Thread: Thomas Hearns - Should've (Could've) Been #1 GOAT.

A couple of other current Threads have got me thinking lately about this . Also , it shows how our views can change over a period of time .
Many years ago , Me and a Mate werde having a debate about the all time standings of the 4 kings. At the time, I ventured to put Duran above Hearns, and quite quickly got put in my place citing the way Hearns comatosed Duran. Fair point.
Gotta say, I'm slighly embarrassed by that view back then. Not because Duran wasn't an amazing fighter who rightfully is lauded as one of the all time greats himself, but more because as times gone on, at this moment in time, I probably have Hearns as my all time fave.
And I've said a few times on here recently, that IF he had Beaten Leonard , and IF he hadn't thrown the gameplan out the window against Hagler, he could've perhaps been all time #1.
I deliberately put the "IF's" in capitals , but not because they are BIG IF's. these things could've conceivably happened, they aren't outlandish.
I kinda would've liked this to be the case , because what's not to like?
1. Freakishly tall for his starting career weight , which enabled him to naturally move up the weights
2. Lovely technique allied to nastiness and aggressiveness
3. Text book venomous jab.
4. Heart and Strength.
5. Desire and love for Boxing. You don't box to the age he did if you didn't possess that.
6. Oodles of ability.
7. Probably Boxed like every single one of us would've wanted to if we were that blessed.
Yes , he had the odd glitch at this Elevated status, like maybe the Barkley loss, but then who doesn't ?
I might get some opposition to this , but happy to hear it.

Originally Posted by Primo Carnera

A couple of other current Threads have got me thinking lately about this . Also , it shows how our views can change over a period of time .
Many years ago , Me and a Mate werde having a debate about the all time standings of the 4 kings. At the time, I ventured to put Duran above Hearns, and quite quickly got put in my place citing the way Hearns comatosed Duran. Fair point.
Gotta say, I'm slighly embarrassed by that view back then. Not because Duran wasn't an amazing fighter who rightfully is lauded as one of the all time greats himself, but more because as times gone on, at this moment in time, I probably have Hearns as my all time fave.
And I've said a few times on here recently, that IF he had Beaten Leonard , and IF he hadn't thrown the gameplan out the window against Hagler, he could've perhaps been all time #1.
I deliberately put the "IF's" in capitals , but not because they are BIG IF's. these things could've conceivably happened, they aren't outlandish.
I kinda would've liked this to be the case , because what's not to like?
1. Freakishly tall for his starting career weight , which enabled him to naturally move up the weights
2. Lovely technique allied to nastiness and aggressiveness
3. Text book venomous jab.
4. Heart and Strength.
5. Desire and love for Boxing. You don't box to the age he did if you didn't possess that.
6. Oodles of ability.
7. Probably Boxed like every single one of us would've wanted to if we were that blessed.
Yes , he had the odd glitch at this Elevated status, like maybe the Barkley loss, but then who doesn't ?
I might get some opposition to this , but happy to hear it.

I was a HUGE fan of Hearns, and didn't exactly like Duran during his early years. So needless to say I was more than a bit joyous when the Hitman starched Duran.

Having said that... if you got "put in your place" when putting Duran over Hearns in your ATG list... seems you weren't ready to defend your argument.

The fact is: a fighter who started his career at superbantam... standing all of 5'-7" with a reach of 66"... whose wheelhouse was anywhere between light (his peak) and welter... faced a 6'-1" fighter (with a 78" reach) at superwelter... a man whose build was arguably suited for lightheavy... AND... he got blown out of the ring.

An ATG in his own right, mind you... because Hearns belongs right up there with the best ever... but a total mismatch in size.

By the way... I keep correcting you people. There were five kings, not four. Wilfredo Benitez fought three of the other four.

For me, Thomas Hearns was the most frightening boxer ever. I would have preferred to face Tyson, Foreman or Julian Jackson than the Hit Man. He looked like he wanted to decapitate your head from your shoulders with that right hand. His jab was razor sharp and would slice his opponents. The left hook to the head or body was unappreciated because of his other outstanding weapons. He was fast, tall and had tremendous power which he loved to use. His will to win and excitement he brought to boxing is legendary.

His physique and those eyes would make me want to run out of the ring. I am sure X will not mind me saying that he shared a gym (and ring) with him.

How Ray Leonard beat him god only knows, and I wonder how Sugar Ray Robinson would have fared against at welterweight. I could only see Robinson being able to beat that version of Hearns. Floyd, Tito, Oscar, Manny, Spence or Crawford would all lose.

Thomas Hearns was a better p4p fighter than Leonard even though he lost to him. Tommy really beat him in the rematch knocking Leonard down twice and was robbed in that fight. Hearns was better at light middleweight, super middleweight, and light heavyweight. He beat the undefeated Vigill Hill which elevates him on the p4p list.

If Hearns fought Benn, G Man, Jackson, Roy Jones, GGG, Canelo there would be dynamite in the ring.

Leonard is higher as an ATG. (Cue Primo ripping into me )

Originally Posted by Master

For me, Thomas Hearns was the most frightening boxer ever. I would have preferred to face Tyson, Foreman or Julian Jackson than the Hit Man. He looked like he wanted to decapitate your head from your shoulders with that right hand. His jab was razor sharp and would slice his opponents. The left hook to the head or body was unappreciated because of his other outstanding weapons. He was fast, tall and had tremendous power which he loved to use. His will to win and excitement he brought to boxing is legendary.

His physique and those eyes would make me want to run out of the ring. I am sure X will not mind me saying that he shared a gym (and ring) with him.

How Ray Leonard beat him god only knows, and I wonder how Sugar Ray Robinson would have fared against at welterweight. I could only see Robinson being able to beat that version of Hearns. Floyd, Tito, Oscar, Manny, Spence or Crawford would all lose.

Thomas Hearns was a better p4p fighter than Leonard even though he lost to him. Tommy really beat him in the rematch knocking Leonard down twice and was robbed in that fight. Hearns was better at light middleweight, super middleweight, and light heavyweight. He beat the undefeated Vigill Hill which elevates him on the p4p list.

If Hearns fought Benn, G Man, Jackson, Roy Jones, GGG, Canelo there would be dynamite in the ring.

Leonard is higher as an ATG. (Cue Primo ripping into me )

no I'm not going to rip into you, I can see some logic in your thought there. But losses are losses unfortunately.
it highlights a difference in ATG and P4P thinking though. the other thing i would say, is that I am more confident that Hearns would've beaten Floyd in a Prime v Prime matchup than i am about SRL v Floyd . (I Know their primes are different weights , so that's something else that makes it difficult.)

Leonard beats Floyd all day long, it would be a good fight but see him better in all departments. It would be a similar fight to how he beat Benitez.

Hearns actively went on to take the biggest challenges. Some may have rated him higher if he avoided Leonard, waited for Hagler to retire, not taken on the champions at the higher weights to protect his zero like some fighters do.

Tommy should not be penalised to losing to greats or someone who had his number like Barkley. Ali had his Norton, Tyson his Holyfield, Shane his Forrest.

Canelo should not be penalised for his losses or Wlad for his early KO’s when he dominates the weight to beat all credible challengers when they are on the p4p list.