Thread: relation between body weight and punching power?

I read this article that explains some reasons why bodybuilding doesn't neccessarily increase punching power: Why Lifting Weights Won’t Increase Punching Power

It said:

- "Punching power (damage caused) = acceleration (hand speed) x force (muscle strength & body weight)"

- its more efficient to use your body weight for power than to add unnecessary weight to your arms through bodybuilding (this would slow the acceleration of your arm during a punch and lead to underwhelming results)


So I ask the experienced among you: in theory, if someone were to aim to use bodybuilding techniques to build a couple more pounds of muscle in their lower body, would it lead to a more destructive punch? sounds like it would increase body weight without affecting the acceleration of the punch. I'm asking this, regardless of whether it would make your footwork rigid or anything... just interested for the sake of science!!

thanks for your thoughts.


Edit: Oh, also! what is your opinion regarding expertboxing.com for advice? they seem very popular as far as articles go, but that doesnt mean they're the best source... thoughts?

Just for starters the formula is not right. When we take the same simplifications that all the energy there is(maybe if we say at the end of the punch the other types of energy don’t play major role), is kinetic energy really simplified it must look like:

E(kin)= SUM of all components(i)(0.5* V²_i * m_i +0.5 * FI²_i * J_i)

Where V_i is the velocity of each component, Fi the rotational speed, m the mass and J the inertia.
Then the Power will look something like:
dE/dt = P = SUM of all components(i)(V_i * (V_i)′ + Fi_i * (Fi_i)′ * J_i)
where for simplification J_i is constant, V_i is the rate of change of the acceleration and Fi_i is the rate of change of the angular acceleration. Now maybe its just by me but at the end of the punch i don’t accelerate much more so the power is way down... So you are left with the maximum kinetic energy and IMPULSE. So in boxing we try to get maximum impulse on impact. For example in the right hand you try to get maximal rotational speed of your body and you don’t try to push of the punch with your right leg and hands.
Now if we go back at the beginning we will see that before the kinetic energy there was the potential one. Here you must ask yourself how do I convert the one type into the other in the most effective way (balance, form...). Other important aspect of the punch is the impact. How do you land your punch without loosing energy(for example distance). Other simple question is can I land it on someone in my life?
Now there is the other aspect. If you are a keyboard warrior, like myself, even a walk in the park will improve everything

Originally Posted by doebird

acceleration (hand speed)

actually decceleration of the hand before the impact

It is the application of your body weight; getting as much of it in the right place before impact. Being bulky doesn't assist that; I don't know, necessarily, that it hurts it either. I either case the whole key to punching hard is punching properly, technique-wise. I remember watching a former Mr Olympia box, on ESPN, against Dickie Ryan (a guy that ended up having a ton of fights). Mr Olympia came out swinging and seemed to be hitting pretty hard but those big arms got heavy and he got tired of swinging them. Ryan rode out the first and stopped him in the second with a left hand to the body.
The guy on expertboxing came from the gym in LaHabra, California. That used to a good gym; back in the 80s, pros like Rocky Garcia and Baby Joe Ruelas trained there. Freddie Roach taught boxing there for a brief time when he first went out on his home; my little brother's cellie trained with him before going to prison.

Of course 'bodybuilding' doesn't improve performance. Bodybuilding develops superficial musculature in the pursuit of aesthetics.

Weight lifting doesn't just equate to bodybuilding... Just as Juan Manuel Marquez

Purposeful weight training should lead to myofibular hypertrophy (as opposed sarcoplasmic attained from bodybuilding), mobility and mechanical efficiancy of the skeletal muscle system and most importantly for somebody looking to improve performance withouting gaining weight - development of the nervous system, leading to greater output from the muscles.

A heavier athlete with a better developed nervous and musculature system will always hit harder than somebody smaller, assuming technique and proportions are equal.

Clearly a well developed athlete with sound technique is going to hit harder than a pumped up bodybuilder. Why wouldn't he?

Thanks for the more complete information, guys!

Originally Posted by greynotsoold

I remember watching a former Mr Olympia box, on ESPN, against Dickie Ryan (a guy that ended up having a ton of fights). Mr Olympia came out swinging and seemed to be hitting pretty hard but those big arms got heavy and he got tired of swinging them. Ryan rode out the first and stopped him in the second with a left hand to the body.

that sounds like an interesting match. do you remember the name of the Mr. Olympia? I want to see if I can find a recording of it!!

Originally Posted by doebird

Thanks for the more complete information, guys!

Originally Posted by greynotsoold

I remember watching a former Mr Olympia box, on ESPN, against Dickie Ryan (a guy that ended up having a ton of fights). Mr Olympia came out swinging and seemed to be hitting pretty hard but those big arms got heavy and he got tired of swinging them. Ryan rode out the first and stopped him in the second with a left hand to the body.

that sounds like an interesting match. do you remember the name of the Mr. Olympia? I want to see if I can find a recording of it!!

I believe that the guy was Shaun Ayers, and the fight was in March of 1991. I was suprised to see that Ayers fought on after that, had 35 pro fights, in fact. I think he was Mr Olympia or was runner-up.

If speed remains the same and body weight increases the punch will be more powerful where ever you put the weight on, since the body is throwing the arm its probably better to have the weight on the body.

Bodybuilding will make you gas, put you in a weight division you dont belong in, and may make punching power increase very inefficiently ie via weight gain or it may even make it decrease if it causes you to slow down too much.

Lifting weights correctly and other resistance exercises can help, bodybuilding however is like an insidious poison to athletes and boxers.

The guy is knowledgeable on boxing good enough for most to learn form he is not an expert though he is a business man and he does get somethings wrong. But most of it is useful. I think My boxing coach and boxing fitness factory are some of the best to learn from.

With regards to his advice on not weight training, well you WILL gain power in your punches if you increase lower body strength and speed, so he is wrong. I mean its obvious, if you know how to throw a cross properly and you drive with the rear leg into the punch, well someone who did squats and plyometrics will
have a faster stronger leg drive and a more powerful punch. (his justification that a punch is elastic etc dosnt hold up because the power flows through the upper body it dosnt come from the upper body, it comes from the lower body, which isnt being used in an elastic way its being used in a normal concentric way)