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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
A safe bet....no risk of an injury and a decent amount of exposure.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
I kind of keep going back & forth on this Lacy Manfredo thing being a worthy fight on the comeback trail.
Think about...it's really not. Try to fight someone that's actually legitly ranked. While I am sure that Manfredo is up there...he sure as S*** aint legit.
Froch, Andrade, Bute, or even Green would be the better choices...hell even Bika.
Manfredo? Not so hot.
We wouldn't even be talking about Manfredo if he wasn't on Contender Lacy will beat Manfedo but will it prove anything really ??
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedByPacstraightleft
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
I kind of keep going back & forth on this Lacy Manfredo thing being a worthy fight on the comeback trail.
Think about...it's really not. Try to fight someone that's actually legitly ranked. While I am sure that Manfredo is up there...he sure as S*** aint legit.
Froch, Andrade, Bute, or even Green would be the better choices...hell even Bika.
Manfredo? Not so hot.
We wouldn't even be talking about Manfredo if he wasn't on Contender Lacy will beat Manfedo but will it prove anything really ??
from a public perspective it will, Jeff needed a great outing after Calzaghe then he got injured and most people wrote him off while not considering the injury. So now if he carves up Petey it kind of gets him back on track
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedByPacstraightleft
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
I kind of keep going back & forth on this Lacy Manfredo thing being a worthy fight on the comeback trail.
Think about...it's really not. Try to fight someone that's actually legitly ranked. While I am sure that Manfredo is up there...he sure as S*** aint legit.
Froch, Andrade, Bute, or even Green would be the better choices...hell even Bika.
Manfredo? Not so hot.
We wouldn't even be talking about Manfredo if he wasn't on Contender Lacy will beat Manfedo but will it prove anything really ??
from a public perspective it will, Jeff needed a great outing after Calzaghe then he got injured and most people wrote him off while not considering the injury. So now if he carves up Petey it kind of gets him back on track
It's kind of an open ended answer. Yes a blowout would be impressive...a 12 round ug-out would not.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Doubting Manfredo lasts twelve with Jeff.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedByPacstraightleft
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
I kind of keep going back & forth on this Lacy Manfredo thing being a worthy fight on the comeback trail.
Think about...it's really not. Try to fight someone that's actually legitly ranked. While I am sure that Manfredo is up there...he sure as S*** aint legit.
Froch, Andrade, Bute, or even Green would be the better choices...hell even Bika.
Manfredo? Not so hot.
We wouldn't even be talking about Manfredo if he wasn't on Contender Lacy will beat Manfedo but will it prove anything really ??
from a public perspective it will, Jeff needed a great outing after Calzaghe then he got injured and most people wrote him off while not considering the injury. So now if he carves up Petey it kind of gets him back on track
I understand what your saying i haven't wrote off Lacy but i find it very hard him beating any of the champions at Lightheavyweight or Supermiddleweight but good luck to him sounds a nice guy out the ring and has a giant heart so i wish him best of luck.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
Froch, Andrade, Bute, or even Green would be the better choices...hell even Bika.
Manfredo? Not so hot.
I remember you saying last year that you thought Jeff taking on Tyspko was a dangerous 1st comeback fight and tyspko wasnt even ranked in anyones 10 I know Vitali has a troubling style but guys like Froch, Bute, Green and even Andrade are dangerous guys that are to tough IMO for a comeback from injury... Jeff needs an easy confidence building fight he certainly deserves it, Lacy was never a fickle opponent picker he fought the best possible that were available. Its a cruise control fight he needs at this juncture of his career
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedByPacstraightleft
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedByPacstraightleft
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
I kind of keep going back & forth on this Lacy Manfredo thing being a worthy fight on the comeback trail.
Think about...it's really not. Try to fight someone that's actually legitly ranked. While I am sure that Manfredo is up there...he sure as S*** aint legit.
Froch, Andrade, Bute, or even Green would be the better choices...hell even Bika.
Manfredo? Not so hot.
We wouldn't even be talking about Manfredo if he wasn't on Contender Lacy will beat Manfedo but will it prove anything really ??
from a public perspective it will, Jeff needed a great outing after Calzaghe then he got injured and most people wrote him off while not considering the injury. So now if he carves up Petey it kind of gets him back on track
I understand what your saying i haven't wrote off Lacy but i find it very hard him beating any of the champions at Lightheavyweight or Supermiddleweight but good luck to him sounds a nice guy out the ring and has a giant heart so i wish him best of luck.
