Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by oakleyno1
only ever lost to foreman and ali, and i think only ever knocked down by foreman?
how would joe of done vs other greats
holmes
liston
rocky m
lewis
tyson
dempsy
louis
his record may not be that impressive ( 32-4) i think
but still i think he does deserve to be in peoples top ten heavys of all time
opinons?
Holmes out points Frazier with that famous jab.
Liston vs Frazier would be slugfest but Frazier extra heart and will would be factor stopping Liston in 10.
Rocky is stopped on cuts Frazier's bobbing and weaving style too much for Rocky.
Lewis should outpoint Frazier unless Frazier gets lucky punch would very well could happen.
Tyson would floor Frazier in early going but once he warms up he takes Tyson's punches and outguts Tyson to stop him in 9th or 10th.
Dempsey too small for Fraizer and Fraizer's bobbing and weaving style too much and he stops Dempsey on his feet in 10th.
Louis's chin wasn't that great and he is too flatfooted which wouldn't be good vs someone like Frazier i think Frazier could ko him in middle rounds.
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Joe in his prime was incredible fighter
He ran in to the problem most short heaveyweights run in to,he got old real fast.
Shorter fighters need their legs,and thats the first thing to go,they need to be able to explode in.Once the explosion's gone,so are they.
Tyson had the same issue,compounded by the fact that he refused to learn how to fight any different then he ever did,once some fighters proved they could take his best punch,the jig was up.
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by oakleyno1
only ever lost to foreman and ali, and i think only ever knocked down by foreman?
how would joe of done vs other greats
holmes
liston
rocky m
lewis
tyson
dempsy
louis
his record may not be that impressive ( 32-4) i think
but still i think he does deserve to be in peoples top ten heavys of all time
opinons?
Holmes out points Frazier with that famous jab.
Liston vs Frazier would be slugfest but Frazier extra heart and will would be factor stopping Liston in 10.
Rocky is stopped on cuts Frazier's bobbing and weaving style too much for Rocky.
Lewis should outpoint Frazier unless Frazier gets lucky punch would very well could happen.
Tyson would floor Frazier in early going but once he warms up he takes Tyson's punches and outguts Tyson to stop him in 9th or 10th.
Dempsey too small for Fraizer and Fraizer's bobbing and weaving style too much and he stops Dempsey on his feet in 10th.
Louis's chin wasn't that great and he is too flatfooted which wouldn't be good vs someone like Frazier i think Frazier could ko him in middle rounds.
And I agree on Holmes,absolutely worst matchup for Frazier,he would have just peppered him with that stinging jab all night
On Tyson though,Joe did have a hell of a chin,with both of them being undersized,I think Joe's ability to outhink,and out bob would have driven the easily frustrated Tyson nuts
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by oakleyno1
only ever lost to foreman and ali, and i think only ever knocked down by foreman?
how would joe of done vs other greats
holmes
liston
rocky m
lewis
tyson
dempsy
louis
his record may not be that impressive ( 32-4) i think
but still i think he does deserve to be in peoples top ten heavys of all time
opinons?
Holmes out points Frazier with that famous jab.
Liston vs Frazier would be slugfest but Frazier extra heart and will would be factor stopping Liston in 10.
Rocky is stopped on cuts Frazier's bobbing and weaving style too much for Rocky.
Lewis should outpoint Frazier unless Frazier gets lucky punch would very well could happen.
Tyson would floor Frazier in early going but once he warms up he takes Tyson's punches and outguts Tyson to stop him in 9th or 10th.
Dempsey too small for Fraizer and Fraizer's bobbing and weaving style too much and he stops Dempsey on his feet in 10th.
Louis's chin wasn't that great and he is too flatfooted which wouldn't be good vs someone like Frazier i think Frazier could ko him in middle rounds.
And I agree on Holmes,absolutely worst matchup for Frazier,he would have just peppered him with that stinging jab all night
On Tyson though,Joe did have a hell of a chin,with both of them being undersized,I think Joe's ability to outhink,and out bob would have driven the easily frustrated Tyson nuts
Good statement have your first :coolclick: on me to welcome you to forum mate.
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Thank ya kindly Ice
Formal introduction,Im Feur Frie's trainer,she's talked this board up so much,I thought I might as well join,as the other Boxing Forumn I post on often resembles a ghost town.
Much better over here
Re: smoking joe... frazier
I have him somewhere in my top 10 for sure.
But I think a taller guy with a good jab like Holmes or Lewis would outpoint him.
I also think a prime Mike Tyson, with his explosive power, would probably stop him. Not saying that Tyson was a better fighter, just saying that I think he is a bad matchup for Joe.
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by oakleyno1
only ever lost to foreman and ali, and i think only ever knocked down by foreman?
how would joe of done vs other greats
holmes
liston
rocky m
lewis
tyson
dempsy
louis
his record may not be that impressive ( 32-4) i think
but still i think he does deserve to be in peoples top ten heavys of all time
opinons?
Holmes out points Frazier with that famous jab.
Liston vs Frazier would be slugfest but Frazier extra heart and will would be factor stopping Liston in 10.
Rocky is stopped on cuts Frazier's bobbing and weaving style too much for Rocky.
Lewis should outpoint Frazier unless Frazier gets lucky punch would very well could happen.
Tyson would floor Frazier in early going but once he warms up he takes Tyson's punches and outguts Tyson to stop him in 9th or 10th.
Dempsey too small for Fraizer and Fraizer's bobbing and weaving style too much and he stops Dempsey on his feet in 10th.
