Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
I dont think that Manny or Roach have ever wanted to compete at Welterweight. The reason they wanted the Oscar fight at 147, is because Roach knew it was a good fight for him, and Oscar was done as a fighter plus Oscar brought in the money. Oscar also brought in the public interest and the fight made Manny an even bigger star than he already was and to a much bigger audience. Fighting at 147 was only for that one fight and a genius business move. Manny is a light welterweight now and that is where he should be. Just like Floyd fought Oscar at light Middle, but is a Welterweight and doesnt belong at 154 and he too had no intention of staying there. Bottom line was if Oscar offered you a fight, reguardless of the weight, you take it.
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
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Originally Posted by
Galaxy
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Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Galaxy
Pacquiao & Roach aren't interested in Mosley or Cotto now because they haven't accepted the unrealistic catchweights! I don't blame Pacquiao, he should remain at 140 & either wait for the Mayweather/ Marquez winner or fight someone like Bradley.
I wish Mosley would make a fight soon! He should target Williams imo
exactly what i was saying, and then they try to label one a "hater" for saying it
Your not a hater mate, just stating the way you & many others (myself included) feel. Pacquiao is interested in fighting Mosley or Cotto but only at weights that are advantagous to him! This not interested business is rubbish. I bet if Mosley came out today saying he's prepared to meet Pacquiao at 142; Pacquiao would be all over it. But that ain't gonna happen cause Mosley, Pacquiao & Roach all know its not a realistic weight for Mosley to make & still be effective!
Pacquiao is a great fighter & I take nothing away from him for not wanting to meet Mosley or Cotto at 147, but saying he wants these guys & then putting on unrealistic stipulations to avoid them is just smoke & mirrors
Pacquiao should just come out & say 'I'd love to fight Mosley or Cotto but they are a little to big & it would be unfair for them to drop the weight, I think my best weight is around 140 & will concentrate my future efforts towards to Mayweather/ Marquez winner'
Nothing wrong with the truth!!!
No doubt,You know how refreshing that would be.....for any fighter to realize a viable/realistic weight range and do everything to clean it out.But if he said that,I'd give it 2 minutes before the "Ducking talk" runs rampant.Everytime I here Arum talking of "we only want big mega-fights",I crinch.The lines of great fighters,major names resulting in great fights are blurred,has been a name attraction affair even more so over the last number of years.I think we miss many suprises along the way.
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
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Originally Posted by
Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Galaxy
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Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
exactly what i was saying, and then they try to label one a "hater" for saying it
Your not a hater mate, just stating the way you & many others (myself included) feel. Pacquiao is interested in fighting Mosley or Cotto but only at weights that are advantagous to him! This not interested business is rubbish. I bet if Mosley came out today saying he's prepared to meet Pacquiao at 142; Pacquiao would be all over it. But that ain't gonna happen cause Mosley, Pacquiao & Roach all know its not a realistic weight for Mosley to make & still be effective!
Pacquiao is a great fighter & I take nothing away from him for not wanting to meet Mosley or Cotto at 147, but saying he wants these guys & then putting on unrealistic stipulations to avoid them is just smoke & mirrors
Pacquiao should just come out & say 'I'd love to fight Mosley or Cotto but they are a little to big & it would be unfair for them to drop the weight, I think my best weight is around 140 & will concentrate my future efforts towards to Mayweather/ Marquez winner'
Nothing wrong with the truth!!!
No doubt,You know how refreshing that would be.....for any fighter to realize a viable/realistic weight range and do everything to clean it out.But if he said that,I'd give it 2 minutes before the "Ducking talk" runs rampant.Everytime I here Arum talking of "we only want big mega-fights",I crinch.The lines of great fighters,major names resulting in great fights are blurred,has been a name attraction affair even more so over the last number of years.I think we miss many suprises along the way.
exactly, i'm not trying to take anything away from Manny, and i honestly think he could dominate 140 lbs for a while, the biggest live dog in the weight class (in terms of youth, power, and ability) is Ortiz, and IMO he's still too green and raw, i'd love to see Manny fight the winner of Marquez/Mayweather, and also see him against, Bradley, Witter, Holt, Torres, Campbell, and Guzman, hell even against Khan, but what him (or mostly Roach) are trying to do with these catch weights are ridiculous
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
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Originally Posted by
fan johnny
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
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Originally Posted by
pacman79
Manny Pacquiao is supposedly "not interested" in fighting either Shane Mosley or Miguel Cotto on October 17 (the date of his next bout), but instead is interested only in facing the winner of the July 18 fight between Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Juan Manuel Marquez. Pacquiao is favoring Mayweather in that bout.
