So compared to past U.S. heavyweights... Wilder's not very popular in the U.S. Why?

[Primo Carnera]

Furthermore, if Wilder were to beat Fury and AJ, Yeah the Americans would be happy to put the “smug Brits” in their place, but they still wouldn’t go overboard about Wilder because they’ll feel that Fury and AJ Aren’t any great shakes anyway.

[p4pking]

I’m not going to say Wilder is a great boxer, but all of that isn’t true Primo. Michael Grant A’s was mentioned was a good example, he wasn’t very good and got massive hype. Tommy Morrison and Gerry Cooney weren’t very good, I guess all that says is that for many race still plays a role, but still. Arturo Gatti wasn’t world class beyond the very beginning of his career, he was for the most part matched carefully during the height of his popularity, but he was exciting. So is Wilder. He has laid guys out with good punches, the windmills you are referring to come afterwards, as he is definitely a very sloppy finisher. Still, that’s hardly the reason anyone doesn’t want to watch him. You are highly overestimating the level of the average American fan, in terms of appreciating the craft. A lot of it is the fact that there just aren’t as many fans as there used to be. I think Kabong has a good point about where Wilder is from and has fought too.

I don’t think any real boxing fan wouldn’t be excited by the prospect of seeing Wilder against any other HW. They might think he has a slim chance, but they’d still want to see it.

[Gandalf]

I think too many no name fights in his hometown which depending on his true level is either good or bad. We will really see against Fury as Fury can box and Wilder can be outboxed. He was outboxed last time too, so he has something to prove here, but that power is genuine, but power as old Jeff Lacy showed power can only take you so far. If you meet a Calzaghe and you cannot touch him, you are fucked. Wilder should have better boxing skills than he does. Maybe too long at home and not enough perfecting his skills, but maybe it won't matter with Joshua and Fury.

[Spicoli]

As has been stated accurately location and venue has so much to do with it. But one word that keeps bouncing around my head is exposure. To the literal of tv dates and early consistent push and promotion, but also to the scrutiny and reveals that can come with exposure itself and the poor level of Wilders road kill that often left the announcers..if their were any..stating something about 'level of competition and work in process' etc. Add in obvious flaws early and the erratic over caffeinated caveman style and fans saw the holes and were not so easy to buy in or call Wilder the goods. Grab any previous American heavy from last the division peaked here..Holyfield to Bowe to Morrison to others like even Grant or a Larry Donald. All came up on bigger well known National platforms that were known weekly 'dates' for fight fans. It was regular and a given. From USA Tuesday night fights to ESPN to all the big 3 weekend boxing shows on ABC NBC or CBS. They came up gaining fans before they reached a major premier network. Wilder truth be told did not main event on hbo or Showtime until 7+ yrs in and prior to that he was buried on undercards. And that was also his last time in Vegas. His commercial tv spots were absolutely terrible and spotty at best being shown on Telefutura or a low advertised Fox1, again on undercards because the comp was iffy and it was known how raw he was. Networks want to feature competitive action in top positions..not predicatble crude muggings. I mean the man and his keepers just didn't seem to 'package' what was a big brash Olympic medalists and his pro debut took place literally in a bingo club with zero local or tv coverage. Even Shannon Briggs got National airtime and had the mentoring of Teddy Atlas as well as a writer-promoter yelling his praises in front of every camera and filling the New York Times with clip after clip on him. In fairness Briggs got his hbo date early and promptly imploded but he got to the dance. You hone and seed the base and grow outward. City to State to Country. Wilder has in a way actually done it backwards. What he sees as a problem or hassle is there to greatly benefit him and by that I mean AJ himself. Now that in itself has over shadowed the big picture at heavyweight but Wilder should have latched onto that shine and made it his own, attended the live fight where he was invited to be on the mic and aka in the face of AJ. Not talking about riding his coattails but you stake your claim. Likewise expand your base and travel. Instead he sort of settled on twitter wars, beating up mascots while pretending to understand Spanish and settled on maybe 4,5 recent spots in Alabama until Ortiz in Barclays.

And yelling incoherently does not count as great self promotion . Wilder has come a long way and I fully want him to refine and continue to improve but he doesn't come off like the brightest bulb on the string of lights honestly. But he now has the opportunity to combine brutal power, pop and top names better comp in major events that have been absent for so long. His turn to act like he's been in the room before.

