Hype of Danny William, Hype of Audley harrison and now Hype of David Haye?

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

Pretty sure I see a shot landed by Enzo then a stumble by Haye...
http://youtube.com/watch?v=beSvupzdMMY

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I personally think enzo fought with less defence and took more risk than he should have after he shook david haye. This is what caused him to get ko especially so early.
I don't consider enzo anything more than khali meehan but he could have won quite easily if he stook to the game plan.

I knew after his mistake enzo would be kicking himself

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Originally Posted by JT Rock

viewed it a gazillion times and I cant see a landed punch..:-\

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At 1 min of the video Enzo catches Haye with a short left hook on the inside...

People think THAT is going to beat Wladimir Klitschko?!?!

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Originally Posted by Lyle

People FUKIN KNOW THAT is going to beat Wladimir Klitschko cold!!!! I am also the biggest Yankee fan in the world

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Fixed it for you ;D

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Originally Posted by Lyle

It's all well and good that you are a fan of Wladimir Klitschko but do everyone (especially me) a favor and bring some reason and some rational thought to your posts.

I am a Wladimir Klitschko fan as well but let's be honest he has not yet solidified his legacy in the sport. He is just now starting to make his mark on the history of the sport....I rate Wladimir rate now as a good but not yet great Champion.

He's not in the top 10, not in the top 20, maybe not in the top 25 but he's making strides in his fights and if he unifies and defends his title successfully until he retires then obviously people will have to come to grips with him as a great fighter...he'd have to beat Jesus' ass to get in the top 10 though....top 15-20 might suit him though and that's in great company Lewis, Tyson, Holyfield, etc...great fighters...Wlad can be up there with them

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No he can't.

Lyle, if you make me a top 20 HW's list that has Klitschko in it.. Well I'd just like to see who you'd do the injustice of leaving them out for Wlad.

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Originally Posted by JT Rock

viewed it a gazillion times and I cant see a landed punch..:-\

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I agree. He pawed with his left and it landed on Haye's shoulder. The punch did not send him back. I think their feet got tied up and Haye stumbled when pulling back.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

No he can't.

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He can....if he wins 10-20 more fights vs the best this division has to offer then he's up there with them.

1. Joe Louis
2. Rocky Marciano
3. Muhamad Ali
4. George Foreman
5. Jack Johnson
6. Larry Holmes
7. Jack Dempsey
8. Ezzard Charles
9. Sonny Liston
10. Joe Walcott
11. Floyd Patterson
12. Evander Holyfield
13. Lennox Lewis
14. Gene Tunney
15. Mike Tyson
16. Riddick Bowe
17. James J. Braddock
18. Max Baer
19. Max Schmelling
20. Ingemar Johanssen

Show me yours

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Originally Posted by TruthandHonesty

I don't think william is that much better than haye but it surely is one of the worst comparison. prime William went 8 round against Vitali KLitschko
I really doubt haye will Last more that few round against any top HW fighter, and we will see

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Prime william? hahah... he looked like a fucking whale for god's sake...

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

At 1 min of the video Enzo catches Haye with a short left hook on the inside...

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I thought that was the punch you were talking about when I watched it back but to me it looked like it missed. He actually loses his balance IMO with that right hand he tries to throw at the same time as the short hook from Enzo. I'm almost 100% sure even if that short hook did land it was a glancing blow at best and not the reason that Haye was sent back. It's an awkward viewing angle though bro..it may have landed, it may have not

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Originally Posted by Lyle

He can....if he wins 10-20 more fights vs the best this division has to offer then he's up there with them.

1. Joe Louis
2. Rocky Marciano
3. Muhamad Ali
4. George Foreman
5. Jack Johnson
6. Larry Holmes
7. Jack Dempsey
8. Ezzard Charles
9. Sonny Liston
10. Joe Walcott
11. Floyd Patterson
12. Evander Holyfield
13. Lennox Lewis
14. Gene Tunney
15. Mike Tyson
16. Riddick Bowe
17. James J. Braddock
18. Max Baer
19. Max Schmelling
20. Ingemar Johanssen

Show me yours

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Lyle you kow I usually agree with you on things but...Lennox at 13!!!!!....I usually rate Lennox 4th though I understand many do not agree but He deserves a top 10 no matter hos you look at it...You have Liston at 9 and the only defense he made of the title was his rematch with Patterson

And your list is where?

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Originally Posted by TruthandHonesty

sanders was beaten by his bro in the next fight, am not saying wladimir had to lose to purity and by the way purity had 13 losess when he fought wladimir not 20 losses, purtiy also broke morrison jaw and obviously knock him down, but he wasn't 42 year old like carl thompson, and neither he had a weak chin like thompson and after 11 round wladimir ran out of steam against durable purity comparing to 5 round of haye being ko by thompson.
I can understand a 22 yrs old wladimir not knocking out durable heavyweight purity but thomson has been stopped by many soft puncher, where was haye power

I will not go in circle so I will not waste any more time on this nonsense

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Ross Purity was a journeyman who beat Wladimir cos Wladimir ran out of steam and quit.