It's interesting because you can look at it one of two ways. The biggest fight is not Pacquiao-Mosley or Pacquiao-Cotto, period. It is Pacquiao versus the Floyd-JMM winner, and we all know that. Having "no interest" in fighting them, though? He seems set on that October 17 date, which is four months after the Mayweather-Marquez bout and assumedly plenty of time for either man to recover, but what if it's a hard fight? What if the winner isn't ready to go that soon? What then? At that point, Mosley or Cotto become the best opponent.
The Pacquiao Mania is pretty awesome and totally deserved, but it feels like we're all setting ourselves up for a letdown if he takes a "good" fight but not a great one in October. If he matches up with a guy on the level of Nate Campbell or Tim Bradley or the like (not that either is likely) instead of a Mosley or Cotto, people will complain. He won't be fighting a bad opponent, though. And frankly this is the type of situation you get sometimes with a great fighter. If he wants to fight, he's gotta fight someone, and the best just might not be available at that time.
But it looks like Mosley will be available. I truly think Freddie Roach and Pacquiao know that's a tough matchup. Mosley is much bigger than Manny at 5'9", and he's still a beast of a welterweight. It's a great fight and one I'd love to see, but I don't think the Pacquiao camp or Top Rank are exactly itching to make that, and for fair enough reasons. I think they absolutely see Manny as a 140-pound fighter save for a special occasion like Oscar or Floyd, where the money is so good that you'd be a fool to pass it up.
One other thing I was thinking about: It's too bad that the pricetag would be too high, because a Shane Mosley-Zab Judah fight on the Mayweather-Marquez undercard could've been a great idea at this point. It gets Shane in the ring in a should-win fight and there's still some decent name value going on there with Judah. I really wish Mosley would make a fight. Sadly I don't think the "big fights" he wants are coming.
all this proves is that Manny has no real interest in fighting REAL welterweight fighters while they're in their REAL weight class, he was all over the idea when Roach said 142, but since neither man took the bait, now he doesn't want the fight, i wouldn't say anything bad about Manny if he decided to take on Bradley or Campbell or even Torres, cause he'd be taking on the best at 140, unlike what he did at 135, Mosley and Cotto are both big names, and they both sell fights, so don't think that the money issue is that valid
You're such a hater dude!
It's all just talk.... and none of it really "means" or "proves" anything......
None of those guys you listed are maga draws as far as PPV numbers go. Money is a primary issue and will continue to be a primary issue.
But David Diaz was, right? That was a PPV fight. Why can't Bradley or Campbell be one?
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
I'm not even going to try to debate with you, just read the rebuttal yourself.;D
Insider Notebook: Vazquez Returns, Pacquiao Debate - Boxing News
Pacquiao Afraid: Don't Think So
This innuendo about Manny Pacquiao being afraid of African American fighters has been making its way around for the past two weeks, yet it was news to Freddie Roach.
"That is the first time I have heard about it," Roach, Pacquiao's trainer, said Wednesday morning via telephone from his Wild Card Gym in Hollywood.
Roach was told this came from trainer John David Jackson, who is African American.
"John David Jackson. That is the most absurd statement I have ever heard in my life," Roach said. "Fighters aren't afraid of anybody. Managers make the decisions, not fighters. He must have a guy he wants to make some money with, that's all."
Indeed, Jackson trains Nate Campbell, an African American and former lightweight champion who recently lost his title on the scales.
Roach went on to note that most of the top fighters in the divisions in which Pacquiao has been fighting have been Mexican. But he also pointed out a few other things.
For one: "We knocked out (Lehlohonolo) Ledwaba. He's African. How much more African can you get? He's a real African, not like John David Jackson, who is an American African."
Bob Arum, Pacquiao's promoter, was reached by telephone on Wednesday in Florida. He is there watching Miguel Cotto train for his June 13 welterweight title defense against Joshua Clottey. Arum was incensed that Jackson would suggest for one second that Pacquiao is afraid to take on African American fighters.
