Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Well Silent assassin bro,what I wrote down was fact,I didn't make anything up.
Form.--- His recent form wasn't so bad IMO against the p4p king.
Well,that's your opinion. I had it 116-112. The rounds Oscar won were the rounds Mayweather did nothing,Mayweather rocked him to his boots twice and beat on Oscar for the last few rounds,9-12 I think.
Weight.---- ODH had never had a problem hitting weight. He didn't fight @ MW because of weight issues. Business $$$ & tryin to add another weightclass belt brought him there.
That point has no relevance. How does a 33 year old big enough to fight at 160 and go back,to 147 and stay effective when he can't fight 12 full rounds at 154? Don't know what your point is there. Being effective at the weight and merely making the weight are 2 totally different things.
Age.--- Not much of an issue IMO. If u put out all the early to mid 30's fighters. Well, u just wouldn't have a whole lot goin on.
Well,if you think Oscar's skills haven't eroded over the years,you seriously should pay more attention to his fights.( "it was ot the night of the jab" is the stupidest thing I've ever heard in possibly your biggest fight)
Part time promoter/fighter/etc...--- If u can handle the load then go for it.
Well,he got boxed by Sturm,got KTFO by Hopkins. I don't call that handling the load.
Stamina.--- Cross that bridge when u get there. One day isn't here yet. He's never been known to throw 100+ punches in the 12th round. But he has never collapsed. His cardio is not as nearly as bad as the wrap he gets.
He was just panting heavily and unable to land any effective attacks from round 9 onwards v Mayweather. It has nothing to do with throwing 100 plus punches,he could not mount any kind of attack v Mayweather.
I guess we'll just agree to disagree.
Well I'm glad that u scored it 116-112 Mr. Giampa. And I'm glad PBF got the dec since I had bet on him to win. But the other 2 judges had it 115-113 & 113-115. SD win for PBF. Hardly a blow out. If everyone that PBF would/could beat by that margin should hang'em up then there wouldn't be many people fighting.
What are u getting at when u say making weight & being effective are 2 different things? I guess that u think that Ricky Hatton is big enough to fight at LHW? You're making my point. You say ODH "a guy that's big enough to make MW". Anybody that steps on a scale at 160lbs is a MW. The point is he's NOT big enough to fight at MW. He had enough sense to know this before the Hopkins fight & got a 156lb weight limit. Knowing this he had the ba**s to go test his limitations. His previous fights a MW have nothing to do with how effective of a WW he is. This discussion is about WW ODH, not MW.
The Sturm fight. Get over it. It's in the books. ODH got the W. And B-Hop a big/alltime great MW king beat him. Big deal. Why do u insist on talking about his MW fights? (whether u like it, agree with or not he went 1-1 @MW).
What have u posted that points to him not being able to be a very dangerous guy at WW? ???
Because YOUR score & not the judges is the one that counts in his MW fight with Sturm? (A fight that he got the W)
Because alltime great B-Hop beat him at MW? (So what)
Because P4P king PBF won a SD against him? (Yeah, that's the end of the road for a guy if that happens.) :Sarcasm:
So again, what makes u so sure that he can't win at WW?--------Because u just don't like him isn't a real good reason.
Maybe ur the one that should being paying more attention to some relevant details.
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Didn't claim Corley was a big puncher, did I? Is Cotto's career limited to the Corley and Torres fights? No..... it's not. And by the way, Torres IS a big puncher, as evidenced by his KO record. Cotto has also fought other credible opposition that people choose to ignore. Even Judah is considered to be a good puncher by many. (Well, at least he was until Cotto beat him. Now he's a bum).
;)
Oh, and by the way.... p4pk. You're not implying that Oscar himself is among the heaviest of WW punchers, are you? Good timing with his left hook... yes. A heavy puncher capable of one-punch KO power against the sturdy Cotto? Naw-w-w...
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by silent assassin
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Well Silent assassin bro,what I wrote down was fact,I didn't make anything up.
Form.--- His recent form wasn't so bad IMO against the p4p king.
Well,that's your opinion. I had it 116-112. The rounds Oscar won were the rounds Mayweather did nothing,Mayweather rocked him to his boots twice and beat on Oscar for the last few rounds,9-12 I think.
