If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
Consider the following, he reigned as a champion of his division for even longer than Hopkins. He will also if he wins be a two weight world champion. He, unlike Hopkins will have remained undefeated throughout his entire career.
Hopkins has the bigger names on his resume but in reality his two biggest wins came against much smaller and overmatched opponents.
I mean in all honesty, does ANYONE think Calzaghe would have been unable to defeat even prime a De La Hoya and Felix Trinidad, or for that matter Winky Wright?
Calzaghe's at least has done something that Hopkins could not, and that is defend his belt against the number 1 prime challengers in his division. In putting a smackdown on Jeff Lacy and then securing a dominant win over Mikkel Kessler he did what B Hop couldnt do against the only great challenger he ever really faced in Jermain Taylor.
Certainly Taylor aside there are no names on BHops resume that are any better than the likes of Eubank, Brewer, prime Robin Reid etc, Glen Johnson maybe.
The one other achievement B Hop has achieved of course is his win over Tarver an impressive feat, but Calzaghe equals that in my mind if he does indeed go on to beat Hopkins.
So what do you guys think? I reckon Calzaghe wil indeed have done more than Hopkins, slightly, but I doubt this view will be widely accepted, at least not unless Calzaghe also goes on to beat Kelly Pavlik.
Your thoughts?
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Good question. I'd be willing to go with Joe on this. It won't happen though simply because he's British. It took forever for American fans to truly appreciate Lennox Lewis.
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bzkfn
Good question. I'd be willing to go with Joe on this. It won't happen though simply because he's British. It took forever for American fans to truly appreciate Lennox Lewis.
Mate how the hell did you reply to this before I even finished posting it :o
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Depends on how much people think Nard has left.
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
Consider the following, he reigned as a champion of his division for even longer than Hopkins. He will also if he wins be a two weight world champion. He, unlike Hopkins will have remained undefeated throughout his entire career.
Hopkins has the bigger names on his resume but in reality his two biggest wins came against much smaller and overmatched opponents.
I mean in all honesty, does ANYONE think Calzaghe would have been unable to defeat even prime a De La Hoya and Felix Trinidad, or for that matter Winky Wright?
Calzaghe's at least has done something that Hopkins could not, and that is defend his belt against the number 1 prime challengers in his division. In putting a smackdown on Jeff Lacy and then securing a dominant win over Mikkel Kessler he did what B Hop couldnt do against the only great challenger he ever really faced in Jermain Taylor.
Certainly Taylor aside there are no names on BHops resume that are any better than the likes of Eubank, Brewer, prime Robin Reid etc, Glen Johnson maybe.
The one other achievement B Hop has achieved of course is his win over Tarver an impressive feat, but Calzaghe equals that in my mind if he does indeed go on to beat Hopkins.
So what do you guys think? I reckon Calzaghe wil indeed have done more than Hopkins, slightly, but I doubt this view will be widely accepted, at least not unless Calzaghe also goes on to beat Kelly Pavlik.
Your thoughts?
I wasnt gonna ssay anything but i just couldnt let this slide. The answer to your question is hell no. History will not be kind to joe. IMO hes only gets notice caus hell have bernard on his record win or lose. U know how history works. In 15 years no will even remember who reid,brewer,lacy or kessler were. You not gonna hear any old men say" fighter x couldnt have beat robin reid or jeff lacy". But trinidad,dlh,winky wright,antonio tarver will be remembered for a long time and when anybody thinks abut those fighters they will think about bernard. See there is a reason joe wasnt on any lb4lb list until about 2 years ago even though hes been fightin for over a decade and thats cause he didnt deserve it. not cause he is british. A win over a 43 year hopkins aint gonna change that. Hopkins will go down as one of the greatest fighters in one of the greaest divisons boxing have. I guess joe will go down as the greatest SMW. But IMO roy jones and james toney would of waxed his tail at 168. To make a long story short Joe cal never dared to be great. He sat at home and waited for his contemporaries to get old. I laugh when i hear joe sometimes cause suddenly he got a lot of mouth but he wasnt saying ANYTHING 5 or 6 years ago when everyone was still in they prime. he wasnt screamin for fights then. Hes a joke tryin to build his legacy on the back of a 43 years old man. Thats why i want him to lose. not cause I dont like him.
