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What's next for Cotto
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  1. #1
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    Default What's next for Cotto

    I wanted to get on the forum after the fight, but too many people watching at home… and then the post-fight cleanup. Went to sleep well into Sunday morning.

    Now I’m reading all the posts about the fight and they’ve mostly been pretty spot on. I thought this was hands down one of Cotto’s best showings ever. Right up there with Cotto-Mosley and Cotto-Judah. He didn’t tire down the stretch… he put pressure on Floyd… he bloodied Floyd’s nose and made him work harder than he has in quite a while… he went to the body… and finally, he gave us fans a wonderful spectacle of a fight, just like I knew he would.

    I would’ve loved for Cotto to pull off the upset, but Floyd clearly won the fight. Although I too have some misgivings about the margin of victory on the judges scorecards. I think it was closer than they scored it. I was also annoyed by Emamuel Stewart’s comments about Cotto’s performance after the fight. I thought he was too critical, pointing out what Cotto did wrong more than what he did right. I would’ve expected different from Stewart.

    Cotto did me proud last night. He fought his heart out… and gave Floyd all he could handle. Props to Floyd for being up to the task. He showed why’s the world’s p4p #1. But no one in recent years has given Floyd the trouble Cotto did. Not Hatton, not Ortiz, not Mosley… not anyone.

    And to those few posters that will now discredit Floyd rather than give credit to Cotto: C’mon…. stop it. Give credit where credit is due. This was an honest-to-goodness championship fight, between two ATG’s and future HOF’ers. Cotto brought it, and so did Floyd. The crowd was thoroughly entertained, just like I said it would be. Cotto is never in a “non-crowd-pleasing” fight.

    Inevitably, there are those who now will say: “Pac would now beat Floyd”…. blah, blah, blah. It never fails. The guy ekes out a win… and now all of sudden he’s fresh prey for the others. Well… I wouldn’t get too carried away. Rather, I now even more strongly stand by my earlier statements that Cotto would’ve given Pacquiao a hell of a fight and possible beaten him, had he been with Pedro Diaz in his corner for that fight. As it was, Cotto was jabbing Pac’s head back and possible dominated the first couple of rounds. But he abandoned his fight plan. Last night’s Cotto would’ve very possibly beaten Pac. I said that then, and I say it now. No hate on Pac… just an opinion.

    Let’s see where Cotto goes from here.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    See if Pacquiao will fight him at 154 with random blood tests

    I feel either Alvarez or Chavez Jr. would be the best likely to happen fights for him. I think he'd neuter Jr. even at 160, but it would be good to watch and obviously a great payday. I do feel he could beat Martinez, I wonder if Sergio would either come down or meet him at a catch weight though? Cotto is to small for 160 no doubt but I'm not sure what real paydays are out there at 154 aside from Canelo. He could always fight Margarito again as they are still even in terms of facial damage

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Tough call here, I think that was that was the fight of Cotto's life. I really cant see him being able to take Alvarez, Alvarez is too big and strong. Same goes for Chavez and Martinez.

    He could coax Pauli Malignaggi (who has a belt again) up to 154 and beat him up again in Madison Square Garden, that would be a huge fight in the Garden. From there he would still probably be able to outbox and beat James Kirland, call it a career after that.
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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Outbox Kirkland? He'd be able to slaughter him! Kirkland would get hit with the kitchen sink and would be lucky to see round 3, that one I didn't think of good match for Cotto.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Quote Originally Posted by Onix View Post
    Tough call here, I think that was that was the fight of Cotto's life. I really cant see him being able to take Alvarez, Alvarez is too big and strong. Same goes for Chavez and Martinez.

    He could coax Pauli Malignaggi (who has a belt again) up to 154 and beat him up again in Madison Square Garden, that would be a huge fight in the Garden. From there he would still probably be able to outbox and beat James Kirland, call it a career after that.

