Re: The truth about the Mayweather, Cotto, Margarito, Delahoya, Williams debacle
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
I stopped reading when the OP compared Miguel Cotto to Oktay Urkal in terms of earning potential.
Seriously you must surely know that a Cotto Mayweather fight is at least a 1 million buy job right?
I'd bet it would probably take over 1.5 million buys which is more than I'd expect a rematch with Oscar to make in all honesty.
Right now the biggest money maker out there for Floyd is Miguel Cotto.
If/when Cotto has beaten Williams or Margarito Floyd will come out of semi retirement to face him and the fight would likely rival the first De La Hoya fight for PPV buys.
Cotto vs Mayweather is the fight that most boxing fans want to see. Floyd is merely being smart in waiting for Cotto's star to rise a little bit higher before putting pen to paper in what will probably be his career biggest payday.
I don't agree at all.
Oscar-Floyd 2 may not be the fight that hardcore boxing fans want to see, but I guarantee you that that fight would blow away Floyd-Cotto in terms of PPVs. Oscar is still Oscar.
Floyd would make more money to fight Oscar than to fight Cotto, and it's really not even close. You're either severely underrating Oscar's popularity, severely overrating Cotto's popularity.... or both.
Well if you read my post correctly I said that 'if/when Cotto has beaten Margarito or Williams' a Floyd fight would rival Mayweather De La Hoya.
If they fought right now I believe it would be a 1+ million PPV show. If Floyd can get 850,000 buys for fighting Hatton a fight with Cotto would draw 1 million.
And Cotto is becoming more popular all the time. If he can add say the winner of Williams/Margarito to his resume he stamps himself as unquestionably the number 1 contender to Floyd's crown and THAT fight WOULD be bigger than a Mayweather De La Hoya rematch in my opinion.
And you're still wrong.
A mega-PPV like Oscar-Floyd doesn't get 2.4 million PPV buys by appealing to hardcore boxing fans. You get all those PPVs by appealing to the general public.
Hardcore boxing fans (like the people on this board) like Miguel Cotto and want to see him fight Floyd. The general public doesn't have a clue who Miguel Cotto is. And if Cotto beats Margarito or Williams, that doesn't change anything, because the general public doesn't know who Antonio Margarito or Paul Williams are either. Miguel Cotto could beat every top welterweight besides Mayweather, and Cotto still wouldn't have anywhere near the name-recogniton and visibility that Oscar has. That's a fact.
I've said a ton of times here that Floyd-Cotto is far and away the fight that I want to see most. I'd love to see that fight. But I'm not the average sports fan, I'm a hardcore boxing fan. Cotto appeals to the hardcore fans, not to the general public. Cotto is a big draw in Puerto Rico and New York City, that's it. Look at Cotto-Judah, which set the all-time record for attendance at Madison Sqaure Garden. If that fight had been in Vegas, LA, or Chicago, the arena would have been half-empty. Cotto-Mosley didn't even sell out in New York, and it would have sold a lot fewer tickets in any other city. Oscar can sell out an arena anywhere in the world.
A Floyd-Cotto fight will never be as big of a moneymaker as a Floyd-Oscar rematch would be. Never.
Re: The truth about the Mayweather, Cotto, Margarito, Delahoya, Williams debacle
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
I stopped reading when the OP compared Miguel Cotto to Oktay Urkal in terms of earning potential.
Seriously you must surely know that a Cotto Mayweather fight is at least a 1 million buy job right?
I'd bet it would probably take over 1.5 million buys which is more than I'd expect a rematch with Oscar to make in all honesty.
Right now the biggest money maker out there for Floyd is Miguel Cotto.
If/when Cotto has beaten Williams or Margarito Floyd will come out of semi retirement to face him and the fight would likely rival the first De La Hoya fight for PPV buys.
Cotto vs Mayweather is the fight that most boxing fans want to see. Floyd is merely being smart in waiting for Cotto's star to rise a little bit higher before putting pen to paper in what will probably be his career biggest payday.
I don't agree at all.
Oscar-Floyd 2 may not be the fight that hardcore boxing fans want to see, but I guarantee you that that fight would blow away Floyd-Cotto in terms of PPVs. Oscar is still Oscar.
Floyd would make more money to fight Oscar than to fight Cotto, and it's really not even close. You're either severely underrating Oscar's popularity, severely overrating Cotto's popularity.... or both.
Well if you read my post correctly I said that 'if/when Cotto has beaten Margarito or Williams' a Floyd fight would rival Mayweather De La Hoya.
