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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Yeah that is pretty crazy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenbeanz
UKIP 3,773,402 = 1 MP
Liberal Democrats 2,322,704 = 8 MP (loss of 46 seats, ouch)
That is a better example of the vagaries of FPTP.
You have to get strongholds.
The problem with proportional representation is that it gives you very little accountability when it comes to local issues. With FPTP, if your MP votes to build a massive railway through your village, or votes to close down the hospital, you get to vote them out at the next election. Proportional representation means you can only punish parties on a regional level, and you may not have the opportunity to hold a particular individual to account at all, if they are placed high on the party's regional list.
True but some types of PR do take that into account. Single Transferable Vote is the best IMO. It is much more representative but keeps the constituency links.Quote:
Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
Damn, to bad, I feel bad you guys are so upset about the results of your election. Are there any English here who prefer Cameron and aren't afraid to voice your opinion. It's good to see such passion in your posts, shows you really care about your country. We here in the US always have a positive view on the English, Irish as well despite what you may think of us. Nary have I heard any of my countrymen speak poorly about England. To be honest, we really don't say, as a people, many bad things about many countries, if we don't like you, you will heat from us in a more concrete manner. We walk softly but carry a big stick. I think we are a bit upset that Putin threatened to Nuke us if we interfere in Crimea, but forget about that, this is about our English friends.
I like the current system because you get a government that can implement their policies and accountability for that every 5 years.
I hear you master but I think the US and England have the same problem. The incumbent has way too much of an advantage. I wrote a letter to the editor that the best way to wake politicians up was one clean sweep of every incumbent in every house, every position. It would be equal to revolution.. Start over. Doesn't even matter who gets in for a term. It will wake the career politicians up. The founding fathers didn't intend to have senators in for twenty thirty and even fourty years. It's crazy. They aren't accountable for there actions. It's happened in a couple states, not many but it had a drastic effect. It brought a smile to my face.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
I will take home my ball because I lost.
http://ak-hdl.buzzfed.com/static/201...31078071-4.png
http://www.buzzfeed.com/danieldalton...ust#.uirk9xrW9
:)
Truly amazing election result. The ruling party never ever increase their vote share yet this actually happened. And it was down to Lib Dem voters. Lib Dem voters were furious with their party for five years of collaboration with the Tories so abandoned them. And voted Tory. Labour actually increased their vote share but the Lib Dem voters switching en masse and UKIP taking roughly half their votes each from Labour and Tory candidates instead of all Tory give Cameron a majority.
Labour are now completely fucked. How the hell does the new leader craft a message that simultaneously appeals to Scottish voters and English voters in the south? Impossible. While Scotland remains part of the UK and is sending 50+ MPs to Westminster Labour will never be trusted by English voters. The only way Labour can ever win again is to repeat 1997 -- wait a decade or two for the Tories to fuck it up and then offer a Conservative Lite alternative.
So get used to the current style of government. It's all you're going to get for the forseeable future. And to be fair if Miliband was in Number Ten right now there'd be very little difference over the next five years.
I got a feeling Labour will go even more right wing to get the lib dem voters but I think they should back anti austerity parties.
Labour are a lame duck unless they can somehow dislodge the SNP in Scotland. If the Scots go independent, Labour will take many years to get a look in at another election, and if they stay in there Labour have to find away to counter the battering they'll get from the Tories for pandering to Scotland (my problems with that negative part of the campaign from the Tories are numerous.
Personally, as a Welshman, the only way I see any kind of chance of being governed in a manner away from the London-centric parties is the Scotland goes independent, proves to be hugely successful and then Wales follows suit. Otherwise, the Tories will continue tweaking English prejudices against Scotland to stay in charge for another two terms at the very least. Many friends were posting on facebook last Friday about Canada and Australia among potential destinations. I'm not going that route, but I can see why many would want to in order to get the best possible life for their families.
I would not bee too cynical and gloomy. Labour will adjust to the centre ground to appeal to the Lib Dem (and Alan Sugar) voters by having pro business, take back disillusioned voters that went to UKIP by being strong on immigration and take back Scotland by saying SNP is a wasted vote. They need to choose a strong leader for the 5 years ahead.
They should be arrested and put on community service as well as being put on an asbo. Proper cunts.
They don't listen to the tens of millions of people who didn't vote for them, why would they care about an asbo. It would just be a status symbol for the likes of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Yep. The way the left are moaning on social media, you might think this was close, but the conservatives annihilated labour at the polls. The silent majority have spoken and the Tories were their choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
I don't mind Cameron, I think he is straightforward and relatively honest. People moan about the welfare state, we'll get off your fucking arse and get a job because they are out there.
Milliband was a metropolitan intellectual member of the North London elite, about as far from a decent labour leader as you will see. He was unelectable.
Clegg and the lib dems got punished for being in government, where they found that their protest party ideals were totally impossible to actually achieve.
