Thread: 1939: Armstrongs Oct Run

After just over one month off after his thrilling victory over Ambers at the end of August.

Oct 9 defends title by ko of Manfredo.
Oct 13 defends title by ko of Howard Scott.
Oct 20 defends title by ko of Fontaine.
Oct 24 defends title by pts win over Garrison
Oct 30 defends title by ko of Pacho.

These were all tough SOB's. That is 5 title defenses in 21 days one month following a 15 round war.

Damn

He was amazing like Manny was in 2009.

Originally Posted by Master

He was amazing like Manny was in 2009.

From 1937 to 1938 he scored 27 straight ko's. That is almost a career these days accomplished in one year. When he lost his lightweight rematch with Ambers it ended a 46-0 streak with 39 knockouts. Moving onto welter he made 19 title defenses which is still a record.

October 1939

Bout #1 'On the Tour'

Monday ~ October 9, 1939

Des Moines Coliseum ~ Des Moines, Iowa

Promoter............ Pinkie George

Attendance.......... 5500 {Capacity; 10,000}
Gate Receipts..... $8900

Henry Armstrong vs. Al Manfredo

Henry Armstrong
Age......... 26 years, 10 Months
Height..... 5' 5 1/2"
Reach..... 67"
Weight.... 141 1/2 lbs.
record..... 97-12-7 {65 KO's}
Rank....... Welterweight Champion

Al Manfredo
Age......... 27 years, 1 month
Height..... 5' 9"
Reach...... 70"
Weight..... 146 3/4 lbs.
Record..... 72-21-8 {26 KO's}
Rank....... #18 Welterweight

The Fresno-based Welterweight was at the end of his career. And, Al was previously
taken apart by Henry {L TKO 3} only 10-Months earlier {December 5, 1938} in a
Welterweight Championship bout.

Since that loss, Al had gone 7-2-0 {3 KO's} in his last 9-Bouts, and strictly against
a string of mediocre opponents.

But Al {a 9-Year Professional} was still a 'cagey sort' and a decent fighter with
a good left-hand. But he was no longer considered a Top 10 Welterweight.

Al's style was that of an aggressive and busy puncher, especially with the left-hand,
as he had a good left-jab and a solid left-uppercut to the body.

Al was a 'big' Welterweight, and was very durable, as he had only been stopped
'twice' in his 9-year career of 101-Bouts. That to Henry Armstrong {L TKO 3} on
December 5, 1938 and an early career TKO loss due to a cut-eye.

Note; This bout, though originally billed as a Welterweight Championship Bout was
changed to a 10-Round bout.

Note; Colonel Harvey Miller, the Secretary of the National Boxing Association stated
that Al Manfredo was 'not' a Top 3 Welterweight, and that the NBA would 'not' recognize
the bout as a World Championship fight.

Henry {Age; 29 years, 10 months} was coming off a grueling 15-Rond Bout with
Lou Ambers only 6-Weeks earlier {August 22, 1939}, where Henry lost {L Dec 15}
in a bout for the Lightweight Championship.

But that being said, it was a remarkable feat for Henry to get back into the Ring
in only 6-Weeks.

The Fight >

In the 'Opening Round', Al Manfredo went to work by using his left-jab to good advantage.
Al was able to keep Henry at long-range by using his longer reach, and took the Round
by a slight-edge.

In Round 2, Al Manfredo was on his bicycle, and back-pedaled all around the Ring as
Henry stalked him. Henry put heavy pressure on Al as he chased his over-matched opponent.
The Champion scored with some solid 'left-right' slams, and had Al in the defensive-mode.

In Round 3, Henry 'exploded' and stormed all over Al by showering him with lefts-and-rights.
Al was sent reeling several times, and repeatedly held to stay upright.

Late in the Round, Henry had Al staggering on rubbery legs. Al was 'helpless' at the Bell.

In Round 4, Henry picked up where he left off, and sent Al flying into the Ropes several times.
At the {1:20 Mark}, Henry battered Al into the Ropes again and moments later had him hanging
over the Ropes in a daze.