    I think Cotto can def beat Alvarez. But the timing would be key. A couple of years or couple of fights down the road, the panorama changes considerably, as age is on Canelo's side.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Quote Originally Posted by p4pking View Post
    Outbox Kirkland? He'd be able to slaughter him! Kirkland would get hit with the kitchen sink and would be lucky to see round 3, that one I didn't think of good match for Cotto.
    The Kirkland that fought Alfredo Angulo would swallow alot of what Cotto was giving out yesterday, Cotto may get a late round stoppage but I think it would be his last winnable tough fight.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Quote Originally Posted by TitoFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Onix View Post
    Tough call here, I think that was that was the fight of Cotto's life. I really cant see him being able to take Alvarez, Alvarez is too big and strong. Same goes for Chavez and Martinez.

    He could coax Pauli Malignaggi (who has a belt again) up to 154 and beat him up again in Madison Square Garden, that would be a huge fight in the Garden. From there he would still probably be able to outbox and beat James Kirland, call it a career after that.

    I think Cotto can def beat Alvarez. But the timing would be key. A couple of years or couple of fights down the road, the panorama changes considerably, as age is on Canelo's side.
    I just dont see Cotto being able to get Alvarez's respect, Alvarez would walk through Cottos punches and hammer his body until Cotto wilted and was carried out on his shield.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    I have a similar question, is Cotto HoF worthy? If so, then why? He has a lot of good solid wins, but no marquee victory. One could argue Zab Judah or Shane Mosley but with no disrespect to Judah I just do not think a victory over him merits enterence to the Hall of Fame.

    As for Mosley he was 36 years old and he's not a crafty boxer. He's a man who's reliant his speed and power rather than technique.

    I like Cotto as a man as well as a boxer, he fight everyone. However he fought two elites and losts to both, granted in one, he was weight drained and was with a new ..really new trainer and came off after his first career lost but he still lost.

    Im conflicted because I truly respect the man but I just can't think of a reason why he might be considered a Hall of Famer.

    I would appreciate it if you could convince me otherwise.
    Last edited by DavilaJones; 05-06-2012 at 08:52 PM. Reason: typos

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Quote Originally Posted by DavilaJones View Post
    I have a similar question, is Cotto HoF worthy? If so, then why? He has a lot of good solid wins, but no marquee victory. One could argue Zab Judah or Shane Mosley but with no disrespect to Judah I just do not think a victory over him merits enterence to the Hall of Fame.

    As for Mosley he was 36 years old and he's not a crafty boxer. He's a man who's reliant his speed and power rather than technique.

    I like Cotto as a man as well as a boxer, he fight everyone. However he fought two elites and losts to both, granted in one, he was weight drained and was with a new ..really new trainer and came off after his first career lost but he still lost.

    Im conflicted because I truly respect the man but I just can't think of a reason why he might be considered a Hall of Famer.

    I would appreciate it if you could convince me otherwise.

    Obviously this is a matter of opinion, but # 1, Cotto list of opponents reads like a "who's who" of boxing. He's never ducked anyone. He fought Margarito when everyone else was avoiding him. It's easy to forget now, that Margarito is damaged goods... but at that time he was the fighter nobody wanted to face. And he lost to a cheating Margarito, only to avenge the defeat last year. It's also easy to dismiss Mosley now, as over-the-hill. But he was not that far from his peak when Cotto beat him, and don't forget how he dismantled Margarito after losing to Cotto. Judah is in the same category. Easy to dismiss now, of course. But a feared fighter when he fought Cotto. You just can't ignore the element of time.

    Even beyond those fighters, Cotto has fought and defeated fighters that others have ducked, like Joshua Clottey. And if you go back to Cotto's early career, his opponents include some very good names, included some who were undefeated at the time. It's easy to forget now, because years have passed. But you gotta look at the whole career, not just the last two or three years.

    He has also shown the ability to adjust and re-invent himself. Just look at how he came back against Margarito in their 2nd clash, and fought a completely different fight. He stuck and moved... he pushed Margarito backwards... he skillfully spun off the ropes... and he chose when to engage Margarito, who is the naturally bigger, stronger man.

