Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
Going off recent form Sturm would be crushed did you see him fight Castillejo? Abraham is the best challenger other than Taylor but I'd have Pavlik as the favourite in that fight too. No dubt for periods of the fight Taylor was winning, but he has little stamina and focus, he couldn't keep it up. I think he was a spent force after the second round, same thing happened against Ouma, he hurts them and has one big burst of energy then he isn't the same for the rest of the fight, he's kinda lazy.
yeah I did see that fight, thats why I said Sturm hasn't looked too good lately.
And what Taylor lacks is patience, if you're going off the 2nd round thing. Taylor knows that, the thing is Taylor knows what his flaws are but I haven't seen much improvement, till tonight he looked the best he's looked in a while.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
OMG pavlik survived and k.oed taylor. i am so shock!!!!!!!
big ups to pavlik, this guy is a huge middleweight with enormous power.
Don't take the rematch at 168 taylor!!!!!!!!!!keep it in the same weight his too big and strong already!!!!!
pavlik p4p top ?
wut you guys think?
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
I'd like to see Pavlik hang around 160 for a bit, but there will just be so much more money to fight the Kessler-Calzaghe winner. If he can win the Taylor rematch, I don't see any fight at 160 being able to entice him to stay at that weight financially speaking with a mega-fight at 168 available.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
I know I couldn't be happier. I really kind of like Jermaine, and thought he would pull out a decision, but will be happy for the next month about this. Taylor seemed to be doing the right thing and staying off the ropes for the most part, but i think Kelly getting up after that bruising beating in the 2nd and still coming forward took something mentally away from Taylor. I didn't think, and wonder if Kelly didn't think, Jermaine hit that hard. I forgot the power he has. Jermaine will be back and the rematch could go either way. This will make Jermaine wake up, and Kelly will hopefully learn to pull that lazy jjab back faster and keep his left hand up higher. Both have alot of heart and Jermaine would have gotten up if he could have, but he got beat bad. Hated to see that as I like him, but I almost cried I was so happy. I know, I'm :gay-as-steelie:; so sue me. Both fighters get mad respect from me. I'll bet the rematch will be a little more cautious from both guys. Fight of the year IMO so far.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by Julius Rain
OMG pavlik survived and k.oed taylor. i am so shock!!!!!!!
big ups to pavlik, this guy is a huge middleweight with enormous power.
Don't take the rematch at 168 taylor!!!!!!!!!!keep it in the same weight his too big and strong already!!!!!
pavlik p4p top ?
wut you guys think?
No
p4p top? He's p4p but not top until he beats Abraham.
The thing is he beat someone Abraham already defeated(under the worst condition of a broken jaw) in Edison Miranda.
Its only fair that Abraham gets the winner of the Taylor vs Pavlik rematch, or Pavlik himself if its at 168
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
im still mistified by the scorecards.
The scorecards should have been either 57-56 Pavlik or 57-56 Taylor. The fact they all had Taylor up by 3 or 4 points was definitely surprising.
Why is that surprising, did you miss his last 5 fights? Pavlik was not going to win a decision in any way.
I thought Taylor won both Hopkins fights 7-5. I scored the Winky fight 114-114. He also deserved the decision in the SPinks fight, even if it was boring.
And you say the "last 5 fights"..... are you saying Kassim Ouma deserved a victory?? Because if you are, you're nuts.
Just that the scorecards were way off. I thought he beat Ouma but Winky should have won and B-Hop won the first fight imo and the second won was a draw.
"Way off"??
Both Hopkins fights were very close, and the scorecards were all very close. The Winky fight was very close, and the scorecards were even. I don't see how the Ouma and Spinks cards were way off either.
I define "way off" as being wrong by more than just 1 or 2 points. If you can prove that the scorecards of the two Hopkins fights and the Winky fight were off by several points, then your argument might make sense.
The cards tonight were definitely off, no argument there. I had it 57-56 Pavlik.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by Majesty
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Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
Going off recent form Sturm would be crushed did you see him fight Castillejo? Abraham is the best challenger other than Taylor but I'd have Pavlik as the favourite in that fight too. No dubt for periods of the fight Taylor was winning, but he has little stamina and focus, he couldn't keep it up. I think he was a spent force after the second round, same thing happened against Ouma, he hurts them and has one big burst of energy then he isn't the same for the rest of the fight, he's kinda lazy.
yeah I did see that fight, thats why I said Sturm hasn't looked too good lately.
And what Taylor lacks is patience, if you're going off the 2nd round thing. Taylor knows that, the thing is Taylor knows what his flaws are but I haven't seen much improvement, till tonight he looked the best he's looked in a while.
Patience? He lacks stamina, he doesn't train hard enough, he doesn't do enough cardio, rounds in sparring, bagwork he doesn't have stamina it's not a mental thing.
I'm sure Taylor knows that he doesn't have any stamina ::** , so he's obviously not working hard enough in the gym. 5000 jabs? I'm not sure he even threw 50 jabs.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
im still mistified by the scorecards.