The Referee - Alex Tidier jumped in and stopped the slaughter at 1:35 of the Round.

Henry by a TKO 4 @ 1:35.

Note > Al Manfredo only fought 'twice' more before retiring.

its amazing how many times they fought. i know that sometimes they were fights against nobodies but sometimes they fought solid competition in a short span.

I'm Not Knocking The October 1939 Run

But, the 2nd Fight in that run was a 'joke'.

Yes, Henry took on Howard 'Cowboy' Scott just 4-days after defeating
Al Manfredo by a TKO 4 in De Moines, Iowa on Monday October 9th.

This bout was also pulled back to 10-Rounds, and the Sportswriters
stated that the bout was more of an 'exhibition' than a Championship
bout.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Friday ~ October 13, 1939

Bout #2 'On the Tour'

The Armory ~ Minneapolis, Minnesota

Attendance......... 6000 {Capacity; 6800}

Henry Armstrong
Age......... 26 years, 10 months
Height..... 5' 5 1/2"
Reach..... 67"
Weight.... 141 lbs.
Record.... 98-12-7 {66 KO's}
Rank....... Welterweight Champion

Howard Scott
Age......... 28 years, 3 months
Height..... 5' 7"
Reach...... 68"
Weight.... 147 lbs.
Record.... 61-38-10 {13 KO's}
Rank....... N/R

Howard 'Cowboy' Scott was a Mid-West 'barn-stormer' from Oklahoma.

And again, this was a scheduled 10-Round bout.

Howard was 'far' from a World Class Top 10 Welterweight, and was the typical
'always ready' club fighter.

Howard was coming into this 'so-called' Welterweight Title Bout by going
an incredible 1-9-0 in his last 10-Bouts, including a {L TKO 6} loss to
Bucky Taylor only 11-days earlier {October 2nd} in Baltimore, Maryland.

To his credit, 'Cowboy' {a 9-Year Professional} was an entertaining fighter who
enjoyed a good scrap. And in 109-Bouts he had only been stopped '7' times.

Howard was really a 135 lb. Lightweight, but was willing to fight over 140 lbs.
at a blink-of-an-eye.

Far from a big puncher, Howard was a surprisingly busy and aggressive
fighter who was willing to trade.

'The Fight'

Henry wasted little time, and the dusky little Champion went right after 'Cowboy'
in the opening Round.

Henry hammered Howard with a series of punches and drove Howard all over
the Ring. But the 'pesky' Challenger fought back hard, despite being out-classed.

But just before the Bell, Henry landed a hard left-hook squarely on Howard's chin,
and dropped him for a '9-Count'. Howard struggled up in a 'dizzy-mess' and barely
made it back to his corner.

Henry came out 'bobbing-and-weaving' at the start of Round 2, and raked over
Howard with a series of lefts-and-rights to both the head and body. Henry 'shellacked'
Howard with punches, and then backed off at the {1:10 Mark}.

The fight moved to Center-Ring, and both fighters were milling about, when suddenly
Henry let loose with a short but powerful right-hand to Howard's jaw. Howard then
tumbled to the canvas.

Referee - John DeOtis counted out Howard Scott @ 1:35 of Round 2.

Note > Howard 'Cowboy' Scott had only '1' more fight in his career before retiring.

After losing the Lightweight Title to Lou Ambers on August 22, 1939

Manager - Ed Meade wanted to take Henry Armstrong on a 'barn-storming'
Tour of the Mid-and-North West.

The bouts would be set with local promoters, and with selected opponents.

Some were 'decent, and some were 'bad'.

The word was, that Henry didn't want a 'rematch' with Lou Ambers in New York
for the Lightweight Championship.

Instead, Manager - Ed Meade focused on the Welterweight Division. Now the
smallish Mr. Armstrong {Height > 5' 5 1/2"} best weight was really at 140 lbs.
as he approached 27 years of age.

