Thread: which style of fighting is most practicle in a real fight.

i've only ever studied boxing. i find it works good just as long as i'm on my feet.

Having skills in

A) boxing or kickboxing

and

B) wrestling or judo

make you one bad ass dude.

Probably boxing, in my opinion. Wrestling and Judo and BJJ are good, but in a real fight, you have to worry about other people. The ground arts leave you too prone to being stomped by people, while boxing will let you fend them off and hopefully drop them quickly to move on to the next.

I've posted extensivley on self defence and real fighting previously. In short a striking art such as boxing and a support system such as judo if it gets in close will basically own everything else. If you are proficient in boxing and judo it covers pretty much every range.

There is so much more to self defence though. Awareness, body language, loop holing. Ive studied and practiced Judo and self defence concepts for years. Here is a post i made on it quite some time ago. Its in response to another post so it may seem a little out of context.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Can't believe no-one has mentioned Judo. Its pressure tested (competition), is adaptable and is widely known and recognised as the best support system in a fight should the fight get close in. Its what a lot of doorman train in. Geoff Thompson (Renowned self protection expert and ex doorman) says judo is the best kept secret in martial arts. I know dan grades that work the doors and they literally OWN every confrontation they find themselves in. Wing Chun is the biggest pile of shyte going (sorry all you wingchunners) I sparred full contact with a Wing Chun red sash and had him submitting 2 times in a couple of mins from two chokes. The 3rd time i threw him on the deck with a bastardised osotogari (grabbing the trachea and powering through) and funnily enough he didn't fancy anymore. Plus their strikes carry zero power (they punch fresh air in training) and under stressful conditions they recall sod all of their fancy straight line punches. The punches carry no weight and are only arm/shoulder punches. Catching a couple on the way in is akin to being hit by a spud gun. (well thats my opinion anyway)

Self defence is so much more than learning to strike. Its all about awareness, situational control, body language, posturing.

I train in Judo (dan grade) and Combatives which is just that. Urban combat. We train to strike pre emptively and cover all bases of combat.We also train eye gouging, biting and all manner of nasty stuff (of course we can't train gouging, biting full contact!!) Judo is my support system.

My advice? Train 3 or 4 pre emptive strikes and drill them until they are second nature.Use correct body mechanics (you will need a teacher for this...dont bother with books). Learn to hit fukcing hard and hit first. When you are faced with a real situation and adrenaline is a factor all your learned fancy training and targetting will go out the window. You will rely on a few gross motor strikes. Judo is the best support system because it is pressure tested in competition. Forget BJJ...if you go to the ground in a bar you are IN THE S*** and someone (anyone...not even someone involved in the altercation) will feel the need to play football with your head.

Look up F.A.S.T training. Fear and Adrenal Stress Training. A lot of martial artsist have had a bit of a shock when attending on of these courses. Suddenly their Karate 'death punches' don't do S*** under the infuelnce of adrenaline.

In summary train strikes (3 or 4)...my suggestion. Elbow,Hammerfist,tiger claw palm strike (you don't want to hit a skull with bare knuckles..learning open hand strikes will allow you to employ continuous attack rather than F****** your hand with the first punch) and chinjab.Traing them hard with full agression and if possible get your training partner to simualte adrenaline by calling you all sorts of names,getting in your face, spitting at you. Then train them pre-emptively hitting the pad with 110% agression and with all the force you can muster. We are looking for a one punch knockout here if that doesn't happen you wan't contiunous attack until the threat has gone.Basically its all about fighting until there is f*ck all to fight about. Combatives is not a two way conversation...its a one sided f*cking beating.

Choose Judo as your support system should the fight get in close. It teaches you weight displacement and body mechanics. Enabling you to get back into a position to win the fight from a standup. Also you can slam the c*nt into the deck. Ever been thrown on concrete from a judoka? You aint getting up.

Minsdet also plays a huge part in self defence. Train agression 110% when you train. You need to be able to flick a swtich in your head and be at 110% agression and fight until the very end.

Self defence/urban combat regardless of art is 80% aggression 20% technique. Ever seen squaddies (soldiers) fight? They are some of the most ferocious fighters i have ever seen yet they hardly have any formal training. Yet their mindset is second to none for out and out aggression.