If they fought right now I believe it would be a 1+ million PPV show. If Floyd can get 850,000 buys for fighting Hatton a fight with Cotto would draw 1 million.
And Cotto is becoming more popular all the time. If he can add say the winner of Williams/Margarito to his resume he stamps himself as unquestionably the number 1 contender to Floyd's crown and THAT fight WOULD be bigger than a Mayweather De La Hoya rematch in my opinion.
And you're still wrong.
A mega-PPV like Oscar-Floyd doesn't get 2.4 million PPV buys by appealing to hardcore boxing fans. You get all those PPVs by appealing to the general public.
Hardcore boxing fans (like the people on this board) like Miguel Cotto and want to see him fight Floyd. The general public doesn't have a clue who Miguel Cotto is. And if Cotto beats Margarito or Williams, that doesn't change anything, because the general public doesn't know who Antonio Margarito or Paul Williams are either. Miguel Cotto could beat every top welterweight besides Mayweather, and Cotto still wouldn't have anywhere near the name-recogniton and visibility that Oscar has. That's a fact.
I've said a ton of times here that Floyd-Cotto is far and away the fight that I want to see most. I'd love to see that fight. But I'm not the average sports fan, I'm a hardcore boxing fan. Cotto appeals to the hardcore fans, not to the general public. Cotto is a big draw in Puerto Rico and New York City, that's it. Look at Cotto-Judah, which set the all-time record for attendance at Madison Sqaure Garden. If that fight had been in Vegas, LA, or Chicago, the arena would have been half-empty. Cotto-Mosley didn't even sell out in New York, and it would have sold a lot fewer tickets in any other city. Oscar can sell out an arena anywhere in the world.
A Floyd-Cotto fight will never be as big of a moneymaker as a Floyd-Oscar rematch would be. Never.
you got to give Cotto more credit he is huge in PR, NY but thats not the case the case is that It is Oscar that will bring in the buys for any of the 2 as for the general public.
Re: The truth about the Mayweather, Cotto, Margarito, Delahoya, Williams debacle
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
I stopped reading when the OP compared Miguel Cotto to Oktay Urkal in terms of earning potential.
Seriously you must surely know that a Cotto Mayweather fight is at least a 1 million buy job right?
I'd bet it would probably take over 1.5 million buys which is more than I'd expect a rematch with Oscar to make in all honesty.
Right now the biggest money maker out there for Floyd is Miguel Cotto.
If/when Cotto has beaten Williams or Margarito Floyd will come out of semi retirement to face him and the fight would likely rival the first De La Hoya fight for PPV buys.
Cotto vs Mayweather is the fight that most boxing fans want to see. Floyd is merely being smart in waiting for Cotto's star to rise a little bit higher before putting pen to paper in what will probably be his career biggest payday.
I don't agree at all.
Oscar-Floyd 2 may not be the fight that hardcore boxing fans want to see, but I guarantee you that that fight would blow away Floyd-Cotto in terms of PPVs. Oscar is still Oscar.
Floyd would make more money to fight Oscar than to fight Cotto, and it's really not even close. You're either severely underrating Oscar's popularity, severely overrating Cotto's popularity.... or both.
Well if you read my post correctly I said that 'if/when Cotto has beaten Margarito or Williams' a Floyd fight would rival Mayweather De La Hoya.
If they fought right now I believe it would be a 1+ million PPV show. If Floyd can get 850,000 buys for fighting Hatton a fight with Cotto would draw 1 million.
And Cotto is becoming more popular all the time. If he can add say the winner of Williams/Margarito to his resume he stamps himself as unquestionably the number 1 contender to Floyd's crown and THAT fight WOULD be bigger than a Mayweather De La Hoya rematch in my opinion.
And you're still wrong.
A mega-PPV like Oscar-Floyd doesn't get 2.4 million PPV buys by appealing to hardcore boxing fans. You get all those PPVs by appealing to the general public.
Hardcore boxing fans (like the people on this board) like Miguel Cotto and want to see him fight Floyd. The general public doesn't have a clue who Miguel Cotto is. And if Cotto beats Margarito or Williams, that doesn't change anything, because the general public doesn't know who Antonio Margarito or Paul Williams are either. Miguel Cotto could beat every top welterweight besides Mayweather, and Cotto still wouldn't have anywhere near the name-recogniton and visibility that Oscar has. That's a fact.