Weight.---- ODH had never had a problem hitting weight. He didn't fight @ MW because of weight issues. Business $$$ & tryin to add another weightclass belt brought him there.
That point has no relevance. How does a 33 year old big enough to fight at 160 and go back,to 147 and stay effective when he can't fight 12 full rounds at 154? Don't know what your point is there. Being effective at the weight and merely making the weight are 2 totally different things.
Age.--- Not much of an issue IMO. If u put out all the early to mid 30's fighters. Well, u just wouldn't have a whole lot goin on.
Well,if you think Oscar's skills haven't eroded over the years,you seriously should pay more attention to his fights.( "it was ot the night of the jab" is the stupidest thing I've ever heard in possibly your biggest fight)
Part time promoter/fighter/etc...--- If u can handle the load then go for it.
Well,he got boxed by Sturm,got KTFO by Hopkins. I don't call that handling the load.
Stamina.--- Cross that bridge when u get there. One day isn't here yet. He's never been known to throw 100+ punches in the 12th round. But he has never collapsed. His cardio is not as nearly as bad as the wrap he gets.
He was just panting heavily and unable to land any effective attacks from round 9 onwards v Mayweather. It has nothing to do with throwing 100 plus punches,he could not mount any kind of attack v Mayweather.
I guess we'll just agree to disagree.
Well I'm glad that u scored it 116-112 Mr. Giampa. And I'm glad PBF got the dec since I had bet on him to win. But the other 2 judges had it 115-113 & 113-115. SD win for PBF. Hardly a blow out. If everyone that PBF would/could beat by that margin should hang'em up then there wouldn't be many people fighting.
What are u getting at when u say making weight & being effective are 2 different things? I guess that u think that Ricky Hatton is big enough to fight at LHW? You're making my point. You say ODH "a guy that's big enough to make MW". Anybody that steps on a scale at 160lbs is a MW. The point is he's NOT big enough to fight at MW. He had enough sense to know this before the Hopkins fight & got a 156lb weight limit. Knowing this he had the ba**s to go test his limitations. His previous fights a MW have nothing to do with how effective of a WW he is. This discussion is about WW ODH, not MW.
The Sturm fight. Get over it. It's in the books. ODH got the W. And B-Hop a big/alltime great MW king beat him. Big deal. Why do u insist on talking about his MW fights? (whether u like it, agree with or not he went 1-1 @MW).
What have u posted that points to him not being able to be a very dangerous guy at WW? ???
Because YOUR score & not the judges is the one that counts in his MW fight with Sturm? (Afight that he got the W)
Because alltime great B-Hop beat him at MW? (So what)
Because P4P king PBF won a SD against him? (Yeah, that's the end of the road for a guy if that happens.) :Sarcasm:
So again, what makes u so sure that he can't win at WW?--------Because u just don't like him isn't a real good reason.
Maybe ur the one that should being paying more attention to some relevant details.
:coolclick: You won't win an argument with El Gamo though. Expect him to hit back hard with details of ring ranked opponents and various other statistical data. Oscar is a part Mexican man after all and nobody studies Mexican men better than El Gamo ;) :-X
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by silent assassin
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Well Silent assassin bro,what I wrote down was fact,I didn't make anything up.
Form.--- His recent form wasn't so bad IMO against the p4p king.
Well,that's your opinion. I had it 116-112. The rounds Oscar won were the rounds Mayweather did nothing,Mayweather rocked him to his boots twice and beat on Oscar for the last few rounds,9-12 I think.
Weight.---- ODH had never had a problem hitting weight. He didn't fight @ MW because of weight issues. Business $$$ & tryin to add another weightclass belt brought him there.
That point has no relevance. How does a 33 year old big enough to fight at 160 and go back,to 147 and stay effective when he can't fight 12 full rounds at 154? Don't know what your point is there. Being effective at the weight and merely making the weight are 2 totally different things.
Age.--- Not much of an issue IMO. If u put out all the early to mid 30's fighters. Well, u just wouldn't have a whole lot goin on.
Well,if you think Oscar's skills haven't eroded over the years,you seriously should pay more attention to his fights.( "it was ot the night of the jab" is the stupidest thing I've ever heard in possibly your biggest fight)
Part time promoter/fighter/etc...--- If u can handle the load then go for it.
Well,he got boxed by Sturm,got KTFO by Hopkins. I don't call that handling the load.
