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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55AasOJZzDE
Quite interesting to see (skip to around the 17 min mark)
Frazier refusing to go either way and then pushed saying he respects Ali's skills and that he has a good chance
Wonder if he was being diplomatic to ensure he got a fight with the winner - but knowing Joe that was actually his prediction! And it was a whole lot better than most!
That is interesting as he did go with the consensus. It probably was him being diplomatic and hedging his bets but he did respect Ali fighting skills. It shows that he did not have the high level of animosity that it has been claimed.
Joe Frazier was an integral part of making the first Ali/Frazier fight. He didn't have to, but wanted to get Ali back into the game for all of what was done. Frazier knew he would always be second fiddle to Ali in that era... he needed a good Ali.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
With this fight, Frazier knew of Ali's ring rust, Foreman's power and youth- but wanted Ali to win so he can get another fight with Ali because Ali presented a better paycheck for a fight than Foreman did.
For example, even after Douglas or even Holyfield beat Tyson, Tyson was still a bigger draw and commanded more money, regardless!
Plus he knew he had a better chance of beating Ali than Foreman, styles makes fights and all that. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaJoe Frazier was an integral part of making the first Ali/Frazier fight. He didn't have to, but wanted to get Ali back into the game for all of what was done. Frazier knew he would always be second fiddle to Ali in that era... he needed a good Ali.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
With this fight, Frazier knew of Ali's ring rust, Foreman's power and youth- but wanted Ali to win so he can get another fight with Ali because Ali presented a better paycheck for a fight than Foreman did.
For example, even after Douglas or even Holyfield beat Tyson, Tyson was still a bigger draw and commanded more money, regardless!
Indeed!Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterPlus he knew he had a better chance of beating Ali than Foreman, styles makes fights and all that. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaJoe Frazier was an integral part of making the first Ali/Frazier fight. He didn't have to, but wanted to get Ali back into the game for all of what was done. Frazier knew he would always be second fiddle to Ali in that era... he needed a good Ali.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
With this fight, Frazier knew of Ali's ring rust, Foreman's power and youth- but wanted Ali to win so he can get another fight with Ali because Ali presented a better paycheck for a fight than Foreman did.
For example, even after Douglas or even Holyfield beat Tyson, Tyson was still a bigger draw and commanded more money, regardless!
Correct. Frazier was awkward for Ali, different angles, bobbing and weaving and always moving and forever throwing that dangerous left hook. Foreman was right there in front of Ali and for the first time Foreman was confronted with an opponent as big as he was, Foreman was the perfect Ali opponent. I don't believe big George would've ever beaten Ali, but Frazier was always a chance. In his prediction Frazier really didn't want to see Ali blasted out of there in 1 or 2 rounds as was the pre fight gloom and doom talk by the media, he wanted a good showing from Ali and a miracle win and he got it. Not only did this fight cement Ali's legacy, it went a long way to helping Joe Frazier's standing too. He beat Ali, he lost to George, but George lost to Ali. In his mind he probably thought things were about even. He got his third fight and it was a war much to the detriment of each personally.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterPlus he knew he had a better chance of beating Ali than Foreman, styles makes fights and all that. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaJoe Frazier was an integral part of making the first Ali/Frazier fight. He didn't have to, but wanted to get Ali back into the game for all of what was done. Frazier knew he would always be second fiddle to Ali in that era... he needed a good Ali.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
With this fight, Frazier knew of Ali's ring rust, Foreman's power and youth- but wanted Ali to win so he can get another fight with Ali because Ali presented a better paycheck for a fight than Foreman did.
For example, even after Douglas or even Holyfield beat Tyson, Tyson was still a bigger draw and commanded more money, regardless!
And this is what made Ali "The Greatest"... he changed his fight plan to suit a guy's fight style. So often he did that. No other fighter- except for a little bit of Holyfield- has changed to adapt to another fighter's fight style, before the match, during the match and in the rematch IF they lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by THE THIRD MANCorrect. Frazier was awkward for Ali, different angles, bobbing and weaving and always moving and forever throwing that dangerous left hook. Foreman was right there in front of Ali and for the first time Foreman was confronted with an opponent as big as he was, Foreman was the perfect Ali opponent. I don't believe big George would've ever beaten Ali, but Frazier was always a chance. In his prediction Frazier really didn't want to see Ali blasted out of there in 1 or 2 rounds as was the pre fight gloom and doom talk by the media, he wanted a good showing from Ali and a miracle win and he got it. Not only did this fight cement Ali's legacy, it went a long way to helping Joe Frazier's standing too. He beat Ali, he lost to George, but George lost to Ali. In his mind he probably thought things were about even. He got his third fight and it was a war much to the detriment of each personally.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterPlus he knew he had a better chance of beating Ali than Foreman, styles makes fights and all that. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaJoe Frazier was an integral part of making the first Ali/Frazier fight. He didn't have to, but wanted to get Ali back into the game for all of what was done. Frazier knew he would always be second fiddle to Ali in that era... he needed a good Ali.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
With this fight, Frazier knew of Ali's ring rust, Foreman's power and youth- but wanted Ali to win so he can get another fight with Ali because Ali presented a better paycheck for a fight than Foreman did.
For example, even after Douglas or even Holyfield beat Tyson, Tyson was still a bigger draw and commanded more money, regardless!
Sure, Holy fell short with Bowe III and Lewis II, but his fight plan changed dramatically and he tried to win one out.
The reason why I wouldn't say Lewis changed his fight style much, was because he didn't. And his losses were as a result of 1. him being caught lazy and 2. him being caught lazy. He just got caught.