[Slim the BoxingManiac]

Wilder absolutely decimates Joshua if they meet.

Which is why Joshua wants nothing to do with him.

If Wilder can’t take Fury’s head off, he doesn’t deserve to be a champion . If Joshua gets “decimated” by Wilder, then Joshua doesn’t deserve to be a champion. If he can get caught by a guy 2 stone lighter with a windmill that can be seen from outer space, he doesn’t deserve to be a champion.
Tell me the last time Wilder KO’d someone where he didn’t
A. Hit them with a windmill
B. Throw about 10 Windmills
C. Took a 5 yard run up.
Now if you or I did one of the above, we would probably knock someone out ffs. That’s not Boxing.
To me, power is when you throw an uppercut for example with hardly any swing and knock someone out. Like Mike Tyson did. Now that is power.
If the most powerful and effective way to Box was to swing like acwhirling dervish doing an impression of a giant Bambi on ice, then everyone would box like that. But it’s not, is it?
The yanks by and large don’t get sucked in by hype, they only go overboard about quality fighters. That is why Wilder hasn’t touched the hearts of the public.

Your hatred for Wilder is clouding your judgement friend

I mean you actually think his punching power is a myth

I will admit that Wilder isn't the most technically skilled boxer in the division, but you're sipping on the haterade so hard that it's removing you from reality.

And also I find it funny that you bring up Tyson in the conversation without realizing the similarities in opposition.

And Fury absolutely schools Joshua as well. Not sure why you're looking down on him.

[smashup]

The Klitschko brothers killed Heavyweight boxing in the US for home grown fighters and the public/promoters lost all interest.
Simple

[Fenster]

I don't buy the location thing, Wilder has fought three of his last 4 fights in New York and won his "world" title in Vegas. He's been promoted by Golden Boy, connected to King and in recent years Al Haymon (all huge outfits). He gets the highest non-PPV TV ratings in the States.

More likely the American public/media have never bought into him because he's never been seen as the genuine worlds best like Tyson and Holyfield and Bowe (to a lesser extent were).

1. Wilder has existed in first the Wlad era and now the AJ one.

2. Tyson and Holyfield blitzed to "world" champion in under two years as a pro, Wilder took 7 years and 30+ fights to pick up a trinket.

Imagine if he'd dethroned Klitschko a few years into his career, he'd have become massive, now he needs to dethrone Joshua. However, as his TV rating prove, he's not half the no-name made out, just in a totally different climate to the past.

[Primo Carnera]

Wilder absolutely decimates Joshua if they meet.

Which is why Joshua wants nothing to do with him.

If Wilder can’t take Fury’s head off, he doesn’t deserve to be a champion . If Joshua gets “decimated” by Wilder, then Joshua doesn’t deserve to be a champion. If he can get caught by a guy 2 stone lighter with a windmill that can be seen from outer space, he doesn’t deserve to be a champion.
Tell me the last time Wilder KO’d someone where he didn’t
A. Hit them with a windmill
B. Throw about 10 Windmills
C. Took a 5 yard run up.
Now if you or I did one of the above, we would probably knock someone out ffs. That’s not Boxing.
To me, power is when you throw an uppercut for example with hardly any swing and knock someone out. Like Mike Tyson did. Now that is power.
If the most powerful and effective way to Box was to swing like acwhirling dervish doing an impression of a giant Bambi on ice, then everyone would box like that. But it’s not, is it?
The yanks by and large don’t get sucked in by hype, they only go overboard about quality fighters. That is why Wilder hasn’t touched the hearts of the public.

Your hatred for Wilder is clouding your judgement friend

I mean you actually think his punching power is a myth

I will admit that Wilder isn't the most technically skilled boxer in the division, but you're sipping on the haterade so hard that it's removing you from reality.

And also I find it funny that you bring up Tyson in the conversation without realizing the similarities in opposition.

And Fury absolutely schools Joshua as well. Not sure why you're looking down on him.

