that reminds me of a dane cook bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla
with a good offense you dont need defense.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla
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that reminds me of a dane cook bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla
with a good offense you dont need defense.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla
There are two sides to every story .. No easy answers . .. If there were a law in place for Americans to turn in their firearms , only the law abiding citizen would do such. the criminal will keep his
I like a waiting period to purchase a handgun.. background check and all.. that’s a good a thing . There is no reason a kid with a history of mental problems should be able to walk into a store and purchase a hand gun , that being said it wont solve the problem .a psycho will use a car and run over people if has no gun. your not going to solve the problem of psycho behavior with gun control .. low moral values, bullying in schools and shit parenting play a bigger role in my opinion
i think to solve the problem you need to get into the mindset of the killer. I think people need to understand that its very easy to snap.. Bullying in schools needs to be dealt with . Say you’re a kid who everyone makes fun of, maybe your poor ? don't speak well , Have a learning disability or have a physical handicap everyone teases you and so on.. Thus you become suicidal. Only you think before I cash out, I ’m going to take down as many of the people who made my life hell, as possible ( the problem is everyone starts falling into that category while your in a rage. ).. its not hard to see how that could happen… the real issue in my opinion is not the gun , but rather focus on how to instill a sense of pride and worth into the less fortunate youth out there . and put a severe tax on bullying behavior right from the gate ! O0
I personally think they should ban guns in the US....as long as they make it a death sentence for anyone committing a crime with a gun...and life if you're caught with a weapon......Quote:
Originally Posted by porkypara
gotta disagfree with you on this one....think of all the people that had guns on the VT campus...boy, those guns did an awesome job in stopping the nut job...but if they were illegal in the first place...32 innocent people would still be alive.....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
I've noticed that most people that do have weapons always throw out the same ole rhetoric..."For safty"...right...these are the same people that live 25 miles from the "Hood"....besides..if someone breaks into your house the odds of you even remembering where the gun is is remote to begin with.....and like you're gonna make it down the hallway before the robber empties half a clip in your back...then kills the rest of the family because he now has nothing to lose....or you could just get robbed and the robber leaves....imagine that...it could happen...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
There is a waiting period....but if the person is really ill but never had a conviction or anything they will wait and then do their killing.
Bullying needs to be solved by the way kids are taught and the fucking punishment in schools...I know I never fought anyone because even if you didn't start the fight you got in trouble which is BULLSHIT. Basically kids are taught to never act for themselves and never stand up for themselves and rely on the parents or teachers or whoever to solve their problems....it's the same with people and the police.
Did you know there is a Supreme Court ruling that states the Police can't do ANYTHING until the law is broken....therefore defending yourself when it comes down to brass tacks is your own personal responsibility.
BigRagu....guns aren't allowed on college campuses, not in Virginia (and I know not here in NC either)....also the illegality of guns for the lawful citizen does nothing but make them easier targets.....look at my previous post on what happened to gun violence in England, Wales, Australia, and Canada after they "controlled guns"
Where do people ROB from??? The well off, and those well off people don't live in the fucking ghetto!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by THE Bigragu
And apparently you don't own a gun or know a gun owner....it ain't like a pair of socks, it's a dangerous tool used for self defense you ALWAYS know where the gun is and if it's loaded!!!
I think more teaching about firearms and firearm safety would do more good than banning guns alltogether
the constitution is a piece of paper...it needs a radical makeover...and the second amendment was meant for Militias to defend against the indians...I think we are past that now....and there is no need for militias anymore...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
.....there will always be a need for Militias.......militias were meant to guard the people from tyranical government, not just indians
true...and what do you do when the uneducated 5 year old grabs the gun and offs his little sister...wait let me answer for you..."He wouldn't do it because the gun would be in a secure place"...if it's secure from him it's secure from you....unless you have a gun safe in every room...with a 1 key code and prior knowledge about when you're going to get robbed....other wise it won't work....I think the death penalty for any crime commited by a gun and life for possession of a firearm might deter criminals...and Dude, I served in the US ARMY....I have a close friend that is a Deputy Sherriff...he processes the conceal and carry permits....amazing how many arrests they get from the applications alone....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
we're not in China bro....or Sudan, Darfur, Iran, Iraq, Afganistan, Russia....etc......we are in the US....no need for nutjobs in so-called Militias....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
BigRagu let me put it this way....I don't like people defacing and/or burning the American flag but I support their right to do it.....I don't even own a gun (yet) but I support the right to do so 110%!!!
Gun control is not going to solve ANYTHING it has spiked gun violence in England, Wales, Canada, and Australia and in America we don't need that!
Knowledge about guns and gun safety is the way to go....it would create even more responsible gun owners.
now you say violence....is that deaths or crime?....need the info...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Once again here's the info
http://www.fraserinstitute.ca/shared...sNav=nr&id=570
Gun Laws do Not Reduce Criminal Violence According to New Study
Contact(s):
Gary Mauser, Professor
Simon Fraser University, Tel (604) 291-3652
Email: mauser@sfu.ca
Click here for the complete publication.