"Yeah, he is afraid to fight African Americans because he fought a bigger Oscar De La Hoya and Ricky Hatton, which generated tremendous amounts of money," Arum said. "When people start this race s**t, it is unbelievable. You could say the same thing aout Mayweather, right? I don't see him fighting ("Sugar" Shane) Mosley. He fought (Oscar) De La Hoya and Ricky Hatton in his last two fights, so it's clear he is afraid of black fighters, right?
"Of course, he isn't. It's nonsense and to start this bulls**t.... People use this ethnic stuff in such an evil way that it makes me disgusted. Every time something happens that is not to a person's liking, instead of saying this should happen or that should happen, they go to the race card. Any race card."
Arum used a political analogy to hammer home his point.
"Did (John) McCain say he didn't get elected president because he was white?" Arum said. "I guess he could have. It is stupid. Anybody who would give any credence to what Jackson said is a moron."
Arum also pointed to President Barack Obama's nomination this week of Sonia Sotomayor to become the first Hispanic justice on the Supreme Court. Arum suggested some critics are bound to say she was nominated because she is Hispanic.
"She was chosen because she is a great judge," Arum said.
Furthermore, Roach said, not only has Pacquiao been fighting the best in the world, he has his eyes on Mayweather and Mosley, both of whom are African American.
There have been reports that Pacquiao was not interested in Mosley. But when Roach was asked if he had advised Pacquiao to wait until the result of the Juan Manuel Marquez-Mayweather fight July 18 before making a decision as to whom he would fight next, Roach brought Mosley's name into the mix.
"We're not so much waiting," Roach said, "but the best fighters that are out there for us are Floyd Mayweather, (Miguel) Cotto and Mosley. Those are the mega-fight guys."
Pacquiao has fought once at welterweight. He just knocked out Hatton at junior welterweight. Mayweather, Cotto and Mosley are welterweights.
"I can't think of anyone at 140 (junior welterweight) that would draw like those guys," Roach said. "And Manny wants to fight the biggest fights out there. Once we find out who wins those fights between Cotto and his guy and Marquez and Mayweather, I think we will be able to make a better decision at that point."
Roach took a shot at Mayweather when sizing up Pacquiao's next possible opponent.
"The easiest fight out of those three, in my opinion, is Mayweather," Roach said. "The other two guys are way stronger, way more physical. Look at Mayweather; he struggled against De La Hoya and his fight with Hatton was competitive.
"And Manny killed both of those guys. I don't care what the excuses are. A fact is a fact. He (Mayweather) won a split decision against De La Hoya. We didn't lose a round to either."
Actually, De La Hoya was given one round by one of the judges before he did not answer the bell for the ninth round of his fight against Pacquaio in December. And to say Hatton was competitive against Mayweather might be a bit of a stretch, though it did take Mayweather 10 rounds to stop Hatton, eight rounds longer than it took Pacquiao.
Roach was asked if he is of the mind that Mosley would be the most difficult nut to crack of the three.
"What he did with Margarito was great," Roach said of Mosley's ninth-round stoppage of Margarito in January in Los Angeles. "But remember, after Manny beat Oscar he told me he wanted to fight Margarito next because he knew he was beatable.
"Manny bet on Mosley (against Margarito); he won a lot of money that night. Mosley is fast, he is aggressive, he is strong and it looks like he would be the toughest fight out there. But then you have to take into consideration that Cotto beat him. Both are bigger than Mayweaether, size-wise. Mayweather can make 140 easy. He is just lazy."
As for Arum, he said he believes Pacquiao's next opponent could be either Cotto or Mosley. Presumably, Pacquiao will next fight in October.
"I think Mayweather would not really be available this year and I think Mosley or Miguel would be good candidates provided they got down to the catch-weight (of 144 pounds)," Arum said.
Why, Arum was asked, will Mayweather not be available this year?
"Because he's Mayweather," Arum said. "And, obviously, we're not going to wait until after the Marquez fight. There have been no discussions whatsoever with the Mayweather people at this particular point and as far as I know nobody is pushing the Mayweather fight."
Arum said the final decision will rest with Pacquiao and Roach.
And what if Clottey beats Cotto? Clottey, also promoted by Arum, is of African descent.
"Pacquiao won't fight Clottey, Arum said. "He is afraid of black fighters."
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
Has Manny himself ever said he doesn't want to fight COtto or Mosley at 147? I am under the impression its always Freddie Roach or other people that are saying stuff like that. Just like the bullshit that Pacquiao was trying to price himself out of a fight with RIcky Hatton.
