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Thread: The Cavemen

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    Default The Cavemen

    One of the very best things about the greatest of sports is that almost any set of physical gifts can be crafted into a style that, with enough work, can bring results. Back in the bare-knuckle days four traits were generally considered essential to becoming a top man. Punching power, durability, stamina and what was called “bottom.” Bottom is a combination of fighting spirit, tenacity and sheer grit. When the Marquess of Queensbury Rules became widely adopted, additional attributes like hand and foot speed, agility and an instinctive understanding of ring geometry became as important as the first four.

    And yet over the past 120 years men gifted with only the first four traits have been able to succeed at the highest level. I call them the cavemen because they are a throwback to earlier times. Put most simply, cavemen are more man than the other guy. They can take more of what the other guy has than they can take of his. Cavemen are NOT men of great skill who also have these traits (think Julio Cesar Chavez or Marvin Hagler or Sandy Saddler). Instead these are the men who thrived almost only on basic physicality and mental toughness. Here in chronological order are some of them.

    Jim Jeffries-Heavyweight champ circa 1900. One of the all-time astounding athletes. 6’2, 230 or so, ran a hundred yards in just over ten seconds, high jumped six feet and was strong enough to carry a large deer nine miles over open ground without putting it down. Jeffries fought out of a deep crouch and was neither exceptionally agile nor fast of hand. But he could take more punishment than George Chuvalo and keep coming. How durable was Jeffries? He OK’d legendary puncher Bob Fitzsimmons plastering over an injured hand for their second fight. Jeffries more or less took punishment for however long it took the other guy to get tired and then took over with Foreman like thudding punches.

    Battling Nelson-Lightweight King circa 1905. The perfect nickname, the Durable Dane. Nelson was an all action volume puncher who registered three top level KO’s past the 20th round and lost two legendary fights by KO past the 40th round. His stamina was his hallmark. Joe Gans himself called him “impervious to punishment.” His low heart rate astounded physicians of the time.

    Ad Wolgast-The man who took the 135 crown from Nelson. The Michigan Wildcat was beaten about the ring for the first 21 rounds and dropped in the 22nd. Nelson crowed “twenty three skidoo” certain he had won. But then he felt someone clutching at his legs. Wolgast climbed Nelson’s legs and torso to beat the count. By round 30 he had closed Nelson’s eye and after forty rounds he did the unthinkable, he outlasted Battling Nelson. Wolgast is among the saddest of boxing stories. Before he was 30 he was committed and spent the rest of his days in and out of psychiatric hospitals. For the rest of his life he trained for a coming rematch with Nelson.

    Paul Berlenbach-Light heavy champion circa 1925. He was famously described by Paul Gallico as “untutored, unlettered, slow-witted, slow-moving, and wholly lacking in animation or imagination.” That may have been because Berlenbach spent his first 18 years deaf and mute. An electric shock gave him both of those abilities. Berlenbach fought out of a deep crouch, had been a national champion wrestler and had stamina, the ability to withstand great pain and a big punch. Half of his losses came to the great Jack Delaney.

    Jake LaMotta-The Bronx Bull. Middleweight champ circa 1950. A legendary chin and awful hands. They were unusually small and fragile. That led to LaMotta becoming a fantastic bodypuncher. Hopelessly behind to Laurent Dauthuille after fourteen rounds, the Bull kept his crown by a body punch driven KO with only a few seconds left in the final round.

    Rocky Marciano-Heavyweight champ circa 1953. A shockingly strong man for his size. He used a 300 pound heavy bag while weighing only 185. Perhaps the fittest man in the history of the heavyweights. Could take extraordinary punishment and keep coming.

    Carmen Basilio-The Onion Farmer. Welter and middle King of the mid 1950’s. As relentless as the tide. He was like a little Jeffries. He could just take more than you could hand out. As extraordinary a boxing spirit as the sport has known. If you watch him on Ringside you really get the idea that even now at 80+ he would be a formidable challenge.

    George Foreman-Big George. The modern archetype. Heavyweight king twenty years apart. Extraordinary power, great chin and the greatest “get OFFA me” push off to get distance I ever saw.

    Khaosai Galaxy-115 strapholder of the late 1980’s. The closest thing I’ve seen to an in ring Terminator. "It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!” Amazing they could put that much muscle on a man that size. A southpaw with an iron jaw, an unquenchable will and a punch to break bones.