Carl Thompson was a former world champion and still a high ranked contender when Haye lost to him by punching himself out and running out of steam in only his 11th fight.

There's the difference Haye lost to a champion while Klitschko lost to a journeyman.

Neither fight has any real relevance on the fighters now. So don't know why those fights keep coming up.

For example:
Its like harking on about Hagler losing a fight to Bobby Watts just when he was about to fight Thomas Hearns. The Watts fight had no bearing on what will happen in the Hearns fight as Hagler had gained alot more experience and was near his best - just a silly soundbite used by some fans to make a lame point.

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Originally Posted by Lyle

And your list is where?

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1.Ali

2. Louis

3. Marciano

4. Lewis

5. Foreman

6. Holmes

7. Johnson

8. Dempsey

9. Tunney

10. Holyfield

11. Patterson

12. Tyson

13. Walcott

14. Frazier

15. Charles

16. Bowe

17. Schmelling

18. Braddock

19. Baer

THE TOP 20 HEAVYWEIGHTS OF ALL TIME

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Jack Johnson
4. George Foreman
5. Larry Holmes
6. Jack Dempsey
7. Sonny Liston
8. Jim Jeffries
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Mike Tyson
11. Rocky Marciano
12. Joe Frazier
13. Riddick Bowe
14. Evander Holyfield
15. Sam Langford
16. Gene Tunney
17. James J. Corbett
18. Ezzard Charles
19. Jersey Joe Walcott
20. Max Schmeling

by historian Monte D. Cox

My Top 10 ;)
1.Lennox Lewis
2.Muhammad Ali
3.George Foreman
4.Jack Johnson
5.Larry Holmes
6.Joe Louis
7.Sonny Liston
8.Joe Frazier
9.Mike Tyson
10.Ike Ibeabuchi

Tunney made two title defenses and retired...an old Dempsey is the only true name on his record at heavyweight

Lewis got sparked out by Rahman in his prime (or at the tail end of it)

Foreman was not only great in his first career but also in his second run at his career

Holyfield didn't have the consistency to be rated in the top 10

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Originally Posted by Lyle

Tunney made two title defenses and retired...an old Dempsey is the only true name on his record at heavyweight

Lewis got sparked out by Rahman in his prime (or at the tail end of it)

Foreman was not only great in his first career but also in his second run at his career

Holyfield didn't have the consistency to be rated in the top 10

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Other then Marciano name a HW who has not been beaten during their best years?.....Louis was starched by Schmelling before he won the title..Lewis also came back and made easy work Rahman in the rematch, also he did not train 3 weeks before the fight and was spending late nights filming Oceans 11.....It was more the fact Lennox gassed out and was prime at the time of the KO

Holyfield was at or near the top for the better part of a decade....From 1990-2000 he was part of 13 title fights.....The only men to beat him in his prim were Bowe and Lewis...Two top 20 ATG hwts. He was only KO'd twice in 9 losses...By Toney way past his better years and a much Bigger Prime Bowe...He also had one of the Best HW triligies with Bowe....He won the title what 4 times I think....Pretty damn impressive IMO


Agreed on Foreman he was great both runs

Ezzard Charles and Joe Walcott had to win the title between reigns of JOE LOUIS and ROCKY MARCIANO ....they had some good fights between themselves as well.

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Originally Posted by TruthandHonesty

Your are really confusing me, I have no idea what you are talking about and yes I did find that other topic by chance and am not the only one who replied to it, I was interested in it since my hero Muhammad Ali was mention and right now my favourtie boxer Wladimir.
I really don't care if you believe me or not but I won't be replying back to anybody who accuses me of doing silly things.
Why would I have 2 different account for? I'm have been very nice to you and I haven't accused you for being those other account that are jealous of Wladimir.

Right now Wladimir is not great as Ali, ALi retired at 41, wladimir is 31 also I love Ali more because of the things he done outside the ring, I loved it when he stood against the american goverment especially when they forced him to go war, how many great are there like him on this planet?
How many people like Ali risk everything for the right thing?

So right now Wladimir is not on ALi level

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You make it too easy when your hiding let me give you some tips, don't go into a very old Wladimir thread where the same guy who started that topic was a fruitcake with broken English who sucked up to Wlad like you old son ;)

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

Holyfield was at or near the top for the better part of a decade....From 1990-2000 he was part of 13 title fights.....The only men to beat him in his prim were Bowe and Lewis...Two top 20 ATG hwts. He was only KO'd twice in 9 losses...By Toney way past his better years and a much Bigger Prime Bowe...He also had one of the Best HW triligies with Bowe.

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Also as a side note in regard to one of the two Holyfield KOs. The first one against Bowe happened more so because of Holyfield's physical issues. If I remember correctly he'd been diagnosed with Hep A and his training had been interrupted because he'd caught the flu a few weeks before the fight. He was easily outpointing a fat, unmotivated Bowe and instantly ran out of steam in the 2nd or 3rd. When he went down for the last time he was throwing HUGE haymakers, trying to rip Bowe's head off before he collapsed. Bowe didn't knock him out, Holyfield knocked himself out.

