Printable View
Being the undisputed lineal cruiser champ earned him his shot (and the fact he's exciting and can sell a fight). When fighters decide to move up, after conquering a divison, they don't drop from being world-class, right? In almost ALL cases the fighter moves straight into a title shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Haye's situation is no different.
So stop with the "only two heavyweight fights" bollocks. ;)
lol that`ll mean apart from the farce he put on against barrett at the o2 he wouldnt of boxed in about 20 months.
your a joke haye
Is it bollocks??? I mean by your standards I guess Tyson Fury should have had his shot years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Sure Haye was a cruiserweight champ but did he do anything spectacular? Not in my eyes, he beat Jean Marc Mormeck and that's just about it...Enzo Maccarinelli ain't shit, Tomaz Bonin isn't anything, and his biggest win coming vs Monte Barrett is just plain WEAK.
I'm sorry, but David Haye isn't that special yet, he's never even had back-to-back heavyweight fights, that is just lame as hell
I think he stood a better chance with Vlad. Vlad still has the potential to be a headcase if he gets grazed hard enough. Even though I think Haye is very beatable, Vlads chin and mental instability after taking a hard shot would play toward hayes strengths.
Vits bigger and showed a willingness to trade if he has to. Hes far from Ali, but showed some decent lateral movement in his last outing. Maybe Haye will be able to cut Vitali early and have it work to his advantage.
Fenster how many people have moved up to get a shot at the main man in the heavyweight division that were moving up not to many at all. Like i said before how long did it take Holyfeild to get a shot at the heavyweight champion. Not only that he had a better resume coming into the heavyweight division and still had to fight a good amount of guys and wait a few years before his shot i mean the division week but still few guys that should be in the mix.
Wouldn't surpise me if Vitali Klitschko had to pull out aswell, i mean how many fights has he pulled out of ? its got to be atleast half a dozen, he's so injury prone.Quote:
Originally Posted by XaduBoxer
First I heard he pulled out of the fight with an "undisclosed hand injury." The latest I heard it was his back that was bothering him which is why he pulled out of the fight.
Anyone know what "officially" happened to him?
BBC NEWS | Business | Setanta 'is on brink of collapse'
he wasn't gonna get paid, the back injury is bull imo. I can't blame him, but at least be honest about it.
He's in London having his back fixed.
He'll be having an epidural injection in his lower back today. The earliest he'll be fit is July 25th, that's a dead period for boxing, so Haye will most likely fight in September, hopefully against Vitali.
I think hackney is nearer the mark though ;)
err.. no, it's the total opposite. Tyson Fury hasn't proven himself world-class.Quote:
Originally Posted by LyleIs it bollocks??? I mean by your standards I guess Tyson Fury should have had his shot years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Sure Haye was a cruiserweight champ but did he do anything spectacular? Not in my eyes, he beat Jean Marc Mormeck and that's just about it...Enzo Maccarinelli ain't shit, Tomaz Bonin isn't anything, and his biggest win coming vs Monte Barrett is just plain WEAK.
I'm sorry, but David Haye isn't that special yet, he's never even had back-to-back heavyweight fights, that is just lame as hell
The example i've given you shows - the credentials of WORLD-CLASS fighters carry when moving up a division. That is a fact. I can give you a million examples - Spinks-Holmes, Leonard-Hagler, Pac-Hatton, Marquez-Casamayor, Hopkins-Tarver etc etc etc.. none of the guys stepping up PROVED themselves in the higher division, right? It didn't stop them from getting a shot. It didn't stop them from winning. You get it?
This is David Hayes situation. Simple as.
You may well believe he's crap, but the fact is he conquered the cruiserweight division. His exploits at cruiser combined with his exciting style made him a BIG draw straight away at heavyweight, hence the Klits setting up a 60,000 seat stadium for him. ;)
Lyle maybe if Tyson Fury was undisputed, lineal Cruiser Weight Champion you'd have a better argument?
As I've said before... 100s of fighters call out 'the man' in the division when they haven't worked their way up to him yet... look at how many stalkers Floyd Mayweather has. It's pretty much the done thing in boxing.
The difference is most of these guys say 'what has he done' 'why should I fight him' 'he's not done enough yet'... WLAD took the fight... what do you want Haye to do? Say "sorry... I'd rather fight 10 other guys first".
Your problem seems to be the fact that Haye got the fight made... that's Wlad's fault.
And if the Heavyweight division wasn't so piss poor I'm sure Wlad would have found it a lot easier to say 'get in line, wait your turn'.
The rate at which the tickets were selling must show that he had some credentials in the eyes of the non-lyle boxing public? ???
OK in the past 50 years how many "World Class" Cruiserweights have really gone on to be spectacular at heavyweight?
I can tell you right now without even looking it up that more light heavyweights have done better in the heavyweight division than cruiserweights.
What does that have to do with anything? How many had the desire or size to fight at heavyweight?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
The division has only been around since the early 80s anyway. That's not even 30 years of history let alone 50.
OK so fine since cruiserweight started who has moved up and done things at heavyweight? And yes this is relevant because either you're saying "This happens all the time, cruiserweights routinely move up and become champions" OR you're saying "David Haye is skilled like no other cruiserweight bar Evander Holyfield"....and I think either way you look at it that's pretty damn stupid.
The TRUTH of the matter is that light heavyweights who move up to heavyweight have done better than cruiserweights....that's a FACT.
Do you think Tomaz Adamek could hang with any halfway decent heavyweight??? How about Steve Cunningham? Hell Vassily Jirov was one of the best cruiserweights around and he moved up to heavyweight, had a decent fight vs Joe Mesi (a very average fighter) and then ended up getting beat down by the likes of an old Michael Moorer and he ended up fighting to a draw with ORLIN NORRIS!!!!
I'm not saying either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
I'm saying Haye has proven himself a world-class fighter.
It's irrelevant whether or not he's a success at heavyweight. If he can't cope at heavyweight it will be because the weight difference was too much for him, not because he couldn't hack it ability wise. This is NO different to ANY other world-class fighter from ANY other division attempting a rise in weight. ;)