Stamina.--- Cross that bridge when u get there. One day isn't here yet. He's never been known to throw 100+ punches in the 12th round. But he has never collapsed. His cardio is not as nearly as bad as the wrap he gets.
He was just panting heavily and unable to land any effective attacks from round 9 onwards v Mayweather. It has nothing to do with throwing 100 plus punches,he could not mount any kind of attack v Mayweather.
I guess we'll just agree to disagree.
Well I'm glad that u scored it 116-112 Mr. Giampa. And I'm glad PBF got the dec since I had bet on him to win. But the other 2 judges had it 115-113 & 113-115. SD win for PBF. Hardly a blow out. If everyone that PBF would/could beat by that margin should hang'em up then there wouldn't be many people fighting.
What are u getting at when u say making weight & being effective are 2 different things? I guess that u think that Ricky Hatton is big enough to fight at LHW? You're making my point. You say ODH "a guy that's big enough to make MW". Anybody that steps on a scale at 160lbs is a MW. The point is he's NOT big enough to fight at MW. He had enough sense to know this before the Hopkins fight & got a 156lb weight limit. Knowing this he had the ba**s to go test his limitations. His previous fights a MW have nothing to do with how effective of a WW he is. This discussion is about WW ODH, not MW.
The Sturm fight. Get over it. It's in the books. ODH got the W. And B-Hop a big/alltime great MW king beat him. Big deal. Why do u insist on talking about his MW fights? (whether u like it, agree with or not he went 1-1 @MW).
What have u posted that points to him not being able to be a very dangerous guy at WW? ???
Because YOUR score & not the judges is the one that counts in his MW fight with Sturm? (Afight that he got the W)
Because alltime great B-Hop beat him at MW? (So what)
Because P4P king PBF won a SD against him? (Yeah, that's the end of the road for a guy if that happens.) :Sarcasm:
So again, what makes u so sure that he can't win at WW?--------Because u just don't like him isn't a real good reason.
Maybe ur the one that should being paying more attention to some relevant details.
:coolclick: You won't win an argument with El Gamo though. Expect him to hit back hard with details of ring ranked opponents and various other statistical data. Oscar is a part Mexican man after all and nobody studies Mexican men better than El Gamo ;) :-X
LOL!!! Thanks for the CC.
What can I say? I am anxiously awaiting anything that would make even a little sense about the point that he was trying to make. I just hope that it won't be a bunch of stuff that has nothing to do with ODH fighting at WW.
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Didn't claim Corley was a big puncher, did I? Is Cotto's career limited to the Corley and Torres fights? No..... it's not. And by the way, Torres IS a big puncher, as evidenced by his KO record. Cotto has also fought other credible opposition that people choose to ignore. Even Judah is considered to be a good puncher by many. (Well, at least he was until Cotto beat him. Now he's a bum).
;)
Oh, and by the way.... p4pk. You're not implying that Oscar himself is among the heaviest of WW punchers, are you? Good timing with his left hook... yes. A heavy puncher capable of one-punch KO power against the sturdy Cotto? Naw-w-w...
I was implying that Cotto has never fought anyone with nearly as much power as Oscar has. He's also never fought anyone nearly as good overall. You can dispute that if you like, Id really like to hear you try. And assuming Oscar could make welterweight without sacrificing too much, I really don't see many(if any) fighters who pack a better punch than his left hook... Maybe Cintron has more sheer power, who else though?? imo Oscar could definetly KO Cotto with a good left hook. Why on earth not?? Miguels been badly hurt when tagged on the chin by much lesser fighters, that's why I brought up Corley and Torres... To date the hardest puncher Cotto has fought is likely Judah. and I thought Zab was going to beat him so I can't do anything but give Cotto lots of credit for that fight... But Judah is still no DLH, he doesn't hit as hard, he isn't as big, not NEARLY as tough, which is why Id favour Oscar to win the fight. Again this is all assuming Oscar can even make welterweight. But I don't see why he'd take a fight there if he didn't know he could make it... Unless it was strictly to fight Hatton for the biggest payday despite being less effective.. Which I guess is possible considering the ease which he'd handle Hatton imo.