Against James Toney, well, that was just a spanking. No way around that.

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Originally Posted by liquid

Also as a side note in regard to one of the two Holyfield KOs. The first one against Bowe happened more so because of Holyfield's physical issues. If I remember correctly he'd been diagnosed with Hep A and his training had been interrupted because he'd caught the flu a few weeks before the fight. He was easily outpointing a fat, unmotivated Bowe and instantly ran out of steam in the 2nd or 3rd. When he went down for the last time he was throwing HUGE haymakers, trying to rip Bowe's head off before he collapsed. Bowe didn't knock him out, Holyfield knocked himself out.

Against James Toney, well, that was just a spanking. No way around that.

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Well the Toney bout was wayyyy past the best of Holyfield...Not a prime Holyfield from the 90's

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Originally Posted by liquid

Also as a side note in regard to one of the two Holyfield KOs. The first one against Bowe happened more so because of Holyfield's physical issues. If I remember correctly he'd been diagnosed with Hep A and his training had been interrupted because he'd caught the flu a few weeks before the fight. He was easily outpointing a fat, unmotivated Bowe and instantly ran out of steam in the 2nd or 3rd. When he went down for the last time he was throwing HUGE haymakers, trying to rip Bowe's head off before he collapsed. Bowe didn't knock him out, Holyfield knocked himself out.

Against James Toney, well, that was just a spanking. No way around that.

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He wasn't easily outpointing Bowe he only won 1 round then after that he got dominated, and yes it was due to physical issues but you can't actually sit there and tell me Bowe didn't KO Holyfield. Holyfield went for broke and he was over powered in that brutal exchange of punches he got up and couldn't even walk forward. And that was not to do with being out of breath that was due to him taking brutal punches off a much bigger man.

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Originally Posted by ICB

He wasn't easily outpointing Bowe he only won 1 round then after that he got dominated, and yes it was due to physical issues but you can't actually sit there and tell me Bowe didn't KO Holyfield. Holyfield went for broke and he was over powered in that brutal exchange of punches he got up and couldn't even walk forward. And that was not to do with being out of breath that was due to him taking brutal punches off a much bigger man.

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Well when you're completely exhausted because of stamina issues I would say that's how a KO could happen. Are YOU going to sit there and say that Bowe in Bowe-Holyfield III was a better fighter in either the first or second fights? Holyfield went for broke because he knew his body was betraying him. Who gets tired by the 2nd round? I'm sorry, but the "brutal exchange of punches" was nothing compared to anything seen in either of the other 2 fights.

And yes, Daxx, that was a way past it Holyfield. That and the fact his shoulder still wasn't working right. It had been fixed and Chris Byrd affectively reaggravated it by punching him there for a full 12 rounds. I remember in the post-fight interview he said it felt fine, but didn't know what happened. That was because Byrd had a great gameplan.

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Originally Posted by liquid

Well when you're completely exhausted because of stamina issues I would say that's how a KO could happen. Are YOU going to sit there and say that Bowe in Bowe-Holyfield III was a better fighter in either the first or second fights? Holyfield went for broke because he knew his body was betraying him. Who gets tired by the 2nd round? I'm sorry, but the "brutal exchange of punches" was nothing compared to anything seen in either of the other 2 fights.

And yes, Daxx, that was a way past it Holyfield. That and the fact his shoulder still wasn't working right. It had been fixed and Chris Byrd affectively reaggravated it by punching him there for a full 12 rounds. I remember in the post-fight interview he said it felt fine, but didn't know what happened. That was because Byrd had a great gameplan.

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I never said Holyfield was the same fighter in there 3rd meeting, i would be stupid to say Holyfield was anything like the fighter he was in there previous fights, but i already said it was due to physical complications, but Holyfield getting knocked out was nothing to do with him being out of breath. He was caught with devastating punches and only just beat the count he couldn't even walk forward that was nothing to do with his stamina problems.

I want to see Haye fight at heavyweight for one simple reason. He is exciting to watch and will bring some drama to a currently boring division..

I don't care if a fighter will fail or get their ass kicked in their ring adventures, I just want to see kick ass fights. Haye is capable of delivering excitement and he is dangerous. Good enough for me ;D

Edison Miranda is one of my favorite fighters and I want to see him fight Kessler more than anyone. Do I think Miranda wins? Hell no! But man, it will be great why it lasts.:D

So you can accuse me of hyping him also, but the division needs Haye and more like him right now.

I don't think Haye is that great, but here's the thing, I don't think Haye needs to be THAT great to beat the current crop of heavyweights. Whose out there ? A bunch of Russian nobodies who I would give Audley Harrison a chance aganist......and I don't even rate Harrison (lol) I still think Haye has stamina and chin questions to be asked, but bar Klitschko there is not much talent out there.