Middleweight, what’s next?

[Ron Swanson]

Canelo has a fight lined up. They haven’t withdrawn the petition. So it is literally to avoid Charlo. He wants the mandatory spot without fighting him. It is by definition to avoid him.

Like you say, he has other options, and they are fine. But the petition is textbook avoiding.

Completely disagree. The king doesn't mingle with the peasants.

Charlo is still at the kids table.

A “petition to avoid” is not avoiding anymore. We have truly reached the point where nothing has meaning.

The king hides behind the peasants, some things never change.

[Alpha]

Canelo has a fight lined up. They haven’t withdrawn the petition. So it is literally to avoid Charlo. He wants the mandatory spot without fighting him. It is by definition to avoid him.

Like you say, he has other options, and they are fine. But the petition is textbook avoiding.

Completely disagree. The king doesn't mingle with the peasants.

Charlo is still at the kids table.

A “petition to avoid” is not avoiding anymore. We have truly reached the point where nothing has meaning.

The king hides behind the peasants, some things never change.

Sorry for the length. I’m going to try this one last time and then I’ll leave it at that.

Just a quick thing, would you want to earn $40mil plus or a portion of that?

Firstly, Canelo is the one avoiding both Charlo and GGG. Canelo along with GBP requested a voluntary defence, this is why the WBC mandated Charlo/ GGG. Charlo is already the interim champion, why should he need to fight GGG to get what he is already entitled to? Who does it help to have Charlo and GGG face each other? It could more than likey be a very physical fight, taking a bit out of both, no matter who wins. It also gives GBP and Canelo a chance to assess what the winner looks like. GGG may win, but will be older and having possibly been in back to back gruelling fights, may be ripe for the picking. Point being if either GGG or Charlo looks outstanding (a first round KO by either for example), Canelo now has the luxury of deciding to stay at 168, where in my opinion the competition doesn’t appear as stiff.

This is so beneficial for Canelo, instead of having to face the interim champ Charlo or an immediate rubber match with Golovkin, Canelo has the perfect set up to allow them to try and eliminate the other. And then he can still decide not fight the winner, with a now built in excuse of wanting to campaign at 168. Now normally I would be all for a Charlo/GGG type fight (and I would love to see it), but right at this moment, it’s not the best fight that can be made at 160, or the best fight for GGG. It is obviously the right fight for Charlo, outside of Canelo.

All this assistance from the WBC, an organisation who Canelo trashed and opted to drop their belt, instead of being dictated to by them. Why would they go out of their way to assist a guy who basically gave them the finger? Couldn’t be the money and trappings Canelo brings could it?
So the only one here avoiding is Canelo.

Ok so secondly let’s get to GGG and the best fights at 160 and for GGG personally. Now his team has said he was going to sit out until May for Canelo, but that was before the WBC Charlo mandate. So he could possibly fight again before the end of the year, but more than likely he’ll be back next year.

Obviously he wants Canelo immediately (who wanted right?). GGG feels he’s beaten him twice already, he ain’t getting any younger and it’s another multimillion dollar payday. Wanting to get crazy money against a guy you feel you have already beaten twice and have had the calls go against you both times vs a fight with Charlo is a no brainer. Calling it ‘avoiding’ shows an agenda or bias. So Canelo is the #1 target.

From there GGG is going to look down the list at the biggest fights that will bring the biggest purses. So big fights, I’ll list them how I see them being the most relevant to GGG’s career:

The Jacobs/ Derevyanchenko winner at the end of this month. Probably won’t be ready to fight again until around February at the earliest. Winner will hold the IBF title. If it’s Jacobs, it’s already got history and many would want to see it. Especially if Jacobs impresses. I also think the fight makes more than a Charlo fight. This is the 2nd most relevant fight for GGG in my opinion.

If it’s Sergiy, it probably won’t be as big an earner as a Jacobs fight but for fans it would be a beast of a match up. Again if Derevyanchenko impresses, then it could start to build a bit of a buzz. The fight would have a bit of history, with the whole GGG avoided Derevyanchenko when he was mandatory thing and getting stripped. The win over Jacobs would be his biggest win at 160. There are also many who feel Jacobs beat GGG, so it would also give Derevyanchenko instant legitimacy. GGG could win the title and use it to push for a unification with Canelo. I would rate this as the 4th most relevant fight for GGG.

The Saunders/ Andrade winner if the fight still happens on Oct-20. Probably won’t be ready again until February at earliest as well. The winner will hold the WBO title. If it’s Saunders, then I think it’s the 3rd most relevant fight GGG could take. It makes more than a Charlo fight in my opinion, especially in the UK and is against an established title holder.
If it’s Andrade, the fight is probably the 5th most relevant fight GGG can make, it’s an unbeaten American title holder, the win over Saunders would be his biggest win at 160, but winning the title from him would give GGG a bargaining chip, for a unification with Canelo.

Jermall Charlo I would rate as the 6th most relevant fight. He is an unbeaten American who holds the WBC interim title. Now you could argue that Charlo could be as high as 4th most relevant, and I wouldn’t argue with anyone who did, I just couldn’t see him ahead of fights with Canelo, Jacobs and Saunders, from GGG and his teams point of view. It’s just, he hasn’t really earnt a shot yet at 160. Sure he was a title holder at 154, but so was Andrade. If Andrade has beaten Saunders, then that’s a better scalp in my opinion than Heiland, Centeno and let’s say Monroe Jr.