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Didn't claim Corley was a big puncher, did I? Is Cotto's career limited to the Corley and Torres fights? No..... it's not. And by the way, Torres IS a big puncher, as evidenced by his KO record. Cotto has also fought other credible opposition that people choose to ignore. Even Judah is considered to be a good puncher by many. (Well, at least he was until Cotto beat him. Now he's a bum).
;)
Oh, and by the way.... p4pk. You're not implying that Oscar himself is among the heaviest of WW punchers, are you? Good timing with his left hook... yes. A heavy puncher capable of one-punch KO power against the sturdy Cotto? Naw-w-w...
I was implying that Cotto has never fought anyone with nearly as much power as Oscar has. He's also never fought anyone nearly as good overall. You can dispute that if you like, Id really like to hear you try. And assuming Oscar could make welterweight without sacrificing too much, I really don't see many(if any) fighters who pack a better punch than his left hook... Maybe Cintron has more sheer power, who else though?? imo Oscar could definetly KO Cotto with a good left hook. Why on earth not?? Miguels been badly hurt when tagged on the chin by much lesser fighters, that's why I brought up Corley and Torres... To date the hardest puncher Cotto has fought is likely Judah. and I thought Zab was going to beat him so I can't do anything but give Cotto lots of credit for that fight... But Judah is still no DLH, he doesn't hit as hard, he isn't as big, not NEARLY as tough, which is why Id favour Oscar to win the fight. Again this is all assuming Oscar can even make welterweight. But I don't see why he'd take a fight there if he didn't know he could make it... Unless it was strictly to fight Hatton for the biggest payday despite being less effective.. Which I guess is possible considering the ease which he'd handle Hatton imo.
No, Cotto hasn't fought anyone of Oscar's pedigree. But he has fought boxers that punch just as hard, or harder. Another factor to consider is that Cotto is still on his way up. Oscar isn't. To me there's nothing to say that Oscar-Cotto would be a done deal either way. Cotto proved a lot vs. Judah, and people are starting to grudgingly give him his due.
About what Oscar will do.... well... that's another story. If he acts true to form, he'll pick the fight with the biggest glory potential and lowest KO loss risk. That leaves out Cintron, and possibly Cotto. Yeah... he just might look Hatton's way after all, especially if he can convince Hatton to come up to 147.
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Didn't claim Corley was a big puncher, did I? Is Cotto's career limited to the Corley and Torres fights? No..... it's not. And by the way, Torres IS a big puncher, as evidenced by his KO record. Cotto has also fought other credible opposition that people choose to ignore. Even Judah is considered to be a good puncher by many. (Well, at least he was until Cotto beat him. Now he's a bum).
;)
Oh, and by the way.... p4pk. You're not implying that Oscar himself is among the heaviest of WW punchers, are you? Good timing with his left hook... yes. A heavy puncher capable of one-punch KO power against the sturdy Cotto? Naw-w-w...
I was implying that Cotto has never fought anyone with nearly as much power as Oscar has. He's also never fought anyone nearly as good overall. You can dispute that if you like, Id really like to hear you try. And assuming Oscar could make welterweight without sacrificing too much, I really don't see many(if any) fighters who pack a better punch than his left hook... Maybe Cintron has more sheer power, who else though?? imo Oscar could definetly KO Cotto with a good left hook. Why on earth not?? Miguels been badly hurt when tagged on the chin by much lesser fighters, that's why I brought up Corley and Torres... To date the hardest puncher Cotto has fought is likely Judah. and I thought Zab was going to beat him so I can't do anything but give Cotto lots of credit for that fight... But Judah is still no DLH, he doesn't hit as hard, he isn't as big, not NEARLY as tough, which is why Id favour Oscar to win the fight. Again this is all assuming Oscar can even make welterweight. But I don't see why he'd take a fight there if he didn't know he could make it... Unless it was strictly to fight Hatton for the biggest payday despite being less effective.. Which I guess is possible considering the ease which he'd handle Hatton imo.
No, Cotto hasn't fought anyone of Oscar's pedigree. But he has fought boxers that punch just as hard, or harder. Another factor to consider is that Cotto is still on his way up. Oscar isn't. To me there's nothing to say that Oscar-Cotto would be a done deal either way. Cotto proved a lot vs. Judah, and people are starting to grudgingly give him his due.