Release Date: November 27, 2003
Vancouver, BC - Restrictive firearm legislation has failed to reduce gun violence in Australia, Canada, or Great Britain. The policy of confiscating guns has been an expensive failure, according to a new paper The Failed Experiment: Gun Control and Public Safety in Canada, Australia, England and Wales, released today by The Fraser Institute.
“What makes gun control so compelling for many is the belief that violent crime is driven by the availability of guns, and more importantly, that criminal violence in general may be reduced by limiting access to firearms,” says Gary Mauser, author of the paper and professor of business at Simon Fraser University.
This new study examines crime trends in Commonwealth countries that have recently introduced firearm regulations. Mauser notes that the widely ignored key to evaluating firearm regulations is to examine trends in total violent crime, not just firearm crime.
The United States provides a valuable point of comparison for assessing crime rates as that country has witnessed a dramatic drop in criminal violence over the past decade – for example, the homicide rate in the US has fallen 42 percent since 1991. This is particularly significant when compared with the rest of the world – in 18 of the 25 countries surveyed by the British Home Office, violent crime increased during the 1990s.
The justice system in the U.S. differs in many ways from those in the Commonwealth but perhaps the most striking difference is that qualified citizens in the United States can carry concealed handguns for self-defence. During the past few decades, more than 25 states in the U.S. have passed laws allowing responsible citizens to carry concealed handguns. In 2003, there are 35 states where citizens can get such a permit.
Disarming the public has not reduced criminal violence in any country examined in this study. In all these cases, disarming the public has been ineffective, expensive, and often counter productive. In all cases, the effort meant setting up expensive bureaucracies that produce no noticeable improvement to public safety or have made the situation worse. Mauser points to these trends in the countries he examined:
England and Wales
Both Conservative and Labour governments have introduced restrictive firearms laws over the past 20 years; all handguns were banned in 1997.
Yet in the 1990s alone, the homicide rate jumped 50 percent, going from 10 per million in 1990 to 15 per million in 2000. While not yet as high as the US, in 2002 gun crime in England and Wales increased by 35 percent. This is the fourth consecutive year that gun crime has increased.
Police statistics show that violent crime in general has increased since the late 1980s and since 1996 has been more serious than in the United States.
Australia
The Australian government made sweeping changes to the firearms legislation in 1997. However, the total homicide rate, after having remained basically flat from 1995 to 2001, has now begun climbing again. While violent crime is decreasing in the United States, it is increasing in Australia. Over the past six years, the overall rate of violent crime in Australia has been on the rise – for example, armed robberies have jumped 166 percent nationwide.
The confiscation and destruction of legally owned firearms has cost Australian taxpayers at least $500 million. The cost of the police services bureaucracy, including the costly infrastructure of the gun registration system, has increased by $200 million since 1997.
“And for what?” asks Mauser. “There has been no visible impact on violent crime. It is impossible to justify such a massive amount of the taxpayers’ money for no decrease in crime. For that kind of tax money, the police could have had more patrol cars, shorter shifts, or better equipment.”
Canada
The contrast between the criminal violence rates in the United States and in Canada is dramatic. Over the past decade, the rate of violent crime in Canada has increased while in the United States the violent crime rate has plummeted. The homicide rate is dropping faster in the US than in Canada.
The Canadian experiment with firearm registration is becoming a farce says Mauser. The effort to register all firearms, which was originally claimed to cost only $2 million, has now been estimated by the Auditor General to top $1 billion. The final costs are unknown but, if the costs of enforcement are included, the total could easily reach $3 billion.
“It is an illusion that gun bans protect the public. No law, no matter how restrictive, can protect us from people who decide to commit violent crimes. Maybe we should crack down on criminals rather than hunters and target shooters?” says Mauser.
- 30 -
The Fraser Institute is an independent research and educational organization based in Canada. Its mission is to measure, study, and communicate the impact of competitive markets and government intervention on the welfare of individuals. To protect the Institute’s independence, it does not accept grants from governments or contracts for research.
Hope that helps :thumb:
...read it, soak it up.....IT'S THE TRUTH!
guns aren't bad....criminals are bad
try this on for size....http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF01.htm
oh snap!! :) .....guess it depends on what website you go to and which one you want to believe......Quote:
Originally Posted by THE Bigragu
Well let's see who has an agenda the GUN CONTROL network.....or an unaffiliated study group out of Canada???
there were quite a few professors and the like from Canada on that website....but who really has the agenda....the NRA has been in politicians pockets for decades....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Yes and as well they should because we have the RIGHT to own guns!
Why would you want to abolish part of the Bill of Rights??? I mean it's only second to freedom of speech and religion!!!!!
What is your issue with guns? Guns aren't inherently good or bad.....criminals are criminals! Ever hear of the BLACK MARKET??? That's where murderers and other criminals would go to get their weapons and the rest of us would be left helpless.