UKIP tap into every nasty side of the British psyche, nothing positive at all and I'm glad they didn't get w stage to peddle their odious quasi 1950s worldview on us
The greens and the SNP are lefty, bossy and aggressive. Scotland didn't want to be independent, but they do want to start calling the shots in the UK, under the protection of the British economy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
At least they had a drink in England , they could have been for worse and gone to Ibiza.
I didn't like this post at all and was well into a good old miles style destruction of every point. Then my cat ran and disconnected my computer. It was a very good post and it caught into the fiery me that offends Tories so much. I will try again, but I realise I am just tired. I will try again, but it isn't as good.Quote:
Originally Posted by XYep. The way the left are moaning on social media, you might think this was close, but the conservatives annihilated labour at the polls. The silent majority have spoken and the Tories were their choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
I don't mind Cameron, I think he is straightforward and relatively honest. People moan about the welfare state, we'll get off your fucking arse and get a job because they are out there.
Milliband was a metropolitan intellectual member of the North London elite, about as far from a decent labour leader as you will see. He was unelectable.
Clegg and the lib dems got punished for being in government, where they found that their protest party ideals were totally impossible to actually achieve.
UKIP tap into every nasty side of the British psyche, nothing positive at all and I'm glad they didn't get w stage to peddle their odious quasi 1950s worldview on us
The greens and the SNP are lefty, bossy and aggressive. Scotland didn't want to be independent, but they do want to start calling the shots in the UK, under the protection of the British economy.
You Tories got lucky because people are so tired. Tired of Labour. Tired of Tory. Tired of working their skins to the bone. Tired of sanctions. Tired of jobs that pay nothing and offer no security. Tired of immigration that means you cannot compete. And no you cannot compete against 5 to a room foreigners who can save money and send it home to a nation that earns a quarter. The domestics can never compete, the honest can never succeed. It is an evil, heartless system and the minority voted for it. Not a majority. A minority.
Jobs? What jobs? You are that close to something truly despotic and you seem to revel in it. You say the same about Greece. They are all lazy! No, share owners are lazy. CEO's are lazy. Governments are slack and lazy and they all need chopping down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XYep. The way the left are moaning on social media, you might think this was close, but the conservatives annihilated labour at the polls. The silent majority have spoken and the Tories were their choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
I don't mind Cameron, I think he is straightforward and relatively honest. People moan about the welfare state, we'll get off your fucking arse and get a job because they are out there.
Milliband was a metropolitan intellectual member of the North London elite, about as far from a decent labour leader as you will see. He was unelectable.
Clegg and the lib dems got punished for being in government, where they found that their protest party ideals were totally impossible to actually achieve.
UKIP tap into every nasty side of the British psyche, nothing positive at all and I'm glad they didn't get w stage to peddle their odious quasi 1950s worldview on us
The greens and the SNP are lefty, bossy and aggressive. Scotland didn't want to be independent, but they do want to start calling the shots in the UK, under the protection of the British economy.
The silent majority = 36% of those that voted.
They got a majority of seats. Not votes. Not arguing the result as that is the system we have, but the numbers also show that most people didn't want the Tories. Can't argue with that.
Cameron isn't allowed to have a drink after he wins a general election?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
;DQuote:
Originally Posted by GandalfI didn't like this post at all and was well into a good old miles style destruction of every point. Then my cat ran and disconnected my computer. It was a very good post and it caught into the fiery me that offends Tories so much. I will try again, but I realise I am just tired. I will try again, but it isn't as good.Quote:
Originally Posted by XYep. The way the left are moaning on social media, you might think this was close, but the conservatives annihilated labour at the polls. The silent majority have spoken and the Tories were their choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
I don't mind Cameron, I think he is straightforward and relatively honest. People moan about the welfare state, we'll get off your fucking arse and get a job because they are out there.
Milliband was a metropolitan intellectual member of the North London elite, about as far from a decent labour leader as you will see. He was unelectable.
Clegg and the lib dems got punished for being in government, where they found that their protest party ideals were totally impossible to actually achieve.
UKIP tap into every nasty side of the British psyche, nothing positive at all and I'm glad they didn't get w stage to peddle their odious quasi 1950s worldview on us
The greens and the SNP are lefty, bossy and aggressive. Scotland didn't want to be independent, but they do want to start calling the shots in the UK, under the protection of the British economy.
You Tories got lucky because people are so tired. Tired of Labour. Tired of Tory. Tired of working their skins to the bone. Tired of sanctions. Tired of jobs that pay nothing and offer no security. Tired of immigration that means you cannot compete. And no you cannot compete against 5 to a room foreigners who can save money and send it home to a nation that earns a quarter. The domestics can never compete, the honest can never succeed. It is an evil, heartless system and the minority voted for it. Not a majority. A minority.
