Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
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Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF PROVIDENCE"
I think that if there were no belts at stake Hopkins would have been supermiddle or light heavy like 2 years ago but thats another story... He stayed there to retain his belts...
But on to my point. Taylors stock has risen signifigantly in my mind after the one sided victory over Tarver... Hokins made him look stupid but as always Hokins style makes everyone look stupid. I'll be honest I dont think he made Taylor look that bad and that says alot for the skill of Taylor. I hated Jermain for beating X and even said X won the first of the exchanges. That being said I, after the Tarver fight, have found a new respect and admiration for the new champ... 8)
No it hasn't. His stock shouldn't rise at all. Taylor aint the style of Tarver and aint a southpaw. If Hopkins ever fought Tarver it would have ended the same way even if he'd never fought Taylor. Hopkins style would do that to tarver's. being that Taylor doesn't have the style, the southpaw stance or the attempted jab of Tarver I don't think Taylor's stock should rise at all and I'm really getting tired of people saying it should ::**
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
I've already addressed this before
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Originally Posted by Starr
It doesn't show squat about Jermain Taylor, are you kidding me ???
First of all Jermain Taylor doesn't fight the way Tarver fights, doesn't try defense the way Tarver tries, doesn't use his jab like Tarver tries, and Tarver is a southpaw.
The styles of both Jermain and Tarver are so far apart its laughable to compare styles and try to upgrade Jermain Taylor because of what Bernard just did to Antonio. ::**
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Originally Posted by Starr
I'm harsh because I knew people would take thie route and try to upgrade Jermain for what Bernard did to Tarver. Two different fighters, and two different circumstances. Stop trying to build up another fighter off of two different styles. Because if Taylor was a southpaw and fought the same style Antonio did, he would have gone out the same way ;)
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
I've already addressed this before
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
It doesn't show squat about Jermain Taylor, are you kidding me ???
First of all Jermain Taylor doesn't fight the way Tarver fights, doesn't try defense the way Tarver tries, doesn't use his jab like Tarver tries, and Tarver is a southpaw.
The styles of both Jermain and Tarver are so far apart its laughable to compare styles and try to upgrade Jermain Taylor because of what Bernard just did to Antonio. ::**
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
I'm harsh because I knew people would take thie route and try to upgrade Jermain for what Bernard did to Tarver. Two different fighters, and two different circumstances. Stop trying to build up another fighter off of two different styles. Because if Taylor was a southpaw and fought the same style Antonio did, he would have gone out the same way ;)
I am not a big fan of Taylors so Im trying to build noone up but I think after the Wright fight, assuming he wins we will probably move up to 2 or 3 p4p... Thats the stock I mean... Your points are correct and I don't deny you're probably right but whether or not u want to admit it(I havent seen u back down yet) his stock has risen in the minds of the critics and fans... So whether or not it went up in your mind isn't the ? it was in general and in reanylizing I think you would agree
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
What that no matter what people are gonna try to upgrade Jermain?
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
maybe........ or maybe he just deserves it
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
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Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF PROVIDENCE"
maybe........ or maybe he just deserves it
I understand everything your saying but i don't think he deserves it. He fought a very novice-type fight against hop and it seemed like the judges gave him rounds because of just aggression and just threw skill and quality out the window.I will go to the grave saying taylor didn't win but that hop just lost.But that being said if he goes out and beats wink in a convincing fashion his stock would rise for sure in my eyes.
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
Taylor is a good fighter...everyone knows that I have always given the kid props.
He's fought & destroyed everyone that's been thrown in with him & I honestly think that he did well against Hopkins...considering who & what Hopkins is...but I think that his status as the Champ is still in question.
I think that he has what it takes & I also think that he deserves respect...but in the end...he didn't take the Nard's titles...they were handed to him.
Again...I like Taylor...but to me...that's a bit of a sour spot for me.
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
Granted, and for me... I will say I dont think Taylor won both fights... He won niether convincingly but he deffinitly lost the first... Mrmanick, I hear ya... Both u and Wacko.
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
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Originally Posted by Preme
HM, to me his stock would now decrease in value after hopkins last bout. Most seem to be in agreement hopkins won the first fight, and for the first 4 rounds he hardly worked, hardly threw a decent punch, it was only as the fight went on he started to work a bit more.
Taylor being the young buck i thought would of done allot more to make hopkins work, even if it was just keeping hopkins moving, to tire his legs 'coz at that time allot questioned if hopkins could go 12 rounds working through each minute of every round; he proved now he can but then allot wondered..
Anyhow, the hopkins who came out to beat tarver was on the front foot, coming forward throwing punches, moving from the first bell and didn't stop until the last bell. The Hopkins who beat tarver was a completely different hopkins who just didn't seem to give a crap in the Taylor fights.
So to me hopkins showed what he can still do when he wants to, and i think Taylor got lucky that the hopkins who turned up for taver didn't turn up to his fights.
NO ...you see the reason he wasnt coming forward throwing punches as often is because he was being checked by Taylor's jab. Tarver's jab did not exist. This wasnt a totally different hopkins, just a totally different opponent.
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
It does nothing for Taylors stock in my opinion, he lost the first fight and was handed a title he didn't win, if they didn't give him the title there wouldn't have been a second fight. He did much better in the second fight but still no better then a draw, Hopkins retains title is how it should have read. Hopkins stayed at the lower weight for one reason only and that was to cement his legacy in the middleweight division. Staying at middle most likely sapped his strength and energy, hence the slow starts so he would have a reserve at the end of fights. He looks much stronger and more energentic at a higher weight, but at 41 years old it's time to retire. In my mind he's retiring as the middleweight champ and the universal lightheavy champ. So now Taylor and Winky can fight for the vacant middleweight championship of the world.
