Thread: Yet another example of astonishing fossil preservation

Rather incredibly the BBC news website reports today how palaeontologists have actually drawn using ink from a 150 million year old squid.

BBC NEWS | UK | England | Wiltshire | Ink found in Jurassic-era squid


So not only is this squid unevolved in over 150 million years of evolution it's ink sac full of ink has remained nice and wet for of all that time, no small achievement considering the nozzles on my last printer clogged and went dry after just a few months

Am I the only person here who is sceptical that ink can remain in a liquid form for over 150 million years? That's one hell of a fucking shelf life I'd like to see Epson manage that

Ha the Daily Mail version says 155 Million years!

Apparently the odds of finding something like an ink sac unfossilised according to the evolutionary scientists is a billion to one, a nice find then.

Best of all it includes a photo of the drawing of the squid made using the actual ink from the sac.

If anyone thinks that ink is 155 million years old........seriously.........

The 150million-year-old squid fossil so perfectly preserved that scientists can make ink from its ink sac | Mail Online

Wow a squid with ink in it


I was hoping for one of those big T-Rex things with a wooly mammoth inside it or sommet.

So does this mean time isnt lineal?

Its is all just one big moment we have been trying to measure from our stupid point of view?


"Hey turn around the future has to be that way "

Originally Posted by Bilbo

So not only is this squid unevolved in over 150 million years of evolution it's ink sac full of ink has remained nice and wet for of all that time, no small achievement considering the nozzles on my last printer clogged and went dry after just a few months

Am I the only person here who is sceptical that ink can remain in a liquid form for over 150 million years? That's one hell of a fucking shelf life I'd like to see Epson manage that

Did you read the part about how the "ink" had solidified and had to be ground up and mixed with ammonia before they could "draw" with it?

Did the squids ink stink?

Originally Posted by CGM

Originally Posted by Bilbo

So not only is this squid unevolved in over 150 million years of evolution it's ink sac full of ink has remained nice and wet for of all that time, no small achievement considering the nozzles on my last printer clogged and went dry after just a few months

Am I the only person here who is sceptical that ink can remain in a liquid form for over 150 million years? That's one hell of a fucking shelf life I'd like to see Epson manage that

Did you read the part about how the "ink" had solidified and had to be ground up and mixed with ammonia before they could "draw" with it?

Of course it would have solidified, that would have happened within a couple weeks, the point is that it shouldn't have remained at all. They have now found ink, blood cells, proteins, collagen etc that are supposedly tens of millions of years old, substances previously thought to have shelf lives in the thousands of years at best.

They have found unfossilised hadrosaur bones, do you even know how amazing that is? We now have miners hats from less than a hundred years ago completely fossilised yet some hadrosaur and T Rex bones defied the fossilisation process for millions and millions of years.

And now ink can apparently survive for 150,000,000 too.

I wonder how long before they find a prehistoric tomato from 80,000,000 BC that can be rehydrated and fed to some rabbits, and you'll helpfully point it that the tomato was sundried not fresh.

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by CGM

Originally Posted by Bilbo

So not only is this squid unevolved in over 150 million years of evolution it's ink sac full of ink has remained nice and wet for of all that time, no small achievement considering the nozzles on my last printer clogged and went dry after just a few months

Am I the only person here who is sceptical that ink can remain in a liquid form for over 150 million years? That's one hell of a fucking shelf life I'd like to see Epson manage that

Did you read the part about how the "ink" had solidified and had to be ground up and mixed with ammonia before they could "draw" with it?

Of course it would have solidified, that would have happened within a couple weeks, the point is that it shouldn't have remained at all. They have now found ink, blood cells, proteins, collagen etc that are supposedly tens of millions of years old, substances previously thought to have shelf lives in the thousands of years at best.

They have found unfossilised hadrosaur bones, do you even know how amazing that is? We now have miners hats from less than a hundred years ago completely fossilised yet some hadrosaur and T Rex bones defied the fossilisation process for millions and millions of years.

And now ink can apparently survive for 150,000,000 too.

I wonder how long before they find a prehistoric tomato from 80,000,000 BC that can be rehydrated and fed to some rabbits, and you'll helpfully point it that the tomato was sundried not fresh.