Thats my two penneth anyway.

---------------------------------------

Hope this helps

Glad to see Judo is well respected, started out a couple of months ago and am now an orange belt

Got into it through my Dad who was brown belt N.Ireland champ before he fucked up his knee. Used to run a dojo (2nd Dan by that time, no brown belt runs a dojo) but just as i got old enough to do it shut down. Fucking typical.

Best part about judo is it requires FIGHTS to progress. If your shit you aint going anywhere. You have to really train. I remember first day i went in, was trashing fellow begginers who were bigger than me so i was naturally a bit proud. Instructer says ok go in with this guy, im like wtf he's about 15 years old. So we start stand up work, guy completely kicked my ass even though he was much smaller and weaker than me. Did that move where you grab them and roll back and kick them over their head (cant remember its name). Shows that using your opponents wait against them really does bring concrete results

oh yeah and to all on this thread, i agree with you about striking combined with judo will pretty much sort you out. Muy Thai would be useful as a striking art aswell i would of thought

Originally Posted by 1-hit Wonder

I remember first day i went in, was trashing fellow begginers who were bigger than me so i was naturally a bit proud. Instructer says ok go in with this guy, im like wtf he's about 15 years old. So we start stand up work, guy completely kicked my a** even though he was much smaller and weaker than me. Did that move where you grab them and roll back and kick them over their head (cant remember its name).

http://www.judoclic.com/tomoe.jpg

Tomoe nage! Come on mate know your terminology. Only kidding. You an 8th Kyu (bottom orange) or 7th Kyu (top orange)?

Re getting your a*** kicked by the younger chaps. I remember when i fisrts started years ago and being a young yellow belt was asked to do randori with a female blue belt. I thought 'he he he she's gonna get ragged something rotten here'. She was small and looked weak.

15 secs into randori she throws me flat on my back 'hard' for ippon sienoge. I think i was taking it a bit easy on her though

Munky, would have been easier to punch her on the jaw?

Originally Posted by Missy

Munky, would have been easier to punch her on the jaw?

You know your problem missy?...You're just too violent

Originally Posted by Munky

Originally Posted by 1-hit Wonder

I remember first day i went in, was trashing fellow begginers who were bigger than me so i was naturally a bit proud. Instructer says ok go in with this guy, im like wtf he's about 15 years old. So we start stand up work, guy completely kicked my a** even though he was much smaller and weaker than me. Did that move where you grab them and roll back and kick them over their head (cant remember its name).

http://www.judoclic.com/tomoe.jpg

Tomoe nage! Come on mate know your terminology. Only kidding. You an 8th Kyu (bottom orange) or 7th Kyu (top orange)?

Re getting your a*** kicked by the younger chaps. I remember when i fisrts started years ago and being a young yellow belt was asked to do randori with a female blue belt. I thought 'he he he she's gonna get ragged something rotten here'. She was small and looked weak.

15 secs into randori she throws me flat on my back 'hard' for ippon sienoge. I think i was taking it a bit easy on her though

Im 8th Kyu, not much but then hey it takes time to climb up the ranks, which wont be for a while see as im out the country. Your right about my terminology, im absolutely crap at it, taken me two months to finally memorise and pronouce Okuri ashi harai properly. Really have to brush up on my terminology when i get back to the UK, gradings above my own wont be so lenient when i look a little clueless as to the instructions (then look to my dad who gestures what to do hehe, ive actually got it down to a pretty fine art i reckon ).

Originally Posted by Munky

I've posted extensivley on self defence and real fighting previously. In short a striking art such as boxing and a support system such as judo if it gets in close will basically own everything else. If you are proficient in boxing and judo it covers pretty much every range.

