Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
I think this one is likely to see Hatton get the more votes at the moment because of his fantastic win, and the fact that it's so fresh and vivid in most people's minds.
However, looking at it dispassionately, I'm torn. Hatton has gone to the states, and no doubt beating Castillo was a huge achievement, but in his other fights he's struggled. Then again, in some of his earlier fights in the first 10 defences in the Calzaghe reign he struggled, especially against Robin Reid. On the other hand, Calzaghe is slick, and can make pure punchers (like Jeff Lacy) look plain and unremarkable. Also, I would say that Calzaghe's rise to the top....in terms of number of fights into his career was quicker, as Hatton spent a long time (under Frank Warren's guiding hand) defending his WBU title, and that the first huge fight of Hatton's career was Kostya Tzuyu, whilst Calzaghe's was Eubank.
I don't know, maybe at a push, I'd let Hatton's fantastic win over the weekend to push me into putting him just ahead.
Super this isn't even debatable Castillo and Tszyu wipe out any of Calzaghes opponents easily Calzaghe may be better skilled but he is no way better than Hatton's opponents aka Tszyu and Castillo and i don't think its even debatable.
Just saying it isn't even debatable is a dumb a** get out for anyone not wishing to debate something, and of course there is an argument that both Tzuyu and Castillo were past their prime. If you can't see there are two sides to all arguments, then you're not open-minded enough, and that isn't even debatable.
I said imo it isn't Lacy is Calzaghes best win an overrated prospect enough said.
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
I think this one is likely to see Hatton get the more votes at the moment because of his fantastic win, and the fact that it's so fresh and vivid in most people's minds.
However, looking at it dispassionately, I'm torn. Hatton has gone to the states, and no doubt beating Castillo was a huge achievement, but in his other fights he's struggled. Then again, in some of his earlier fights in the first 10 defences in the Calzaghe reign he struggled, especially against Robin Reid. On the other hand, Calzaghe is slick, and can make pure punchers (like Jeff Lacy) look plain and unremarkable. Also, I would say that Calzaghe's rise to the top....in terms of number of fights into his career was quicker, as Hatton spent a long time (under Frank Warren's guiding hand) defending his WBU title, and that the first huge fight of Hatton's career was Kostya Tzuyu, whilst Calzaghe's was Eubank.
I don't know, maybe at a push, I'd let Hatton's fantastic win over the weekend to push me into putting him just ahead.
Super this isn't even debatable Castillo and Tszyu wipe out any of Calzaghes opponents easily Calzaghe may be better skilled but he is no way better than Hatton's opponents aka Tszyu and Castillo and i don't think its even debatable.
Just saying it isn't even debatable is a dumb a** get out for anyone not wishing to debate something, and of course there is an argument that both Tzuyu and Castillo were past their prime. If you can't see there are two sides to all arguments, then you're not open-minded enough, and that isn't even debatable.
I said imo it isn't Lacy is Calzaghes best win an overrated prospect enough said.
Well, by using the three letters "imo" there, that pretty much negates your argument. It can't only be your opinion, and then not debatable, it's a contradiction in terms. By saying that it's your opinion, it opens the field up to the possibility that there are other opinions, which there are.
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
Yes and Hatton deserves more respect and is better which over half the people state here!
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
We can never debate without arguing can we ;D ;D ;D
I see Big Dan McCarthy viewing this topic...gotta offer him my Congrats on winnin the front page comp!
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
I'd have to say they are about even with me leaning a little bit more towards hatton. Both a popular and good fighters but hatton seems reguardless of his past performances more willing to show that he deserves his record..while joe seems content to be popular oversees and stay a protected fighter. Joe has talked a good game about all the fights he wants and people he wants to face but that's about it. Hatton seems more willing to show what he's got with his fists not just the hype of a overblown record.
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
I think this one is likely to see Hatton get the more votes at the moment because of his fantastic win, and the fact that it's so fresh and vivid in most people's minds.