“Your hatred for Wilder is clouding your judgement friend”

I think hate is a very emotive word used ignorantly sometimes. I’m not sure if I Hate anybody. Certainly not sure that there are very few people in the World I could hate without ever meeting or speaking to them.
I used to quite like Wilder as a person, despite never really rating him as a Boxer. But I strongly dislike him now because of his disgusting comments about wanting to kill someone in the ring and how he “wants one on his record.”

“I mean you actually think his punching power is a myth”

Yes. In the sense that anyone can severely damage someone if they get the opportunity to swing wildly or take a run up. Fuck me , he even had to take a run up to floor that fucking mascot!

“I will admit that Wilder isn't the most technically skilled boxer in the division, but you're sipping on the haterade so hard that it's removing you from reality.”

Yeah, nice one!

“And also I find it funny that you bring up Tyson in the conversation without realizing the similarities in opposition.”

Come on mate, don’t embarrass yourself. we won’t go into there early fights unless you want me to, but Mike Tyson’s opponents couldn’t possibly have been worse than Wilder’s. So we’ll go from when Tyson won the title in his 28th fight to Wilder’s opponents from 28th for 10 fights.
TYSON V WILDER
BERBICK. V AUDLEY HARRISON
BONECRUSHER SMITH V LIAKHOVICH
PINKLON THOMAS. V FIRTHA
TUCKER. V MALIK SCOTT
TYRELL BIGGS. V JASON GAVERN
LARRY HOLMES. V BERMANE STIVERNE
TONY TUBBS. V ERIC MOLINA
MICHAEL SPINKS. V DUHAUPAS
BRUNO. V SZPILIKA
CARL WILLIAMS. V ARREOLA

it’s comments like this that make me think that Brock asked to use your profile so he could post when his own profile gets banned. I can’t find another reason for it.

“And Fury absolutely schools Joshua as well. Not sure why you're looking down on him.”

Fury may beat Wilder, and he may school Joshua ....... but if he does , that would prove what a pile of shit they both are. Can’t see it myself, but you never know.
Fury beat Klitschko and that can never be taken away from him. But in reality , one guy averaged 7 punches a round and one 4 punches a round.
Apart from that , who has Fury EVER fought and what has he EVER done?
Add to that, that he’s not had a seriou fight for over 3 years , so if Fury does beat them, then either he’s the greatest HW that has ever lived , or they are seriously below par champions in comparison to previous champions.
I don’t think he’s the greatest HW That has ever lived , so as our transatlantic cousins say, go figure!

[Spicoli]

I don't buy the location thing, Wilder has fought three of his last 4 fights in New York and won his "world" title in Vegas. He's been promoted by Golden Boy, connected to King and in recent years Al Haymon (all huge outfits). He gets the highest non-PPV TV ratings in the States.

More likely the American public/media have never bought into him because he's never been seen as the genuine worlds best like Tyson and Holyfield and Bowe (to a lesser extent were).

1. Wilder has existed in first the Wlad era and now the AJ one.

2. Tyson and Holyfield blitzed to "world" champion in under two years as a pro, Wilder took 7 years and 30+ fights to pick up a trinket.

Imagine if he'd dethroned Klitschko a few years into his career, he'd have become massive, now he needs to dethrone Joshua. However, as his TV rating prove, he's not half the no-name made out, just in a totally different climate to the past.

True enough but it's the entire package and previous lack of 'big' stage. Those early GBP cards were basically in the dark. Also doesn't help that 2 of his last 4 were against late replacement opponents. Truth is fans remember the glory and you just cannot really duplicate the previous eras depth, what they did with Wilder instead of barging into the house and trying for an older scalp for name-exposure purposes or roll the dice early in career with a Wlad (not like Wlad should of or needed to then) they kept Wilder low key and comfortable. Almost like a career cold start now that he has been nearly lapped by AJ in the heavyweight-fan picture and his closest shot at connection to Wlad now is beating the unretired guy who already beat him. And not fighting ,yet, AJ who also knocked the stuffing out of Wlad. Wilder and people didn't really put in the work. Skill or promotion wise imo.

[El Kabong]

The Klitschko brothers killed Heavyweight boxing in the US for home grown fighters and the public/promoters lost all interest.
Simple

No the United States not developing quality heavyweight fighters since Holyfield and Tyson was the problem....our amateur boxing program is a shambles!

We had DECENT heavyweights, but they never were consistent.