Your certainly entitled to your opinion bro ;)
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
Froch, Andrade, Bute, or even Green would be the better choices...hell even Bika.
Manfredo? Not so hot.
I remember you saying last year that you thought Jeff taking on Tyspko was a dangerous 1st comeback fight and tyspko wasnt even ranked in anyones 10 I know Vitali has a troubling style but guys like Froch, Bute, Green and even Andrade are dangerous guys that are to tough IMO for a comeback from injury... Jeff needs an easy confidence building fight he certainly deserves it, Lacy was never a fickle opponent picker he fought the best possible that were available. Its a cruise control fight he needs at this juncture of his career
Yeah...Tsypko is a hard nut to crack, IWO & the first fight was a sign that he was going to give Lacy issues.
...and maybe I'm just being to analytical or critical here. Jeff probably does deserve & need a confidence builder...after the Calzaghe hyding...he does indeed deserve it.
Tsypko was not it.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
I would like Jeff Lacy to take on Mads Larsen. It would be a come-back for both of them at the top scene.
http://politiken.dk/archive/00195/Ma...en_195568c.jpg
http://www.teamtalk.com/Images/51277.jpg
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Create EB
I would like Jeff Lacy to take on Mads Larsen. It would be a come-back for both of them at the top scene.
Larsen really doesn't need much of a comeback. Who was it that beat him that he needs to comeback from? Ottke?
I think tossing him in with Lacy would be a mistake...there's nothing to gain from that...hardly anyone here knows him. I mean I know he's from Denmark & has that tatt thing going like Kessler...but he should just stay in obscurity.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Lacy is done. Lacy has always been a one-dimensional fighter. And I think his recent injury has robbed him of that one dimension. Unless Lacy proves other wise, I see him as a journeyman fighter. And even a crappy fighter like Manfredo can beat a journeyman.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Lacy is done. Lacy has always been a one-dimensional fighter. And I think his recent injury has robbed him of that one dimension. Unless Lacy proves other wise, I see him as a journeyman fighter. And even a crappy fighter like Manfredo can beat a journeyman.
you seem to be another one that is hell bent on hating on Lacy... Thats cool and all but his 1 dimension got him along way, its a little premature to take a fighter with one loss and call him a journey man dont you think seeing he is the #3 ranked supermiddle in the world? I mean for you to say Manfredo can beat him is far reaching, if anyone is a flash in the pan journeyman its Petey
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Lacy is done. Lacy has always been a one-dimensional fighter. And I think his recent injury has robbed him of that one dimension. Unless Lacy proves other wise, I see him as a journeyman fighter. And even a crappy fighter like Manfredo can beat a journeyman.
you seem to be another one that is hell bent on hating on Lacy... Thats cool and all but his 1 dimension got him along way, its a little premature to take a fighter with one loss and call him a journey man dont you think seeing he is the #3 ranked supermiddle in the world? I mean for you to say Manfredo can beat him is far reaching, if anyone is a flash in the pan journeyman its Petey
Manfredo a flash in the pan? When was the flash? Maybe journeyman might be to much, but a torn cuff is no joke. If it robs Lacy of his power, than what is Lacy suppose to do? Power is his only game. If he loses that, than he's pretty much done. It ain't a knock on him. It's a fact.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
I was really excited about Jeff Lacy and was shocked at what Calzaghe did to him. I didn't know about his injury when he fought Vitali, but I thought he didn't look like the same fighter. When in the fight did the injury occur?
I have to agree with VD he's a bit one dimensional. That doesn't mean he couldn't be successful, but since his strengths are his strength and power, he drops way down ineffectiveness if the injury takes some of that power away.
The other factor that a fighter like Lacy needs is the absolute belief that he's the baddest MoFo on the planet. Calzaghe crushed a lot of that out of him. IMO he didn't look like he had an unshaken belief in his badness in his last fight.
If he has recovered physically, I think Manfredo might be the perfect opponent for him now, to see where he is mentally. Manfredo is still a name that will draw attention, and it's the perfect chance for him to feel powerful again. Plus if he demolishes Peter, maybe Peter will finally fade into the sunset. If he struggles or gets beat, then we'll know a lot about how poor his future prospects are.