'
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MRMANICK
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
Consider the following, he reigned as a champion of his division for even longer than Hopkins. He will also if he wins be a two weight world champion. He, unlike Hopkins will have remained undefeated throughout his entire career.
Hopkins has the bigger names on his resume but in reality his two biggest wins came against much smaller and overmatched opponents.
I mean in all honesty, does ANYONE think Calzaghe would have been unable to defeat even prime a De La Hoya and Felix Trinidad, or for that matter Winky Wright?
Calzaghe's at least has done something that Hopkins could not, and that is defend his belt against the number 1 prime challengers in his division. In putting a smackdown on Jeff Lacy and then securing a dominant win over Mikkel Kessler he did what B Hop couldnt do against the only great challenger he ever really faced in Jermain Taylor.
Certainly Taylor aside there are no names on BHops resume that are any better than the likes of Eubank, Brewer, prime Robin Reid etc, Glen Johnson maybe.
The one other achievement B Hop has achieved of course is his win over Tarver an impressive feat, but Calzaghe equals that in my mind if he does indeed go on to beat Hopkins.
So what do you guys think? I reckon Calzaghe wil indeed have done more than Hopkins, slightly, but I doubt this view will be widely accepted, at least not unless Calzaghe also goes on to beat Kelly Pavlik.
Your thoughts?
I wasnt gonna ssay anything but i just couldnt let this slide. The answer to your question is hell no. History will not be kind to joe. IMO hes only gets notice caus hell have bernard on his record win or lose. U know how history works. In 15 years no will even remember who reid,brewer,lacy or kessler were. You not gonna hear any old men say" fighter x couldnt have beat robin reid or jeff lacy". But trinidad,dlh,winky wright,antonio tarver will be remembered for a long time and when anybody thinks abut those fighters they will think about bernard. See there is a reason joe wasnt on any lb4lb list until about 2 years ago even though hes been fightin for over a decade and thats cause he didnt deserve it. not cause he is british. A win over a 43 year hopkins aint gonna change that. Hopkins will go down as one of the greatest fighters in one of the greaest divisons boxing have. I guess joe will go down as the greatest SMW. But IMO roy jones and james toney would of waxed his tail at 168. To make a long story short Joe cal never dared to be great. He sat at home and waited for his contemporaries to get old. I laugh when i hear joe sometimes cause suddenly he got a lot of mouth but he wasnt saying ANYTHING 5 or 6 years ago when everyone was still in they prime. he wasnt screamin for fights then. Hes a joke tryin to build his legacy on the back of a 43 years old man. Thats why i want him to lose. not cause I dont like him.
'
In extreme short hand "No cos Joe is not American"
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Thanks for the replies so far guys, can't belive of 8 responses it's a 4 way 25% split so far!
Guess this is a divisive topic.
More comments and discussion welcome and The Bookkeeper I sure as hell better see your ass in here seeing as you were moaning about people not making enough threads. Well I've made some, no come and repsond to them. :)
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MRMANICK
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
Consider the following, he reigned as a champion of his division for even longer than Hopkins. He will also if he wins be a two weight world champion. He, unlike Hopkins will have remained undefeated throughout his entire career.
Hopkins has the bigger names on his resume but in reality his two biggest wins came against much smaller and overmatched opponents.
I mean in all honesty, does ANYONE think Calzaghe would have been unable to defeat even prime a De La Hoya and Felix Trinidad, or for that matter Winky Wright?
Calzaghe's at least has done something that Hopkins could not, and that is defend his belt against the number 1 prime challengers in his division. In putting a smackdown on Jeff Lacy and then securing a dominant win over Mikkel Kessler he did what B Hop couldnt do against the only great challenger he ever really faced in Jermain Taylor.
Certainly Taylor aside there are no names on BHops resume that are any better than the likes of Eubank, Brewer, prime Robin Reid etc, Glen Johnson maybe.
The one other achievement B Hop has achieved of course is his win over Tarver an impressive feat, but Calzaghe equals that in my mind if he does indeed go on to beat Hopkins.