OK, well you were the one who made such a big deal about being skeptical that the ink could be in liquid form, I was just pointing out that which you had apparently overlooked, which was that no-on in either article made the claim that it was liquid in the first place. If you want to now say of course it was solidified, well the discrepancy is obvious.

Anyways, the "ink" had solidified, more than that, it was fossilized. That much is explicit and clear from the BBC article. . If you want to argue that that is not possible, then take it up with The British Geological Survey, and let us know how it goes.

your comments seem to indicate total cluelessness about the concept of fossilization.

I don't believe in evolution and little by little, Bilbo is giving me more reasons not to believe it.

Thanks Bilbo.

I don't see how this dispells evolution?

It is astonishing to me, yet nothing new, to hear someone claim to be intelligent, then within a few breaths say they don't believe evolution. And it isn't even that I am suggesting all smart people agree it is part of our history (even though most do) but more that it amazes me that people have so little subjective reasoning ability. That they'll totally not notice the giant mountain rising up from the Earth in front of them, to then grab a questionable pebble and say, "here it is, and so we climb!"

Yes Youngblood its like having blinkers on.

But to say the reverse is only true, is also having blinkers on too.

I think its a mixture of both creation and evolution. Just because two sections of thought split and two groups took sides who says you have to think one way or the other?

Night and day ,good and evil, hot and cold,white and black. False judgments the whole lot of them; when viewed from only inside their own effect.

I say your spirit your body and your mental state are separate and they each evolve through separate means and the mind is also mainly split in two so as to accommodate the fact you are locked into duality.People can be ran by either, some by one, some by all in balance,that is where our choices and personalities evolve from and form.

Physics is on the brink of proving the whole thing (in this dimension only) is held together by thoughts and that thought is the original form behind energy and energy behind all matter. What will never be measured from where we are at, is the divine feeling that created the original divine thought.

Then unfortuantley a question arose and is being answered internally from within the questioners,us.


We should be growing or evolving on each level. Fixed thinking and fixed beliefs are judgments and that is from the heart of duality and that is what keeps people stuck and not able to think outside of the square.
Their own religious documents warned them about it,their own religion warns them to cease it on all levels, but alas,they judge ,the mental ,the physical and the spiritual all with the same measuring stick ...right or wrong...which is the judgment their own book warns about getting stuck within.


Vibrating frequencies have dimensional limitations; as do thoughts, if your whole system isnt in sync and ready to operate at a higher frequency you will be stuck within one point of view, until you feel to choose otherwise.

lol what's a blinker?

I'm not saying that there aren't possibly things going on we don't know about. There of course are. And we discover more and more each passing day. But to hinge a whole arguement for discounting a mountain of scientifically proven evidence based on a mere belief and no proof is the foolish part. To say, 'ha you can't prove there is no God, therefore there is. So therefore I am right and the world is 6000 yrs old! Here is a tiny morsel of maybe disproof, it all must be beans!" lol is basically that logic simplified. And it is flawed reasoning. But anyway, this is a long tiring subject, and I really am not trying to convert anyone.

But what are you talking about here, "thought is the original form of energy and energy behind all matter? And that physics is on the brink of explaining it and in this dimension only?" lol what?

I'd like to get a bit more clued in where you are finding this stuff. I am pretty aware to where physics is currently, and where M-string theory is in trying to unravel the possibilities of other dimensions (as I've previously discussed, 10 of space, 1 of time in Witten's work after unifying the five differing POVs of string theory) and this is more about understanding particles, supersymmetry, the mysteries of gravity, things that occured micro-seconds after creation, by recreating them. Not thoughts. (You know I can go in this area forever...)

I like you Andre, and I get the whole higher thinking/spirituality based angle you tend to wander in, and a part of me hopes for humankinds sake we further evolve as a species beyond the mere physical and one day become an enlighted species, beyond such petty things now as our primary negative emotions and traits, anger, greed, domination, jealousy, self-centeredness etc. They will be our downfall I believe.

And Andre, I agree we should have an open mind.

I guess what I am saying regarding religion and such things, is OK, you creationists who must believe in some kinda God, have your belief, your faith, but don't try to use that to in some way argue facts that are proving to explain the known universe. As well the unseeable universe. That explain who you are and where you came from. The realm in which we live. We have laws of nature that make it work. These laws, and science are leading us there to an answer. Hey, who knows what that answer is. It may even be God. But blind faith is often trying to pull us back. And why? Because science contradicts a bunch of beliefs written up thousands of years ago by some dudes sitting around, and people, for whatever reason, can't get there heads around that...it was likely just a story! Made by men.

