I'll have to score the fight round by round with a proper video tomorrow, but looking at the fight holistically I think Marquez edged it.
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I'll have to score the fight round by round with a proper video tomorrow, but looking at the fight holistically I think Marquez edged it.
I wasn't even citing the punch stats was the main reason he won the fight because I really don't believe in judging a fight by punch count.. You can tell who got the better of who in a round and that's the way it should be judged imo.. My main reason for saying the decision was the right one is because Manny is the champ, and you have to beat the champ decisively to win...Period. Marquez did not do that...Quote:
Originally Posted by generalbulldog
Now this is a valid argument. But someone here said that you can't use punch stats when it fits one's agenda in an argument and be inconsistent against it in others. And I agree. People like to cite punch stats as a major part of argument that Pac lost the first 2 fights. And I think now you have a Pac defender here citing punch stats that Pac won in the 3rd fight, and someone here said you can't use punch stats for the 3rd fight. So which is it? Because there is a saying, you can't have your cake and eat it too or you can't have it both ways.Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Why does Max Kellerman get such a shit time from everyone as well? He is the only one of the callers who isn't senile and has no problem calling out the shitty card of Harold Letterman - I like his no bullshit, call it down the middle style.
When the rest of them are spunking their load the whole fight about Pacquaio, Kellerman brings them back down to earth. You can tell he just loves the sport and see's a lot more that the others don't (Obviously apart from Steward)
Those cards are seriously fucked up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Youngblood
Haha!Quote:
Originally Posted by milesThose cards are seriously fucked up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Youngblood
Round 1: Consensus PacquiaoQuote:
Originally Posted by Youngblood
Round 2: Split
Round 3: Consensus Pacquiao
Round 4: Consensus Marquez
Round 5: Consensus Marquez
Round 6: Consensus Pacquiao
Round 7: Consensus Marquez
Round 8: Split
Round 9: Split
Round 10: Split
Round 11: Split
Round 12: Split
Interesting on a consensus basis 3-3-6 (Pacquiao-Marquez-No Consensus)
I look forward to seeing the press row scorecards tomorrow.
:cwm13:Quote:
Originally Posted by fan johnny
Call me crazy but I'm sure your the biggest Arum sympathiser on this Forum.
Marquez won this by four rounds pure clinicQuote:
Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus:cwm13:Quote:
Originally Posted by fan johnny
Call me crazy but I'm sure your the biggest Arum sympathiser on this Forum.
I missed it :(
12 rounds again. :(
And once again Marquez had his number. It was shockingly easy for Marquez.Quote:
Originally Posted by miron_lang
Whats with people crying about robbery and Marquez putting on some masterful display of boxing?
Did Marquez face get lumped up because of Nachos vaseline?
If someone simply read this thread without watching the fight, you'd figure Manny would have been taken out of the ring on a stretcher.
The fight was extremely close and could have gone either way. Marquez, is just great enough to make Manny look human after all, but gets entirely too much credit for doing so. 8 rounds to 4? Are you serious? I guess people have gotten so used to Manny putting up numbers like 120--108, or 119-109, or 118-110, that a very close fight makes it appear that he got his ass pounded from corner to corner.
Gladly, instead of just reading this forum, I actually got to see the fight and see both fighters wack eachother around for 12 rounds. Mostly every single round was close and could have gone either way. There was no point at any time where one guy dominated the other. There was no point where either guy was going to lay down and give up.
Its quite sad that a great fight has to be marred by such outlandish comments like "this was a robbery and boxing is fucked" because you didn't get the outcome you thought it should be. For the record, I had it a draw. Neither guy had complete control at any time and neither guy overpowered the other.
Robbery? Seriously?
You must have missed Whitaker Chavez.
I didn't even have it close marquez 8/4 masterclass I stand by itQuote:
Originally Posted by Right Handed Southpaw
Amir khan seems eager to fight JMM from what I heard on the primetime commentary.
I don't see Amir winning a fight against JMM at the form he displayed at this fight. Amir may have the hand speed and weight/height advantage but jmm is just so mental with his boxing prowess. Props to Amir if he wins though. I think it would be a hell of a lot better than bradley jmm once amir goes past lamont.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tam Seddon
When even amir khan thought manny lost you know he lost. Some bad decisions are debateable but this was corruption. Too much money to be made from manny - mayweather to risk letting three honest judges fuck it up. This was an old school fix. Fucking shame on them
Yep when your boy even thinks you lost and yet you get the now you know the fix is onQuote:
Originally Posted by Fatsandman
I apologize in advance but I'm feeling very vindictive this morning. :footinmouth:
From the day this fight was signed, I said Marquez is Pacquiao's kriptonite. He just is Pac's perfect foil. All the Marquez doubters stand down! Most of the forum here repeatedly said that Manny was too big, Manny was so much better now blah blah. No way. Marquez will always be a tough style match-up for Pacquiao and vice versa. It could be at any weight. These two just make for close, gritty fights. And to think people were even angry that Manny had chosen Marquez as an opponent for last night's fight and angry for Manny fighting him at 144. :LOS: Manny couldn't have chosen better and the weight was no issue whatsoever.
