Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Pacquaio is a great fighter, I have no qualms in saying that. He is exciting to watch and brings a lot of excitement to his fights. However, having said that, I do have some issues, but like someone mentioned before that is largely to do with his team. There was no good reason to call Cotto down to a CW, there was no justification for giving Margarito a big fight and there is widespread disdain for choosing to fight Mosley at this point in Mosley's career. We can all point the finger at Roach and Arum, but at the end of the day it is Manny choosing to get in the ring with these people.
We cannot just give unreserved praise to a fighter and it is certainly not hateful to formulate constructive criticism when it is called for.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
For every Pac hater is a loser! An unsportsmanlike loser!
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Pacquaio is a great fighter, I have no qualms in saying that. He is exciting to watch and brings a lot of excitement to his fights. However, having said that, I do have some issues, but like someone mentioned before that is largely to do with his team. There was no good reason to call Cotto down to a CW, there was no justification for giving Margarito a big fight and there is widespread disdain for choosing to fight Mosley at this point in Mosley's career. We can all point the finger at Roach and Arum, but at the end of the day it is Manny choosing to get in the ring with these people.
We cannot just give unreserved praise to a fighter and it is certainly not hateful to formulate constructive criticism when it is called for.
It's not widespread disdain. It's a few criticisms from within the hardcore boxing fan community. The reason Manny has selected Mosley is because it is a fight that the widespread boxing fanbase want to see.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
He doesn't get anywhere near the amount of hate he should.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Pacquaio is a great fighter, I have no qualms in saying that. He is exciting to watch and brings a lot of excitement to his fights. However, having said that, I do have some issues, but like someone mentioned before that is largely to do with his team. There was no good reason to call Cotto down to a CW, there was no justification for giving Margarito a big fight and there is widespread disdain for choosing to fight Mosley at this point in Mosley's career. We can all point the finger at Roach and Arum, but at the end of the day it is Manny choosing to get in the ring with these people.
We cannot just give unreserved praise to a fighter and it is certainly not hateful to formulate constructive criticism when it is called for.
It's not widespread disdain. It's a few criticisms from within the hardcore boxing fan community. The reason Manny has selected Mosley is because it is a fight that the widespread boxing fanbase want to see.
Every forum that I have read since the fight was made is FULL of people who are repulsed by the prospect of this fight. There are a minority of voices saying that they think the fight is acceptable, but that is it. This is the only gauge of popular opinion that we have.
There is no evidence to suggest that Pacquiao-Mosley is being demanded by the public at this stage. Two years ago there was, but after Mosley has been hammered by Mayweather and laboured his way through 12 rounds against Mora for the draw? Nah, the fight will sell on Pacs current name and the fact that Mosley many years ago was an excellent fighter.
There are better fights and bigger challenges than this and everbody knows it. Were fight fans polled on who they wanted to see Manny fight next? Was this poll secretly given to the general public? Get real, it has been made simply because Mosley went rogue and Arum couldn't turn down the prospect of an easily negotiated fight against an old legend. Easy money in the pocket with a minimal level of risk involvement.
It has next to nothing to do with what the typical boxing fan wants nor expects.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
hate, no
but he does deserve criticism for choosing to fight Mosley of all people, especially when there were more challenging opponents than Mosley
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Pacquaio is a great fighter, I have no qualms in saying that. He is exciting to watch and brings a lot of excitement to his fights. However, having said that, I do have some issues, but like someone mentioned before that is largely to do with his team. There was no good reason to call Cotto down to a CW, there was no justification for giving Margarito a big fight and there is widespread disdain for choosing to fight Mosley at this point in Mosley's career. We can all point the finger at Roach and Arum, but at the end of the day it is Manny choosing to get in the ring with these people.
We cannot just give unreserved praise to a fighter and it is certainly not hateful to formulate constructive criticism when it is called for.
It's not widespread disdain. It's a few criticisms from within the hardcore boxing fan community. The reason Manny has selected Mosley is because it is a fight that the widespread boxing fanbase want to see.
Every forum that I have read since the fight was made is FULL of people who are repulsed by the prospect of this fight. There are a minority of voices saying that they think the fight is acceptable, but that is it. This is the only gauge of popular opinion that we have.