So anyway, yea. This is a subject which ofc will never have closure. But we are getting closer. By doing math. By conducting experiments. By challenging beliefs, questioning. By theorizing. And it's a good thing too. Otherwise we'd all still be living on a flat world.

Originally Posted by Youngblood

lol what's a blinker?

I'm not saying that there aren't possibly things going on we don't know about. There of course are. And we discover more and more each passing day. But to hinge a whole arguement for discounting a mountain of scientifically proven evidence based on a mere belief and no proof is the foolish part. To say, 'ha you can't prove there is no God, therefore there is. So therefore I am right and the world is 6000 yrs old! Here is a tiny morsel of maybe disproof, it all must be beans!" lol is basically that logic simplified. And it is flawed reasoning. But anyway, this is a long tiring subject, and I really am not trying to convert anyone.

But what are you talking about here, "thought is the original form of energy and energy behind all matter? And that physics is on the brink of explaining it and in this dimension only?" lol what?

I'd like to get a bit more clued in where you are finding this stuff. I am pretty aware to where physics is currently, and where M-string theory is in trying to unravel the possibilities of other dimensions (as I've previously discussed, 10 of space, 1 of time in Witten's work after unifying the five differing POVs of string theory) and this is more about understanding particles, supersymmetry, the mysteries of gravity, things that occured micro-seconds after creation, by recreating them. Not thoughts. (You know I can go in this area forever...)

I like you Andre, and I get the whole higher thinking/spirituality based angle you tend to wander in, and a part of me hopes for humankinds sake we further evolve as a species beyond the mere physical and one day become an enlighted species, beyond such petty things now as our primary negative emotions and traits, anger, greed, domination, jealousy, self-centeredness etc. They will be our downfall I believe.

And Andre, I agree we should have an open mind.

I guess what I am saying regarding religion and such things, is OK, you creationists who must believe in some kinda God, have your belief, your faith, but don't try to use that to in some way argue facts that are proving to explain the known universe. As well the unseeable universe. That explain who you are and where you came from. The realm in which we live. We have laws of nature that make it work. These laws, and science are leading us there to an answer. Hey, who knows what that answer is. It may even be God. But blind faith is often trying to pull us back. And why? Because science contradicts a bunch of beliefs written up thousands of years ago by some dudes sitting around, and people, for whatever reason, can't get there heads around that...it was likely just a story! Made by men.

So anyway, yea. This is a subject which ofc will never have closure. But we are getting closer. By doing math. By conducting experiments. By challenging beliefs, questioning. By theorizing. And it's a good thing too. Otherwise we'd all still be living on a flat world.

Fuck you for being half my age and twice as smart as me. I hope you die.

Originally Posted by Youngblood

lol what's a blinker?

I'm not saying that there aren't possibly things going on we don't know about. There of course are. And we discover more and more each passing day. But to hinge a whole arguement for discounting a mountain of scientifically proven evidence based on a mere belief and no proof is the foolish part. To say, 'ha you can't prove there is no God, therefore there is. So therefore I am right and the world is 6000 yrs old! Here is a tiny morsel of maybe disproof, it all must be beans!" lol is basically that logic simplified. And it is flawed reasoning. But anyway, this is a long tiring subject, and I really am not trying to convert anyone.

But what are you talking about here, "thought is the original form of energy and energy behind all matter? And that physics is on the brink of explaining it and in this dimension only?" lol what?

I'd like to get a bit more clued in where you are finding this stuff. I am pretty aware to where physics is currently, and where M-string theory is in trying to unravel the possibilities of other dimensions (as I've previously discussed, 10 of space, 1 of time in Witten's work after unifying the five differing POVs of string theory) and this is more about understanding particles, supersymmetry, the mysteries of gravity, things that occured micro-seconds after creation, by recreating them. Not thoughts. (You know I can go in this area forever...)

I like you Andre, and I get the whole higher thinking/spirituality based angle you tend to wander in, and a part of me hopes for humankinds sake we further evolve as a species beyond the mere physical and one day become an enlighted species, beyond such petty things now as our primary negative emotions and traits, anger, greed, domination, jealousy, self-centeredness etc. They will be our downfall I believe.