I know I'm not going to agree with everyone on everything but guns aren't bad and the majority of legal gun owners are the best law abiding citizens you could ever know
well, as we've seen the freedom of speech is really not there anymore....and religion causes more deaths than pretty much anything else.....but I still say...Death for a crime and life for possession....that would stop it...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Well freedom of religion is more freedom of thought and belief...speech is being clamped down on by the PC Nazi's (who are also the anti gun people...strangely enough)
Death for owning a gun??? You're going to vote for Hilary aren't you? You sad sick bastard!
I am actually FOR public executions though...I figure the deterrant factor doesn't play a role when you can't see what happens to the bad guys
proof is in the pudding mates !
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=15304
Since Australia banned private ownership of most guns in 1996, crime has risen dramatically on that continent, prompting critics of U.S. gun control efforts to issue new warnings of what life in America could be like if Congress ever bans firearms.
After Australian lawmakers passed widespread gun bans, owners were forced to surrender about 650,000 weapons, which were later slated for destruction, according to statistics from the Australian Sporting Shooters Association.
The bans were not limited to so-called "assault" weapons or military-type firearms, but also to .22 rifles and shotguns. The effort cost the Australian government about $500 million, said association representative Keith Tidswell.
Though lawmakers responsible for passing the ban promised a safer country, the nation's crime statistics tell a different story:
Countrywide, homicides are up 3.2 percent;
Assaults are up 8.6 percent;
Amazingly, armed robberies have climbed nearly 45 percent;
In the Australian state of Victoria, gun homicides have climbed 300 percent;
In the 25 years before the gun bans, crime in Australia had been dropping steadily;
There has been a reported "dramatic increase" in home burglaries and assaults on the elderly.
no....I said Death for anyone commiting a crime with a gun...any crime...and life for possession of a firearm...that would stop alot of this crap.....suicides would go down to....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
....why would suicides go down? #1 if they had a gun they'd get life in prison anyways #2 there's more than one way to kill yourself....pills, bleeding to death, drowning, jumping off buildings.......I mean I'm not even thinking that hard about it.
CC LG! Great info
a huge percentage of suicides are committed by firearms....men are 90% more likely to off themselves with a gun than women...and usually it's a shottie to the domepiece....guns make it easier to off your self...not everyone has access to the good drugs...and the slitting of wrists rarely ends in death....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?Quote:
Originally Posted by THE Bigragu
"I'm taking everyone with me!!!!"....."oh dear god...I think he's serious!!!!"
BigRagu maybe we should just cut off everyone's trigger finger instead of getting rid of guns
Aftere the shooting in Dunblane Scotland,new laws were intriduced in Britian that more or less banned all handguns.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lords Gym
As far as I know there has not been an incident of this type in the UK since.
You are right it is everyones problem but it seems to me that a lot of Americans dont think its there problem and are willing to carry on as they are.
Waiting for the next time!!!
no way...then you'd really have some pissed off people!!!!!! how are they gonna "Hook themselves up" :spunk: if you catch my drift...:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
yo porkypara why do you keep sparkin me with the sc's mate? we just havin a friendly discussion.
"Let me at 'em! I'll splat 'em!" Scrappy-DooQuote:
Originally Posted by Lords Gym
LOL ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla
:coolclick: thats a very good questionQuote:
Originally Posted by Lords Gym
cc :laugh:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lords Gym
I am shooting from the hip,so to speak.LOL
Have a CC
These stats on Australia are interesting but they don't take into account other things that have happened which might account for crime etc.
Most armed robberies in Australia are guys who go into a petrol station with a baseball bat or a big knife - usually not a gun.
There has been a pretty nasty (worst in 100 years) drought which has caused many farmers in country areas to commit suicide. Farmers are allowed to own guns for work purposes so they go out into the bush where there is no one to stop them and shoot themselves. I guess they are just extremely depressed suddenly finding themselves unable to support their families despite working their arses off because of something as uncontrollable as the weather.
September 11 and following cultural unrest has in some cities evoked too much fear and suspicion and hate. This has lead to some cultural unrest and increases in related crimes which have nothing to do with gun laws and usually do not involve guns.
If these crimes did involve guns I believe the death toll would be much higher. Stress and hardship will occur and crazy people will always act out but if they have a more powerful weapon they can do more damage.
As I've said before if these laws were brought into the US they might not be enforceable enough to be successful but those stats do not prove that the laws are not working in Australia.
What is not working in Australia is the treatment and services catering for mentally ill people. I've heard too many stories of people who try to off themselves many times and are still discharged from mental hospitals only to kill themselves and other people at the first opportunity.
I wonder how many killings could be prevented if there was better preventative care for the mentally ill?
Good article and good points Sharla.
Lyle: wouldn't the gun be your first choice of a suicidal weapon??? I mean it seems more appealling than drowning or some other method.
nah some people hate their life so much they want to have as painful a suicide as imaginable. I think the most popular means of suicide is a big building dive: you get a once in a lifetime view, it traumatizes everyone who sees and it takes awhile to clean up.Quote:
Originally Posted by boozeboxer