The standard agreement in these {off-site} bouts was that Henry would come in
around 141 lbs. and the opponent would get to come in close to the high end
of the Welterweight Division {147 lbs.}

While Henry was on the move, the National Boxing Association was reluctant to
sanction several of these bouts as 15-Round Welterweight Championship Bouts.

Instead, Secretary - Colonel Harvey Miller stated that he would 'sanction'
the 10-Round Bouts as 'Championship Exhibitions'.

While this was going on, in October, Philadelphia Fight Promoter - Phil Glassman
wired Manager - Ed Meade, and offered Henry $20,000 to come to Philadelphia
and fight the winner of the Al Nettlow vs. Leonard Del Genio {October 18th} bout.

Yep, Henry Armstrong's run, Sugar Ray Robinson's run, Willie Pep, Duran, Julio Cesar Chavez, Benny Leonard, Archie Moore, Harry Greb, Joe Louis, Ali: That's why it's a joke for a certain somebody to claim that he's the Greatest of All-Time...

Originally Posted by powerpuncher

its amazing how many times they fought. i know that sometimes they were fights against nobodies but sometimes they fought solid competition in a short span.

Greb fought 49 times in one year. Young Stribling 55 I think. Joe Gans took a train the night after a fight to go meet Langford the next day and crossed the US to do it.

These nobodies were actually doing the same thing as the atg's. That is a fundamental difference between today's fighters and yesterdays. Does anyone believe that Floyd could fight 50 times in one year and remain undefeated? That is 4 fights a month?

Originally Posted by IamInuit

Originally Posted by powerpuncher

its amazing how many times they fought. i know that sometimes they were fights against nobodies but sometimes they fought solid competition in a short span.

Greb fought 49 times in one year. Young Stribling 55 I think. Joe Gans took a train the night after a fight to go meet Langford the next day and crossed the US to do it.

These nobodies were actually doing the same thing as the atg's. That is a fundamental difference between today's fighters and yesterdays. Does anyone believe that Floyd could fight 50 times in one year and remain undefeated? That is 4 fights a month?

The biggest question is if these fighters bodies could hold up. For example, could Floyd's hands handle that many fights even against weak competition? I know his hands get a lot of special treatment. Then it is worth asking how many old fighters weren't able to make it just because of their inability to stay healthy?

Originally Posted by powerpuncher

The biggest question is if these fighters bodies could hold up. For example, could Floyd's hands handle that many fights even against weak competition? I know his hands get a lot of special treatment. Then it is worth asking how many old fighters weren't able to make it just because of their inability to stay healthy?

Floyd, Manny, ect would have eaten those same opponents alive, too. They were experienced, but they really were weak competition for a guy of Armstrong's caliber, and with the quick KO's I doubt he broke a sweat in most of those fights. Guys like Floyd and Manny have tougher sparring sessions I would imagine. In Floyd's heyday, he sparred 9-12 minute rounds for stamina, against better fighters than that. I never did understand the fascination with quantity over quality and I guess I never will, but I don't believe that those guys who fought more often against shitty opposition did anything that modern greats like Floyd, Manny, ect wouldn't have been able to do.

I'm more interested in knowing how they scheduled the fights. Did Armstrong have all those fights booked in advance with dates etched in stone? Or did he dispatch of an opponent quickly and tell his promoter "I feel good, I can fight again on Friday."

Originally Posted by IamInuit

Does anyone believe that Floyd could fight 50 times in one year and remain undefeated? That is 4 fights a month?

Against the same 50 opponents that those guys fought in a year?

Absolutely.

Barnstorming Tour

#3 Bout 'On the Tour'

Friday ~ October 20, 1939

Seattle, Washington

Just 1-Week after destroying Howard 'Cowboy' Scott, Henry will take on an
'old' nemesis in Richie Fontaine.

