Who would have won in a 15 rounder?
Printable View
Who would have won in a 15 rounder?
Joe and Dempsey would have ran for the hills. He ducked every African American fighter of his day.
Dempsey is one of the most overrated fighters of all time, in terms of both technique and historical standing.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
Jersey Joe all the way.
Dempsey's caveman style might have worked in his prehistoric era when Boxing was still in the developing stage, but against a more modern fighter like Walcott, his wrecklessness would get him seriously hurt.
I agree. Jack Dempsey is very overrated and he even in todays poor HW division, he wouldn't qualify to be a journeyman.
You guys are ridiculous.
Which African American fighters did Dempsey duck that he should have seen? The only African American that he should have probably faced was Harry Wills. And, quite frankly, can you say with a straight that Harry Wills would have beat Dempsey? I can't. I won't argue that Dempsey drew the color line, although there is debate about it, but my point is how much does that matter if the primary African American heavyweights at the time weren't very good?
Also, calling boxing styles of that age pre-historic is outrageous. Dempsey was the epitome of a swarmer. Mike Tyson studied Dempsey's style and mimicked parts of it, including the bobbing and weaving (and the hair cut).
Now I'm one of those guys that can see the issues that Dempsey, Louis etc. might have had with the bigger heavyweights of the modern age, but that doesn't mean he wasn't a class boxer.
Joe Gans, arguably the greatest lightweight to ever walk the planet, came around earlier than Jack Dempsey. Let's just say that he was called the Old Professor for a reason.
Due to the clarity of the footage, here's a great video on the skills of the old-timers. It is a fight between Battling Siki and Mike McTigue held in 1923. Siki used a crouching style that Marciano made famous years later and also defended with a bit of a philly shell type of defense. McTigue rocked his hands low and used the shoulder roll to roll with punches. They both utilized angles. To keep it in perspective though, neither of these guys is ever listed as one of the top fighters of their era.
youtube.com/watch?v=CkUr2twPIyQ
Please Rant and I never said he was overrated but he did duck black fighters. Perhaps it’s the shit kicking he took from John Lester Johnson. He turned down a fight with little Sammy and admitted he was scared to fight him, refused to fight Harry Wills and Mcvey. Shit he traveled to fight a guy named Joe Bonds but when he found out it was Joe Jeanette he bolted. After he won the title he flat out refused to fight “any negro contender” I guess you could make the case that he didn’t duck them but the times they were in did but I don’t think so.
Walcott was just too well rounded and out and out skilled for Dempsey I'd say. Not slighting Jack and for what he brought, he brought a Hellstorm, but I could see Walcott seriously and increasingly baiting him into shots he never sees coming as it went.
You Dempsey lovers should read A Flame of Pure Fire. Dempsey was a draft dodger and a crook, who even pimped out his own wife when times got hard. Jack Kearns was a shady crook who protected Dempsey after he won the world title.
I've read a Flame of Pure Fire; if your version is the same as mine, it was proved pretty clearly that Dempsey did in fact volunteer to serve, despite having an exemption due to being the sole support of his family. The 'evidence' that he pimped his wife came from the same wife, a life-long prostitute, who admitted that she lied and fabricated charges against him out of bitterness over his success after he left her. Your version may be different than mine, or maybe "accused' isn't the same as 'guilty.'
As to his 'primitive' style, learn the "Dempsey Triples", two series of three punches incorporating bob and weave moves. Take the time and learn the moves, then talk about primitive. And take it one step further...Walk into any gym any where and start throwing those moves into the heavy bag- never mind in the ring against a live opponent- and you'll get everybody's attention.
Because nobody today, with supposed modern, sophisticated styles, does stuff like that, especially not Dempsey's size or larger. They don't have the balance, the concise footwork...they just don't fight like that. His style was certainly far less 'primitive' than the 'ear-muff', 'high-guard' take turns punching type of thing you see today.