Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Does Pacquiao have the same skills when he's off PEDs?
Based on the Rios fight, the one fight we know of his where he was clean, do you think he can still dominate?
He wasn't able to put the smaller Rios away even tho he landed 48% of his power punches.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Does Pacquiao have the same skills when he's off PEDs?
Based on the Rios fight, the one fight we know of his where he was clean, do you think he can still dominate?
He wasn't able to put the smaller Rios away even tho he landed 48% of his power punches.
You cant just assume a fighter is dirty if they never failed a drug test.. Yeah it looks fishy but you cant just say " the one fight where we know he was clean " show me a fight where he was on PEDs
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Does Pacquiao have the same skills when he's off PEDs?
Based on the Rios fight, the one fight we know of his where he was clean, do you think he can still dominate?
He wasn't able to put the smaller Rios away even tho he landed 48% of his power punches.
When was the last time Pacquiao had a knockout? Hatton in 2009. That's 4 years without a knockout during a period he was alleged to have been on PEDs. Rios has never been stopped and has taken many, many big punches to the head.
Pacquiao is suspect, like any fighter is suspect, unless they undergo random testing all year. It's just the society we live in.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Does Pacquiao have the same skills when he's off PEDs?
Based on the Rios fight, the one fight we know of his where he was clean, do you think he can still dominate?
He wasn't able to put the smaller Rios away even tho he landed 48% of his power punches.
You cant just assume a fighter is dirty if they never failed a drug test.. Yeah it looks fishy but you cant just say " the one fight where we know he was clean " show me a fight where he was on PEDs
You can safely assume a fighter is on PEDs if he refuses a guaranteed $50 million payday on the grounds that he refuses to take a drug test 13 days before a fight.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
When was the last time Pacquiao had a knockout? Hatton in 2009. That's 4 years without a knockout during a period he was alleged to have been on PEDs.
Actually, that's after the period where he was alleged to have been on PED's.
Floyd accused him in 2009, just after his last knockout vs Cotto. 2009-2010 was when they were negotiating at the whole drug testing issue came up, where Manny took heat for not agreeing to the test.
Since he was accused of using steroids and it was made public knowledge that he refused the random drug testing, he hasn't had a knockout. If someone wanted to get imaginative, they could speculate that perhaps something changed after the accusations. Maybe being accused of certain behaviours and having the accusations dragged into the public might make someone cease those behaviours and cleaning out his closet before something is found?
That's just conjecture though.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Does Pacquiao have the same skills when he's off PEDs?
Based on the Rios fight, the one fight we know of his where he was clean, do you think he can still dominate?
He wasn't able to put the smaller Rios away even tho he landed 48% of his power punches.
You cant just assume a fighter is dirty if they never failed a drug test.. Yeah it looks fishy but you cant just say " the one fight where we know he was clean " show me a fight where he was on PEDs
You can safely assume a fighter is on PEDs if he refuses a guaranteed $50 million payday on the grounds that he refuses to take a drug test 13 days before a fight.
You can also assume a fighter is making excuses after seeing another fighter leave a path of destruction with KOs and stoppages so they decided to accuse the other of taking PEDs to avoid em.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Does Pacquiao have the same skills when he's off PEDs?
Based on the Rios fight, the one fight we know of his where he was clean, do you think he can still dominate?
He wasn't able to put the smaller Rios away even tho he landed 48% of his power punches.
You cant just assume a fighter is dirty if they never failed a drug test.. Yeah it looks fishy but you cant just say " the one fight where we know he was clean " show me a fight where he was on PEDs
You can safely assume a fighter is on PEDs if he refuses a guaranteed $50 million payday on the grounds that he refuses to take a drug test 13 days before a fight.
You can also assume a fighter is making excuses after seeing another fighter leave a path of destruction with KOs and stoppages so they decided to accuse the other of taking PEDs to avoid em.
Yes, that may be true. Floyd saw Manny do something that a lot of people think is amazing to the point of being suspicious. Manny's incredible leaps in weight divisions, while maintaining KO power against top opponents is in the words of Greg Lemond (who was addressing Lance Armstrong's incredible ascension to rise to the top of cycling, from an average rider/cancer survivor to the 7 time Tour de France winner) UNBELIEVABLE.
But as the opponent that everyone wanted Manny to fight, and being the fighter that has the most clout in boxing and who makes more money than any other athlete in the world, aaaaaaand being the person who is putting their health and life on the line, Floyd was in the position to demand that Manny be tested for PEDs or pass on the fight.
As we all know now Manny was using PEDs all along so he couldn't submit himself to random drug testing while Floyd made as much money fighting clean fighters. How do we know they're clean? Because they all agreed to be tested.
How do we know Pacquiao was dirty? Because he passed up over $50 million dollars.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
You can also assume a fighter is making excuses after seeing another fighter leave a path of destruction with KOs and stoppages so they decided to accuse the other of taking PEDs to avoid em.
