Padwork

Recently I've become frustrated with the lack of quality padwork I've been receiving, but it's brought me to think of the methods of padwork I prefer.
Many Irish coaches hold the pads back and allow the fighter to throw full force punches at the pads, as hard and fast as possible. For me this isn't ideal as the combinations become sloppy and the fighter tires easily, which negates the ability to learn.

At the trainers course I was told under no citcumstances should I bring the pad forward, just to hold it back and let the fighter do the work. To be honest I think the best way to do is to bring the pad forward.
-I call the combination, which is thrown below full speed at half power and meet the punches as they extend to full length.
-Making it the responsibility of the coach to ensure the punches are correct. I find by throwing under optimum "fire power," the combinations are memorised better, thrown more correctly and with a better technique.

For example, it's so easy for a fighter to get into sloppy habits throwing the double jab. By "slapping" the pad a bit it makes the fighter connect well and with a sense of realism.

Any trainers or fighters have any thoughts?

I was once called the man on pads, when in the states the gyms would stop when I was on them. Now the older I get the less I believe in them. You are not teaching the fighter you are teaching yourself to look good. Now people will say look at so and so they look teriffic on the pads, maybe but what construction do they bring to learning. In the cold light of day not a lot Ill argue. There are better ways Biomechanicaly to invest in good technique and form. One way is Teaching Muscle memory by other ways, plus teaching intelectual form patterns of where and when. Its down to the coach to use the Grey matter and think and have the ability to give the fighter that ability to do the same ;D

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Originally Posted by Scrap

I was once called the man on pads, when in the states the gyms would stop when I was on them. Now the older I get the less I believe in them. You are not teaching the fighter you are teaching yourself to look good. Now people will say look at so and so they look teriffic on the pads, maybe but what construction do they bring to learning. In the cold light of day not a lot Ill argue. There are better ways Biomechanicaly to invest in good technique and form. One way is Teaching Muscle memory by other ways, plus teaching intelectual form patterns of where and when. Its down to the coach to use the Grey matter and think and have the ability to give the fighter that ability to do the same ;D

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Well I'll listen to you Scrap, you obviously no more than I on the subject.

I do find them good though If they're done the right way. Before a fight or spar I repeat the same combinations a number of times and jab them a bit and I can get the right "rhythm" going.
But I'm open to any suggestions as an alternative,

I give a lot away on here, Those things stay in house for a bit its taken a few years to find out Truths on the system.:-X

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Originally Posted by Scrap

I give a lot away on here, Those things stay in house for a bit its taken a few years to find out Truths on the system.:-X

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Understand completely.
Thats why my sparring vid, is only play sparring. None of the serious stuff;)
Well maybe on the hidden board

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Recently I've become frustrated with the lack of quality padwork I've been receiving, but it's brought me to think of the methods of padwork I prefer.
Many Irish coaches hold the pads back and allow the fighter to throw full force punches at the pads, as hard and fast as possible. For me this isn't ideal as the combinations become sloppy and the fighter tires easily, which negates the ability to learn.

At the trainers course I was told under no citcumstances should I bring the pad forward, just to hold it back and let the fighter do the work. To be honest I think the best way to do is to bring the pad forward.
-I call the combination, which is thrown below full speed at half power and meet the punches as they extend to full length.
-Making it the responsibility of the coach to ensure the punches are correct. I find by throwing under optimum "fire power," the combinations are memorised better, thrown more correctly and with a better technique.

For example, it's so easy for a fighter to get into sloppy habits throwing the double jab. By "slapping" the pad a bit it makes the fighter connect well and with a sense of realism.

Any trainers or fighters have any thoughts?

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My trainer slaps back with the pads and smacks me in the head or body if I get sloppy. He calls the combos, then I fire off. He'll also move me around and make me work on my footwork while working pad.

Scrap, it's funny you say that about pads. I spar with guy who just kills the pads - fast, sharp, great combos, good form. He's MUCH more impressive on the pads than I am. But put him in the ring, I own him. The first time we sparred, I though he was going to eat me up with his handspeed and combos - do a Calzaghe to my Jeff Lacy. Nope. Once he gets in the ring, it all goes out the window. It's a mental thing. Now we are working together with punch-counterpunch-slip drills and that helps us both a lot.

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Originally Posted by RozzySean

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Recently I've become frustrated with the lack of quality padwork I've been receiving, but it's brought me to think of the methods of padwork I prefer.
Many Irish coaches hold the pads back and allow the fighter to throw full force punches at the pads, as hard and fast as possible. For me this isn't ideal as the combinations become sloppy and the fighter tires easily, which negates the ability to learn.

At the trainers course I was told under no citcumstances should I bring the pad forward, just to hold it back and let the fighter do the work. To be honest I think the best way to do is to bring the pad forward.
-I call the combination, which is thrown below full speed at half power and meet the punches as they extend to full length.
-Making it the responsibility of the coach to ensure the punches are correct. I find by throwing under optimum "fire power," the combinations are memorised better, thrown more correctly and with a better technique.

For example, it's so easy for a fighter to get into sloppy habits throwing the double jab. By "slapping" the pad a bit it makes the fighter connect well and with a sense of realism.

Any trainers or fighters have any thoughts?

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My trainer slaps back with the pads and smacks me in the head or body if I get sloppy. He calls the combos, then I fire off. He'll also move me around and make me work on my footwork while working pad.

Scrap, it's funny you say that about pads. I spar with guy who just kills the pads - fast, sharp, great combos, good form. He's MUCH more impressive on the pads than I am. But put him in the ring, I own him. The first time we sparred, I though he was going to eat me up with his handspeed and combos - do a Calzaghe to my Jeff Lacy. Nope. Once he gets in the ring, it all goes out the window. It's a mental thing. Now we are working together with punch-counterpunch-slip drills and that helps us both a lot.

