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AFP: Second autopsy shows boxer Gatti died by hanging: report
Not sure what to make of this. Im sure the Canadians were a lot more thourough and accurate then the Brazilian autopsy. I would not be surprised if they find out there was a large amount of the sedtives in his body. I still dont believe that he killed himself and I think there were likely more than one person involved in his death. Thats just my thought and opinion, but I hope the truth, whatever it may be, comes out.
So those stains on the floor definitely weren't blood (no other injury). And there was about a dozen things reported wrong from the original death scene. Great stuff. :rolleyes:
If the guys doing drugs that says something. He must have had something going on.
When Amanda Rodrigues sister said "Amanda is a tiny girl how would she strangle a man like him?" I immediately thought "if Arturo had been slipped a Micky then he wouldn't be able to put up any fight"...sounds like that may have been the case IF he was murdered
Yes, it was blood. Here's an article I forgot to post the other day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Arturo Gatti's last few hours | Other Sports | Sports | Toronto Sun
The statement that get's me is this.....
Police Chief Paulo Alberes said the blood didn't begin running from the wound on Gatti's head until after 9 a.m. "probably when Amanda went back down and she figured out that he was dead by shaking him."
WTF!!!! The blood didn't begin to run out of his body until long after he was dead!!! That's Mickey Mouse detective work there.
this is some fishy stuff.
Certainly another boxing tragedy. Our prayers to the family and friends. God Bless!
Quote:
Originally Posted by I Lust For Violent DYes, it was blood. Here's an article I forgot to post the other day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Arturo Gatti's last few hours | Other Sports | Sports | Toronto Sun
The statement that get's me is this.....
Police Chief Paulo Alberes said the blood didn't begin running from the wound on Gatti's head until after 9 a.m. "probably when Amanda went back down and she figured out that he was dead by shaking him."
WTF!!!! The blood didn't begin to run out of his body until long after he was dead!!! That's Mickey Mouse detective work there.
Hmm.. I dunno. It sort of makes sense if you believe the second autopsy from Canada. The second autopsy found there were no signs he was beaten. Yet there's evidence he suffered a head wound earlier in the evening during the fight, which obviously couldn't have been serious according to the autopsy findings, her shaking him could have re-opened the wound spreading the blood.
That would explain her not thinking anything was wrong when first seeing him.
Is it more likely he was depressed, got drunk and hanged himself (which is fairly common), or she strangled him to death and faked his suicide? I think probably the former.
This history reeks a tons to me, especially as the body moved, from the first statements, from the living room to now the hallway or the flat. Seems like it might be even harder to find out.
in Quebec, a new article has been released saying that they found a "dubious" medicine in Arturo's body, something only sold in Brazil, something that could create dizzyness, sleep and to depress too to some extend, now they want to determine what was the quantity in his blood to see if it could have been induced to him or if it might have played on his judgment.
No, actually it was the second autopsy that found markings and bruising that wasn't reported on the first autopsy.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by I Lust For Violent DYes, it was blood. Here's an article I forgot to post the other day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Arturo Gatti's last few hours | Other Sports | Sports | Toronto Sun
The statement that get's me is this.....
Police Chief Paulo Alberes said the blood didn't begin running from the wound on Gatti's head until after 9 a.m. "probably when Amanda went back down and she figured out that he was dead by shaking him."
WTF!!!! The blood didn't begin to run out of his body until long after he was dead!!! That's Mickey Mouse detective work there.
Hmm.. I dunno. It sort of makes sense if you believe the second autopsy from Canada. The second autopsy found there were no signs he was beaten. Yet there's evidence he suffered a head wound earlier in the evening during the fight, which obviously couldn't have been serious according to the autopsy findings, her shaking him could have re-opened the wound spreading the blood.
That would explain her not thinking anything was wrong when first seeing him.
Is it more likely he was depressed, got drunk and hanged himself (which is fairly common), or she strangled him to death and faked his suicide? I think probably the former.
As far as the blood, he had been dead for hours, blood would not flow out from her shaking him.
What I want to find out is if it was blood, or just red blood cells that was on the floor? If it was blood, then more than likely he was still alive when he hit the floor, and the blood would flow since he still had blood pressure to push it out. But if it was just red blood cells, then he would have been dead when he hit, because hypostasis begins almost immediately after death, which means that the heavier red blood cells settle at the bottom portion of the body, while the plasma separates and goes to the top. And the only way that the red blood cells would have exited his body after death, is if the the wound was on the bottom, as in touching the floor, the pressure of the red blood cells settling could cause some oozing. But if it's true that the wound was at the back of his neck, that scenario wouldn't be possible, since according to the crime scene photo the back of his neck was not touching the ground.