Also is it not valid to want to fight Mayweather or Marquez more than Cotto or Mosley? Are they not better fighters? ANd the winner of their fight will make Pacquiao way more money than Cotto or Mosley could generate for him, as well as it would establish his legacy a LOT more than beating Shane or Miguel. Mayweather was a better welterweight than either Cotto or Mosley and would have been favored to beat either of them at 147, Marquez gave Pacquiao two of his three hardest fights since becoming a star, he's the only person who is somewhat in contention for the p4p title right now.
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
Hold up..!!What is it that no one listens to Floyd,,He is 147 right now.He said it last week on Friday night Fights..An why do these sorry names keep comen up Judah Are u serious when the last time he won a fight.So is that what boxing has come to lose all the fights u want retire come back an fight Champions.Pac is 140 Why is this the best fight for Floyd?See what needs to happen is Eliminate Pac An Judahs name Replace them wit Berto an Williams.Both of these guys are belt holders that are being ignored..Let pac stay down at 140.Theres fights there for him.Shane can get Williams,Floyd take Berto vice versa.Mix that up however u like.Then some Questions can be answerd.If Pac wanna get in on that he need to get his weight up 147..
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
I'm with PAC... Why fight Cotto or Mosley at 147 when he can wait the winner of PBF-JMM and have a fight at 143?? Winner of PBF-JMM will give him the most money I think...
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Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
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Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
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Originally Posted by
fan johnny
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Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
all this proves is that Manny has no real interest in fighting REAL welterweight fighters while they're in their REAL weight class, he was all over the idea when Roach said 142, but since neither man took the bait, now he doesn't want the fight, i wouldn't say anything bad about Manny if he decided to take on Bradley or Campbell or even Torres, cause he'd be taking on the best at 140, unlike what he did at 135, Mosley and Cotto are both big names, and they both sell fights, so don't think that the money issue is that valid
You're such a hater dude!
It's all just talk.... and none of it really "means" or "proves" anything......
None of those guys you listed are maga draws as far as PPV numbers go. Money is a primary issue and will continue to be a primary issue.
But David Diaz was, right? That was a PPV fight. Why can't Bradley or Campbell be one?
If Team Bradley or Team Campbell can offer PAC a $12M guaranteed purse, I think PAC will take the fight...
PAC's guaranteed purse history:
vs. David Diaz = $3M
vs. Hoya = > $10M
vs. Hatton = $12M
So PAC's next fight should be at least with $12M guaranteed purse... The winner of PBF-JMM fight IMO can offer that kind of money to PAC...
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Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
Well i woudl say Mosley over all has done alot more at Welter then Mayweather has at 147 teath i cant see any wins that are better then Molseys are enless you want to point them out for me i guess. As for the fight i say Mosley would be a harder fight then Pac to be honest or atleast as hard i just think i Mosley best wins are on par if not better then Mayweathers are only diffrence is that he beat a prime Oscar and not the part time fighter he turned out to be later Oscar Dela Hoya the promoter.
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
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Originally Posted by
Taeth
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Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
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Originally Posted by
pacman79
Manny Pacquiao is supposedly "not interested" in fighting either Shane Mosley or Miguel Cotto on October 17 (the date of his next bout), but instead is interested only in facing the winner of the July 18 fight between Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Juan Manuel Marquez. Pacquiao is favoring Mayweather in that bout.
It's interesting because you can look at it one of two ways. The biggest fight is not Pacquiao-Mosley or Pacquiao-Cotto, period. It is Pacquiao versus the Floyd-JMM winner, and we all know that. Having "no interest" in fighting them, though? He seems set on that October 17 date, which is four months after the Mayweather-Marquez bout and assumedly plenty of time for either man to recover, but what if it's a hard fight? What if the winner isn't ready to go that soon? What then? At that point, Mosley or Cotto become the best opponent.
The Pacquiao Mania is pretty awesome and totally deserved, but it feels like we're all setting ourselves up for a letdown if he takes a "good" fight but not a great one in October. If he matches up with a guy on the level of Nate Campbell or Tim Bradley or the like (not that either is likely) instead of a Mosley or Cotto, people will complain. He won't be fighting a bad opponent, though. And frankly this is the type of situation you get sometimes with a great fighter. If he wants to fight, he's gotta fight someone, and the best just might not be available at that time.