I've said a ton of times here that Floyd-Cotto is far and away the fight that I want to see most. I'd love to see that fight. But I'm not the average sports fan, I'm a hardcore boxing fan. Cotto appeals to the hardcore fans, not to the general public. Cotto is a big draw in Puerto Rico and New York City, that's it. Look at Cotto-Judah, which set the all-time record for attendance at Madison Sqaure Garden. If that fight had been in Vegas, LA, or Chicago, the arena would have been half-empty. Oscar can sell out an arena anywhere in the world.
A Floyd-Cotto fight will never be as big of a moneymaker as a Floyd-Oscar rematch would be. Never.
You may have a point but it seems to me you are assuming that a rematch with Oscar would generate the same PPV numbers as it did before. I really don't think it will. I'd be very suprised if a rematch got near 2 million buys again as the first fight, although an interesting tactical matchup really wasn't that exciting.
I'd guess a rematch would get around 1.5 million buys if it happened right not, maybe even less as they could hardly do another 24/7 show considering Oscar hasn't fought since that defeat.
Now regarding Cotto's popularity, I agree he's nowhere near Oscar. His fight with Mosely got 400,000 buys I believe compared to over 800,000 that Oscar got for Mayorga.
But Floyd himself is becoming more popular. The Hatton fight may have been big over in the UK because of Hatton's popularity but he's certainly not a household name in the states. You'd have to agree that Floyd was responsible for HBO's figures on that fight as Hatton can't carry a PPV in America.
So seeing as Hatton was less of a star in America that Cotto and Cotto is very much on the way up I'd say right now a Cotto Mayweather fight breaks 1 million buys.
If he does go on to unify the welterweight division in Mayweather's temporary absence his popularity will rise, but more importantly the significance of the challenge for Floyd would rise and more people would likely pay to watch FLOYD, not Cotto ;)
It's probably a way off but I'm very confident that if/when the Cotto fight happens it will generate well over a million buys, I'd say around 1.5 million.
If Floyd rematches Oscar this year I'd estimate the rematch would net around 1.3-1.5 million.
So I stand by my original statement that a potential future Cotto match could eclipse the PPV buys of a De La Hoya rematch
Re: The truth about the Mayweather, Cotto, Margarito, Delahoya, Williams debacle
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetPea
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
I stopped reading when the OP compared Miguel Cotto to Oktay Urkal in terms of earning potential.
Seriously you must surely know that a Cotto Mayweather fight is at least a 1 million buy job right?
I'd bet it would probably take over 1.5 million buys which is more than I'd expect a rematch with Oscar to make in all honesty.
Right now the biggest money maker out there for Floyd is Miguel Cotto.
If/when Cotto has beaten Williams or Margarito Floyd will come out of semi retirement to face him and the fight would likely rival the first De La Hoya fight for PPV buys.
Cotto vs Mayweather is the fight that most boxing fans want to see. Floyd is merely being smart in waiting for Cotto's star to rise a little bit higher before putting pen to paper in what will probably be his career biggest payday.
I don't agree at all.
Oscar-Floyd 2 may not be the fight that hardcore boxing fans want to see, but I guarantee you that that fight would blow away Floyd-Cotto in terms of PPVs. Oscar is still Oscar.
Floyd would make more money to fight Oscar than to fight Cotto, and it's really not even close. You're either severely underrating Oscar's popularity, severely overrating Cotto's popularity.... or both.
Well if you read my post correctly I said that 'if/when Cotto has beaten Margarito or Williams' a Floyd fight would rival Mayweather De La Hoya.
If they fought right now I believe it would be a 1+ million PPV show. If Floyd can get 850,000 buys for fighting Hatton a fight with Cotto would draw 1 million.
And Cotto is becoming more popular all the time. If he can add say the winner of Williams/Margarito to his resume he stamps himself as unquestionably the number 1 contender to Floyd's crown and THAT fight WOULD be bigger than a Mayweather De La Hoya rematch in my opinion.
And you're still wrong.
A mega-PPV like Oscar-Floyd doesn't get 2.4 million PPV buys by appealing to hardcore boxing fans. You get all those PPVs by appealing to the general public.
Hardcore boxing fans (like the people on this board) like Miguel Cotto and want to see him fight Floyd. The general public doesn't have a clue who Miguel Cotto is. And if Cotto beats Margarito or Williams, that doesn't change anything, because the general public doesn't know who Antonio Margarito or Paul Williams are either. Miguel Cotto could beat every top welterweight besides Mayweather, and Cotto still wouldn't have anywhere near the name-recogniton and visibility that Oscar has. That's a fact.