So basically, what I'm saying is, that the blood had to be there when she first seen him at 6:00 am, and there's no way she could not have seen that.
Yes but the second autopsy also concluded that Gatti most likely took his own life - there were no injuries showing one or more other people could have hung the boxer and no sign that Gatti was tied up or beatenQuote:
Originally Posted by I Lust For Violent DNo, actually it was the second autopsy that found markings and bruising that wasn't reported on the first autopsy.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by I Lust For Violent D
Hmm.. I dunno. It sort of makes sense if you believe the second autopsy from Canada. The second autopsy found there were no signs he was beaten. Yet there's evidence he suffered a head wound earlier in the evening during the fight, which obviously couldn't have been serious according to the autopsy findings, her shaking him could have re-opened the wound spreading the blood.
That would explain her not thinking anything was wrong when first seeing him.
Is it more likely he was depressed, got drunk and hanged himself (which is fairly common), or she strangled him to death and faked his suicide? I think probably the former.
As far as the blood, he had been dead for hours, blood would not flow out from her shaking him.
What I want to find out is if it was blood, or just red blood cells that was on the floor? If it was blood, then more than likely he was still alive when he hit the floor, and the blood would flow since he still had blood pressure to push it out. But if it was just red blood cells, then he would have been dead when he hit, because hypostasis begins almost immediately after death, which means that the heavier red blood cells settle at the bottom portion of the body, while the plasma separates and goes to the top. And the only way that the red blood cells would have exited his body after death, is if the the wound was on the bottom, as in touching the floor, the pressure of the red blood cells settling could cause some oozing. But if it's true that the wound was at the back of his neck, that scenario wouldn't be possible, since according to the crime scene photo the back of his neck was not touching the ground.
So basically, what I'm saying is, that the blood had to be there when she first seen him at 6:00 am, and there's no way she could not have seen that.
I agree with you the blood thing is a bit iffy. I understand about the blood flow but it's hard to tell exactly how much there is from the picture they released. If blood leaked from the fall, then was disturbed when the body was being moved.. dunno, but it's possible.. probably. :-\
(nice one wasn't for the name change. I guessed you lost a bet ;))
I am keeping an open mine on this murder/suiside thing but just because Gatti was an exciting and much loved boxer I hope other people keep an open mind as well.
Dont let your love/admiration/hero worship for Gatti cloud your judgement in this sad story.
From what I understand on the night/morning he died he was a man with many personal problems under the influnce of drink and drugs.
Exactly, unfortunately I had a cousin who shot himself in his car with a note... Everyone was surprised and in denial because of the fact he always was a hospitable family man generous as can be with 2 lovely daughters in their late teens early 20's a great wife. He didnt have any horrible addictions, just demons from a past tragedy he thought he could have saved, even though it was out of his hands and he carried that pain his whole life into his early 40's
My point is, we only see what people want us to see of them. he was a great guy with all the family love and admiration from his friends and contemporaries you could ask for, but deep in his mind he was always consumed.
We wanna deny Arturo would kill himself but we dont know much about his personal life, he was a terrific entertainer and fighter but as we find out he had a serious drug and alcohol problems and spouse abuse problems too, not to mention the head trauma he sustained in his career.. You bet that causes a whole slew of emotional problems, depression being a big one.
Also I can tell you 1st hand their are a lot of inaccuracies and inconsistencies in initial police reports, it took them 9 months to give an official report on my buddy who died in a Motorcycle accident, they would give us pieces of inaccurate and contradictory info from time to time until we got the official report. How much more for a high profile person like Gatti, with all pressure form the media, family and fans who demand info asap...
I dont know what the circumstances exactly point to other than Gatti more than likely killed himself under the influence because deep down inside he was that tormented and not ok:-\
The newspaper reports reported that his wife said she didn't murder him some guys from the bar broke in and murdered him. She also said she was in the apartment that night with him and didn't hear a thing all night. She said she found him in the morning. This still stinks worse than the state of denmark. There's something rotten here.
According to Baden, Gatti could have hanged too and he needs some more details from the Brazilian police before making any more statements, he also says that there is a lot of questions remaining to be answered:
Gatti : encore bien des questions - RDS.ca