The scorecards should have been either 57-56 Pavlik or 57-56 Taylor. The fact they all had Taylor up by 3 or 4 points was definitely surprising.
Why is that surprising, did you miss his last 5 fights? Pavlik was not going to win a decision in any way.
I thought Taylor won both Hopkins fights 7-5. I scored the Winky fight 114-114. He also deserved the decision in the SPinks fight, even if it was boring.
And you say the "last 5 fights"..... are you saying Kassim Ouma deserved a victory?? Because if you are, you're nuts.
Just that the scorecards were way off. I thought he beat Ouma but Winky should have won and B-Hop won the first fight imo and the second won was a draw.
"Way off"??
Both Hopkins fights were very close, and the scorecards were all very close. The Winky fight was very close, and the scorecards were even. I don't see how the Ouma and Spinks cards were way off either.
I define "way off" as being wrong by more than just 1 or 2 points. If you can prove that the scorecards of the two Hopkins fights and the Winky fight were off by several points, then your argument might make sense.
The cards tonight were definitely off, no argument there. I had it 57-56 Pavlik.
117-111 in the Spinks fight. 115-113 in the Wright fight is 2 points off and for the wrong guy. Also 115-113 for Hop would have been correct.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
Wow, in Rafael's write-up of the fight he says Taylor was "dominant" through the first 6 rounds. You could have scored Taylor ahead at that point, but to say he was dominating Pavlik is absurd. I respect Rafael and often agree with his takes, but in no shape or form was Taylor dominating.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
We should all consider ourselves lucky that we got to see a great fight that will go down in the boxing history books. No matter who you liked in the fight, No matter who you thought was ahead when the brutal end came, bottom line we all saw an amazing fight that will be remembered from now till the final bell rings. There was doubts about both fighters in this match. Many people thought Taylor was not the rising star that the media had made him out to be. At the same time many people thought that Pavlik would not be able to handle the skills and experiance of the more proven fighter. Both guys showed incredible heart and determination, but in the end it was Pavlik who was willing to go the extra mile. With the relative dud of DeLa Hoya Mayweather still fresh in our minds, and the countless other fights in recent memory that don't quite live up of to the hype Important fights like this don't go down the way this one did, it was a fine moment for boxing
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
im still mistified by the scorecards.
The scorecards should have been either 57-56 Pavlik or 57-56 Taylor. The fact they all had Taylor up by 3 or 4 points was definitely surprising.
Why is that surprising, did you miss his last 5 fights? Pavlik was not going to win a decision in any way.
I thought Taylor won both Hopkins fights 7-5. I scored the Winky fight 114-114. He also deserved the decision in the SPinks fight, even if it was boring.
And you say the "last 5 fights"..... are you saying Kassim Ouma deserved a victory?? Because if you are, you're nuts.
Just that the scorecards were way off. I thought he beat Ouma but Winky should have won and B-Hop won the first fight imo and the second won was a draw.
"Way off"??
Both Hopkins fights were very close, and the scorecards were all very close. The Winky fight was very close, and the scorecards were even. I don't see how the Ouma and Spinks cards were way off either.
I define "way off" as being wrong by more than just 1 or 2 points. If you can prove that the scorecards of the two Hopkins fights and the Winky fight were off by several points, then your argument might make sense.
The cards tonight were definitely off, no argument there. I had it 57-56 Pavlik.
117-111 in the Spinks fight. 115-113 in the Wright fight is 2 points off and for the wrong guy. Also 115-113 for Hop would have been correct.
As I said, a fight should be wrong (or perceived as wrong by you) by more than 2 points to be "way off." I fail to see how any of those cards was off by more than 2 points.
In the two Hopkins fights, 5 of the 6 judges scored it for Taylor, and they all were 115-113. In the Wright fight, it was 115-113, 113-115, 114-114.
I'm still not seeing your argument.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
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Originally Posted by Majesty
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Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
Going off recent form Sturm would be crushed did you see him fight Castillejo? Abraham is the best challenger other than Taylor but I'd have Pavlik as the favourite in that fight too. No dubt for periods of the fight Taylor was winning, but he has little stamina and focus, he couldn't keep it up. I think he was a spent force after the second round, same thing happened against Ouma, he hurts them and has one big burst of energy then he isn't the same for the rest of the fight, he's kinda lazy.
yeah I did see that fight, thats why I said Sturm hasn't looked too good lately.
And what Taylor lacks is patience, if you're going off the 2nd round thing. Taylor knows that, the thing is Taylor knows what his flaws are but I haven't seen much improvement, till tonight he looked the best he's looked in a while.
Patience? He lacks stamina, he doesn't train hard enough, he doesn't do enough cardio, rounds in sparring, bagwork he doesn't have stamina it's not a mental thing.
I'm sure Taylor knows that he doesn't have any stamina ::** , so he's obviously not working hard enough in the gym. 5000 jabs? I'm not sure he even threw 50 jabs.