However, looking at it dispassionately, I'm torn. Hatton has gone to the states, and no doubt beating Castillo was a huge achievement, but in his other fights he's struggled. Then again, in some of his earlier fights in the first 10 defences in the Calzaghe reign he struggled, especially against Robin Reid. On the other hand, Calzaghe is slick, and can make pure punchers (like Jeff Lacy) look plain and unremarkable. Also, I would say that Calzaghe's rise to the top....in terms of number of fights into his career was quicker, as Hatton spent a long time (under Frank Warren's guiding hand) defending his WBU title, and that the first huge fight of Hatton's career was Kostya Tzuyu, whilst Calzaghe's was Eubank.
I don't know, maybe at a push, I'd let Hatton's fantastic win over the weekend to push me into putting him just ahead.
Super this isn't even debatable Castillo and Tszyu wipe out any of Calzaghes opponents easily Calzaghe may be better skilled but he is no way better than Hatton's opponents aka Tszyu and Castillo and i don't think its even debatable.
Just saying it isn't even debatable is a dumb a** get out for anyone not wishing to debate something, and of course there is an argument that both Tzuyu and Castillo were past their prime. If you can't see there are two sides to all arguments, then you're not open-minded enough, and that isn't even debatable.
I have to disagree. While I try to be open-minded about most things, I find it very difficult to put ticks in the pro column of an argument in favour of Junior Witter ;D
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by leftylee
Yes and Hatton deserves more respect and is better which over half the people state here!
I said that at a push I'd say that Hatton was Britain's #1, I was just saying that I objected to being told that I wasn't allowed to debate it by ICE. As far as I'm concerned that's a childish get-out. Like repeating whatever the other guy said.
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Originally Posted by bzkfn
I have to disagree. While I try to be open-minded about most things, I find it very difficult to put ticks in the pro column of an argument in favour of Junior Witter ;D
I sympathise with that, but fair play he can finish a fight when he wants to, the KO against Morua was impressive, I just wish I hadn't had to sit through the 8 or so rounds before that.
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
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Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
I think this one is likely to see Hatton get the more votes at the moment because of his fantastic win, and the fact that it's so fresh and vivid in most people's minds.
However, looking at it dispassionately, I'm torn. Hatton has gone to the states, and no doubt beating Castillo was a huge achievement, but in his other fights he's struggled. Then again, in some of his earlier fights in the first 10 defences in the Calzaghe reign he struggled, especially against Robin Reid. On the other hand, Calzaghe is slick, and can make pure punchers (like Jeff Lacy) look plain and unremarkable. Also, I would say that Calzaghe's rise to the top....in terms of number of fights into his career was quicker, as Hatton spent a long time (under Frank Warren's guiding hand) defending his WBU title, and that the first huge fight of Hatton's career was Kostya Tzuyu, whilst Calzaghe's was Eubank.
I don't know, maybe at a push, I'd let Hatton's fantastic win over the weekend to push me into putting him just ahead.
Super this isn't even debatable Castillo and Tszyu wipe out any of Calzaghes opponents easily Calzaghe may be better skilled but he is no way better than Hatton's opponents aka Tszyu and Castillo and i don't think its even debatable.
Just saying it isn't even debatable is a dumb a** get out for anyone not wishing to debate something, and of course there is an argument that both Tzuyu and Castillo were past their prime. If you can't see there are two sides to all arguments, then you're not open-minded enough, and that isn't even debatable.
I said imo it isn't Lacy is Calzaghes best win an overrated prospect enough said.
Well, by using the three letters "imo" there, that pretty much negates your argument. It can't only be your opinion, and then not debatable, it's a contradiction in terms. By saying that it's your opinion, it opens the field up to the possibility that there are other opinions, which there are.
All im saying is Super imo it isn't im not saying no one else isn't allowed to debate or have there say im just saying imo it isn't debatable based on opponents.
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
it's got to be Hatton, least he has fought proper opponents, and not WBO hand pick fights the Wank Warren way, Joe has to really pull his finger out if he is to be taken seriously.