Well in the end Manny dodged the drug test. He finally agreed to a 24 day cutoff, Floyd wanted a 14 day cutoff, and Manny refused and the fight was off. Ask any doctor you can find if someone can have a small sample of blood taken, and will still be weakened by it 2 weeks later. It's ridiculous.
And of course in negotiations Manny's camp sent Floyd's camp the email asking what the penalty for a positive test would be, and if a positive test could be kept secret to maintain the integrity of the fight and boxing.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Beanflicker
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
You can also assume a fighter is making excuses after seeing another fighter leave a path of destruction with KOs and stoppages so they decided to accuse the other of taking PEDs to avoid em.
Well in the end Manny dodged the drug test. He finally agreed to a 24 day cutoff, Floyd wanted a 14 day cutoff, and Manny refused and the fight was off. Ask any doctor you can find if someone can have a small sample of blood taken, and will still be weakened by it 2 weeks later. It's ridiculous.
And of course in negotiations Manny's camp sent Floyd's camp the email asking what the penalty for a positive test would be, and if a positive test could be kept secret to maintain the integrity of the fight and boxing.
All the references to Pac asking if a positive result could be kept quiet is not substantiated. Yes Mannys camp said he feels blood draws weaken him. Was he lying and covering things up or was that how he truly felt. Did he truly feel it would effect his performance in the fight. I'm not him I don't know. Drugs themselves are not tested for, metabolites the body produces are tested for. Metabolites always last longer in Urine. If you are tested by the government they always prefer urine. Opiate use can be detected in blood for about eight hours give or take while in Urine it can be detected for up to a week.
Yes it's strange the path Manny chose but athletes due often have bizarre beliefs about what will help or hinder their performance. Manny has been boxing for a number of years and has never tested positive. Boxing has standardized tests which has caught a number of fighters. I do feel the tests should be changed, we are talking about a sport that can lead to death more so than any other sport except maybe extreme skydiving (I have done that) I do not think Manny uses steroids now or in the past. I think he has a natural gift that he developed into a premier world athlete. I'm sure I'll catch some shit for my beliefs and if you guys are really mean to me I'll just log out and hang with my buddy Miles, I don't need you, except for all you who are on my friends list, you guys can stop by anytime. It's always the Floyd nuthuggers who go on about this. It doesn't seem other boxers he has faced have ever accused him.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
walrus
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Beanflicker
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
You can also assume a fighter is making excuses after seeing another fighter leave a path of destruction with KOs and stoppages so they decided to accuse the other of taking PEDs to avoid em.
Well in the end Manny dodged the drug test. He finally agreed to a 24 day cutoff, Floyd wanted a 14 day cutoff, and Manny refused and the fight was off. Ask any doctor you can find if someone can have a small sample of blood taken, and will still be weakened by it 2 weeks later. It's ridiculous.
And of course in negotiations Manny's camp sent Floyd's camp the email asking what the penalty for a positive test would be, and if a positive test could be kept secret to maintain the integrity of the fight and boxing.
All the references to Pac asking if a positive result could be kept quiet is not substantiated. Yes Mannys camp said he feels blood draws weaken him. Was he lying and covering things up or was that how he truly felt. Did he truly feel it would effect his performance in the fight. I'm not him I don't know. Drugs themselves are not tested for, metabolites the body produces are tested for. Metabolites always last longer in Urine. If you are tested by the government they always prefer urine. Opiate use can be detected in blood for about eight hours give or take while in Urine it can be detected for up to a week.
Yes it's strange the path Manny chose but athletes due often have bizarre beliefs about what will help or hinder their performance. Manny has been boxing for a number of years and has never tested positive. Boxing has standardized tests which has caught a number of fighters. I do feel the tests should be changed, we are talking about a sport that can lead to death more so than any other sport except maybe extreme skydiving (I have done that) I do not think Manny uses steroids now or in the past. I think he has a natural gift that he developed into a premier world athlete. I'm sure I'll catch some shit for my beliefs and if you guys are really mean to me I'll just log out and hang with my buddy Miles, I don't need you, except for all you who are on my friends list, you guys can stop by anytime. It's always the Floyd nuthuggers who go on about this. It doesn't seem other boxers he has faced have ever accused him.
Lance Armstrong was tested more than any other cyclist and he never failed a test either. He was the biggest name in the sport and the poster boy for the story of the clean, hard working, super athlete. The truth is he had failed a number of tests but because he was such a star he was able to have these failed tests covered up by asserting influence. Who has more influence than Bob Arum? Why would Pacquiao have stayed with Bob Arum for so long knowing that like Mayweather he could have left Bob years ago and made all the money for himself?
Boxers who have spoken up about Manny alleged PED use include: ODL, Malignaggi, Mosely, Arce, Cotto, Mora, Mayweather, Cintron.
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
Quote:
Originally Posted by
walrus
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Beanflicker
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
You can also assume a fighter is making excuses after seeing another fighter leave a path of destruction with KOs and stoppages so they decided to accuse the other of taking PEDs to avoid em.