I've said a ton of times here that Floyd-Cotto is far and away the fight that I want to see most. I'd love to see that fight. But I'm not the average sports fan, I'm a hardcore boxing fan. Cotto appeals to the hardcore fans, not to the general public. Cotto is a big draw in Puerto Rico and New York City, that's it. Look at Cotto-Judah, which set the all-time record for attendance at Madison Sqaure Garden. If that fight had been in Vegas, LA, or Chicago, the arena would have been half-empty. Oscar can sell out an arena anywhere in the world.
A Floyd-Cotto fight will never be as big of a moneymaker as a Floyd-Oscar rematch would be. Never.
You may have a point but it seems to me you are assuming that a rematch with Oscar would generate the same PPV numbers as it did before. I really don't think it will. I'd be very suprised if a rematch got near 2 million buys again as the first fight, although an interesting tactical matchup really wasn't that exciting.
I'd guess a rematch would get around 1.5 million buys if it happened right not, maybe even less as they could hardly do another 24/7 show considering Oscar hasn't fought since that defeat.
Now regarding Cotto's popularity, I agree he's nowhere near Oscar. His fight with Mosely got 400,000 buys I believe compared to over 800,000 that Oscar got for Mayorga.
But Floyd himself is becoming more popular. The Hatton fight may have been big over in the UK because of Hatton's popularity but he's certainly not a household name in the states. You'd have to agree that Floyd was responsible for HBO's figures on that fight as Hatton can't carry a PPV in America.
So seeing as Hatton was less of a star in America that Cotto and Cotto is very much on the way up I'd say right now a Cotto Mayweather fight breaks 1 million buys.
If he does go on to unify the welterweight division in Mayweather's temporary absence his popularity will rise, but more importantly the significance of the challenge for Floyd would rise and more people would likely pay to watch FLOYD, not Cotto ;)
It's probably a way off but I'm very confident that if/when the Cotto fight happens it will generate well over a million buys, I'd say around 1.5 million.
If Floyd rematches Oscar this year I'd estimate the rematch would net around 1.3-1.5 million.
So I stand by my original statement that a potential future Cotto match could eclipse the PPV buys of a De La Hoya rematch
No, I don't think that all. A rematch won't get 2.4 million. But I don't see it dropping below 1.5 million PPVs. I guess it ends up somewhere between 1.5 and 2 million. And I don't see Floyd-Cotto ever doing more than 1 million PPVS, and I'm being generous in even saying it could draw that much. My best guess would be around 700-800K PPV buys for Floyd-Cotto, with 1 million an outside chance if the fight were marketed perfectly.
Floyd-Oscar 2 would probably double Floyd-Cotto in terms of PPV buys.
When factoring in the 850K that Floyd-Hatton did, you have to factor in something.... and that's the fact that Ricky Hatton is white and speaks English as his first language. And like it or not, those things have a big effect on the interest levels of the general public in the United States. If Ricky Hatton had been a Spanish speaker from somewhere in Latin America, that fight would have done 400-500K.
Re: The truth about the Mayweather, Cotto, Margarito, Delahoya, Williams debacle
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
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Originally Posted by SweetPea
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Originally Posted by Bilbo
I stopped reading when the OP compared Miguel Cotto to Oktay Urkal in terms of earning potential.
Seriously you must surely know that a Cotto Mayweather fight is at least a 1 million buy job right?
I'd bet it would probably take over 1.5 million buys which is more than I'd expect a rematch with Oscar to make in all honesty.
Right now the biggest money maker out there for Floyd is Miguel Cotto.
If/when Cotto has beaten Williams or Margarito Floyd will come out of semi retirement to face him and the fight would likely rival the first De La Hoya fight for PPV buys.
Cotto vs Mayweather is the fight that most boxing fans want to see. Floyd is merely being smart in waiting for Cotto's star to rise a little bit higher before putting pen to paper in what will probably be his career biggest payday.
I don't agree at all.
Oscar-Floyd 2 may not be the fight that hardcore boxing fans want to see, but I guarantee you that that fight would blow away Floyd-Cotto in terms of PPVs. Oscar is still Oscar.
Floyd would make more money to fight Oscar than to fight Cotto, and it's really not even close. You're either severely underrating Oscar's popularity, severely overrating Cotto's popularity.... or both.