    Recently and today men like Librado Andrade, Juan Urango, Antonio Margarito and Marco Maidana fit this bill. The cavemen. They aren’t pretty, they aren’t skilled, they can be made to look foolish sometimes. But they keep coming.
    Last edited by marbleheadmaui; 06-23-2011 at 07:27 AM.
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    Default

    First of all I have to say great thread, it is interesting and thought provoking. I'm curious to see how this thread plays out because I think it is going to be a hotly debated one. I will withhold my opinion of your list until the thread gets heated up for fear of possibly embarassing myself.

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Quote Originally Posted by chinchekked View Post
    First of all I have to say great thread, it is interesting and thought provoking. I'm curious to see how this thread plays out because I think it is going to be a hotly debated one. I will withhold my opinion of your list until the thread gets heated up for fear of possibly embarassing myself.
    Wait a minute, I put myself out there like this and YOU are afraid of embarassing yourself! Duuuude!
    Hidden Content Bring me the best and I will knock them out-Alexis Arguello
    I'm not God, but I am something similar-Robert Duran

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Blueprint caveman = Tex Cobb. Nevertheless even made it as hollywood-actor. What a thread,omg.

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Quote Originally Posted by GOAT View Post
    Blueprint caveman = Tex Cobb. Nevertheless even made it as hollywood-actor. What a thread,omg.
    His greatest win was driving Howard Cosell from the ring!

    Tex is a perfect call.
    Hidden Content Bring me the best and I will knock them out-Alexis Arguello
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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    I'd add Vito Antefuermo to the list. He was definately a caveman and wore others down with is face.

    Iran Barkley was also a caveman, though a bit more talented than Antefuermo.
    "You knocked him down...now how bout you try knockin me down ?"

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Quote Originally Posted by Hulk View Post
    I'd add Vito Antefuermo to the list. He was definately a caveman and wore others down with is face.

    Iran Barkley was also a caveman, though a bit more talented than Antefuermo.
    Vito is one of the strangest guys ever. How in hell did a guy who moved like a heavy and punched like a lightweight become middle champ?

    The Blade is a good call.
    Hidden Content Bring me the best and I will knock them out-Alexis Arguello
    I'm not God, but I am something similar-Robert Duran

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Quote Originally Posted by marbleheadmaui View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Hulk View Post
    I'd add Vito Antefuermo to the list. He was definately a caveman and wore others down with is face.

    Iran Barkley was also a caveman, though a bit more talented than Antefuermo.
    Vito is one of the strangest guys ever. How in hell did a guy who moved like a heavy and punched like a lightweight become middle champ?

    The Blade is a good call.
    Both were bad asses.
    "You knocked him down...now how bout you try knockin me down ?"

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Quote Originally Posted by Hulk View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by marbleheadmaui View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Hulk View Post
    I'd add Vito Antefuermo to the list. He was definately a caveman and wore others down with is face.

    Iran Barkley was also a caveman, though a bit more talented than Antefuermo.
    Vito is one of the strangest guys ever. How in hell did a guy who moved like a heavy and punched like a lightweight become middle champ?

    The Blade is a good call.
    Both were bad asses.
    Damned right!
    Hidden Content Bring me the best and I will knock them out-Alexis Arguello
    I'm not God, but I am something similar-Robert Duran

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    did you see the richard hall roy jones jr fight?

    hall isn't a caveman... he's a zombie!
    dude did not stop coming forward all night. got the hell beat out of him, marched thru every punch you can throw...and complained about the stoppage!

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Quote Originally Posted by ruthless rocco View Post
    did you see the richard hall roy jones jr fight?

    hall isn't a caveman... he's a zombie!
    dude did not stop coming forward all night. got the hell beat out of him, marched thru every punch you can throw...and complained about the stoppage!
    It was the steroids he and Jones tested positive for that night !

    Flashback: When Roy Jones Tested Positive | BoxingInsider.com - Boxing | Boxing News
    Hidden Content Bring me the best and I will knock them out-Alexis Arguello
    I'm not God, but I am something similar-Robert Duran

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    Default Re: The Cavemen

    Gotta have the human windmill in there.
    Hidden Content " border="0" />

    I can explain it.
    But I cant understand it for you.

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