There is no evidence to suggest that Pacquiao-Mosley is being demanded by the public at this stage. Two years ago there was, but after Mosley has been hammered by Mayweather and laboured his way through 12 rounds against Mora for the draw? Nah, the fight will sell on Pacs current name and the fact that Mosley many years ago was an excellent fighter.
There are better fights and bigger challenges than this and everbody knows it. Were fight fans polled on who they wanted to see Manny fight next? Was this poll secretly given to the general public? Get real, it has been made simply because Mosley went rogue and Arum couldn't turn down the prospect of an easily negotiated fight against an old legend. Easy money in the pocket with a minimal level of risk involvement.
It has next to nothing to do with what the typical boxing fan wants nor expects.
That's forums mate. That's not widespread. Only about 1% of sporting fans are actually sad enough to be posting members of forums.
The fight will likely do over 1 million PPV buys making it one of the most popular sporting events of 2010.
I'm sure Manny's team will take the opinions of 1 million paying fans over the whines of a few thousand nonpaying armchair critics any day.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Pacquaio is a great fighter, I have no qualms in saying that. He is exciting to watch and brings a lot of excitement to his fights. However, having said that, I do have some issues, but like someone mentioned before that is largely to do with his team. There was no good reason to call Cotto down to a CW, there was no justification for giving Margarito a big fight and there is widespread disdain for choosing to fight Mosley at this point in Mosley's career. We can all point the finger at Roach and Arum, but at the end of the day it is Manny choosing to get in the ring with these people.
We cannot just give unreserved praise to a fighter and it is certainly not hateful to formulate constructive criticism when it is called for.
It's not widespread disdain. It's a few criticisms from within the hardcore boxing fan community. The reason Manny has selected Mosley is because it is a fight that the widespread boxing fanbase want to see.
Every forum that I have read since the fight was made is FULL of people who are repulsed by the prospect of this fight. There are a minority of voices saying that they think the fight is acceptable, but that is it. This is the only gauge of popular opinion that we have.
There is no evidence to suggest that Pacquiao-Mosley is being demanded by the public at this stage. Two years ago there was, but after Mosley has been hammered by Mayweather and laboured his way through 12 rounds against Mora for the draw? Nah, the fight will sell on Pacs current name and the fact that Mosley many years ago was an excellent fighter.
There are better fights and bigger challenges than this and everbody knows it. Were fight fans polled on who they wanted to see Manny fight next? Was this poll secretly given to the general public? Get real, it has been made simply because Mosley went rogue and Arum couldn't turn down the prospect of an easily negotiated fight against an old legend. Easy money in the pocket with a minimal level of risk involvement.
It has next to nothing to do with what the typical boxing fan wants nor expects.
That's forums mate. That's not widespread. Only about 1% of sporting fans are actually sad enough to be posting members of forums.
The fight will likely do over 1 million PPV buys making it one of the most popular sporting events of 2010.
I'm sure Manny's team will take the opinions of 1 million paying fans over the whines of a few thousand nonpaying armchair critics any day.
Right, so we disregard the opinions of all the fans on forums even though these are the only voices we know of. You are telling me that the widespread boxing fanbase wants to see this fight. What evidence do you have to suggest that the average armchair fan wants to see Manny Pac fight a 40 year old Mosley who hasn't won in 3 years above all other possible opponents? Has Mosley been dazzling them with his latest performances? Are we to assume that they have been impressed by what they have seen? Sure, with some snazzy marketing people will be led into buying the fight, but as things stand there is no demand for it. You could market a fight with a number of other fighters and still make great money from it.
It is a fight being built on Manny's name and that of a guy who was last decent a few years back and was excellent many years before. It is an opportunistic scam and the kind of behaviour that turned people against Floyd Mayweather. Pac is doing precisely the same.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Goodness no. To answer VD's song and dance about the steroids... why don't we bash the boxing organizations for not growing a pair and MAKE Pacquiao submit to the kind of testing everybody wants him to submit to? And no... Pac HASN'T tested dirty, regardless of the circumstances.
But let's see... why should we hate Pac... hmmm....
'Cause some of his fans are obnoxious? Well... that's hardly Pac's fault. If anybody deserves the hate, it would be the individual obnoxious fans.
