doing breaststroke is a slower swimmer than somebody doing front crawl. You can't accurately say which one would be faster unless they were both doing the same stroke.

Who will be the puncher between Lacy and Diaz, I don't know for sure but giving Lacy's recent performances I'll go with Nick.

A better analogy would have been to say it's like a proffesional swimmer facing off against a Triathlete. Of course boxers in general are better punchers than MMA fighters, it absurd to suggest otherwise really. Lacy however is completely toast, and Diaz does have very good boxing skills for an MMA fighter. Crap fight though.

My guess is that Diaz figures Lacy is shot and that he watched the Calzaghe fight. He'll come out throwing a lot of punches, expecting Lacy to cover up and let him. Of course, Diaz is no Calzaghe, but Lacy is more shot than he was then. It would make me pretty sick to see it happen, but if he can keep the pace it may work for Diaz, as Lacy can't catch him with a hook with his gloves to the side of his head.
It is, on paper, a smart choice for Diaz. Lacy is shot and, unlike Vargas, he couldn't fight much when he wasn't shot. My expectation, and my hope, is that Lacy catches him at some point and wins. I think it would be a mistake for Diaz to let it be a slow fight but I'd bet there isn't much chance of him approaching it that way.

Originally Posted by p4pking

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by mattboxingfan

Originally Posted by Snakey

Im not sure whether Lacy does hit harder than anyone in MMA...he hasnt knocked anyone out in a while. No doubt Wlad Klit would hit harder than ANYONE in MMA, put 4 ounce gloves on him and see the damage that would be done. The question is does Diaz hit hard enough with bigger gloves?

How on earth can you know? Do you know every fighter in MMA? Do you know the level of there power? You can't possibly make accusations like that without the facts. We would have to do a some form of power test to see if that would be true. It's just crazy.

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves? What your saying is like...Do you know every boxer in the world, they may have better ju jitsu or wrestling you just dont know. Well lets work on whats more likely, a guy whos sport is to punch and has an extremely high knockout record with it is probably going to be better at it then someone whos sport is to punch, kick, wrestle, grapple (ju jitsu).

Most MMA fighters dont even have a proper boxing stance, they have wider stance and are more square so they have a better chance of stopping a takedown. Even Dana White says that boxing is completely different. Next thing your going to tell me is that these guys could of hit harder than Mike Tyson in his prime.

Im not even anti MMA, I buy every PPV, Ive seen the UFC live...i like watching it, I am a MMA fan. But lets be real: boxings hardest puncher would punch harder than MMAs...boxers technique is way better than an MMA punchers.

They have the appropriate stance for the sport they are in. I think when Diaz boxes he is pretty likely to adopt a boxing stance no?

You are arguing against your own point. It's like arguing that you can run faster than a runner when he's running 26 miles and you're running 100 metres.

Chances are good that if the marathon runner was sprinting with you he'd run at a different pace.

Im not arguing against my own point. We are saying MMA fighters as they punch today (technique not changed, stance not changed) do not punch in a way that lets them have optimum punching power. Im simply stating why they wouldnt punch harder.

It makes no sense Snakey, it's like saying one swimmer doing breaststroke is a slower swimmer than somebody doing front crawl. You can't accurately say which one would be faster unless they were both doing the same stroke.

Who will be the puncher between Lacy and Diaz, I don't know for sure but giving Lacy's recent performances I'll go with Nick.

A better analogy would have been to say it's like a proffesional swimmer facing off against a Triathlete. Of course boxers in general are better punchers than MMA fighters, it absurd to suggest otherwise really. Lacy however is completely toast, and Diaz does have very good boxing skills for an MMA fighter. Crap fight though.

It's not a better analogy as I'm not comparing boxing ability, I'm comparing the ability of MMA fighters to be able to punch as hard as boxers.

Do I think boxers are like professional swimmers whereas MMA fighters are triathletes. Yes. But does this mean the boxer will always punch hareder than an MMA fighter. Not at all. A hard punching MMA fighter punching from a boxers stance will likely pucnh just as hard. Will he have the technical skills, and boxing ability? No? But if you stick 5 top MMA guys and 5 top boxing guys on that punching machine and see who hits the hardest I dont think for one second that the boxers would all be higher than the MMA fighters.

My analogy is about the specific detail of punch power related to stance which is why my analogy with swimming strokes is more accurate.

If you have read this far then I have managed to waste two minutes of your life. Five if you bother to reply.

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by Snakey

Originally Posted by mattboxingfan

Originally Posted by Snakey

Im not sure whether Lacy does hit harder than anyone in MMA...he hasnt knocked anyone out in a while. No doubt Wlad Klit would hit harder than ANYONE in MMA, put 4 ounce gloves on him and see the damage that would be done. The question is does Diaz hit hard enough with bigger gloves?

How on earth can you know? Do you know every fighter in MMA? Do you know the level of there power? You can't possibly make accusations like that without the facts. We would have to do a some form of power test to see if that would be true. It's just crazy.

Dont get your panties in a bunch mate. But lets be serious...you really think that Overeem, Brock Lesnar, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velazquez could hit harder than Wlad. Some of these guys couldnt get knock outs with 4 ounce gloves, Wlad gets them all the time with 8 ounces gloves. What the fuck does that tell you? The hardest puncher I just mentioned would probably be JDS and he couldnt even finish Roy Nelson in a fight that was mostly standing. What do you think Wlad would of done to Roy Nelson if he landed repeated punches with 4 ounce gloves? What your saying is like...Do you know every boxer in the world, they may have better ju jitsu or wrestling you just dont know. Well lets work on whats more likely, a guy whos sport is to punch and has an extremely high knockout record with it is probably going to be better at it then someone whos sport is to punch, kick, wrestle, grapple (ju jitsu).

Most MMA fighters dont even have a proper boxing stance, they have wider stance and are more square so they have a better chance of stopping a takedown. Even Dana White says that boxing is completely different. Next thing your going to tell me is that these guys could of hit harder than Mike Tyson in his prime.

Im not even anti MMA, I buy every PPV, Ive seen the UFC live...i like watching it, I am a MMA fan. But lets be real: boxings hardest puncher would punch harder than MMAs...boxers technique is way better than an MMA punchers.

They have the appropriate stance for the sport they are in. I think when Diaz boxes he is pretty likely to adopt a boxing stance no?

You are arguing against your own point. It's like arguing that you can run faster than a runner when he's running 26 miles and you're running 100 metres.

Chances are good that if the marathon runner was sprinting with you he'd run at a different pace.

Im not arguing against my own point. We are saying MMA fighters as they punch today (technique not changed, stance not changed) do not punch in a way that lets them have optimum punching power. Im simply stating why they wouldnt punch harder.

It makes no sense Snakey, it's like saying one swimmer doing breaststroke is a slower swimmer than somebody doing front crawl. You can't accurately say which one would be faster unless they were both doing the same stroke.

Who will be the puncher between Lacy and Diaz, I don't know for sure but giving Lacy's recent performances I'll go with Nick.

No i think your wrong. Ok lets do it this way: the sport is Fighting in General (boxing and MMA) and lets say the sport is Swimming in General. Freestyle is punching, kicking is breastroke. Because they are completely different strokes. Punching is punching no matter what the stance, there are boxers who use front on stances too and they dont punch very hard either in general. So to end this their freestyle stroke is sloppy...but its still freestyle.

Get me ?

This fight is now off, Diaz got the fight he wanted with st. pierre

Originally Posted by MMASUX

This fight is now off, Diaz got the fight he wanted with st. pierre

Why am I not surprised ?

Source ?