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The pads are a drill really, it's up to the trainer to make it beneficial.
I'm thinking that it's only good as a sharpening point for already rehearsed strtegic combinations and a confidence booster.

Many guys look unreal on the pads, but just flop in the ring. I fought this guy, I was really intimidated because he had a superb jab on the pads. I just warmed out by jumping back and forth and loosening out. I closed his eye with the jab and stopped him.
I hate to sound like I'm boasting, but I wanted to prove I agreed entirely with your point.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

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Originally Posted by RozzySean

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Recently I've become frustrated with the lack of quality padwork I've been receiving, but it's brought me to think of the methods of padwork I prefer.
Many Irish coaches hold the pads back and allow the fighter to throw full force punches at the pads, as hard and fast as possible. For me this isn't ideal as the combinations become sloppy and the fighter tires easily, which negates the ability to learn.

At the trainers course I was told under no citcumstances should I bring the pad forward, just to hold it back and let the fighter do the work. To be honest I think the best way to do is to bring the pad forward.
-I call the combination, which is thrown below full speed at half power and meet the punches as they extend to full length.
-Making it the responsibility of the coach to ensure the punches are correct. I find by throwing under optimum "fire power," the combinations are memorised better, thrown more correctly and with a better technique.

For example, it's so easy for a fighter to get into sloppy habits throwing the double jab. By "slapping" the pad a bit it makes the fighter connect well and with a sense of realism.

Any trainers or fighters have any thoughts?

---

My trainer slaps back with the pads and smacks me in the head or body if I get sloppy. He calls the combos, then I fire off. He'll also move me around and make me work on my footwork while working pad.

Scrap, it's funny you say that about pads. I spar with guy who just kills the pads - fast, sharp, great combos, good form. He's MUCH more impressive on the pads than I am. But put him in the ring, I own him. The first time we sparred, I though he was going to eat me up with his handspeed and combos - do a Calzaghe to my Jeff Lacy. Nope. Once he gets in the ring, it all goes out the window. It's a mental thing. Now we are working together with punch-counterpunch-slip drills and that helps us both a lot.

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The pads are a drill really, it's up to the trainer to make it beneficial.
I'm thinking that it's only good as a sharpening point for already rehearsed strtegic combinations and a confidence booster.

Many guys look unreal on the pads, but just flop in the ring. I fought this guy, I was really intimidated because he had a superb jab on the pads. I just warmed out by jumping back and forth and loosening out. I closed his eye with the jab and stopped him.
I hate to sound like I'm boasting, but I wanted to prove I agreed entirely with your point.

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Pads don't punch back. Even if the trainer is smacking with them to let you know where you screwed up, you aren't faced with prospect of getting busted back hard.

The more I spar the more I realize that sparring, and probably fighting too, is at least 50% mental. I'm 35 years old and a relative beginner, and I can hold my own. This isn't to say I would be great in competition or I kick peoples ass. I get beat on plenty, but every bloody nose is a lesson I couldn't learn in weeks on the pads. It's not that I like getting hit, but it doesn't seem to bother me the way it bothers some people. This lets me hang in with more experienced guys, take my licks, and learn my lessons.

Too much padwork and not enough drilling with a partner or sparring can hurt you, it think. I get more out of pad work now that I'm sparring regularly because I can work fight specific things, work on fixing problems that cause me to get hit or to not land. Like you said, it's a tool, and the objective is learn to box against an opponent, not put on a show against mitts.

If you take the first shot away from a pad trained Fighter the rest of the combo goes out the window. The annalising that takes place on his face is a Picture, lets start again ;D.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

If you take the first shot away from a pad trained Fighter the rest of the combo goes out the window. The annalising that takes place on his face is a Picture, lets start again ;D.

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That's a great way of putting it.

Here's the thing, with all the "fitness" boxing that's happening in the States, lots of people become overtrained on the pads. Then if they want to take the next step, they have to overcome that approach.

I really can't remember the last time I was on the pads, we just don't do them in our gym as our trainer doesn't believe in them. I guess for the reasons expressed here.

What do you do as an alternative Salty?

We do a lot more partner work instead, we'll get directions say a combination for the attacker, while the defender might have to parry the first few and then counter punch. It slowly builds up so after about half an hour it becomes light sparring and then we will do the proper sparring. Which i find works well for me as I hate the pads, due to the fact that I tend to overthink things. Where as in sparring I find myself seeing combinations i've been taught rather than being told what to punch.

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Originally Posted by Salty

We do a lot more partner work instead, we'll get directions say a combination for the attacker, while the defender might have to parry the first few and then counter punch. It slowly builds up so after about half an hour it becomes light sparring and then we will do the proper sparring. Which i find works well for me as I hate the pads, due to the fact that I tend to overthink things. Where as in sparring I find myself seeing combinations i've been taught rather than being told what to punch.

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Yeah I do a good bit of that.
Seems to be popular in the states.

I need more ideas I think.

Surely the idea is for the body to adapt to the process of correct action of thought so long as the process is correct its the incorrect thought that causes trouble as regards correct, level ,, distance, and angles. Sparring is a great way to learn it doesnt need to be Heavy. Doing drills with a partner is a very good way and can be a good learning drill, a pair of senseable lads eventually working at speed is terrific to watch, we do a lot of it reccommended. There is a form of stretch with Plyometric adaptions which I have found to be excellent for bonding Neurons at the same time interesting stuff.