So what do you guys think? I reckon Calzaghe wil indeed have done more than Hopkins, slightly, but I doubt this view will be widely accepted, at least not unless Calzaghe also goes on to beat Kelly Pavlik.
Your thoughts?
I wasnt gonna ssay anything but i just couldnt let this slide. The answer to your question is hell no. History will not be kind to joe. IMO hes only gets notice caus hell have bernard on his record win or lose. U know how history works. In 15 years no will even remember who reid,brewer,lacy or kessler were. You not gonna hear any old men say" fighter x couldnt have beat robin reid or jeff lacy". But trinidad,dlh,winky wright,antonio tarver will be remembered for a long time and when anybody thinks abut those fighters they will think about bernard. See there is a reason joe wasnt on any lb4lb list until about 2 years ago even though hes been fightin for over a decade and thats cause he didnt deserve it. not cause he is british. A win over a 43 year hopkins aint gonna change that. Hopkins will go down as one of the greatest fighters in one of the greaest divisons boxing have. I guess joe will go down as the greatest SMW. But IMO roy jones and james toney would of waxed his tail at 168. To make a long story short Joe cal never dared to be great. He sat at home and waited for his contemporaries to get old. I laugh when i hear joe sometimes cause suddenly he got a lot of mouth but he wasnt saying ANYTHING 5 or 6 years ago when everyone was still in they prime. he wasnt screamin for fights then. Hes a joke tryin to build his legacy on the back of a 43 years old man. Thats why i want him to lose. not cause I dont like him.
'
Joe has been calling Hopkins out for years and it was Hopkins that pulled out of the fight. I think he goes higher in the P4P list but not sure on all time list.
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
This is boxing and anything can happen but I dont think Calzaghe is skilled enough to beat Hopkins, especially at light heavyweight! But if Joe does get the nod it will be close & contraversal
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
littlebif
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MRMANICK
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
Consider the following, he reigned as a champion of his division for even longer than Hopkins. He will also if he wins be a two weight world champion. He, unlike Hopkins will have remained undefeated throughout his entire career.
Hopkins has the bigger names on his resume but in reality his two biggest wins came against much smaller and overmatched opponents.
I mean in all honesty, does ANYONE think Calzaghe would have been unable to defeat even prime a De La Hoya and Felix Trinidad, or for that matter Winky Wright?
Calzaghe's at least has done something that Hopkins could not, and that is defend his belt against the number 1 prime challengers in his division. In putting a smackdown on Jeff Lacy and then securing a dominant win over Mikkel Kessler he did what B Hop couldnt do against the only great challenger he ever really faced in Jermain Taylor.
Certainly Taylor aside there are no names on BHops resume that are any better than the likes of Eubank, Brewer, prime Robin Reid etc, Glen Johnson maybe.
The one other achievement B Hop has achieved of course is his win over Tarver an impressive feat, but Calzaghe equals that in my mind if he does indeed go on to beat Hopkins.
So what do you guys think? I reckon Calzaghe wil indeed have done more than Hopkins, slightly, but I doubt this view will be widely accepted, at least not unless Calzaghe also goes on to beat Kelly Pavlik.
Your thoughts?
I wasnt gonna ssay anything but i just couldnt let this slide. The answer to your question is hell no. History will not be kind to joe. IMO hes only gets notice caus hell have bernard on his record win or lose. U know how history works. In 15 years no will even remember who reid,brewer,lacy or kessler were. You not gonna hear any old men say" fighter x couldnt have beat robin reid or jeff lacy". But trinidad,dlh,winky wright,antonio tarver will be remembered for a long time and when anybody thinks abut those fighters they will think about bernard. See there is a reason joe wasnt on any lb4lb list until about 2 years ago even though hes been fightin for over a decade and thats cause he didnt deserve it. not cause he is british. A win over a 43 year hopkins aint gonna change that. Hopkins will go down as one of the greatest fighters in one of the greaest divisons boxing have. I guess joe will go down as the greatest SMW. But IMO roy jones and james toney would of waxed his tail at 168. To make a long story short Joe cal never dared to be great. He sat at home and waited for his contemporaries to get old. I laugh when i hear joe sometimes cause suddenly he got a lot of mouth but he wasnt saying ANYTHING 5 or 6 years ago when everyone was still in they prime. he wasnt screamin for fights then. Hes a joke tryin to build his legacy on the back of a 43 years old man. Thats why i want him to lose. not cause I dont like him.