Murata, I would rate as GGG’s 7th most relevant option, but it could place anywhere from 4 to 7. It would be for the WBA title. Murata is fighting Brant at the end of the month, but I feel confident Murata will win. So probably won’t be back until February at the earliest. Is 1-1 win N’Jikam, but really should be 2-0 for Murata. Is also an Olympic gold medallist. This probably makes more than a Charlo fight, especially if held in Japan.

I’ll stop there, I won’t both looking above or below, or at retired fighters, lets just focus on 160 and what’s current. 7 options are more than enough.
So for GGG to fight Charlo he has to be taking on a guy who is arguably only his 4th (arguably as low as 7th) best option. That just isn’t logical. Wins against title holders give GGG just as much of a guarantee at Canelo as the interim title does, we have seen Canelo drop the belt before, and now he could have a WBA super-middle title.

GGG’s team have said he was going to sit out until a Canelo fight in May, he may chose to fight one of the guys I mentioned early next year instead. We won’t get into GGG moving up or anything here. With Jacobs and Saunders being the best options outside Canelo.

Now lets say Canelo relinquishes the WBC title and remains at 168 and the WBC make Charlo the full champion. And the winners of Jacobs/ Derevyanchenko and Saunders/ Andrade decided to fight each other. And Murata takes on Lemieux. I would bet my house, that if a Canelo fight can’t be made next, then GGG would fight Charlo in a heartbeat. A Charlo/ GGG fight would be a fantastic match up, unfortunately for Charlo, right now he isn’t even close to being in the conversation.

You want to call it avoiding, that’s fine. I call it logical, and basic common sense.

[powerpuncher]

Looks like Charlo will be facing Sulecki next. I guess it’s probably one of the better fights that can be made in December because everybody else already has fights.

[Alpha]

Looks like Charlo will be facing Sulecki next. I guess it’s probably one of the better fights that can be made in December because everybody else already has fights.

Saw this, I like the fight. Charlo needed to shake some rust. It's a better opponent than Monroe Jr would have been.

[Alpha]

Oh well Jermall settled on Monroe Jr, lets hope Ron is consistent and is disappointed with the opponent choice here.

[Alpha]

So we now have Canelo holding a couple of belts but his next fight being at 168 against Fielding.

Saunders being stripped and being suspend by the WBO.

Andrade winning the vacant title.

Jacobs winning the vacant IBF title with a SD over Derevyanchenko, and Derevyanchenko establishing himself among the top guys.

Brant dominating Murata with an upset win to grab a portion of a title.

Lemieux is supposed to be fighting Tureano Johnson on the Canelo undercard. I expect he'll have a tougher time than he did against O'Sullivan.

Charlo set to face Monroe at the end of the year.


I'm kind of hoping that the 4 Americans want to find out who's the best.

[Master]

Canelo should win the title and defend and unify it against the Gilberto Ramirez

Saunders will fight for the WBO next against Andrade.

Golovkin smashes Brant

[Alpha]

Canelo should win the title and defend and unify it against the Gilberto Ramirez

Saunders will fight for the WBO next against Andrade.

Golovkin smashes Brant

I think Andrade has been granted a voluntary in Feb. Saunders won't be ranked for 9 months by the WBO.

[Master]

Canelo should win the title and defend and unify it against the Gilberto Ramirez

Saunders will fight for the WBO next against Andrade.

Golovkin smashes Brant

I think Andrade has been granted a voluntary in Feb. Saunders won't be ranked for 9 months by the WBO.

Maybe Saunders fights him later in the year then as I think he withdrew his complaint/appeal probably on a promise that he will get a shot for the title.

[Alpha]

Canelo should win the title and defend and unify it against the Gilberto Ramirez

Saunders will fight for the WBO next against Andrade.

Golovkin smashes Brant

I think Andrade has been granted a voluntary in Feb. Saunders won't be ranked for 9 months by the WBO.

Maybe Saunders fights him later in the year then as I think he withdrew his complaint/appeal probably on a promise that he will get a shot for the title.

Last I heard from the recent WBO convention was that they had suspended Saunders for 6 months, and then a further 3 months before he can be rated again. So end of next year at the earliest for the WBO title.

[Alpha]

So Monroe got pinched by VADA, an adverse finding (whatever that means).

Rumor that Korobov may step in as replacement. That's a better fight to me if it happens.

[Ron Swanson]

Oh well Jermall settled on Monroe Jr, lets hope Ron is consistent and is disappointed with the opponent choice here.

Not happy with Korobov and wouldn’t have been happy with Monroe Jr either. But the consistency comes with my desire for the guys that can actually choose to fight other top guys to choose to fight other top guys. Charlo can’t say “I want GGG” and get GGG, GGG can say “I want Charlo” and get Charlo.

[Alpha]

Oh well Jermall settled on Monroe Jr, lets hope Ron is consistent and is disappointed with the opponent choice here.

Not happy with Korobov and wouldn’t have been happy with Monroe Jr either. But the consistency comes with my desire for the guys that can actually choose to fight other top guys to choose to fight other top guys. Charlo can’t say “I want GGG” and get GGG, GGG can say “I want Charlo” and get Charlo.

Yea but that's also like saying "I want a paycut and get a paycut".

[palmerq]

Seems like Andrade is fighting the Soviet geezer who's name starts with a. I forgot exactly, anyway he's the guy Saunders fought and won a decision against and didn't look so great doing it. I guess they want Andrade to bet him in better style to build up a fight with Saunders next year.

[powerpuncher]

Andrade has wasted so many years doing nothing. He is pretty good and has done basically nothing his whole career