But it looks like Mosley will be available. I truly think Freddie Roach and Pacquiao know that's a tough matchup. Mosley is much bigger than Manny at 5'9", and he's still a beast of a welterweight. It's a great fight and one I'd love to see, but I don't think the Pacquiao camp or Top Rank are exactly itching to make that, and for fair enough reasons. I think they absolutely see Manny as a 140-pound fighter save for a special occasion like Oscar or Floyd, where the money is so good that you'd be a fool to pass it up.
One other thing I was thinking about: It's too bad that the pricetag would be too high, because a Shane Mosley-Zab Judah fight on the Mayweather-Marquez undercard could've been a great idea at this point. It gets Shane in the ring in a should-win fight and there's still some decent name value going on there with Judah. I really wish Mosley would make a fight. Sadly I don't think the "big fights" he wants are coming.
all this proves is that Manny has no real interest in fighting REAL welterweight fighters while they're in their REAL weight class, he was all over the idea when Roach said 142, but since neither man took the bait, now he doesn't want the fight, i wouldn't say anything bad about Manny if he decided to take on Bradley or Campbell or even Torres, cause he'd be taking on the best at 140, unlike what he did at 135, Mosley and Cotto are both big names, and they both sell fights, so don't think that the money issue is that valid
Wouldn't Mosley and Cotto be pussies for fighting Pacquiao or Mayweather because neither of them are legit welterweights?
I think PAcman should fight Cotto, and I still see it happening, lets wait for June 09 first.
This thread is going to be just like the Mayweather won't fight welterweights ones.
Does it really fucking matter? Roy Jones wouldn't fight Vitali Klitschko. Big deal.
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
I can't see it happening but since Pac and Cotto share a promoter,a double bill would be mighty.
Pac v Floyd
Cotto v Mosley 2
No undercard needed I'd pay big bucks just for these 2 ;)
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
all this proves is that Manny has no real interest in fighting REAL welterweight fighters while they're in their REAL weight class, he was all over the idea when Roach said 142, but since neither man took the bait, now he doesn't want the fight, i wouldn't say anything bad about Manny if he decided to take on Bradley or Campbell or even Torres, cause he'd be taking on the best at 140, unlike what he did at 135, Mosley and Cotto are both big names, and they both sell fights, so don't think that the money issue is that valid
ANd thats a bad thing? Why in the blue hell would he want to fight a REAL welterweight when he is, in fact, FAR from a REAL welterweight?
I think its amazing that he moved up and took on the #1 light welterweight. Now all of a sudden he's expected to go up and fight the best WW's? I mean common, the guy's a great fighter but he's not superman. What next? Will we expect him to go up and clean out the HW division?
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
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Originally Posted by
Beanflicker
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
all this proves is that Manny has no real interest in fighting REAL welterweight fighters while they're in their REAL weight class, he was all over the idea when Roach said 142, but since neither man took the bait, now he doesn't want the fight, i wouldn't say anything bad about Manny if he decided to take on Bradley or Campbell or even Torres, cause he'd be taking on the best at 140, unlike what he did at 135, Mosley and Cotto are both big names, and they both sell fights, so don't think that the money issue is that valid
ANd thats a bad thing? Why in the blue hell would he want to fight a REAL welterweight when he is, in fact, FAR from a REAL welterweight?
I think its amazing that he moved up and took on the #1 light welterweight. Now all of a sudden he's expected to go up and fight the best WW's? I mean common, the guy's a great fighter but he's not superman. What next? Will we expect him to go up and clean out the HW division?
Exactamento!!! A six division world championship is already a feat by itself, especially coming from a former flyweight. Having the welters meet PAC at a catchweight makes the fight a lil fair.
Re: Pacquiao "not interested" in Cotto or Mosley, only Floyd or Marquez
Exactamento!!! A six division world championship is already a feat by itself, especially coming from a former flyweight. Having the welters meet PAC at a catchweight makes the fight a lil fair.[/quote]
I agree with the first statement but not the second.
I don't like catch weight fights.I want to see the best fighting the best at their optimal healthy fighting weights.I'd prefer not to see Cotto/Mosley fight weight-drained like Oscar.
If Manny feels he can compete at 147 (I don't think he can),he should move up.If not he should fight at 140 - Bradley etc.
I would prefer to see more Cotto v Mosley type fights.Than watch Pac via the shell that was Oscar type fights,that were made solely for the money.