'
Joe has been calling Hopkins out for years and it was Hopkins that pulled out of the fight. I think he goes higher in the P4P list but not sure on all time list.
All time British defo all time world not yet lets see how he finishes
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
I respect Calzaghe but given the options I had to choose #1. You kind of glide right over "the question" of their respective ages, but consider a few things.
Does anyone see Joe Cal stepping up to take the Ring cruiserweight title in 2013? And then beating a top-ten PFPer in 2014 at the age of 42? Because that would be relative to what Bernard Hopkins has done. Or this: if they switched eras and a 43-year-old Calzaghe had to fight the 36-year-old Bernard that destroyed Trinidad, who would the smart money be on?
Considering their respective ages and reputations, Calzaghe needs to beat Hopkins convincingly just to keep his current place in the historical pecking order. If it's a close fight or a Hopkins win, his stature drops dramatically, IMO.
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NorthSideX4
This is boxing and anything can happen but I dont think Calzaghe is skilled enough to beat Hopkins, especially at light heavyweight! But if Joe does get the nod it will be close & contraversal
Calzaghe is more skilled than Taylor and he won twice against B'hop even though i fought Hopkins won the first fight.The work rate and hand speedd will be a real problem for Hopkins.
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
uptoscratch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
I respect Calzaghe but given the options I had to choose #1. You kind of glide right over "the question" of their respective ages, but consider a few things.
Does anyone see Joe Cal stepping up to take the Ring cruiserweight title in 2013? And then beating a top-ten PFPer in 2014 at the age of 42? Because that would be relative to what Bernard Hopkins has done. Or this: if they switched eras and a 43-year-old Calzaghe had to fight the 36-year-old Bernard that destroyed Trinidad, who would the smart money be on?
Considering their respective ages and reputations, Calzaghe needs to beat Hopkins convincingly just to keep his current place in the historical pecking order. If it's a close fight or a Hopkins win, his stature drops dramatically, IMO.
I agree, great point made!
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
littlebif
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MRMANICK
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
Consider the following, he reigned as a champion of his division for even longer than Hopkins. He will also if he wins be a two weight world champion. He, unlike Hopkins will have remained undefeated throughout his entire career.
Hopkins has the bigger names on his resume but in reality his two biggest wins came against much smaller and overmatched opponents.
I mean in all honesty, does ANYONE think Calzaghe would have been unable to defeat even prime a De La Hoya and Felix Trinidad, or for that matter Winky Wright?
Calzaghe's at least has done something that Hopkins could not, and that is defend his belt against the number 1 prime challengers in his division. In putting a smackdown on Jeff Lacy and then securing a dominant win over Mikkel Kessler he did what B Hop couldnt do against the only great challenger he ever really faced in Jermain Taylor.
Certainly Taylor aside there are no names on BHops resume that are any better than the likes of Eubank, Brewer, prime Robin Reid etc, Glen Johnson maybe.
The one other achievement B Hop has achieved of course is his win over Tarver an impressive feat, but Calzaghe equals that in my mind if he does indeed go on to beat Hopkins.
So what do you guys think? I reckon Calzaghe wil indeed have done more than Hopkins, slightly, but I doubt this view will be widely accepted, at least not unless Calzaghe also goes on to beat Kelly Pavlik.
Your thoughts?
I wasnt gonna ssay anything but i just couldnt let this slide. The answer to your question is hell no. History will not be kind to joe. IMO hes only gets notice caus hell have bernard on his record win or lose. U know how history works. In 15 years no will even remember who reid,brewer,lacy or kessler were. You not gonna hear any old men say" fighter x couldnt have beat robin reid or jeff lacy". But trinidad,dlh,winky wright,antonio tarver will be remembered for a long time and when anybody thinks abut those fighters they will think about bernard. See there is a reason joe wasnt on any lb4lb list until about 2 years ago even though hes been fightin for over a decade and thats cause he didnt deserve it. not cause he is british. A win over a 43 year hopkins aint gonna change that. Hopkins will go down as one of the greatest fighters in one of the greaest divisons boxing have. I guess joe will go down as the greatest SMW. But IMO roy jones and james toney would of waxed his tail at 168. To make a long story short Joe cal never dared to be great. He sat at home and waited for his contemporaries to get old. I laugh when i hear joe sometimes cause suddenly he got a lot of mouth but he wasnt saying ANYTHING 5 or 6 years ago when everyone was still in they prime. he wasnt screamin for fights then. Hes a joke tryin to build his legacy on the back of a 43 years old man. Thats why i want him to lose. not cause I dont like him.