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
All im saying is Super imo it isn't im not saying no one else isn't allowed to debate or have there say im just saying imo it isn't debatable based on opponents.
And I'm saying it is debatable. Playing the devil's advocate, there is the argument:
Kostya Tzuyu - was 36 when he went in with Hatton, which especially considering he fought among the lighter weights, is very old for a light welter, and who had only beaten Sharmba Mitchell and Jesse James Lejia in the two years leading up to the Hatton fight. Not nearly enough activity going into a fight with someone with Hatton's style.
Jose Luis Castillo - had only had one victory of note in the 18 months leading to the Hatton fight, and had struggled to overcome the limited Ngoudjo. Despite many people saying that it took Castillo the big fights to get motivated, he didn't show too much of that in the three and a half rounds before he got knocked out.
Apart from those two the only wins of any real note were over Eamonn Magee, which was mainly significant because he put Hatton down, and beating Thaxton, which he was expected to do. He struggled against Urango and Collazo, and Maussa's pedigree returned with his defeat against the top fighters.
Whilst I don't agree with all of the points here, it is an example of how Hatton's record is not exactly littered with glittering stars, in the same way that many people criticise Calzaghe's record.
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by bzkfn
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Originally Posted by Pacstraightleft
I like Calzaghe's style of fighting.
You like a good slapper?
I think people prefer Hatton because he is scared of nobody and goes looking for the big fights. Calzaghe has been happy fighting the mandatories for most of his career. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Joe, but I do feel there is plenty to criticize. With Hatton, I find him difficult to criticise.
British p4p for me is:
#1. Ricky Hatton
#2. Joe Calzaghe
#3. David Haye
#4. Enzo Maccarinelli
#5. Clinton Woods
Joes fought like 2 or 3 mandatories out of 20 straight defences...
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Originally Posted by hitmandonny
Hatton is no.1 for me. He does so much for the sport of boxing.
Everywhere he goes he makes people smile with recognition and he is just an all around nice guy. But that does'nt justify him being picked over joe...I just feel he's been forced to show how much he wants to win (like against collazo.) Lets see joe in one single war and then i mite reconsider...
Watch the brewer, eubank and reid fights. They were very very hard fought fights - brewer was a massive puncher and calzaghe took them and give back... just because he hasn't struggled because of a lack of his own talent is very unfair too mark him down.
Take into considerartion that collazo can't ounch for absolut shit, that one of brewers power pounces are like 3 round sof what collazo can do to you, i would class the brewer fight as just as hard.
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Originally Posted by Mar
I'd have to say they are about even with me leaning a little bit more towards hatton. Both a popular and good fighters but hatton seems reguardless of his past performances more willing to show that he deserves his record..while joe seems content to be popular oversees and stay a protected fighter. Joe has talked a good game about all the fights he wants and people he wants to face but that's about it. Hatton seems more willing to show what he's got with his fists not just the hype of a overblown record.
Joe signed to fight hopkins in the US, Ottke made it crystal clear he never ever wanted anything to do with calzaghe EVER - i think its clear by now the only reason calzaghe and kessler have not fought is down to palle/warren and nothing more....
In terms of boxing there is no doubt imo calzaghe is #1 - hatton has gone to the us and beaten names out there credit for him, calzaghe has domonated his devision for over a decade beating anyone willing to fight him - hatton has only ever defended a recognised belt ONCE (IBF agasint mausa)
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
Oi wackoff, whats your opinion on this?
your a pretty impartial cat and are a fan of both and followed them both...
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by Preme
Oi wackoff, whats your opinion on this?
your a pretty impartial cat and are a fan of both and followed them both...
I didn't think Wacko was a fan of Hatton ??
Re: Hatton or Calzaghe (British Number 1)
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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
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Originally Posted by Preme
Oi wackoff, whats your opinion on this?
your a pretty impartial cat and are a fan of both and followed them both...
I didn't think Wacko was a fan of Hatton ??
never really seen him take many shots at him if any... could be wrong.