The reason Taylor gasses is because he's impatient and he expends so much energy looking for a knockout instead of boxing. He only boxes usually when he's tired and he should do it from the beginning. Taylor should box all the time, instead of loading for a knockout. He seems so desperate to look impressive it doesnt happen. He impressed me most when he was boxing effectively instead of when he was trying to knock out Pavlik in the 2nd. It was after the 2nd round I knew I was gonna lose my bet tonight ;)
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by BoomBoom
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
im still mistified by the scorecards.
The scorecards should have been either 57-56 Pavlik or 57-56 Taylor. The fact they all had Taylor up by 3 or 4 points was definitely surprising.
Why is that surprising, did you miss his last 5 fights? Pavlik was not going to win a decision in any way.
I thought Taylor won both Hopkins fights 7-5. I scored the Winky fight 114-114. He also deserved the decision in the SPinks fight, even if it was boring.
And you say the "last 5 fights"..... are you saying Kassim Ouma deserved a victory?? Because if you are, you're nuts.
Just that the scorecards were way off. I thought he beat Ouma but Winky should have won and B-Hop won the first fight imo and the second won was a draw.
"Way off"??
Both Hopkins fights were very close, and the scorecards were all very close. The Winky fight was very close, and the scorecards were even. I don't see how the Ouma and Spinks cards were way off either.
I define "way off" as being wrong by more than just 1 or 2 points. If you can prove that the scorecards of the two Hopkins fights and the Winky fight were off by several points, then your argument might make sense.
The cards tonight were definitely off, no argument there. I had it 57-56 Pavlik.
117-111 in the Spinks fight. 115-113 in the Wright fight is 2 points off and for the wrong guy. Also 115-113 for Hop would have been correct.
As I said, a fight should be wrong (or perceived as wrong by you) by more than 2 points to be "way off." I fail to see how any of those cards was off by more than 2 points.
In the two Hopkins fights, 5 of the 6 judges scored it for Taylor, and they all were 115-113. In the Wright fight, it was 115-113, 113-115, 114-114.
I'm still not seeing your argument.
The wrong guy winning a fight is what is way off to me. I understand what you are saying, but scoring every round correctly is very important to the outcome of a close fight. No, the Hopkins and Wright fights werent the worst scores but they were bad enugh to cost them each a fight. Its not just on one judge . Of three judges you would think in a close fight at least 2 of them would get the winner at least right. But like I said I understand what you are saying.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
Taylor just needs to relax and box behind his jab more consistently. He has good power...but he needs to set up instead of going all out from the beginning. But there is just no pleasing some people. Against crafty fighters like Wright, Hopkins, Spinks...some people get on his case for not fighting "exciting"....and and then he tries to be more fan friendly by going all out...it is at the cost of his stamina. He has the athleticism and skills...he needs to focus and get comfortable with a particular style. I think it was a good fight for him. Hopefully this type of loss will make him focused and hungry to get back on top. Hats off to Pavlik. Great fight. A rematch would be fine by me.
Re: The coveted return of Wacko's Drunken Round by Round Taylor vs Pavlik!!!
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Originally Posted by Majesty
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Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
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Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
Going off recent form Sturm would be crushed did you see him fight Castillejo? Abraham is the best challenger other than Taylor but I'd have Pavlik as the favourite in that fight too. No dubt for periods of the fight Taylor was winning, but he has little stamina and focus, he couldn't keep it up. I think he was a spent force after the second round, same thing happened against Ouma, he hurts them and has one big burst of energy then he isn't the same for the rest of the fight, he's kinda lazy.
yeah I did see that fight, thats why I said Sturm hasn't looked too good lately.
And what Taylor lacks is patience, if you're going off the 2nd round thing. Taylor knows that, the thing is Taylor knows what his flaws are but I haven't seen much improvement, till tonight he looked the best he's looked in a while.
Patience? He lacks stamina, he doesn't train hard enough, he doesn't do enough cardio, rounds in sparring, bagwork he doesn't have stamina it's not a mental thing.
I'm sure Taylor knows that he doesn't have any stamina ::** , so he's obviously not working hard enough in the gym. 5000 jabs? I'm not sure he even threw 50 jabs.
The reason Taylor gasses is because he's impatient and he expends so much energy looking for a knockout instead of boxing. He only boxes usually when he's tired and he should do it from the beginning. Taylor should box all the time, instead of loading for a knockout. He seems so desperate to look impressive it doesnt happen. He impressed me most when he was boxing effectively instead of when he was trying to knock out Pavlik in the 2nd. It was after the 2nd round I knew I was gonna lose my bet tonight ;)
You never see fighters like Calzaghe, Barrera, Pacquiao, Hatton, Mayweather gas because they put the rounds in neccessary to have stamina to rely on, it has nothing to do with impatience, a fighter sould be able to rely on his cardio so they don't gas, under any circumstance. It's not a problem you can fix in terms of gameplan.