'Cause he's fought a lot of fights at catchweights? Again... don't blame Pac for that. If the opposing promoters or trainers haven't been able to get fights with Pac at the official weights, don't blame Pac. Those are negotiation issues.
'Cause people consider him the world's p4p instead of Floyd? Well... good for them! IMO, Floyd deserves 10 times the hate Pac does, just for being a Grade-A asshole, and playing boxing fans for the fools some of them are. Dangles them on a string, while acting like an idiot to the rest of the world. Dodging fighters, taking sabbaticals, getting in all the trouble he can possibly get himself into... should I go on? And what... just because he's an American he should be given a free pass over someone who's the exact opposite? (Has class). I don't think so.
Pacquiao is a humble, great champion, and a wonderful ambassador for boxing. He's a people's champion, and that brings in more fans to our great sport. What is there to hate?
Truth be told, I liked Pac BEFORE he kicked the shit out of Oscar "Prima Donna" De La Hoya, who was looking for an easy, undersized scalp to ride off into the sunset with. That was just icing on the cake for me. THEN... when Hatton was making noises about him and Pac fighting for the p4p title (what a joke)... Pac made me more of a fan AGAIN when he put Hatton under full anestezia in two short, lopsided rounds. Finally... when he destroyed the cheating Margarito's face... that made me a fan for life. I wanted Margarito counted out... but the beating he took was probably more satisfying for me.
And yes... Pac did beat my boy Cotto. But I'm cool with that. Cotto brought some of that on himself by refusing to get a decent corner after his rift with his uncle. NOW he's finally seen the light, and got himself a professional guy in Manny Stewart. And Cotto will be back. He's not done yet.
And finally, I've never actually hated any fighter. Utter dislike... yes. Hate... that's a bit too strong for someone who hasn't personally wronged me in any way.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
He don't deserve the hate but he will get an ice pack.
He challenge the wrong veteran!!!
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
hate, no
but he does deserve criticism for choosing to fight Mosley of all people, especially when there were more challenging opponents than Mosley
Really? I'm sure Pac's so thrilled that YOU don't hate him, most especially since your "offensive" sig running for over a thousand years now, "mislead" him into thinking otherwise. LOL!
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
KananKrus
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
hate, no
but he does deserve criticism for choosing to fight Mosley of all people, especially when there were more challenging opponents than Mosley
Really? I'm sure Pac's so thrilled that YOU don't hate him, most especially since your "offensive" sig running for over a thousand years now, "mislead" him into thinking otherwise. LOL!
yea cause i'm sure Pacquiao logs on here all the time to check up on us :rolleyes:, you're the type of "fan" that calls anyone who doesn't suck Pacquiao's dick a "hater" that's why your name always reminds me of Canker Sores, and it's a lot more fitting for you ;)
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Pacquaio is a great fighter, I have no qualms in saying that. He is exciting to watch and brings a lot of excitement to his fights. However, having said that, I do have some issues, but like someone mentioned before that is largely to do with his team. There was no good reason to call Cotto down to a CW, there was no justification for giving Margarito a big fight and there is widespread disdain for choosing to fight Mosley at this point in Mosley's career. We can all point the finger at Roach and Arum, but at the end of the day it is Manny choosing to get in the ring with these people.
We cannot just give unreserved praise to a fighter and it is certainly not hateful to formulate constructive criticism when it is called for.
It's not widespread disdain. It's a few criticisms from within the hardcore boxing fan community. The reason Manny has selected Mosley is because it is a fight that the widespread boxing fanbase want to see.
Every forum that I have read since the fight was made is FULL of people who are repulsed by the prospect of this fight. There are a minority of voices saying that they think the fight is acceptable, but that is it. This is the only gauge of popular opinion that we have.
There is no evidence to suggest that Pacquiao-Mosley is being demanded by the public at this stage. Two years ago there was, but after Mosley has been hammered by Mayweather and laboured his way through 12 rounds against Mora for the draw? Nah, the fight will sell on Pacs current name and the fact that Mosley many years ago was an excellent fighter.