There is so much more to self defence though. Awareness, body language, loop holing. Ive studied and practiced Judo and self defence concepts for years. Here is a post i made on it quite some time ago. Its in response to another post so it may seem a little out of context.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Can't believe no-one has mentioned Judo. Its pressure tested (competition), is adaptable and is widely known and recognised as the best support system in a fight should the fight get close in. Its what a lot of doorman train in. Geoff Thompson (Renowned self protection expert and ex doorman) says judo is the best kept secret in martial arts. I know dan grades that work the doors and they literally OWN every confrontation they find themselves in. Wing Chun is the biggest pile of shyte going (sorry all you wingchunners) I sparred full contact with a Wing Chun red sash and had him submitting 2 times in a couple of mins from two chokes. The 3rd time i threw him on the deck with a bastardised osotogari (grabbing the trachea and powering through) and funnily enough he didn't fancy anymore. Plus their strikes carry zero power (they punch fresh air in training) and under stressful conditions they recall sod all of their fancy straight line punches. The punches carry no weight and are only arm/shoulder punches. Catching a couple on the way in is akin to being hit by a spud gun. (well thats my opinion anyway)

Self defence is so much more than learning to strike. Its all about awareness, situational control, body language, posturing.

I train in Judo (dan grade) and Combatives which is just that. Urban combat. We train to strike pre emptively and cover all bases of combat.We also train eye gouging, biting and all manner of nasty stuff (of course we can't train gouging, biting full contact!!) Judo is my support system.

My advice? Train 3 or 4 pre emptive strikes and drill them until they are second nature.Use correct body mechanics (you will need a teacher for this...dont bother with books). Learn to hit fukcing hard and hit first. When you are faced with a real situation and adrenaline is a factor all your learned fancy training and targetting will go out the window. You will rely on a few gross motor strikes. Judo is the best support system because it is pressure tested in competition. Forget BJJ...if you go to the ground in a bar you are IN THE S*** and someone (anyone...not even someone involved in the altercation) will feel the need to play football with your head.

Look up F.A.S.T training. Fear and Adrenal Stress Training. A lot of martial artsist have had a bit of a shock when attending on of these courses. Suddenly their Karate 'death punches' don't do S*** under the infuelnce of adrenaline.

In summary train strikes (3 or 4)...my suggestion. Elbow,Hammerfist,tiger claw palm strike (you don't want to hit a skull with bare knuckles..learning open hand strikes will allow you to employ continuous attack rather than F****** your hand with the first punch) and chinjab.Traing them hard with full agression and if possible get your training partner to simualte adrenaline by calling you all sorts of names,getting in your face, spitting at you. Then train them pre-emptively hitting the pad with 110% agression and with all the force you can muster. We are looking for a one punch knockout here if that doesn't happen you wan't contiunous attack until the threat has gone.Basically its all about fighting until there is f*ck all to fight about. Combatives is not a two way conversation...its a one sided f*cking beating.

Choose Judo as your support system should the fight get in close. It teaches you weight displacement and body mechanics. Enabling you to get back into a position to win the fight from a standup. Also you can slam the c*nt into the deck. Ever been thrown on concrete from a judoka? You aint getting up.

Minsdet also plays a huge part in self defence. Train agression 110% when you train. You need to be able to flick a swtich in your head and be at 110% agression and fight until the very end.

Self defence/urban combat regardless of art is 80% aggression 20% technique. Ever seen squaddies (soldiers) fight? They are some of the most ferocious fighters i have ever seen yet they hardly have any formal training. Yet their mindset is second to none for out and out aggression.

Thats my two penneth anyway.

---------------------------------------

Hope this helps

you know me... I've come to really respect judo, but I saw this one vid of greco roman wrestling and hot dang, those guys had some pretty wicked awesome throws too. I never knew that about wrestlers. I thought is was just touch, touch, touch, go for a take done. But they were some pretty nasty belly-belly suplexes I guess you'd call them. Obviously the submissions aren't there though...

boxing and wrestiling i dont think explanation is needed

BTW, Munky's response was in a thread I started on this very same topic. It's why I started boxing, and how I became interested in judo.

Originally Posted by Von Milash

Originally Posted by Munky

I've posted extensivley on self defence and real fighting previously. In short a striking art such as boxing and a support system such as judo if it gets in close will basically own everything else. If you are proficient in boxing and judo it covers pretty much every range.