About what Oscar will do.... well... that's another story. If he acts true to form, he'll pick the fight with the biggest glory potential and lowest KO loss risk. That leaves out Cintron, and possibly Cotto. Yeah... he just might look Hatton's way after all, especially if he can convince Hatton to come up to 147.
Id hardly say people are grudgingly giving Cotto his due... He gets a lot of props from most people on here, and including me... Im just not sure he'd beat De La Hoya, and I don't get this whole Oscar shouldn't/can't fight at welterweight thing.. He makes for a hell of a matchup with anyone there. That I agree wholeheartedly with you in regards to he vs Cotto. I also don't buy that Oscar is going for the lowest risk... Moreso he's interested in the highest reward, regardless of the risk. That's been the pattern his whole career. Hatton is the biggest draw he could currently fight. Also, who in your opinion has Cotto fought that punches harder than Oscar?? CC for the debate.
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
I'd love DLH to get in the mix @ 147 the division is stacked @ the moment. Cotto is probably the biggest money maker so I'd say that would be the fight he'd target!
Re: Yes, Oscar......c'mon down to 147 (heh-heh-heh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Didn't claim Corley was a big puncher, did I? Is Cotto's career limited to the Corley and Torres fights? No..... it's not. And by the way, Torres IS a big puncher, as evidenced by his KO record. Cotto has also fought other credible opposition that people choose to ignore. Even Judah is considered to be a good puncher by many. (Well, at least he was until Cotto beat him. Now he's a bum).
;)
Oh, and by the way.... p4pk. You're not implying that Oscar himself is among the heaviest of WW punchers, are you? Good timing with his left hook... yes. A heavy puncher capable of one-punch KO power against the sturdy Cotto? Naw-w-w...
I was implying that Cotto has never fought anyone with nearly as much power as Oscar has. He's also never fought anyone nearly as good overall. You can dispute that if you like, Id really like to hear you try. And assuming Oscar could make welterweight without sacrificing too much, I really don't see many(if any) fighters who pack a better punch than his left hook... Maybe Cintron has more sheer power, who else though?? imo Oscar could definetly KO Cotto with a good left hook. Why on earth not?? Miguels been badly hurt when tagged on the chin by much lesser fighters, that's why I brought up Corley and Torres... To date the hardest puncher Cotto has fought is likely Judah. and I thought Zab was going to beat him so I can't do anything but give Cotto lots of credit for that fight... But Judah is still no DLH, he doesn't hit as hard, he isn't as big, not NEARLY as tough, which is why Id favour Oscar to win the fight. Again this is all assuming Oscar can even make welterweight. But I don't see why he'd take a fight there if he didn't know he could make it... Unless it was strictly to fight Hatton for the biggest payday despite being less effective.. Which I guess is possible considering the ease which he'd handle Hatton imo.
No, Cotto hasn't fought anyone of Oscar's pedigree. But he has fought boxers that punch just as hard, or harder. Another factor to consider is that Cotto is still on his way up. Oscar isn't. To me there's nothing to say that Oscar-Cotto would be a done deal either way. Cotto proved a lot vs. Judah, and people are starting to grudgingly give him his due.
About what Oscar will do.... well... that's another story. If he acts true to form, he'll pick the fight with the biggest glory potential and lowest KO loss risk. That leaves out Cintron, and possibly Cotto. Yeah... he just might look Hatton's way after all, especially if he can convince Hatton to come up to 147.
Id hardly say people are grudgingly giving Cotto his due... He gets a lot of props from most people on here, and including me... Im just not sure he'd beat De La Hoya, and I don't get this whole Oscar shouldn't/can't fight at welterweight thing.. He makes for a hell of a matchup with anyone there. That I agree wholeheartedly with you in regards to he vs Cotto. I also don't buy that Oscar is going for the lowest risk... Moreso he's interested in the highest reward, regardless of the risk. That's been the pattern his whole career. Hatton is the biggest draw he could currently fight. Also, who in your opinion has Cotto fought that punches harder than Oscar?? CC for the debate.
CC back, p4p. It's hard to compare punchers Cotto has faced with Oscar. Oscar's been at 154 for awhile, and naturally he'd be a big 147-pounder. But Cotto HAS faced fighters regarded as big punchers back at 140, such as: Abdullaev, Pinto, and Bailey. All had impressive KO records when they faced Cotto. Then he faced Judah, regarded a pretty good puncher himself at 147.