    Then there's the HOF issue itself. People here have made arguments for fighters like Hatton belonging in the Hall. I'll be damned if Hatton is HOF-worthy and Cotto isn't, when Miguel has had the better career. And not just Hatton. Other fighters have been mentioned as HOF-worthy here, whose resumes just don't stack up to Cotto's.

    But like I said.... it's a matter of opinion. Mine is that Cotto belongs there.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    It doesn't really matter that Mosley wasn't a crafty boxer, surely? He was still a great fighter when Cotto beat him. You're right hes now lost his biggest fights, but last night should only enhance his standing certainly. He has also never taken an easy fight on paper since god knows when, and has solid wins over Malignaggi, Quintana and Clottey. I suspect as he's been so popular and a great sportsman there is no doubt he will get in, but I also don't feel it's undeserved in the slightest. If he isn't worthy who would be from this generation? You're then talking about 3 or 4 people, none of which have been better for boxing than Miguel. Why even have a hall of fame anymore if Cotto isn't worthy, given the current depth of competition...

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Quote Originally Posted by Onix View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TitoFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Onix View Post
    Tough call here, I think that was that was the fight of Cotto's life. I really cant see him being able to take Alvarez, Alvarez is too big and strong. Same goes for Chavez and Martinez.

    He could coax Pauli Malignaggi (who has a belt again) up to 154 and beat him up again in Madison Square Garden, that would be a huge fight in the Garden. From there he would still probably be able to outbox and beat James Kirland, call it a career after that.

    I think Cotto can def beat Alvarez. But the timing would be key. A couple of years or couple of fights down the road, the panorama changes considerably, as age is on Canelo's side.
    I just dont see Cotto being able to get Alvarez's respect, Alvarez would walk through Cottos punches and hammer his body until Cotto wilted and was carried out on his shield.

    You also thought (and hoped) Floyd would embarrass Cotto.


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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Good post Tito you beat me to it. The fact is Cotto has seen everything as a pro now and was quite unfortunate to likely have been cheated in his first 2 defeats. The fact that he has been able to adapt and stick around culminating with that performance last night is just a rock solid case for it as well imo, good point there. Davila's point that Mosley wasn't a crafty boxer would seem to imply that Cotto isn't suited to deal with that, which I think is way off.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    I don’t want there to be a misunderstanding I have total utter respect for Cotto and the fact that he ducked no one and had a solid career but my standards for HOF is higher than sadly even the HOF folks. Kostya Tszyu as first bout HOFer? I just can't wrap my head around that one.

    I'll give you my criteria and do feel free to critique it.
    Number of Title defenses
    Number of weight classes in which he was 'the man' of the division, i.e. lineal champion
    Number of legitimate (not paper champs) champions dethroned.

    If on average his number is greater than someone else in a comparable division then I’d consider him a first ballot HoFer for that time period.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Quote Originally Posted by TitoFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Onix View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TitoFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Onix View Post
    Tough call here, I think that was that was the fight of Cotto's life. I really cant see him being able to take Alvarez, Alvarez is too big and strong. Same goes for Chavez and Martinez.

    He could coax Pauli Malignaggi (who has a belt again) up to 154 and beat him up again in Madison Square Garden, that would be a huge fight in the Garden. From there he would still probably be able to outbox and beat James Kirland, call it a career after that.

    I think Cotto can def beat Alvarez. But the timing would be key. A couple of years or couple of fights down the road, the panorama changes considerably, as age is on Canelo's side.
    I just dont see Cotto being able to get Alvarez's respect, Alvarez would walk through Cottos punches and hammer his body until Cotto wilted and was carried out on his shield.

    You also thought (and hoped) Floyd would embarrass Cotto.


    What does hoping it would happen have to do with anything? I didnt say it was going to be a blow out, I just wanted it to happen.

    I have put up my scorecard, I have Cotto winning rounds 3, 6, and 8. 117-111 is a blow out. It was the toughest fight of Floyds career but a clear victory nonetheless.

    If Cotto wasnt embaressed he may have given an interview.

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    Default Re: What's next for Cotto

    Alvarez makes a great match up, then JCC Jnr.

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