Well in the end Manny dodged the drug test. He finally agreed to a 24 day cutoff, Floyd wanted a 14 day cutoff, and Manny refused and the fight was off. Ask any doctor you can find if someone can have a small sample of blood taken, and will still be weakened by it 2 weeks later. It's ridiculous.
And of course in negotiations Manny's camp sent Floyd's camp the email asking what the penalty for a positive test would be, and if a positive test could be kept secret to maintain the integrity of the fight and boxing.
All the references to Pac asking if a positive result could be kept quiet is not substantiated. Yes Mannys camp said he feels blood draws weaken him. Was he lying and covering things up or was that how he truly felt. Did he truly feel it would effect his performance in the fight. I'm not him I don't know. Drugs themselves are not tested for, metabolites the body produces are tested for. Metabolites always last longer in Urine. If you are tested by the government they always prefer urine. Opiate use can be detected in blood for about eight hours give or take while in Urine it can be detected for up to a week.
Yes it's strange the path Manny chose but athletes due often have bizarre beliefs about what will help or hinder their performance. Manny has been boxing for a number of years and has never tested positive. Boxing has standardized tests which has caught a number of fighters. I do feel the tests should be changed, we are talking about a sport that can lead to death more so than any other sport except maybe extreme skydiving (I have done that) I do not think Manny uses steroids now or in the past. I think he has a natural gift that he developed into a premier world athlete. I'm sure I'll catch some shit for my beliefs and if you guys are really mean to me I'll just log out and hang with my buddy Miles, I don't need you, except for all you who are on my friends list, you guys can stop by anytime. It's always the Floyd nuthuggers who go on about this. It doesn't seem other boxers he has faced have ever accused him.
Lance Armstrong was tested more than any other cyclist and he never failed a test either. He was the biggest name in the sport and the poster boy for the story of the clean, hard working, super athlete. The truth is he had failed a number of tests but because he was such a star he was able to have these failed tests covered up by asserting influence. Who has more influence than Bob Arum? Why would Pacquiao have stayed with Bob Arum for so long knowing that like Mayweather he could have left Bob years ago and made all the money for himself?
Boxers who have spoken up about Manny alleged PED use include: ODL, Malignaggi, Mosely, Arce, Cotto, Mora, Mayweather, Cintron.
Seems to me that Floyd compares' more to Armstrong then Pacquiao does. Its always the one pointing the finger at others that has something to hide..
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Maravilla2012
Seems to me that Floyd compares' more to Armstrong then Pacquiao does. Its always the one pointing the finger at others that has something to hide..
Always!!!?
Re: Is there PED testing in advance of the Pacquiao Algieri fight?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
walrus
All the references to Pac asking if a positive result could be kept quiet is not substantiated. Yes Mannys camp said he feels blood draws weaken him. Was he lying and covering things up or was that how he truly felt. Did he truly feel it would effect his performance in the fight. I'm not him I don't know. Drugs themselves are not tested for, metabolites the body produces are tested for. Metabolites always last longer in Urine. If you are tested by the government they always prefer urine. Opiate use can be detected in blood for about eight hours give or take while in Urine it can be detected for up to a week.
Yes it's strange the path Manny chose but athletes due often have bizarre beliefs about what will help or hinder their performance. Manny has been boxing for a number of years and has never tested positive. Boxing has standardized tests which has caught a number of fighters. I do feel the tests should be changed, we are talking about a sport that can lead to death more so than any other sport except maybe extreme skydiving (I have done that) I do not think Manny uses steroids now or in the past. I think he has a natural gift that he developed into a premier world athlete. I'm sure I'll catch some shit for my beliefs and if you guys are really mean to me I'll just log out and hang with my buddy Miles, I don't need you, except for all you who are on my friends list, you guys can stop by anytime. It's always the Floyd nuthuggers who go on about this. It doesn't seem other boxers he has faced have ever accused him.
You can feel how you want, there's no definitive proof either way. The fact that Manny didn't want to take the test doesn't prove guilt, just as the fact that he's never tested positive doesn't prove innocence.
I'm just saying there is more than enough red flags to make someone suspicious. And government prefers urine because it's much faster and cheaper. This olympic style blood testing doesn't come cheap and is impractical to perform on all government employees (federal, municipal, ect).
The standard testing at the time was a complete joke, there were tons of athletes who cheated it for years and only got busted when someone ratted on them or the FBI busted a steroid lab and their names came up on receipts.
And as far the Pacquiao email goes... I tend to believe it because the guys who reported it were given first hand info from someone who had seen it and was credible, and Manny's camp never refuted the claim or tried to sue for defamation/slander. He sued Mayweather because Floyd made claims that he could not substantiate because he didn't have proof. They didn't sue the reporter or Teddy Atlas because the email would have been brought forward as evidence and made public. And I don't think Teddy would have brought it up and said it on national TV (and thereby putting himself and ESPN in danger of being sued by Pac) if he didn't have it on solid authority that the email existed. That's just my take on it anyway.