Well if you read my post correctly I said that 'if/when Cotto has beaten Margarito or Williams' a Floyd fight would rival Mayweather De La Hoya.
If they fought right now I believe it would be a 1+ million PPV show. If Floyd can get 850,000 buys for fighting Hatton a fight with Cotto would draw 1 million.
And Cotto is becoming more popular all the time. If he can add say the winner of Williams/Margarito to his resume he stamps himself as unquestionably the number 1 contender to Floyd's crown and THAT fight WOULD be bigger than a Mayweather De La Hoya rematch in my opinion.
And you're still wrong.
A mega-PPV like Oscar-Floyd doesn't get 2.4 million PPV buys by appealing to hardcore boxing fans. You get all those PPVs by appealing to the general public.
Hardcore boxing fans (like the people on this board) like Miguel Cotto and want to see him fight Floyd. The general public doesn't have a clue who Miguel Cotto is. And if Cotto beats Margarito or Williams, that doesn't change anything, because the general public doesn't know who Antonio Margarito or Paul Williams are either. Miguel Cotto could beat every top welterweight besides Mayweather, and Cotto still wouldn't have anywhere near the name-recogniton and visibility that Oscar has. That's a fact.
I've said a ton of times here that Floyd-Cotto is far and away the fight that I want to see most. I'd love to see that fight. But I'm not the average sports fan, I'm a hardcore boxing fan. Cotto appeals to the hardcore fans, not to the general public. Cotto is a big draw in Puerto Rico and New York City, that's it. Look at Cotto-Judah, which set the all-time record for attendance at Madison Sqaure Garden. If that fight had been in Vegas, LA, or Chicago, the arena would have been half-empty. Oscar can sell out an arena anywhere in the world.
A Floyd-Cotto fight will never be as big of a moneymaker as a Floyd-Oscar rematch would be. Never.
You may have a point but it seems to me you are assuming that a rematch with Oscar would generate the same PPV numbers as it did before. I really don't think it will. I'd be very suprised if a rematch got near 2 million buys again as the first fight, although an interesting tactical matchup really wasn't that exciting.
I'd guess a rematch would get around 1.5 million buys if it happened right not, maybe even less as they could hardly do another 24/7 show considering Oscar hasn't fought since that defeat.
Now regarding Cotto's popularity, I agree he's nowhere near Oscar. His fight with Mosely got 400,000 buys I believe compared to over 800,000 that Oscar got for Mayorga.
But Floyd himself is becoming more popular. The Hatton fight may have been big over in the UK because of Hatton's popularity but he's certainly not a household name in the states. You'd have to agree that Floyd was responsible for HBO's figures on that fight as Hatton can't carry a PPV in America.
So seeing as Hatton was less of a star in America that Cotto and Cotto is very much on the way up I'd say right now a Cotto Mayweather fight breaks 1 million buys.
If he does go on to unify the welterweight division in Mayweather's temporary absence his popularity will rise, but more importantly the significance of the challenge for Floyd would rise and more people would likely pay to watch FLOYD, not Cotto ;)
It's probably a way off but I'm very confident that if/when the Cotto fight happens it will generate well over a million buys, I'd say around 1.5 million.
If Floyd rematches Oscar this year I'd estimate the rematch would net around 1.3-1.5 million.
So I stand by my original statement that a potential future Cotto match could eclipse the PPV buys of a De La Hoya rematch
No, I don't think that all. A rematch won't get 2.4 million. But I don't see it dropping below 1.5 million PPVs. I guess it ends up somewhere between 1.5 and 2 million. And I don't see Floyd-Cotto ever doing more than 1 million PPVS, and I'm being generous in even saying it could draw that much. My best guess would be around 700-800K PPV buys for Floyd-Cotto, with 1 million an outside chance if the fight were marketed perfectly.
Floyd-Oscar 2 would probably double Floyd-Cotto in terms of PPV buys.
When factoring in the 850K that Floyd-Hatton did, you have to factor in something.... and that's the fact that Ricky Hatton is white and speaks English as his first language. And like it or not, those things have a big effect on the interest levels of the general public in the United States. If Ricky Hatton had been a Spanish speaker from somewhere in Latin America, that fight would have done 400-500K.
Well considering the FREE Calzaghe Kessler fight had the lowest viewing figures for a HBO championship fight EVER I'd say it has more to do with just being White and speaking English.
I guess where we disagree is on that a De La Hoya rematch right now would still be a 2 million PPV event and that Floyd himself isn't now a big PPV star in his own right.