I also agree that Manfredo is above journeyman level and is capable of exposing a weakness in Lacy, if it exists. In other words, pre or close to pre-Calzaghe Lacy should do well. A physically weakened Lacy will have problems. A mentally shaky, but physically healthy Lacy could get back on track with this fight.
Incidentally, I see a lot of parallels with Berto here. He seems of similar ilk to me, and shouldn't be rushed along to fast.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
I do not think Berto is a one demension fighter he has power,speed and good foot work a good thing for him would be to have a fight with Quitana or Juhda then if he does well in those fights he should either fight Cintron or Williams but that is just a thought i could be wrong but i think i am right
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Lacy will knock Peter out. Manfredo might give him some trouble early, but once he tires, he'll get hit and once that happens, he's outta there. Lacy by mid round TKO.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Manfredo is no better than a 40 ranked fighter , he fookin usless
lacy ko 3
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**Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/box...ory?id=3059731
I think this will be a great fight.  This is by far(not even gonna count the Calzaghe "fight") the biggest challenge in Manfredo's carreer.  We'll finally get to see if he belongs in this div.  This should be a nice fight for Lacy on the comeback trail.
All around it should be fun to watch... ;)
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
CC thanks for letting me know, will make staying up till 4am more worthy ;D
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
The battle of Calzaghes leftovers
Lacy really looked poor in his last fight so he may be damaged goods. Peter however has always looked poor so youd have to favour Lacy in thid one .
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAME
The battle of Calzaghes leftovers
Lacy really looked poor in his last fight so he may be damaged goods. Peter however has always looked poor so youd have to favour Lacy in thid one .
if i am correct he started off real good and then he injured his shoulder. torn his rotator cuff and that really affected his performance.
good to see lacy making his return. he should ko manfredo
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
Quote:
Originally Posted by ds91
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAME
The battle of Calzaghes leftovers
Lacy really looked poor in his last fight so he may be damaged goods. Peter however has always looked poor so youd have to favour Lacy in thid one .
if i am correct he started off real good and then he injured his shoulder. torn his rotator cuff and that really affected his performance.
good to see lacy making his return. he should ko manfredo
He didn't start all that great against Tsypko but surely Lacy can beat Manfredo.
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
Quote:
Originally Posted by ds91
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAME
The battle of Calzaghes leftovers
Lacy really looked poor in his last fight so he may be damaged goods. Peter however has always looked poor so youd have to favour Lacy in thid one .
if i am correct he started off real good and then he injured his shoulder. torn his rotator cuff and that really affected his performance.
good to see lacy making his return. he should ko manfredo
He didn't start all that great against Tsypko but surely Lacy can beat Manfredo.
Well, although he wasn't dynamite starting out against Tsypko he was definitely making the running in the early stages and was ahead. As for Lacy against Manfredo, Calzaghe was hitting Manfredo at will, which says to me that Lacy will be able to catch him, and I'd be certain that left-hook Lacy could demolish Manfredo within the distance, even quicker if he can catch him flush in the first round or two.
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
This will be the bloodiest battle of the year as Lacy can dish out and endless amount of punishment and Manfredo will be more than willing to be his ragdoll. Look for Manfredo's corner to throw in the blood-sopped towel.
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
Carnt see Manfredo lasting any longer than 4 rounds.
Hope this fight is on the undercard.
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
this is the second biggest fight of manfredo's career....and this is the first comeback fight for lacy after his injury.
Should be a quick fight for someone.
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
this is the second biggest fight of manfredo's career....and this is the first comeback fight for lacy after his injury.
Should be a quick fight for someone.
This will be a 1st or 2nd round knockout for Lacy. Manfredo is just too easy to hit for an accurate power puncher like Lacy.
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Re: **Lacy Slated to fight Peter Manfredo in Mayweather Hatton undercard**
Quote:
Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Big' Dan McCarthy
Quote:
Originally Posted by ds91
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAME
The battle of Calzaghes leftovers
Lacy really looked poor in his last fight so he may be damaged goods. Peter however has always looked poor so youd have to favour Lacy in thid one .
if i am correct he started off real good and then he injured his shoulder. torn his rotator cuff and that really affected his performance.
good to see lacy making his return. he should ko manfredo
He didn't start all that great against Tsypko but surely Lacy can beat Manfredo.