Shockingly, if anything, the weight favored Marquez?!!??
:oooh:
Either way, this was a good fight. Maybe to some, in outcome it disappointed, but in pure fight, it exceeded. 12 rounds of good boxing. Sadly, it has become quite rare in PPV's these days.
Do any of the people who thought Manny won the first two fights think Marquez won this one? Do any of the people who had Marquez in those fights think Manny won this one?
Also, if there is backlash over the decision, it shouldn't be against Manny Pacquiao. He fought his ass off last night. Blame the judging. Blame HBO. Hell-blame Floyd :biglaugh: Like Marquez, Manny gave it his all. Those guys are warriors. Freaking warriors.
I have it 1-1-1. both had a win and first was a draw. forgot my scores on previous 2 fights but i'm sure without the kd's marquez edged manny on the 2 previous fights. 3rd fight I had it 7 rounds marquez 5 pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
I need to rewatch it with a clear head but 115-113 Marquez seems like a reasonable score. Last night I had it a draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by arcanum26I have it 1-1-1. both had a win and first was a draw. forgot my scores on previous 2 fights but i'm sure without the kd's marquez edged manny on the 2 previous fights. 3rd fight I had it 7 rounds marquez 5 pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Two things I learned . Floyd is not the god he thinks he is but he would outbox and avoid and potshot pac with ease for 15 rounds if he had to and secondly that manny for whatver reason you want to use is better than Marquez end of .
Rant-cat, you totally nailed this one before the fight, the only thing you wern't right about we're the exact scores. Great job of analyzing the 2 fighters, you were right, Marquez would do much better then me or just about anyone else had figured.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratI need to rewatch it with a clear head but 115-113 Marquez seems like a reasonable score. Last night I had it a draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by arcanum26I have it 1-1-1. both had a win and first was a draw. forgot my scores on previous 2 fights but i'm sure without the kd's marquez edged manny on the 2 previous fights. 3rd fight I had it 7 rounds marquez 5 pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Congrats dude, you need a special title on Saddoboxing now!
Cheers
Thanks, Kind Sir. I've been bit of a vindictive louse today because of it. Cheers to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars_axRant-cat, you totally nailed this one before the fight, the only thing you wern't right about we're the exact scores. Great job of analyzing the 2 fighters, you were right, Marquez would do much better then me or just about anyone else had figured.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratI need to rewatch it with a clear head but 115-113 Marquez seems like a reasonable score. Last night I had it a draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by arcanum26I have it 1-1-1. both had a win and first was a draw. forgot my scores on previous 2 fights but i'm sure without the kd's marquez edged manny on the 2 previous fights. 3rd fight I had it 7 rounds marquez 5 pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Congrats dude, you need a special title on Saddoboxing now!
Cheers
A ton of people here saying they have to watch the fight again to get a better handle on who won. This way you can slowmo your dvr and/or rewind to take a better look at what landed and didn't land. That's all good for the fan who has that ability, but on the night of the fight everyone see's it one time and has to make a judgement on the spot, they have around 60 seconds to make a decision in a live fight and write it down on their scorecards.
They don't have live replays to judge from and 24 hrs to make a decision on a round.
I can't say if the judges made the right or wrong decision at the time since I had a very bad stream and was unable to find a good one, but I was hoping like hell that Marquez beat the life out of him for one more night.
And from what most posters are saying, he did enough of that to win.
Admittedly, I had :beerchug::drunks::drinker: so I need to rewatch it with a clear head. At the time, I had it a draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by stebs
Quote:
Originally Posted by stebs
Same here, my stream was good for for the 1st half of the fight, but turned to shit in the 2nd half. From what I could see, Pacquiao appeared to be the aggressor much of the fight, especially in the last 6 rounds. But here again, it was hard to tell how effective he was.
It's very possible JMM did enough to win the fight, but a robbery? I just don't see that, that's why I want to look at the replay next week.
that is the problem with the official scorecards. 2 of the judges had Pac up 4-2 after 6 rounds. I find that to be total bullshit. There is no way in hell Pac won 4 of the first 6 rounds.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars_axQuote:
Originally Posted by stebs
Same here, my stream was good for for the 1st half of the fight, but turned to shit in the 2nd half. From what I could see, Pacquiao appeared to be the aggressor much of the fight, especially in the last 6 rounds. But here again, it was hard to tell how effective he was.
It's very possible JMM did enough to win the fight, but a robbery? I just don't see that, that's why I want to look at the replay next week.