And Andre, I agree we should have an open mind.

I guess what I am saying regarding religion and such things, is OK, you creationists who must believe in some kinda God, have your belief, your faith, but don't try to use that to in some way argue facts that are proving to explain the known universe. As well the unseeable universe. That explain who you are and where you came from. The realm in which we live. We have laws of nature that make it work. These laws, and science are leading us there to an answer. Hey, who knows what that answer is. It may even be God. But blind faith is often trying to pull us back. And why? Because science contradicts a bunch of beliefs written up thousands of years ago by some dudes sitting around, and people, for whatever reason, can't get there heads around that...it was likely just a story! Made by men.

So anyway, yea. This is a subject which ofc will never have closure. But we are getting closer. By doing math. By conducting experiments. By challenging beliefs, questioning. By theorizing. And it's a good thing too. Otherwise we'd all still be living on a flat world.

Sorry mate; Blinkers, like on horses to create tunnel vision.

I like you too by the way, but we wont get a room. :-)

I have studied and practiced so many things I cant say all as some ways are to be found by those who seek.

I'll try and split up and answer all you asked of me there just so you can begin to understand why I choose to view it the way I do; but from the physical -add and subtract point of view only Im more with Albert Einstein than anyone else regarding the big question.

I dont agree with him at all that mankind does not shape his own life because I know that it is shaped by our previous incarnations our Karmic position and our agreements and more than that our intention from being right in the moment of now.

Many ancient scriptures had that knowledge removed and kept secret completly in order to hold people under an "its now or never for you" fear based control', so as to gain full control over the masses, who breeds faster who has money tithed to them etc, as they still do.

The Vatican its self has this knowledge and more under lock and key and Rome will not relinquish control over its adopted and reshaped religion, Just yet there is too much $ and control of people at stake.

Anyway some excerpts from the times when Albert E was asked the big question:

Do you believe in God?
“I’m not an atheist. I don’t think I can call myself a pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn’t know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God. We see the universe marvelously arranged and obeying certain laws but only dimly understand these laws.”
Is this a Jewish concept of God? “I am a determinist. I do not believe in free will. Jews believe in free will. They believe that man shapes his own life. I reject that doctrine. In that respect I am not a Jew.”
Is this Spinoza’s God? “I am fascinated by Spinoza’s pantheism, but I admire even more his contribution to modern thought because he is the first philosopher to deal with the soul and body as one, and not two separate things.”

Do you believe in immortality? “No. And one life is enough for me.”

Einstein tried to express these feelings clearly, both for himself and all of those who wanted a simple answer from him about his faith. So in the summer of 1930, amid his sailing and ruminations in Caputh, he composed a credo,
“What I Believe,” that he recorded for a human rights group and later published. It concluded with an explanation of what he meant when he called himself religious: “The most beautiful emotion we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion that stands at the cradle of all true art and science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead, a snuffed-out candle. To sense that behind anything that can be experienced there is something that our minds cannot grasp, whose beauty and sublimity reaches us only indirectly: this is religiousness. In this sense, and in this sense only, I am a devoutly religious man.”



People found the piece evocative, even inspiring, and it was reprinted repeatedly in a variety of translations. But not surprisingly, it did not satisfy those who wanted a simple, direct answer to the question of whether or not he believed in God. For some, only a clear belief in a personal God who controls daily life qualified as a genuine faith. “The outcome of this doubt and befogged speculation about time and space is a cloak beneath which hides the ghastly apparition of atheism,” Boston’s Cardinal William Henry O’Connell said. This public blast from a Cardinal prompted the noted Orthodox Jewish leader in New York, Rabbi Herbert S. Goldstein, to send a very direct telegram: “Do you believe in God? Stop. Answer paid. 50 words.” Einstein used only about half his allotted number of words. It became the most famous version of an answer he gave often: “I believe in Spinoza’s God, who reveals himself in the lawful harmony of all that exists, but not in a God who concerns himself with the fate and the doings of mankind.”








That last statment has so much hidden wisdom in it that has to do with why God remains whole ,untouched and in his/her original form elsewhere away from this lower dimension that we experience our own stuff from. Which is also linked to why there is only about 4% matter in the whole universe and how it is held in formations.