Well, although he wasn't dynamite starting out against Tsypko he was definitely making the running in the early stages and was ahead. As for Lacy against Manfredo, Calzaghe was hitting Manfredo at will, which says to me that Lacy will be able to catch him, and I'd be certain that left-hook Lacy could demolish Manfredo within the distance, even quicker if he can catch him flush in the first round or two.
calzaghe was shit against manfredo... he didnt want that fight, and verything he said about it ebing legit as bullshit, but a fighter rying to make it happen.. i blame hbo for that fight and only hbo.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
1st time ive read this thread. Will be a good good fight. Manfredo has rebuilt his confidence by staying busy while Lacy still probably has the better chance of winning.
Dont knock it, this is a good match up ;)
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
I find it hard to take Manfredo seriously at world level tho. The only step fight he took between up and comer and world level was a shot Scott Pemberton. There was very little time for growth there.
Alfonso Gomez seems to be making more of his chance with growth fights like Gatti etc. before jumping in with the elite.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
I find it hard to take Manfredo seriously at world level tho. The only step fight he took between up and comer and world level was a shot Scott Pemberton. There was very little time for growth there.
Alfonso Gomez seems to be making more of his chance with growth fights like Gatti etc. before jumping in with the elite.
so gatti's not shot? ??? ???
and BELIEVE ME, if alfonso gomez was offered a title shot, he would take it before they even told him who he was fighting.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
I find it hard to take Manfredo seriously at world level tho. The only step fight he took between up and comer and world level was a shot Scott Pemberton. There was very little time for growth there.
Alfonso Gomez seems to be making more of his chance with growth fights like Gatti etc. before jumping in with the elite.
so gatti's not shot? ??? ???
and BELIEVE ME, if alfonso gomez was offered a title shot, he would take it before they even told him who he was fighting.
No i don't believe Gatti was shot. No doubt he was a shadow of his former self, but given the opportunity he would have loved to have put a beatdown on Gomez. Gatti wasn't shot, he was jus depreciated in quality to the point that he became an average fighter.
Scott pemberton on the other hand was shot, he showed little to no offense no aggression and he flailed when hit by Manfredo. This was the same guy who Lacy had to slug repeatedly at the start of their fight to get him to move backward.
And i wouldn't blame Gomez for taking a title shot at his nearest opportunity, he looked very good against Gatti and he's a hard worker. Why not give it a go.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
I find it hard to take Manfredo seriously at world level tho. The only step fight he took between up and comer and world level was a shot Scott Pemberton. There was very little time for growth there.
Alfonso Gomez seems to be making more of his chance with growth fights like Gatti etc. before jumping in with the elite.
so gatti's not shot? ??? ???
and BELIEVE ME, if alfonso gomez was offered a title shot, he would take it before they even told him who he was fighting.
No i don't believe Gatti was shot. No doubt he was a shadow of his former self, but given the opportunity he would have loved to have put a beatdown on Gomez. Gatti wasn't shot, he was jus depreciated in quality to the point that he became an average fighter.
Scott pemberton on the other hand was shot, he showed little to no offense no aggression and he flailed when hit by Manfredo. This was the same guy who Lacy had to slug repeatedly at the start of their fight to get him to move backward.
And i wouldn't blame Gomez for taking a title shot at his nearest opportunity, he looked very good against Gatti and he's a hard worker. Why not give it a go.
I like Gomez but all of the top Welterweights would destroy Gomez.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
I find it hard to take Manfredo seriously at world level tho. The only step fight he took between up and comer and world level was a shot Scott Pemberton. There was very little time for growth there.
Alfonso Gomez seems to be making more of his chance with growth fights like Gatti etc. before jumping in with the elite.
so gatti's not shot?  ??? ???
and BELIEVE ME, if alfonso gomez was offered a title shot, he would take it before they even told him who he was fighting.
No i don't believe Gatti was shot. No doubt he was a shadow of his former self, but given the opportunity he would have loved to have put a beatdown on Gomez. Gatti wasn't shot, he was jus depreciated in quality to the point that he became an average fighter.
Scott pemberton on the other hand was shot, he showed little to no offense no aggression and he flailed when hit by Manfredo. This was the same guy who Lacy had to slug repeatedly at the start of their fight to get him to move backward.
And i wouldn't blame Gomez for taking a title shot at his nearest opportunity, he looked very good against Gatti and he's a hard worker. Why not give it a go.