Both Wlad and Vitali were top tier amateurs before the dominated the division. Deontay Wilder won bronze and he's the best American heavyweight right now....gee I wonder if that's a coincidence.



Blaming the Klitschko's for killing boxing in the US is complete bullshit. Heavyweight boxing in the US was on it's knees before the Klitschko's even turned pro. Chird Byrd as the top heavyweight from the US, John Ruiz? Lamon Brewster could have been better, but again he struggled with injuries and wasn't consistent. Shannon Briggs? Who else has there been with any promise? Seth Mitchell? NOT a great amateur, John Banks? Too small. Calvin Brock? Got injured and retired.


In order to be competitive in the pros you've got to produce quality amateur talent....look at AJ.

[Memphis]

He's in a great fight now but it's been a long time coming. He's fought way way too many taxi drivers. His power is overrated. He can clump of course he can, but he's not icing anyone decent and the ones he is, are being iced in better fashion by others. His punches are wild, he bundles people over half the time, there's no finesse in anything he does. Some people see him as having other Worldly power, I just don't buy it. His mouth is just as wild, some of the things he says are just horrendous and you can see it on him when he talks, he doesn't believe it half the time and knows he's talking utter shite.

Sometimes of course it just doesn't work out for a guy. I remember yonks back there was a piece in one of the boxing mags about Robin Reid and why he wasn't a huge huge cross over star. He apparently had all the components. Pedigree, good looking bastard, great Grim Reaper moniker, decent talker. Now I'm sure Robin Reid on the whole is happy with what he got from boxing but he was never really the superstar that his parts suggested he'd be. It just didn't work out quite as expected. As far as I can remember Robin Reid never bragged about wanting to kill someone either so....

[El Kabong]

He's in a great fight now

Let's see how the fight goes....good matchup, good records, but exciting fun fight? I don't think it'll be that way. I think it'll be ugly and the talk will be better than the in ring results and that's saying something.

[Memphis]

I'm not expecting a Foreman Lyle shoot out. Lets repackage it as a fight of great significance

[El Kabong]

I'm not expecting a Foreman Lyle shoot out. Lets repackage it as a fight of great significance

100% Agreed, it means a lot....I think it'll be one of those chess match fights, but we'll see who knows, maybe we will get Foreman vs Lyle, but what we know for certain is it's a meaningful heavyweight fight and those are rare. Meaningful fights in general for boxing are rare and this is one of those where it's happening in the prime for both fighters, both undefeated, they have everything to fight for and everything to lose.


Focusing on the fight itself rather than the aura surrounding it....I think Wilder only has 1 way to fight which is to swing for the fences. I think Fury is a slick boxer, he's a lot slicker than I initially gave him credit for. I don't believe Wilder allows Fury to fight a negative style fight the way he did vs Wlad and to be quite honest I don't think Fury's ego is stable enough to accept criticism of fighting another negative style fight. I think Fury will try the mind games with Wilder and hell maybe it'll work, but Wilder isn't a fighter that's in his own head all that much, he's more of a guy with heart and instinct so I think mentally, emotionally, psychologically Wilder and Fury are mirror images of each other but 1 is all power and the other is about just boxing.


It'll be interesting to see what happens...it would be better if we knew more about how Fury was doing in training and so on, there's obviously troubles under the surface (else he wouldn't have take the time off...and of course there's the PEDs question) but you wonder how deep those go.

[mikeeod]

There are a couple of reasons, in my opinion. First, and most painful for me to admit, is that boxing is no longer a major U.S. sport. At one point kids who were poor dreamed of becoming Ali, Louis, Dempsey, Holyfield...etc. U.S. heavyweight champs transcended the sport and used the platform to make political statements that had global impacts. Unfortunately, the media took on the mission of ending the violent sport of boxing in the 80s and eventually achieved their goal (in the U.S., thankfully it is a global sport so it remains popular everywhere else).

The second reason is that Wilder, like Ward, just doesn’t have that “it” factor necessary to pull in casual fans. Floyd is an ATG fighter, without a doubt, but his biggest fights were not a result of people wanting to watch him fight for his skills, it was because he was so damn good at eliciting emotions and creating spectacles. The only way a heavyweight reaches the levels of previous decades is if he is extremely charismatic.