Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
ALL TIME??
Does everyone realize how long "All time" is?? It's... well... ALL TIME!
I didn't see a time frame in the thread, so I'm just assuming all time.
Modern day in the last 20 years or so, definitely throw him in that list.
But if we're talking all time, Oscar is barely a blip on the p4p list.
I have nothing against Oscar and I love that he fights everyone out there.
But I'm talking ALL TIME.
If you have Oscar in your top30 all time p4p, consider some names of the last... well... all time number of years...
SRR
Ali
Armstrong
Sweet Pea
Greb
RJJ
Duran
SRL
Arguello
JCC
Ezzard Charles
Willie Pep
Marciano
Louis
Tunney
Benny Leonard
Hagler
Archie Moore
PBF
Holyfield
Hearns
Hopkins
Jimmy Wilde
Benitez
Langford
Fitzsimmons
Attel
Jersey Joe
Dempsey
Jack Johnson
That's just 30 off the top of my head. I'm sure there are at least 20 obvious names I forgot.
Can you really put Oscar ahead of these guys in an all-time prime p4p list?
I think it'd be a stretch to include Oscar even on a top50 all time list.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Floyd top 10 of all time,that is some kind of sick joke right? May be talent wise but taking into account opposition too,NO WAY is he top 10 of all time.
Meowza,who is Attel?
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by shza
I really don't think Oscar belongs anywhere in the top 50. of all time? seriously? he's not even top 5 of his generation. Floyd, Winky, B-Hop, RJJ, and James Toney are all better than Oscar.
The rest, I'll give ya, but...James Toney is better than Oscar? You must be taking the piss?
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Floyd top 10 of all time,that is some kind of sick joke right? May be talent wise but taking into account opposition too,NO WAY is he top 10 of all time.
Meowza,who is Attel?
http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/attell.htm
Looking for a better link...
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I would probably have PBF top 20 and Oscar top 30 :-\
Yea about right Big H round about where i have em.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfn
Quote:
Originally Posted by shza
I really don't think Oscar belongs anywhere in the top 50. of all time? seriously? he's not even top 5 of his generation. Floyd, Winky, B-Hop, RJJ, and James Toney are all better than Oscar.
The rest, I'll give ya, but...James Toney is better than Oscar? You must be taking the piss?
I think most on this forum will agree that James Toney is indeed much better than Oscar. James Toney at 160-200 was easily one of the top 5 of his generation.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
I have PBF among the best... Fuck competition. He has the skills and the speed to have given anyone in history p4p a fight, and I think beats almost everyone. Mayweather is naturally 130-135 imagine if he was naturally a welterweight like Robinson or Leonard I think he would give them the fight of their lives as is, but if he was their weight like he was when he was 130 he would beat either one.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
PBF top 20. haha
You guys are such novices to the sport.
Oscar top 30, hahaha.
This is just plain... stupidity at work.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
I dont think oscar deserves to be in the top 30 of all time nd neither does mayweather yet but if ur talking p4p boxing abilty then i think floyd nd rjj would be in my top 15 but they just never fort as gd opposition as many of the other so they cant claim to of beaten great fighters well i suppose rjj beat a green hopkins nd james toney but getting dominated by tarver aint done him to many favours.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gyrokai
PBF top 20. haha
You guys are such novices to the sport.
Oscar top 30, hahaha.
This is just plain... stupidity at work.
The mere fact you get so bothered at how people you will never meet rank fighters just goes to show how pathetic your life really is. I pity you.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gyrokai
PBF top 20. haha
You guys are such novices to the sport.
Oscar top 30, hahaha.
This is just plain... stupidity at work.
Comming from you, who probably has people you've never even seen box in the top 10 and 20.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gyrokai
PBF top 20. haha
You guys are such novices to the sport.
Oscar top 30, hahaha.
This is just plain... stupidity at work.
Comming from you, who probably has people you've never even seen box in the top 10 and 20.
Big CC to you... It's so easy to say names like Langford, Greb, Fitsimmons, Wilde, or whoever else you want should be ranked far higher than say Floyd... But I have no idea where they actually stood compared to him in terms of ability... It should be about who was actually the better fighter based on their performances in the ring.. Not names on their record when the majority of even the most hardcore fans haven't in fact seen the fights.. I think people put WAY too much weight on achievements in p4p rankings... The fact that you would find names like Dempsey, Marciano, or Joe louis on many lists is testament to this imo... There is no way one of those 3 could have beat even Oscar in a p4p sense, let alone Mayweather.. The funny thing is not one of those guys even achieved as much as DLH or Floyd in terms of world class fighters they beat..
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gyrokai
PBF top 20. haha
You guys are such novices to the sport.
Oscar top 30, hahaha.
This is just plain... stupidity at work.
Comming from you, who probably has people you've never even seen box in the top 10 and 20.
Big CC to you... It's so easy to say names like Langford, Greb, Fitsimmons, Wilde, or whoever else you want should be ranked far higher than say Floyd... But I have no idea where they actually stood compared to him in terms of ability... It should be about who was actually the better fighter based on their performances in the ring.. Not names on their record when the majority of even the most hardcore fans haven't in fact seen the fights.. I think people put WAY too much weight on achievements in p4p rankings... The fact that you would find names like Dempsey, Marciano, or Joe louis on many lists is testament to this imo... There is no way one of those 3 could have beat even Oscar in a p4p sense, let alone Mayweather.. The funny thing is not one of those guys even achieved as much as DLH or Floyd in terms of world class fighters they beat..