There is so much more to self defence though. Awareness, body language, loop holing. Ive studied and practiced Judo and self defence concepts for years. Here is a post i made on it quite some time ago. Its in response to another post so it may seem a little out of context.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Can't believe no-one has mentioned Judo. Its pressure tested (competition), is adaptable and is widely known and recognised as the best support system in a fight should the fight get close in. Its what a lot of doorman train in. Geoff Thompson (Renowned self protection expert and ex doorman) says judo is the best kept secret in martial arts. I know dan grades that work the doors and they literally OWN every confrontation they find themselves in. Wing Chun is the biggest pile of shyte going (sorry all you wingchunners) I sparred full contact with a Wing Chun red sash and had him submitting 2 times in a couple of mins from two chokes. The 3rd time i threw him on the deck with a bastardised osotogari (grabbing the trachea and powering through) and funnily enough he didn't fancy anymore. Plus their strikes carry zero power (they punch fresh air in training) and under stressful conditions they recall sod all of their fancy straight line punches. The punches carry no weight and are only arm/shoulder punches. Catching a couple on the way in is akin to being hit by a spud gun. (well thats my opinion anyway)

Self defence is so much more than learning to strike. Its all about awareness, situational control, body language, posturing.

I train in Judo (dan grade) and Combatives which is just that. Urban combat. We train to strike pre emptively and cover all bases of combat.We also train eye gouging, biting and all manner of nasty stuff (of course we can't train gouging, biting full contact!!) Judo is my support system.

My advice? Train 3 or 4 pre emptive strikes and drill them until they are second nature.Use correct body mechanics (you will need a teacher for this...dont bother with books). Learn to hit fukcing hard and hit first. When you are faced with a real situation and adrenaline is a factor all your learned fancy training and targetting will go out the window. You will rely on a few gross motor strikes. Judo is the best support system because it is pressure tested in competition. Forget BJJ...if you go to the ground in a bar you are IN THE S*** and someone (anyone...not even someone involved in the altercation) will feel the need to play football with your head.

Look up F.A.S.T training. Fear and Adrenal Stress Training. A lot of martial artsist have had a bit of a shock when attending on of these courses. Suddenly their Karate 'death punches' don't do S*** under the infuelnce of adrenaline.

In summary train strikes (3 or 4)...my suggestion. Elbow,Hammerfist,tiger claw palm strike (you don't want to hit a skull with bare knuckles..learning open hand strikes will allow you to employ continuous attack rather than F****** your hand with the first punch) and chinjab.Traing them hard with full agression and if possible get your training partner to simualte adrenaline by calling you all sorts of names,getting in your face, spitting at you. Then train them pre-emptively hitting the pad with 110% agression and with all the force you can muster. We are looking for a one punch knockout here if that doesn't happen you wan't contiunous attack until the threat has gone.Basically its all about fighting until there is f*ck all to fight about. Combatives is not a two way conversation...its a one sided f*cking beating.

Choose Judo as your support system should the fight get in close. It teaches you weight displacement and body mechanics. Enabling you to get back into a position to win the fight from a standup. Also you can slam the c*nt into the deck. Ever been thrown on concrete from a judoka? You aint getting up.

Minsdet also plays a huge part in self defence. Train agression 110% when you train. You need to be able to flick a swtich in your head and be at 110% agression and fight until the very end.

Self defence/urban combat regardless of art is 80% aggression 20% technique. Ever seen squaddies (soldiers) fight? They are some of the most ferocious fighters i have ever seen yet they hardly have any formal training. Yet their mindset is second to none for out and out aggression.

Thats my two penneth anyway.

---------------------------------------

Hope this helps

you know me... I've come to really respect judo, but I saw this one vid of greco roman wrestling and hot dang, those guys had some pretty wicked awesome throws too. I never knew that about wrestlers. I thought is was just touch, touch, touch, go for a take done. But they were some pretty nasty belly-belly suplexes I guess you'd call them. Obviously the submissions aren't there though...

I go to another class with a fella from eastern europe who did greco roman wrestling. Fookin hell he is one tough bastard. We always have a laugh when we spar. Granted its got some huge slam type things going on and looks awesome. Those are fight enders right there!

Mongolian Wrestling must be pretty effective.

I mean they did conquer all the known world at the time.