There are better fights and bigger challenges than this and everbody knows it. Were fight fans polled on who they wanted to see Manny fight next? Was this poll secretly given to the general public? Get real, it has been made simply because Mosley went rogue and Arum couldn't turn down the prospect of an easily negotiated fight against an old legend. Easy money in the pocket with a minimal level of risk involvement.
It has next to nothing to do with what the typical boxing fan wants nor expects.
That's forums mate. That's not widespread. Only about 1% of sporting fans are actually sad enough to be posting members of forums.
The fight will likely do over 1 million PPV buys making it one of the most popular sporting events of 2010.
I'm sure Manny's team will take the opinions of 1 million paying fans over the whines of a few thousand nonpaying armchair critics any day.
Right, so we disregard the opinions of all the fans on forums even though these are the only voices we know of. You are telling me that the widespread boxing fanbase wants to see this fight. What evidence do you have to suggest that the average armchair fan wants to see Manny Pac fight a 40 year old Mosley who hasn't won in 3 years above all other possible opponents? Has Mosley been dazzling them with his latest performances? Are we to assume that they have been impressed by what they have seen? Sure, with some snazzy marketing people will be led into buying the fight, but as things stand there is no demand for it. You could market a fight with a number of other fighters and still make great money from it.
It is a fight being built on Manny's name and that of a guy who was last decent a few years back and was excellent many years before. It is an opportunistic scam and the kind of behaviour that turned people against Floyd Mayweather. Pac is doing precisely the same.
There are whiny fans who have criticised every single Pacquiao fight since he left the superfeatherweight division.
David Diaz was a handpicked paper champion
Oscar was a weight drained corpse
Hatton was shot
Cotto was weight drained and forced to fight at a catchweight
Clottey was overated, Manny looked sluggish, he chose to avoid prime fighters in the division
Margarito should never have got the fight, it was a disgusting catchweight, shouldnt have been for a world title.
Manny ducked Floyd, takes PEDS, only fights old, washed up fighters at catchweights etc etc.
Now it's Mosley is old and shot to bits because he lost Floyd and was robbed of a win against Sergio Mora by the judges.
History will assess the fights above as being so momentus as to earn Manny a spot amongst the top 10 greatest fighters to ever grace the sport. But in the eyes of the whiny minority every fight was a travesty.
Look at the end of the day, the whiners and detractors will lose. Manny will be regarded as one of the greatest fighters ever, and nobody will remember or care about any of the rants of the unknown fools who never have anything positive to say about anything.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Pacquaio is a great fighter, I have no qualms in saying that. He is exciting to watch and brings a lot of excitement to his fights. However, having said that, I do have some issues, but like someone mentioned before that is largely to do with his team. There was no good reason to call Cotto down to a CW, there was no justification for giving Margarito a big fight and there is widespread disdain for choosing to fight Mosley at this point in Mosley's career. We can all point the finger at Roach and Arum, but at the end of the day it is Manny choosing to get in the ring with these people.
We cannot just give unreserved praise to a fighter and it is certainly not hateful to formulate constructive criticism when it is called for.
It's not widespread disdain. It's a few criticisms from within the hardcore boxing fan community. The reason Manny has selected Mosley is because it is a fight that the widespread boxing fanbase want to see.
Every forum that I have read since the fight was made is FULL of people who are repulsed by the prospect of this fight. There are a minority of voices saying that they think the fight is acceptable, but that is it. This is the only gauge of popular opinion that we have.
There is no evidence to suggest that Pacquiao-Mosley is being demanded by the public at this stage. Two years ago there was, but after Mosley has been hammered by Mayweather and laboured his way through 12 rounds against Mora for the draw? Nah, the fight will sell on Pacs current name and the fact that Mosley many years ago was an excellent fighter.
There are better fights and bigger challenges than this and everbody knows it. Were fight fans polled on who they wanted to see Manny fight next? Was this poll secretly given to the general public? Get real, it has been made simply because Mosley went rogue and Arum couldn't turn down the prospect of an easily negotiated fight against an old legend. Easy money in the pocket with a minimal level of risk involvement.
It has next to nothing to do with what the typical boxing fan wants nor expects.
That's forums mate. That's not widespread. Only about 1% of sporting fans are actually sad enough to be posting members of forums.