I'm with Donny as far as Gatti being Shot... He wasnt! Sure he has more miles on him than Lindsey Lohans crack pipe but he has always styed competitive.
Gatti developed the same trouble Diego Coralles had. He was to big to fight at his optimal weight but to undersized  to bring his power and chin to the higher weight with him.....Trying to cut weight was murder for them  :-\
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
CC Jt. 100% in agreement. Only problem is, if Big_Deuce replies, my next arguement is gone now :D
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
CC Jt. 100% in agreement. Only problem is, if Big_Deuce replies, my next arguement is gone now :D
:coolclick: thats got a be a young boxer like Coralles biggest nightmare. the night he fought Clottey, Joshua hydrated up to about 165 :o Corrales was just about fighting a SuperMiddle that night and he is a little fella :-\
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Deuce
Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
I find it hard to take Manfredo seriously at world level tho. The only step fight he took between up and comer and world level was a shot Scott Pemberton. There was very little time for growth there.
Alfonso Gomez seems to be making more of his chance with growth fights like Gatti etc. before jumping in with the elite.
so gatti's not shot? ??? ???
and BELIEVE ME, if alfonso gomez was offered a title shot, he would take it before they even told him who he was fighting.
No i don't believe Gatti was shot. No doubt he was a shadow of his former self, but given the opportunity he would have loved to have put a beatdown on Gomez. Gatti wasn't shot, he was jus depreciated in quality to the point that he became an average fighter.
Scott pemberton on the other hand was shot, he showed little to no offense no aggression and he flailed when hit by Manfredo. This was the same guy who Lacy had to slug repeatedly at the start of their fight to get him to move backward.
And i wouldn't blame Gomez for taking a title shot at his nearest opportunity, he looked very good against Gatti and he's a hard worker. Why not give it a go.
Wait a minute.
Gatti isnt shot? but pemberton is?
Both guys were shells of the men they once were. Pemberton's wars with sheika, his lethal ko loss to lacy were devastating to his career and possible his health. He got crushed by peter manfredo easily. However look who gatti fought with, and if you can consider pemberton shot, and not gatti, i dont know what to tell ya but YOUR CRAZY.
Gatti's incredible wars with angel manfredy, oscar de la hoya, micky ward x3, also getting completely annihilated by PBF and carlos baldomir basically into submission, then to lose the way he did against alfonso gomez, where gomez sends gatti into retirement. And gatti isn't shot?????? Give me break, he did nothing in that fight. to me he lost almost every round to gomez. He showed he had nothing left in the tank by round 4. and you tell me this is anywhere close to the guy who battled ward till the end in 3 epic battles? please please tell me how pemberton can be called shot, but gatti cant? gatti endured much more punishment in his career then pemberton ever did, and then lost to the same caliber competition as pemberton did. Manfredo & gomez.
Quote:
No doubt he was a shadow of his former self, but given the opportunity he would have loved to have put a beatdown on Gomez. Gatti wasn't shot, he was jus depreciated in quality to the point that he became an average fighter.
please re read what you just said, and tell me how that makes sense.
gatti is a shadow of his former self, and it made him into an average fighter? Average fighters do not get KTFO'd by alfonso gomez PERIOD. the same alfonso gomez who never fought in a 10 round fight before gatti, the same alfonso gomez who got a draw with jesse feliciano (whom i believe beat gomez). Gatti isn't shot? just look at gatti, he retired because he realized who he just lost to. Alfonso fricken gomez. please re-read that name again, before you tell me gatti wasn't shot. Alfonso-fricken-gomez.
Quote:
And i wouldn't blame Gomez for taking a title shot at his nearest opportunity, he looked very good against Gatti and he's a hard worker. Why not give it a go.
But your saying that alfonso gomez is smart by not jumping in with the elite fighters. The ONLY reason he isnt with the elite, is because none of the "elite" have given him a shot. and if they did give him a shot before gatti, he would of gladly accepted, so dont give credit to gomez for being patient in fighting "growth" fights before elite fights. Those "growth" fights are the only thing gomez has on his plate.
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Re: Jeff lacy vs peter manfredo in the works.
Deuce i could argue with u til well after Christmas as i always stick with what i think and will only change my mind if given a very good reason.
U haven't given me reason to change my mind and i don't think ul offer me sufficient arguement to alter my opinion in any way.
So, forget about it, think what you want.