Louis's chin wasn't that great and he is too flatfooted which wouldn't be good vs someone like Frazier i think Frazier could ko him in middle rounds.
Tyson was at least 2x faster and more Explosive in terms of Combo punching than Foreman... Tysons uppercut was on par with Foremans if not better Tyson also had great side to side head movement and an exteremely underrated chin, Joe got slaughtered by Foreman, what makes you think he can with stand Tysons early fury.. Especially when Joe would take 3 to give 1.. You couldnt do that against early Tyson he was way to fast and accurate especially with Joe standing infront of him like that
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by oakleyno1
only ever lost to foreman and ali, and i think only ever knocked down by foreman?
how would joe of done vs other greats
holmes
liston
rocky m
lewis
tyson
dempsy
louis
his record may not be that impressive ( 32-4) i think
but still i think he does deserve to be in peoples top ten heavys of all time
opinons?
Holmes out points Frazier with that famous jab.
Liston vs Frazier would be slugfest but Frazier extra heart and will would be factor stopping Liston in 10.
Rocky is stopped on cuts Frazier's bobbing and weaving style too much for Rocky.
Lewis should outpoint Frazier unless Frazier gets lucky punch would very well could happen.
Tyson would floor Frazier in early going but once he warms up he takes Tyson's punches and outguts Tyson to stop him in 9th or 10th.
Dempsey too small for Fraizer and Fraizer's bobbing and weaving style too much and he stops Dempsey on his feet in 10th.
Louis's chin wasn't that great and he is too flatfooted which wouldn't be good vs someone like Frazier i think Frazier could ko him in middle rounds.
Tyson was at least 2x faster and more Explosive in terms of Combo punching than Foreman... Tysons uppercut was on par with Foremans if not better Tyson also had great side to side head movement and an exteremely underrated chin, Joe got slaughtered by Foreman, what makes you think he can with stand Tysons early fury.. Especially when Joe would take 3 to give 1.. You couldnt do that against early Tyson he was way to fast and accurate especially with Joe standing infront of him like that
Tyson was a straight line attack fighter,who made up for his lack of size by charging in.
That is not the way to beat Frazier,Foreman got him because of superior size and reach,Joe just couldnt get in on him.
But both Chuvallo,and Mathis tried to fight Frazier the way Tyson would
TKO in the 11,TKO in the 4th
Re: smoking joe... frazier
joe got wobbled by fighters like manuel ramos and jerry quarry...Imo these fighters couldn't touch Tyson in his prime. Sorry but Tyson is bigger, stronger, faster and imo has the better chin.
Tyson would knock him out hands down
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Tyson
5'11
Weight 224 pounds
Reach 72
Frazier
5' 11-1/2"
Weight: 205 pounds
Reach: 73-1/2"
Although Frazier was a 1/2 taller and 1in and 1/2 reach better he would be at a severe disadvantage handspeed wise and outweighed by almost 20lbs and Prime Tyson was all solid muscle.. He was faster, stronger and more explosive than Frazier... Tyson would manhandle and bully Frazier... Again like mentioned Frazier would take 3 punches to give 1 and Tyson would just bury him in Foreman like fashion.
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_One77
joe got wobbled by fighters like manuel ramos and jerry quarry...Imo these fighters couldn't touch Tyson in his prime. Sorry but Tyson is bigger, stronger, faster and imo has the better chin.
Tyson would knock him out hands down
Two words
Buster Douglas
Every time Tyson got pushed past the first couple of rounds hed get frustrated,and would take risks.
Compare the fighters of the era's,sorry,Frank Bruno was no Muhamed Ali
Also Cus massaged his fights,most of the guys Tyson fought were scrubs.
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Buster Douglas is nothing like Frazier, two completly different styles.....Tyson would not have a difficult time hitting Frazier because he would be toe to toe all night long.
I dont care how much heart Joe Frazier had, his chin was always shaky and no heart or grit will ever compensate for that. He would ge KO'd
just my opinion
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_One77
Buster Douglas is nothing like Frazier, two completly different styles.....Tyson would not have a difficult time hitting Frazier because he would be toe to toe all night long.
I dont care how much heart Joe Frazier had, his chin was always shaky and no heart or grit will ever compensate for that. He would ge KO'd
just my opinion
Frazer was very good at making other fighters,fight his fight
He got the Gold Medal and the championship for a reason.
Once Tyson got exposed,he was well and truly exposed.
He couldnt beat a weak hitting Holyfield,whose never been much more then a blown up cruiser weight.
Go back and watch most of Tysons "great fights"
Now check the name of the opponent
Not exactly George Foreman,or Ali,or even Ernie Shavers for that matter
Re: smoking joe... frazier
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_One77
Buster Douglas is nothing like Frazier, two completly different styles.....Tyson would not have a difficult time hitting Frazier because he would be toe to toe all night long.
I dont care how much heart Joe Frazier had, his chin was always shaky and no heart or grit will ever compensate for that. He would ge KO'd
just my opinion
Frazer was very good at making other fighters,fight his fight
He got the Gold Medal and the championship for a reason.
Once Tyson got exposed,he was well and truly exposed.
He couldnt beat a weak hitting Holyfield,whose never been much more then a blown up cruiser weight.Go back and watch most of Tysons "great fights"
Now check the name of the opponent
Not exactly George Foreman,or Ali,or even
Earnie Shavers for that matter
There went your credibility dude.... Holyfield is a great at both Cruiser and Heavy. Shavers always came up short but I'll have to agree to disagree with you... ;)