The fight will likely do over 1 million PPV buys making it one of the most popular sporting events of 2010.
I'm sure Manny's team will take the opinions of 1 million paying fans over the whines of a few thousand nonpaying armchair critics any day.
Right, so we disregard the opinions of all the fans on forums even though these are the only voices we know of. You are telling me that the widespread boxing fanbase wants to see this fight. What evidence do you have to suggest that the average armchair fan wants to see Manny Pac fight a 40 year old Mosley who hasn't won in 3 years above all other possible opponents? Has Mosley been dazzling them with his latest performances? Are we to assume that they have been impressed by what they have seen? Sure, with some snazzy marketing people will be led into buying the fight, but as things stand there is no demand for it. You could market a fight with a number of other fighters and still make great money from it.
It is a fight being built on Manny's name and that of a guy who was last decent a few years back and was excellent many years before. It is an opportunistic scam and the kind of behaviour that turned people against Floyd Mayweather. Pac is doing precisely the same.
There are whiny fans who have criticised every single Pacquiao fight since he left the superfeatherweight division.
David Diaz was a handpicked paper champion
Oscar was a weight drained corpse
Hatton was shot
Cotto was weight drained and forced to fight at a catchweight
Clottey was overated, Manny looked sluggish, he chose to avoid prime fighters in the division
Margarito should never have got the fight, it was a disgusting catchweight, shouldnt have been for a world title.
Manny ducked Floyd, takes PEDS, only fights old, washed up fighters at catchweights etc etc.
Now it's Mosley is old and shot to bits because he lost Floyd and was robbed of a win against Sergio Mora by the judges.
History will assess the fights above as being so momentus as to earn Manny a spot amongst the top 10 greatest fighters to ever grace the sport. But in the eyes of the whiny minority every fight was a travesty.
Look at the end of the day, the whiners and detractors will lose. Manny will be regarded as one of the greatest fighters ever, and nobody will remember or care about any of the rants of the unknown fools who never have anything positive to say about anything.
Well, I haven't criticised Pacquaio for each of these fights. Sure, I have backed against him, but I always give credit where credit is due. In fact Pac deserves full credit for his wins over DLH, Hatton and Clottey. Less so for his wins over Cotto and Margarito. And David Diaz I disregard completely. Mosley though takes Manny firmly into the Floyd Mayweather stratosphere. You would expect this kind of fight from Hatton managed under Warren at the age of 25, not of the best fighter in the world at the age of 32. It's sad and the only reason we have it is because Mosley has gone rogue and sold himself against the interests of Golden Boy. They wanted Marquez for Pac and at 140 that would have been a corker.
I am going to use a political analogy here, but I won't go into politics per se. But basically you sound like an official trying to justify one of Stalin's 5 year plans. The detractors were right and they did see through the official party line and history has proven them correct. You can propagandise Manny as much as you like, but the detractors do have a voice and they will ultimately be heard.
I actually like Manny a lot and think he is an awesome fighter, but you can guarantee I will say my piece when I think there is bullshit at hand and everywhere people are complaining about this. Sure, good old 'Stalin' has access to the media and can convince the world that things aren't quite so bad and thus can sell his regime. But you can't sweep it all under the carpet.
This fight has hurt Manny and we are actually hearing negative calls against Manny in the mainstream media too (Yahoo and ESPN).
Note: I used Soviet politics as an analogy only.
Re: Does Pacquiao deserve all the hate???
PSL made a thread ages ago, about ODLH vs Manny Pacquiao happening in the future. Everyone laughed about it on this forum, saying there's no way Manny Pacquiao can move up. He's too small he will get dominated ETC.
Now that he has moved up, people are saying he has been cherry picking. Even though there has been no one else better that he could of fought. Except Floyd Mayweather Jr obviously.
But no i really don't understand the hate, i mean who would of believed Manny Pacquiao could dominate elite Welterweight's a few years ago ?
He deserves all the credit in the world, what he has done is amazing. Just like what B-Hop has done recently, both fighters are up there with the very best of all time.
Instead of hating or debating we should just sit back and enjoy the ride while is lasts, im just glad im in this era to watch amazing fighters like those 2 i mentioned. They don't come around very often.