From the little I could tell from my shitty stream, this fight doesn't seem to qualify as a "robbery" like some are saying. I'm looking forward to seeing it next week in HD on my big screen.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratThanks, Kind Sir. I've been bit of a vindictive louse today because of it. Cheers to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars_axRant-cat, you totally nailed this one before the fight, the only thing you wern't right about we're the exact scores. Great job of analyzing the 2 fighters, you were right, Marquez would do much better then me or just about anyone else had figured.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratI need to rewatch it with a clear head but 115-113 Marquez seems like a reasonable score. Last night I had it a draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by arcanum26I have it 1-1-1. both had a win and first was a draw. forgot my scores on previous 2 fights but i'm sure without the kd's marquez edged manny on the 2 previous fights. 3rd fight I had it 7 rounds marquez 5 pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Congrats dude, you need a special title on Saddoboxing now!
Cheers
P.S. Did Bradley look good against Casa?
He looked Bradley to be fair. You need to check out Prescott vs. Alvarado.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars_axFrom the little I could tell from my shitty stream, this fight doesn't seem qualify as a "robbery" like some are saying. I'm looking forward to seeing it next week in HD on my big screen.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratThanks, Kind Sir. I've been bit of a vindictive louse today because of it. Cheers to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars_axRant-cat, you totally nailed this one before the fight, the only thing you wern't right about we're the exact scores. Great job of analyzing the 2 fighters, you were right, Marquez would do much better then me or just about anyone else had figured.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratI need to rewatch it with a clear head but 115-113 Marquez seems like a reasonable score. Last night I had it a draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by arcanum26I have it 1-1-1. both had a win and first was a draw. forgot my scores on previous 2 fights but i'm sure without the kd's marquez edged manny on the 2 previous fights. 3rd fight I had it 7 rounds marquez 5 pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Congrats dude, you need a special title on Saddoboxing now!
Cheers
P.S. Did Bradley look good against Casa?
Dan Rafael Breaks Down Manny's Win - ESPN Video - ESPN
ESPN Take on the fight. Draw.
Probably not, but I can't believe some of the lame shit i'm hearing about this fight on this forum. I mean jesus h. christ folks, Marquez did much better then expected, Manny did not, but why all the childish hate threads?Quote:
Originally Posted by captainanddewthat is the problem with the official scorecards. 2 of the judges had Pac up 4-2 after 6 rounds. I find that to be total bullshit. There is no way in hell Pac won 4 of the first 6 rounds.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars_axQuote:
Originally Posted by stebs
Same here, my stream was good for for the 1st half of the fight, but turned to shit in the 2nd half. From what I could see, Pacquiao appeared to be the aggressor much of the fight, especially in the last 6 rounds. But here again, it was hard to tell how effective he was.
It's very possible JMM did enough to win the fight, but a robbery? I just don't see that, that's why I want to look at the replay next week.
From what i've been able to see and hear, I gather this was a closely contested fight, one that many thought was a draw, but saying it was a robbery and acting like you're all butt hurt about it? That's just fucking ridiculous, some of you muther-fuckers on this forum need to get a life.
I for one thank Marquez, for being a damned good rival for Pacquiao. I saw something in Pacquiao's eyes last night that I haven't seen in years. Fear, desperation, desolation, worry, and the realization that he still has gaps to close. I hope Freddie and his camp see that as well and take action to improve his game even further. Muhammad Ali became an even greater fighter after his three wars with Frazier and I think Marquez's badass performance last night was just what Pacquiao needed.
And anyone get dejavu from Robinson vs Lamotta II when watching Alvarado vs Prescott? That was a really hardcore performance from the both of them.
Being a new member and only the last couple of years going from only really watching the big fights to being a big fan watching pretty much all boxing I can, I'd hate to offend any members here who obviously no much more than I do and are better placed to give scores but I just thought I'd post my opinion on the fight to see if anyone agrees??
I felt that jmm was in control pretty much all the fight. There were many close rounds but still though he was at least 1 maybe 2 ahead?? He didn't let manny fight how he wanted. Apparently the official punch stats say manny threw and landed more but watching it seemed jmm was landing more and cleaner. At the end of I think 8th maybe 9th roach said to manny "your falling too far behind" so even they knew they were well behind. And the body language at the end of the fight I think said it all, jmm arms aloft while manny dragged himself back to his corner head slumped down. If anyone thinks I'm talking shit don't worry I won't be offended, as I said I'm still learning more and more all the time.
Good humble first post. Keep them coming.Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl9234
:coolclick:Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl9234
Welcome to the forum.
Little late to the party but 1st view. Have tried to avoid reading and discussion...6 rounds in I see 3-3, go figure :p
Manny...1,2,4....Jmm 3,5,6
Landshark time!