If the Roy Jones thought fought Griffin, had fought Tarver what would be the ...

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Originally Posted by pacdog

keep in mind toney was getting absultley dominated against michel nunn before he caught him with a single punch...

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Has anybody ever seen that fight?

That is one of the most repeated myths about boxing, seriously I wonder how many people have even seen that fight. Toney had won at least the last three rounds in a row, more like four before he knocked out Nunn in the 11th.

You know, I think honestly that Tarver had Jones' number. Roy had everything in spades over Tarver, but for some reason Antonio was just in his head. I think Tarver was the one guy for Roy, just like Vernon was the one guy for Shane.

First round Ko without a doubt. Roy would have destroyed 2 men in the same ring at the same time that night.

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

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Originally Posted by pacdog

keep in mind toney was getting absultley dominated against michel nunn before he caught him with a single punch...

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Has anybody ever seen that fight?

That is one of the most repeated myths about boxing, seriously I wonder how many people have even seen that fight. Toney had won at least the last three rounds in a row, more like four before he knocked out Nunn in the 11th.

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exactly! I actually had Toney 1 point behind and then winning the 11th so it would have hinged on the 12th for me which I only saw Toney winning!

Jones is one of the best fighters ever when he came down in weight from Heavyweight he lost confidence in his body after the ko loss to Tarver It took him time to get it back i think he has got it back watch out Calzaghe!. But back to the subject the jones who fought Griiffin would have done the same to Tarver he would have taken him out the same.

the roy jones that fought griffin the second time was RJ and RJ was a beast in the ring and i think he would destroy tarver. tarver waited until roy came down from heavyweight and he had been studying roy for years so when they got in the ring he was able to match up to roys style

I didn't think Roy looked that bad in the second fight. He'd had enough time to recover from the weight drop. He had speed and accuracy, and I thought he was outboxing Tarver. And then he got caught. It happens.

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Originally Posted by Killface

You know, I think honestly that Tarver had Jones' number. Roy had everything in spades over Tarver, but for some reason Antonio was just in his head. I think Tarver was the one guy for Roy, just like Vernon was the one guy for Shane.

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Exactly...this forum is full of RJJ nuthuggers and Tarver haters. Roy Jones was Jesus, Moses, Muhammed, and the Dali Lama to people and they can't accept that for all his greatness, he had flaws and Tarver was the right guy to expose the flaws.

I think Roy gets disqualified for hitting Tarver while he is down :-X

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Originally Posted by RozzySean

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Originally Posted by Killface

You know, I think honestly that Tarver had Jones' number. Roy had everything in spades over Tarver, but for some reason Antonio was just in his head. I think Tarver was the one guy for Roy, just like Vernon was the one guy for Shane.

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Exactly...this forum is full of RJJ nuthuggers and Tarver haters. Roy Jones was Jesus, Moses, Muhammed, and the Dali Lama to people and they can't accept that for all his greatness, he had flaws and Tarver was the right guy to expose the flaws.

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You could be right! Its just funny that it came after all the weight draining.

I am a huge Jones fan but I know EVERY fighter in history has flaws. Even Ali had his, he was slightly susceptible to a good left hook as Frazier and Cooper showed and Ken Norton was a nightmare fighter for him.

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

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Originally Posted by RozzySean

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Originally Posted by Killface

You know, I think honestly that Tarver had Jones' number. Roy had everything in spades over Tarver, but for some reason Antonio was just in his head. I think Tarver was the one guy for Roy, just like Vernon was the one guy for Shane.

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Exactly...this forum is full of RJJ nuthuggers and Tarver haters. Roy Jones was Jesus, Moses, Muhammed, and the Dali Lama to people and they can't accept that for all his greatness, he had flaws and Tarver was the right guy to expose the flaws.

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You could be right! Its just funny that it came after all the weight draining.

I am a huge Jones fan but I know EVERY fighter in history has flaws. Even Ali had his, he was slightly susceptible to a good left hook as Frazier and Cooper showed and Ken Norton was a nightmare fighter for him.

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The Ken Norton analogy is very good one. And Ali pulled his head straight back, which is a technical flaw and made his vunerble to the left hook. Ali liked to fight going backwards. Ken Norton could only fight coming forward. Ali's style played right into Norton's hands. Ali is unquestionable the greater fighter, but Norton had his number.

As for the weight loss, Jones entered the right at 193 against Ruiz, and think it's safe to assume that he didn't sweat out any water before the weigh-in because he at HW the weigh in is just a formality. On a normal fight night at LH, Roy would fight at 175, probably draining out about 10 lbs of water to make weight. So his fight night weight would be around 185. Even if Jones only draining 5lbs, that brings him in at 180. So Roy only had to take off 10-15 lbs, probably closer to 10. It's not like he ballooned up to 205. The probably had some impact, but I believe it's greatly overblown, and by second fight, he had plenty of time to recover.

Jones would win clear decision over Tarver.

I just rewatch Griffin 2 and Tarver 2. Like always, Jones throws lead left hook and drops his right or leaves his hand sloppy when he does it. He was doing against Griffin, and he did it against Tarver. Griffin is short and orthodox. He couldn't take advantage. It's a clear technical flaw in Jones game. Tarver is a southpaw with a great counter left. That spells disaster for a guy that drops his right when throwing a left hook, the same way that that pulling your head straight back to avoid punches will get you hurt against a guy with a great left hook. It was a chink in Jones armor and Tarver had the magic bullet.

Jones was looking good on his feet. His handspeed looked good. He won the first round. Clearly, Tarver or somebody in his team had found that flaw and Tarver was looking for it.

So, if Tarver came out like he did against Griffin, Tarver might have caught Roy over his sloppy right in the first round and put him on his butt then. Same result.

I get what you're saying about the technical issue. I just think there was an intimidation factor that kept Roy from performing like he should have against Tarver. I think Roy has fought and beaten tougher opponents and he's fought guys who COULD HAVE hit him with that same left hook, but weren't able to. Look at the third match, Roy got hit with that left hook, but kept his feet. It wasn't the punch that beat him, it was Roy's confidence. He spent half the fight hanging his head out there for Tarver to tap on as if to say, "See? You can take that, you can take that." He didn't start fighting back until halfway through the fight. Roy felt he'd won a moral victory at the end of that one because he'd simply survived.