Jobs? What jobs? You are that close to something truly despotic and you seem to revel in it. You say the same about Greece. They are all lazy! No, share owners are lazy. CEO's are lazy. Governments are slack and lazy and they all need chopping down.
Ha ha. There's loads of jobs. What do you know about anything anyway. More empty overblown rhetoric miles ol' chum.
The Tories got in because they were the least bad option. Also, I think that they should now cut welfare even more, make unemployed people clean rich people's houses for free, bring back fox hunting (in fact, we could just hunt poor people, that would kill two birds with one stone)
I definitely agree that we should have more immigration, as that brings scummy lower class people's wages down, and then they are nowhere to be seen when I'm on holiday. I don't like to see their pasty obese and tattooed bodies when I am exploiting foreigners in their own countries. In Greece, perhaps,
;D
X you are a cunt.
Scotland doesn't want to call the shots, it just wants some kind of voice in the nation's politics, and with the Tories making it abundantly clear that they didn't want to talk to the SNP, and by forcing Labour to do the same, they made absolutely sure that the vastly biggest party in Scotland is completely ignored in the country's decisions. That to me is far more aggressive than the SNP.Quote:
Originally Posted by X
The Tories want a quiet docile Scotland (and Northern Ireland, Wales and anyone else they don't like) that does what its told and doesn't complain when their incomes are squeezed while the rules protecting them from ruthless business owners and the wealthy is eroded.
Divide and conquer, divide and conquer.
Yeah, what do I know anyway, I only live in exile and chose that life because the UK was a blossoming place for young British people. So many good jobs out there and it must have been because I was worthless and not good enough that I couldn't get a look in. That was in the good times! Ironically, I discovered I was good enough and I can only assume tens of millions that feel they aren't good enough are just trapped in a system that saddles them with debt, forces them to compete with abroad, will never let them own a home or start a family, and then when it goes wrong as it will as the nation is fleeced be told it is their fault for not being efficient enough or some such spiel. It is a nasty elitist system and I stand by my original mantra. Get out of that place, or go to war and make sure it is a worthwhile fight for freedom. People like to interpret me and say that I am down on the British. No, it is the system that appalls me. It has been a despicable system my entire lifetime and was induced by people with no connection to people. Nasty elitist freaks who hate their children so much they send them off to private school to be brainwashed and buggered.
People are literally selling away their futures for a quick buck. There won't even be a country once fracking has its way with the water system. Do the elite care? No, they make their money and run. It is what they do in places like Africa anyway. Share owners should be shaken down, the rich taxed down, and the banks done away with. The entire system is a mirage built on lies and nothing more. The media isn't even run by people with any interest in the British people. That people are not waking up to the most basic of observations befuddles me. You Tories are winning and it helps your case that people like me who do care are so sickened that they never want to go near the place. There are a lot of us in lands afar and we all say the same things.
I didn't vote Conservative in the Election, by the way. Not that it's particularly relevant to the discussion.
What with Milliband, Farage and Clegg all stepping down, the leaders are all resigning left, right and centre. ;D.
Who did you vote for, X? Yep, the people voted but Labour did all they did to mess themselves up. I will write the ballad of milliband next. ðŸ˜
I don't doubt that Ed Milliband is probably a decent guy, but he was a complete disaster as a leader.
I privately educated, Oxbridge graduate from a metropolitan elite enclave in North London who never had a real job in his life doesn't really speak to the traditional working class labour voter. The fact that an uneasy coalition government , run by conservatives, who have instigated one of the sharpest periods of austerity in our history could actually win the next election with a majority really shows how poor labour and their leadership have been.
I couldn't stand Milliband. Every time I saw his stupid gurning face, I ground my teeth. The Tories biggest election winning weapon this time was Ed Milliband
Even Noel Gallagher said he didn't rate Ed Milliband ....... and there's a bloke that knows a thing or two about dickhead younger brothers.
May I suggest as a title:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
The Bland Ballad Of Moribund Milliband's Demise
That's a great title! I am also pleasantly surprised to see that I would have beaten all of these parties too. I guess it doesn't take much to flush a toilet.
Labour really are completely fucked. For them to win the next election there would need to be a 12.5% swing to Labour. To put that in perspective, in 1997, the year of the huge Labour victory when the stars aligned for them and everything went wrong for the Tories, the swing to Labour was only 8.8%.
Want to know what's going to happen for the next five years? The first two years will see massive cuts. The next three years they'll stop the cuts so the economy will recover in time for the next election and won't be a factor that Labour can gain votes from.
There'll be a EU referendum which will see a reasonably big majority voting to stay in. 55+%. The out campaign will all be painted as Farage-like racists and big business, which has a lot of interest in remaining part of the EU as it helps them make more profits out of consumers, will back a load of (bullshit) scare stories about how bad things will be if we vote to leave. We won't vote to leave.
Fuck knows what happens in Scotland. Probably another referendum but no guarantee they'll vote to leave, especially if oil is still cheap when it happens.