hugging or boxing

someone else made a thread about this the other week

boxing is suppose to be entertainment isnt it? why arent the refs doing anything about it?

devon alexandra recently, mcphilbin against macrinelli, molina v kirkland

not once did the ref warn these fighters for holding yet their whole tactic was based on holding which is against the rules isnt it? The only thing molina and mcphilbin did at times was hold without any atempt to even throw on the way in

I would go as far to say that andre ward and wlad klit dont fight within the rules but thats kind of another step to the argument because at least they try and land punches as well as hold

I remember when matthew barny fought danny macintosh and the fight lasted 3 rounds (I think) and barny was DQ'd for holding by richie davies (I think). barnys holding was no worse than molina or mcphilbin (or alexandra for that matter)

I think it is because they are cunts. They will disqualify a fighter for nothing and allow blatant hugging for all of the previous rounds. It is most definitely because a referee is a cunt with no regard for those who want to be entertained. I hate blatant spoiling and think it should be docked heavily. Molina was beating Kirkland, but I would also have take away a couple of points for the approach. It would have changed the fight and actually given the fans a fight to watch rather than a 'please hug me' fest. Proper fighters don't clinch. Working inside is fine, but John Ruiz tactics are blatant and wrong.

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Originally Posted by Gandalf

I think it is because they are cunts. They will disqualify a fighter for nothing and allow blatant hugging for all of the previous rounds. It is most definitely because a referee is a cunt with no regard for those who want to be entertained. I hate blatant spoiling and think it should be docked heavily. Molina was beating Kirkland, but I would also have take away a couple of points for the approach. It would have changed the fight and actually given the fans a fight to watch rather than a 'please hug me' fest. Proper fighters don't clinch. Working inside is fine, but John Ruiz tactics are blatant and wrong.

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spot on, people cant be upset because kirkland "got away" with a win, because if the ref would have been doing his job and would have made molina fight then the fight would have been completely different

i feel a bit for mcphilbin because he may have won with the 47 seconds he lost, but i dont because after round 3 all he did was hug. I would have liked to have seen him Knocked out tho, and there is talk of a rematch? thats one i wont be looking forward to

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMZuG...adFAAAAAAAAMAA

whens it gonna stop?

Holding is a legitimate tactic to use against opponents Ali v Fraizier, Forrest v Shane worked to their advantage, but in excess it should lead to points being deducted and disqualification John Ruiz. The ref can influence the way the fight will result, they should be stronger at times, Hatton at the end of his career did spend a lot of time doing it.

Molina was a joke this weekend, he was so frustrating to watch. I know the right ended in contraversie but I am glad Kirkland finally caught him, Molina was horrible to watch.

So you're fighting a strong hard hitting guy that wants to run after you and throw a ton of punches...What do you do? Let him? Fight his fight and get knocked out to entertain people? Boxing is not entertainment; it is a competition in which you try and hit the guy more than he hits you. Sometimes it is entertaining, sometimes less so. Strategy is an integral part of the sport. My big disappointment was that Molina was so artless about his holding and tying up. No style at all.
Kirkland may be too dumb to be a good fighter, and Ann Wolfe is useless in a corner.

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Originally Posted by greynotsoold

So you're fighting a strong hard hitting guy that wants to run after you and throw a ton of punches...What do you do? Let him? Fight his fight and get knocked out to entertain people? Boxing is not entertainment; it is a competition in which you try and hit the guy more than he hits you. Sometimes it is entertaining, sometimes less so. Strategy is an integral part of the sport. My big disappointment was that Molina was so artless about his holding and tying up. No style at all.
Kirkland may be too dumb to be a good fighter, and Ann Wolfe is useless in a corner.

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Nice post.

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Originally Posted by greynotsoold

So you're fighting a strong hard hitting guy that wants to run after you and throw a ton of punches...What do you do? Let him? Fight his fight and get knocked out to entertain people? Boxing is not entertainment; it is a competition in which you try and hit the guy more than he hits you. Sometimes it is entertaining, sometimes less so. Strategy is an integral part of the sport. My big disappointment was that Molina was so artless about his holding and tying up. No style at all.
Kirkland may be too dumb to be a good fighter, and Ann Wolfe is useless in a corner.