'
Joe has been calling Hopkins out for years and it was Hopkins that pulled out of the fight. I think he goes higher in the P4P list but not sure on all time list.
Really? Please show me the clips or articles where joe has been constantly callin out bernard. This year is probably the first time i ever heard joe say his name in public. I know they were supposed to fight years ago so no need to talk about that. But has joe really been callin hop out all these years? No. Their fight fell through and to be honest if you wsnt a hardcore fan u would know nothing about. If joe cal really wanted to fight hp years ago alot more people would of known. Believe. He only talking big now cause hop is old. Why wsnt he talkin like that years ago.
Re: If Calzaghe beats Hopkins will he be higher on the all time p4p rankings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tins06
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MRMANICK
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
If Joe does indeed beat Bernard Hopkins next month will he have had the more successful career?
I know people will question Bernard's age but if Calzaghe does beat him, on paper at least he looks to have the better resume.
Consider the following, he reigned as a champion of his division for even longer than Hopkins. He will also if he wins be a two weight world champion. He, unlike Hopkins will have remained undefeated throughout his entire career.
Hopkins has the bigger names on his resume but in reality his two biggest wins came against much smaller and overmatched opponents.
I mean in all honesty, does ANYONE think Calzaghe would have been unable to defeat even prime a De La Hoya and Felix Trinidad, or for that matter Winky Wright?
Calzaghe's at least has done something that Hopkins could not, and that is defend his belt against the number 1 prime challengers in his division. In putting a smackdown on Jeff Lacy and then securing a dominant win over Mikkel Kessler he did what B Hop couldnt do against the only great challenger he ever really faced in Jermain Taylor.
Certainly Taylor aside there are no names on BHops resume that are any better than the likes of Eubank, Brewer, prime Robin Reid etc, Glen Johnson maybe.
The one other achievement B Hop has achieved of course is his win over Tarver an impressive feat, but Calzaghe equals that in my mind if he does indeed go on to beat Hopkins.
So what do you guys think? I reckon Calzaghe wil indeed have done more than Hopkins, slightly, but I doubt this view will be widely accepted, at least not unless Calzaghe also goes on to beat Kelly Pavlik.
Your thoughts?
I wasnt gonna ssay anything but i just couldnt let this slide. The answer to your question is hell no. History will not be kind to joe. IMO hes only gets notice caus hell have bernard on his record win or lose. U know how history works. In 15 years no will even remember who reid,brewer,lacy or kessler were. You not gonna hear any old men say" fighter x couldnt have beat robin reid or jeff lacy". But trinidad,dlh,winky wright,antonio tarver will be remembered for a long time and when anybody thinks abut those fighters they will think about bernard. See there is a reason joe wasnt on any lb4lb list until about 2 years ago even though hes been fightin for over a decade and thats cause he didnt deserve it. not cause he is british. A win over a 43 year hopkins aint gonna change that. Hopkins will go down as one of the greatest fighters in one of the greaest divisons boxing have. I guess joe will go down as the greatest SMW. But IMO roy jones and james toney would of waxed his tail at 168. To make a long story short Joe cal never dared to be great. He sat at home and waited for his contemporaries to get old. I laugh when i hear joe sometimes cause suddenly he got a lot of mouth but he wasnt saying ANYTHING 5 or 6 years ago when everyone was still in they prime. he wasnt screamin for fights then. Hes a joke tryin to build his legacy on the back of a 43 years old man. Thats why i want him to lose. not cause I dont like him.
'
In extreme short hand "No cos Joe is not American"
Thats really lame man. if you cant disprove my point then you shouldnt reply. Nothing in my post was anti-british. Nothing. But it seems thats all u can think of in his defense. Its sad really.
