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He's 86, and couldn't possibly go on much longer, (right?)
-is he boxing's biggest problem?
-Don King is officially feckless, right?
-is one strong promotional company, (presumably Golden Boy), the way to UFC style success? (including national level athletic commissions, striped power from the "belt" organizations?)
I’d say Hearn has already passed him in the Arum behavior. Hard to see the dark side is.
There isn't a strong promotional company right now. Arum is on ESPN and his son in law, when he takes over, has a lot of different problems on his hands. Golden Boy have Alvarez and basically nobody else. Haymon has most of the top fighters signed up but who knows what's going to happen with Haymon. He's trying to UFCise boxing with PBC but it's not looking too good right now. There's been news that haymon and the UFC people are going to form a new company and also that UFC are going to set up on their own which could be just a negotiating ploy. I would guess boxing is going to get even more fragmented and messy over the next few years.
Just hope the door hits his arse on the way out. He's done well at paving the way to leave setting best guys at basically ppv apps per fight, I missed both Crawford and Manny. Just not paying a cost to see basically espn #4. The boxing world will trudge forward just fine as the Frankenstein sport it has always been. I can't see and don't believe a singular promoter in a Dana White fashion is realistic. Plenty of snafus in ufc with weight, violations and big cancellations also. For all his faults Don King ppv still feels like money well spent. He also just had a complete unknown and overmatched guy in top hbo slot. Golden Boy is basically a sausage making factory and big on favorites. Haymon recycles many but has a twisted way of keeping guys in camera rotation, in a fight or calling it you will see them etc. Individual fighters are also responsible for what happens and what doesn't.
Not wishing Arum to pass away or anything but I’d love to see him get his grubby hands out of boxing. At least we can have some hope that some different ideas can take root but it will be a long slow process. I did have a little more hope for PBC.
Arum and King, sleazy as they may have been, can't be denied their credit for keeping boxing in the limelight.
To promote, you almost need an outlandish personality and a willingness to take risks. Of the former boxers delving in promotion right now, I just don't see that same type of personality and/or mentality. Yeah, boxing will trudge on in its current state.... but IMO we need one or two forward-looking people who can grab the reins and try and increase boxing's popularity. The talent will always be there.
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Originally Posted by Spicoli
So, we don't want the continuity of the UFC? The basic premise of question is this: is it Bob Arum that's holding it up? (Everyone else DOES seem inherently feckless) Will that be enough of a vacuum for a cult-of-personality type + big money (Billions) to come in and fix this thing? Or is Haymon enough to stop it all? (He doesn't seem to have the magic to see any of this through; his success (sic) i think it's just because of the void of anything else happening...)
When will it be dead enough for real change?
Does anybody know what's happening with PBC? Thomas Hauser wrote a couple of great articles about Al Haymon a while ago but since then I haven't seen anything really good. I know the fund that put the money up for PBC are being sued by their investors for basically throwing hundreds of millions of dollars away but there's no news on whether that's going to affect Haymon and no news on how he's doing at the minute. He's got a lot of fighters and I'm sure a lot of them are not getting the number of fights he promised them. Something has to happen there eventually.
"...guess boxing is going to get even more fragmented and messy over the next few years. "Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Yeah, but is that enough to kill it completely?
To me, Haymon is greedy enough, has connections, but doesn't have what it takes on the business side, (his current lawsuit being the proof).Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
A lot of guys want out because they aren't making money because they aren't fighting. My friend called that turn three years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Nobody brings along talent as well as Top Rank. Arum doesn't affect that too much but guys like Bruce Trampler and Brad Goodman do and they are not getting any younger themselves.
What is the current one?Quote:
Originally Posted by hfahrenheitTo me, Haymon is greedy enough, has connections, but doesn't have what it takes on the business side, (his current lawsuit being the proof).Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Totally agree with this.Quote:
Originally Posted by greynotsoold
I think Top Rank has good foundations in place so that when Arum does pass the company will continue to run just fine.
At the moment they are trying new things with streaming and ESPN, all promoters need to be agile and able to adapt to the current markets.
Maybe Haymon collapses, Zuffa (the UFC people) move in and buy him out and go after total domination and in a while we have some kind of UFC setup. Hard to see happening though with the profusion of sanctioning bodies and established promoters. No matter how fragmented it does get boxing will chug on. It's booming in some parts of the world, just not America right now but it'll come back a certain amount at some point.Quote:
Originally Posted by hfahrenheit"...guess boxing is going to get even more fragmented and messy over the next few years. "Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Yeah, but is that enough to kill it completely?
Haymon has been successful in promoting music stars and is a wealthy guy but his boxing plan seems a little weird. UFC workd because they own the whole show and can tell fighters to fight each other whenever. Haymon legally is just these guys' advisor and is legally obligated to get them the best risk/reward purses he can get which workd directly against Haymon the PBC promoter (officially he isn't but in reality he is). PBC would be much better if Haymon could put whatever fights he wanted on on a schedule where there was a show every week and the most compelling fights in the divisions were constantly made like UFC but the various sanctioning bodies, the Muhammad Ali Act and various other things all work against that and PBC isn't a compelling spectacle with a schedule full of the best possible, it's a dog's breakfast that's blown through hundreds of millions of dollars and has done nothing to raise its profile.