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honestly man you couldnt be more wrong

and i dont blame molina or mcphilbin, had either have fought within the rules they would have more than likely have been knocked out, but why would they if they can get away with it?

and refs seem to be happy to let these tactics go in more and more fights

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Originally Posted by erics44

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Originally Posted by greynotsoold

So you're fighting a strong hard hitting guy that wants to run after you and throw a ton of punches...What do you do? Let him? Fight his fight and get knocked out to entertain people? Boxing is not entertainment; it is a competition in which you try and hit the guy more than he hits you. Sometimes it is entertaining, sometimes less so. Strategy is an integral part of the sport. My big disappointment was that Molina was so artless about his holding and tying up. No style at all.
Kirkland may be too dumb to be a good fighter, and Ann Wolfe is useless in a corner.

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honestly man you couldnt be more wrong

and i dont blame molina or mcphilbin, had either have fought within the rules they would have more than likely have been knocked out, but why would they if they can get away with it?

and refs seem to be happy to let these tactics go in more and more fights

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WWE is entertainment, Boxing is a competitive sport. I do agree that excessive holding does make boring fights and should be penalised but if a guy was trying to knock your head off would you just get knocked out? or hold and spoil his work and try getting the W? In my view boxing is a sport first and then entertainment.

Actually, I would be embarrassed to take a win if my main strategy was holding. It's boxing, not Dancing With The Stars. I like Molina, but I was quite disappointed in all that damn holding. I was yelling at the ref to do something about it. :p

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Originally Posted by Tam Seddon

Molina was a joke this weekend, he was so frustrating to watch. I know the right ended in contraversie but I am glad Kirkland finally caught him, Molina was horrible to watch.

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I agree. I couldn't be happier when Kirkland hurt him in the 10th round and eventually dropped him.

The ref deprived us of a probable come from behind KO or TKO win from Kirkland.

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Originally Posted by Manos de Piedra

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Originally Posted by erics44

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Originally Posted by greynotsoold

So you're fighting a strong hard hitting guy that wants to run after you and throw a ton of punches...What do you do? Let him? Fight his fight and get knocked out to entertain people? Boxing is not entertainment; it is a competition in which you try and hit the guy more than he hits you. Sometimes it is entertaining, sometimes less so. Strategy is an integral part of the sport. My big disappointment was that Molina was so artless about his holding and tying up. No style at all.
Kirkland may be too dumb to be a good fighter, and Ann Wolfe is useless in a corner.

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honestly man you couldnt be more wrong

and i dont blame molina or mcphilbin, had either have fought within the rules they would have more than likely have been knocked out, but why would they if they can get away with it?

and refs seem to be happy to let these tactics go in more and more fights

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WWE is entertainment, Boxing is a competitive sport. I do agree that excessive holding does make boring fights and should be penalised but if a guy was trying to knock your head off would you just get knocked out? or hold and spoil his work and try getting the W? In my view boxing is a sport first and then entertainment.

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honestly mate you couldnt be more wrong

every sport design their rules to make their game more entertaining for the millions of people who pay their hard earned money to be entertained

first and foremost boxing is entertainment

the rules of football have changed many times (take the offside rule for example) to make the game faster and more attacking and bring more goals. Rugby and cricket the same have changed the rules over and over again to make the game more entertaining

one of the rules of boxing is no hugging and that is because boxing is entertainment and hugging isnt entertaining

Molina's tactics were against the rules of boxing

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Originally Posted by greynotsoold

So you're fighting a strong hard hitting guy that wants to run after you and throw a ton of punches...What do you do? Let him? Fight his fight and get knocked out to entertain people? Boxing is not entertainment; it is a competition in which you try and hit the guy more than he hits you. Sometimes it is entertaining, sometimes less so. Strategy is an integral part of the sport. My big disappointment was that Molina was so artless about his holding and tying up. No style at all.
Kirkland may be too dumb to be a good fighter, and Ann Wolfe is useless in a corner.

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That's an interesting viewpoint although I don't agree. Rule 2 of the Queensberry Rules expressly states that there is no holding. Most commissions follow the Queensberry Rules. Molina broke that rule when he initiated an excessive amount of holding. A strategy purposefully designed to break a rule in a sport with rules is a poor strategy. Realize that Molina could have fought on the inside without initiating clinches and had the same effect, which may have been your point I bolded above. In reality, it would have been even better because he would have been punching on the inside too. As I don't need to tell you, there have been many great matches almost entirely fought on the inside without holding.