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
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Originally Posted by MRMANICK
Quote:
Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF PROVIDENCE"
I think that if there were no belts at stake Hopkins would have been supermiddle or light heavy like 2 years ago but thats another story... He stayed there to retain his belts...
But on to my point. Taylors stock has risen signifigantly in my mind after the one sided victory over Tarver... Hokins made him look stupid but as always Hokins style makes everyone look stupid. I'll be honest I dont think he made Taylor look that bad and that says alot for the skill of Taylor. I hated Jermain for beating X and even said X won the first of the exchanges. That being said I, after the Tarver fight, have found a new respect and admiration for the new champ... 8)
This is a 50/50 thing.Why? Cause i thought that he beat taylor in the first fight and i also think he made taylor look like a novice just like tarver the only difference is he threw more punches against tarver.This victory showed me that taylor had more heart than i thought but i still think he was outclassed. Thats what upsets me about the lost cause taylor in no way showed he was better than hop just that he was younger. All the quality in that fight came from hop all the quantity from taylor and i'm the type of fan who will pick quality over quantity any day. I just feel like if you land 5 jabs and i land 3 solid hooks i should win the round,so what you landed more my shots probably meant more. Thats how that fight went and that always bothered me.But regardless of how many hop threw he still beat that kid up.So like i said its 50/50.This is hops time, I will never think taylor is better than what he is until he shows me but i do respect his heart a little more now
100%agree B-HOP won first fight,sec was close to call but B-HOP prove us that he is great Champ and HOFer :appl:
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
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Originally Posted by BigLuke
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preme
HM, to me his stock would now decrease in value after hopkins last bout. Most seem to be in agreement hopkins won the first fight, and for the first 4 rounds he hardly worked, hardly threw a decent punch, it was only as the fight went on he started to work a bit more.
Taylor being the young buck i thought would of done allot more to make hopkins work, even if it was just keeping hopkins moving, to tire his legs 'coz at that time allot questioned if hopkins could go 12 rounds working through each minute of every round; he proved now he can but then allot wondered..
Anyhow, the hopkins who came out to beat tarver was on the front foot, coming forward throwing punches, moving from the first bell and didn't stop until the last bell. The Hopkins who beat tarver was a completely different hopkins who just didn't seem to give a crap in the Taylor fights.
So to me hopkins showed what he can still do when he wants to, and i think Taylor got lucky that the hopkins who turned up for taver didn't turn up to his fights.
NO ...you see the reason he wasnt coming forward throwing punches as often is because he was being checked by Taylor's jab. Tarver's jab did not exist. This wasnt a totally different hopkins, just a totally different opponent.
sorry totaly dissagree.
the first thing tarver tired to do was get a good jab going. but from the moment hopkins came out from his corner he had one thing in mind "this is my ring, this is my fight, we gunna do it the way i want and tonight tony ur gunna be my bitch" he basicaly said f*** your jab im gunna smash u str8 off, he did that, tarver expected a totaly different tactic from him and after 2 rounds looked completey lost int hat ring!
Prior to the tarver fight hopkins has hardly fought a 3 miniute round since he stopped de la hoya. even with the easterman fight he stood back, slowly picked him off, he done enough to win the rounds, but nothing more. He didnt get at him, he didnt smash him like he could do, he just done the minimum he had to.
The taylor fight WATCH it again, he made no atempt to come at taylor. He sat back thinking he could just do enough to win it, those 2 fights he lacked the hunger, it was as if he said to him self f*** it, i want ot win, but i aint busting my nuts for it, and after all hes done thats to be expected.
ol' bad inentions has a good looking future ahead of him, he has 2 hopkins wins to his name, regardless of how contreversial they are, or people opinions on the hopkins who showd him; he has the wins 2 his name. but for the point of this disccusion i think your sadly misled if u think it was taylors jab that made hopkins fight that fight. This is just my opinion and i sure as hell could be wrong, but i think if you watch them fights again u will see 2 different hopkins' turn up - he said it him self, doing what he done, jumping 2 w8s, winning the fight, was doing something his idol couldn't do, he was 99% certain this was to be his last fight and he looke dlike he was ready to go through hell and back to make sure he won!
(lil drunk so ecuse the spelling)
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
I'm sorry but this arguement that hopkins could have won but just didnt want to put in the effort is about as ridiculous as it gets. Look...its obvious that Taylor is much more skilled than Tarver. Hopkins was in the ring with a better fighter than his recent opponent. Plain and simple.
Re: **What does Hopkins win over Tarver do for Taylor's stock?**
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Originally Posted by BigLuke
I'm sorry but this arguement that hopkins could have won but just didnt want to put in the effort is about as ridiculous as it gets. Look...its obvious that Taylor is much more skilled than Tarver. Hopkins was in the ring with a better fighter than his recent opponent. Plain and simple.
First fight B-HOP won most people on this site agreed,sec fight was close fight could go eather way.I give Taylor respect and credit for going to fight Winky when he could of just go and fight nobody's after two tough fights he had with B-HOP. IMO is mistake on Taylor part,Winky will win fight by UD but is going to be great fight,cant wait until Saturday. :)