Richie Fontaine
Age........ 23 years, 7 months
Height.... 5' 6"
Reach..... 66"
Weight.... 141 lbs.
Record.... 36-20-10 {11 KO's}
Rank....... N/R

Richie "The Little Frenchman" Fontaine is a fast-handed and 'scrappy' fighter out of Montana.
At one-time earlier in his career, Richie was a highly regarded Featherweight. Richie is a tough
kid, who is not afraid to trade with anyone.

Included on his log, are '2' bouts with Henry Armstrong at Featherweight in 1936.

As a matter of fact, a 20 year-old Richie defeated {W Dec 10} Henry on February 26, 1936
at the Coliseum in Oakland.

A re-match took place 1-Month later {March 31} at the Olympic Auditorium in Los Angeles,
where Henry turned the tables and scored a {W Dec 10} over Richie.

Richie eventually moved up to Lightweight, but he did not fair so well at the higher
weight. Since March 1936 {3 1/2 years}, Richie has gone 9-11-4 {0 KO's} in 24-Bouts.

But, Richie has been in the Ring with many 'high-quality' fighters during that span.

Richie is coming into this bout on a 'downer' though, as he has only gone 1-4-2 in his last
7-Bouts dating back to October 1938 {1-Year}. And in his most recent bout
3-Months earlier {July 25th}, he was stopped on a cut-eye {L TKO 6} by 'California' Jackie Wilson.

In that bout, at {134 lbs.} Richie looked weak. Also, Richie was injured in an auto accident
in August and has been recuperating.

Still, Richie thinks he has a chance against "Hammerin' Hank".

An 8-year Professional who started his career at {Age; 15}, Richie has only been
stopped 'twice' in 66-Bouts.

Richie Fontaine >
"Henry has been in a lot of wars. I think he's had around 250-Bouts, and he looks
worn down. He's nearly 27 years-old, and he's past his prime. He's ready to be taken."

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Originally Posted by powerpuncher

The biggest question is if these fighters bodies could hold up. For example, could Floyd's hands handle that many fights even against weak competition? I know his hands get a lot of special treatment. Then it is worth asking how many old fighters weren't able to make it just because of their inability to stay healthy?

Floyd, Manny, ect would have eaten those same opponents alive, too. They were experienced, but they really were weak competition for a guy of Armstrong's caliber, and with the quick KO's I doubt he broke a sweat in most of those fights. Guys like Floyd and Manny have tougher sparring sessions I would imagine. In Floyd's heyday, he sparred 9-12 minute rounds for stamina, against better fighters than that. I never did understand the fascination with quantity over quality and I guess I never will, but I don't believe that those guys who fought more often against shitty opposition did anything that modern greats like Floyd, Manny, ect wouldn't have been able to do.

I'm more interested in knowing how they scheduled the fights. Did Armstrong have all those fights booked in advance with dates etched in stone? Or did he dispatch of an opponent quickly and tell his promoter "I feel good, I can fight again on Friday."

true but many of them weren't bums. And they didn't get the time to really nurse injuries. Most fighters couldn't get a personal assistant to give them manicures like Floyd does.

I understand that sparring is kind of a secret thing many times but you do hear every once in a while how the sparring partner gets the better of the main fighter. I'm not sure how frequent that happens. I'm mentioning this because I'm wondering if it's equivalent. How many times do fighters have bad days in training? Then could you pretty easily have a bad fight if you are fighting so many times? It's a lot easier to lose to a lesser fighter because of that. Obviously it's all speculation.

Beanflicker

Ed Meade, the Manager for Henry Armstrong had these October 1939
bouts pretty much booked in advance.

They were 'safe bouts', and bouts that 'No Way in Hell' Henry could lose.

The bout with Richie Fontaine set for October 20th in Seattle, Washington
was signed on September 29th.

The Fight Promoter - Nate Druxman promised to get a worthy Challenger
for Henry.

Richie Fontaine 'was available', and was the best he could get.

Richie looked good in Training Camp, but the 'experts' said that the fight
would go no longer than a few Rounds.

There was little wagering on this bout, as Henry was a Heavy-Favorite to win
easily,