Why wouldn't they beat Oscar in P4P sense? Aren't they some of the hardest hitters ever P4P?Too many factors to take into account there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
I have PBF among the best... Fuck competition. He has the skills and the speed to have given anyone in history p4p a fight, and I think beats almost everyone. Mayweather is naturally 130-135 imagine if he was naturally a welterweight like Robinson or Leonard I think he would give them the fight of their lives as is, but if he was their weight like he was when he was 130 he would beat either one.
That is probably one of the worst fucking comments I have ever read on this site. Your nuthugging goes beyond believable,I mean everyone nuthugs once in a while but that's just shocking. So by showing his talent v Angel Manfredy,Brusseles etc he can take on SRR,SRL etc>? So Sven Ottke,forget who he fought,he didn't lose,he must be an all time great too because he must have alot of talent not lose!???
I like PBF,his talent is ATG stuff but you have to take into account opposition when talking about ATG,because skills wise would be difficult. Whilst Floyd still ahs time to fight many more excellent fighters,at the moment,NO WAY is he in the TOP 10 ever! no way Top 10.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
I've been looking for good footage of the all-time bests, and there is a little bit of Willie Pep, a little of prime Sugar Ray Robinson, but there isn't all that much of old school fighters in their prime. Half the guys people rate highly p4p are virtually impossible to find on tape. I mean I bet nobody on here has seen even ten prime Ray Robinson fights except maybe Ted, and nobody on here has seen ten prime Archie Moore, Hank/Henry Armstrong, etc, etc. What footage I've found has done nothing to inspire me to place Ray Robinson or any of those guys any higher htan Mayweather or Roy Jones Jr. It's a simple matter of people following a myth or lore, and blowing a fighter to more epic proportions than are actually valid. Ali and Joe Louis are probably the easiest to find of the old school days, and while Ali was very impressive I never found Joes Louis all that great. He was pretty slow, overrated puncher, and he fought 190 pound guys who are nothing like the heavyweights today or even in Ali's day.
Re: Where do you have PBF and Oscar in your all time P4P list??
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gyrokai
PBF top 20. haha
You guys are such novices to the sport.
Oscar top 30, hahaha.
This is just plain... stupidity at work.
Comming from you, who probably has people you've never even seen box in the top 10 and 20.
Big CC to you... It's so easy to say names like Langford, Greb, Fitsimmons, Wilde, or whoever else you want should be ranked far higher than say Floyd... But I have no idea where they actually stood compared to him in terms of ability... It should be about who was actually the better fighter based on their performances in the ring.. Not names on their record when the majority of even the most hardcore fans haven't in fact seen the fights.. I think people put WAY too much weight on achievements in p4p rankings... The fact that you would find names like Dempsey, Marciano, or Joe louis on many lists is testament to this imo... There is no way one of those 3 could have beat even Oscar in a p4p sense, let alone Mayweather.. The funny thing is not one of those guys even achieved as much as DLH or Floyd in terms of world class fighters they beat..
Why wouldn't they beat Oscar in P4P sense? Aren't they some of the hardest hitters ever P4P?Too many factors to take into account there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
I have PBF among the best... F*** competition. He has the skills and the speed to have given anyone in history p4p a fight, and I think beats almost everyone. Mayweather is naturally 130-135 imagine if he was naturally a welterweight like Robinson or Leonard I think he would give them the fight of their lives as is, but if he was their weight like he was when he was 130 he would beat either one.
That is probably one of the worst F****** comments I have ever read on this site. Your nuthugging goes beyond believable,I mean everyone nuthugs once in a while but that's just shocking. So by showing his talent v Angel Manfredy,Brusseles etc he can take on SRR,SRL etc>? So Sven Ottke,forget who he fought,he didn't lose,he must be an all time great too because he must have alot of talent not lose!???
I like PBF,his talent is ATG stuff but you have to take into account opposition when talking about ATG,because skills wise would be difficult. Whilst Floyd still ahs time to fight many more excellent fighters,at the moment,NO WAY is he in the TOP 10 ever!Top 20 or so,yeah but no way Top 10.
Oh yeah, who did Henry Armstrong fight besides Robinson? You guys say Lamotta, Fulmer, all those guys were great fighters, but go ahead and watch them... They are slow, bad fighters. You guys nut hug Ray Robinson like there is no tomorrow. Even though he would often get hit by ridiculous punches by these bigger slower guys. I have no problem if he got out powered, but that wasn't the case. Ray Leonard I give respect to, but Mayweather just beat ODLH, and showed that he has way more skill than Dela Hoya, size was the only reason Dela Hoya even stood a chance.Are you comparing Sven Ottke to Floyd? Because if you are that is retarded. I judge fighters, unlike you, on what I see in the ring. You don't need the guy to face good competition to see if he was good or not, and Mayweather has foughten a lot better competition than people give him credit for. You can talk all the shit you want, but in reality you are far more blinded than me. I've seen Leonard's whole career, I've seen as many Robinson fights as there is available, I've seen all of Roy Jones Jr.'s fights, I've seen as many Archie Moore, Billy Conn, Ezzard Charles, Willie Pep, Joe Louis as I've been able to find. I'm not making blind assumptions.
