what about JMM i think he is better than antonio margarito
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what about JMM i think he is better than antonio margarito
jeah I got to agree that list is missing jmm, arguably with better management he could have been as great as mab and em, and some would say he is either way.
JMM could be no. 6 ... ;) He's nowhere seen among the top 5 ... Or maybe JMM not really considered that a great fighter in Mexico because he's not employing the Mexican aggresive, offensive, brawling style of boxing... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfrnk
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Looks like fishing time again eh :biteit: Maybe Pac could be honorary 'Mexican' top 5 because he has beaten so many ?At least your a better salesman and hypeman than these guys......:bucktooth:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKdck...eature=related :cwm34:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spicoli surfs 'Nawlins
You're really a smart fisherman Mr. Spi... You can always catch what I'm up to... :lolhaha:
BTW JCC Sr. is considered the greatest Mexican fighter... ;) That further pushed JMM to no. 7 ... :lolhaha:
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Merged.
Sanchez for me.
Thats silly logic because Ricardo Lopez wasn't brawler and was a master boxer, and yet he is number 1 i just don't think its a thought out list.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerJMM could be no. 6 ... ;) He's nowhere seen among the top 5 ... Or maybe JMM not really considered that a great fighter in Mexico because he's not employing the Mexican aggresive, offensive, brawling style of boxing... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfrnk
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Salvador Sanchez has to be my favorite Mexican fighter of all time only equal to Ricardo Lopez, he had legendary stamina in his fights with Pat Cowdell, Azumah Nelson, when these fights were very close going into last round what does he do ? he comes out for the 15th round likes its the first round and drops Cowdell heavily with 20 seconds left with a counter right hand which won him the fight, and stopped Nelson with barrage of non stop punching. He also showed this kind of stamina when Ruben Castillo was slightly ahead in there fight and Sanchez rallied late to win a decision, and he also showed it against Patrick Ford.Quote:
Originally Posted by Markusdarkus
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBSalvador Sanchez has to be my favorite Mexican fighter of all time only equal to Ricardo Lopez, he had legendary stamina in his fights with Pat Cowdell, Azumah Nelson, when these fights were very close going into last round what does he do ? he comes out for the 15th round likes its the first round and drops Cowdell heavily with 20 seconds left with a counter right hand which won him the fight, and stopped Nelson with barrage of non stop punching. He also showed this kind of stamina when Ruben Castillo was slightly ahead in there fight and Sanchez rallied late to win a decision, and he also showed it against Patrick Ford.Quote:
Originally Posted by Markusdarkus
The way he took Wilfredo Gomez apart was pure masterclass.
I think that Oscar has to be up there if not the best even with his loses his resume looks was better then any other fighter you name. He held titles in the SFW, LW, LWW, WW, LMW, and then MW not many have done that my friends and i dont think many while do that. His best wins are good also i would have to say Jimmy Bredahl, Jorge Paez, John John Molina, Rafael Ruelas, Jesse James Leija, Julio Cesar Chavez, Miguel Angel Gonzalez, Pernell Whitaker, Hector Camacho, Ike Quartey, Arturo Gatti, Javier Castillejo, Fernando Vargas, Luis Ramon Campas, Felix Sturm, Ricardo Mayorga, and then there was Steve Forbes. Now all the people i listed are not the best best wins but all of them have been champions and title holders also. So you tell me how that looks and i think Oscar can claim to be the best mexican to ever fight but just me or am i missing somthing i mean why no love for Oscar all he done for boxing.
Oscar is one of my favorite fighters of all time and you will always see me fighting his corner on here. But I am unsure about calling him a Mexican. He did at the end of the day win a gold medal for the USA in '92. Also Sanchez has to get my vote as greatest Mexican fighter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Yea but i dont know he is mexican even though he was born here i mean i live in San Diego it is like mexico in southern California if you been here. But when i look at achiviment and talent and pound for pound. I dont see any of those names you listed as good as Oscar Del La Hoya i could be wrong in the end it is just the way i see it good thread by the way.
Thank you! I'd rep you but I have to spread some before it will let me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
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Originally Posted by rjj tszyuOscar is one of my favorite fighters of all time and you will always see me fighting his corner on here. But I am unsure about calling him a Mexican. He did at the end of the day win a gold medal for the USA in '92. Also Sanchez has to get my vote as greatest Mexican fighter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Oscar is American by birth of mexican decent. I too would have trouble calling him mexican, he was after all born and raised in LA.
The fact that boxing writers can come up a list like this only supports the general sentiment that JMM is not really considered that great in Mexico... :(Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBThats silly logic because Ricardo Lopez wasn't brawler and was a master boxer, and yet he is number 1 i just don't think its a thought out list.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerJMM could be no. 6 ... ;) He's nowhere seen among the top 5 ... Or maybe JMM not really considered that a great fighter in Mexico because he's not employing the Mexican aggresive, offensive, brawling style of boxing... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfrnk
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JMM is not even included in this poll options... ;)
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Well when i think mexican i think race so greatest mexican for me is Oscar.
would say salvador but I would go with Lopez cause Ricardo had a long career and displayed his masterpiece consistently. As for sanchez he did have a great short career but since he did get hit more then he should, anything could of happen if he had lived longer. We will never know, K.O's do happen to anybody even to Roy Jones.
Sanchez is the first that comes up to my mind then Chavez.. Sanchez had a short but very meaningful career. That's my opinion though. I notice the name Juan Manuel Marquez is not in the list? I consider him one of the best to his contemporaries. He is still in the process of rewriting mexican boxing history and he might turn out to be best who knows. As for Oscar, yeah i see him as mexican but he act and breath now like an american.
id say chavez definately, didnt he have 90 fights before he lost?
In terms of greatness JCC. If Salvador Sanchez wouldn't have passed young then he may have surpassed JCC.
Shame we'll never know
Mexico has produced some very great boxers throughout the history of the sport of boxing. I have put together a small list of great fighters in their honor and in gratitude for all the historic moments they have given to this great sport. Enjoy!!!!!
Salvador Sanchez
Julio Cesar Chavez
Ricardo Finito Lopez
Lupe Pintor
Carlos Zarate
Raul Raton Macias
Ruben Olivares
Alfonso Zamora
Vicente Zaldivar
Humberto Chiquita Gonzalez
Eric Morales
Marco Antonio Barrera
Kid Azteca
Rodolfo Gonzalez
Jesus Pimentel
Israel Vasquez
Daniel Zaragosa
Jose Pipino Cuevas
Chango Casanova
Gabriel Ruelas
Jose Luis Castillo
The list goes on and on. Much love and respect to all fighters who continue to contribute to our great sport. Peace!
Many thanks
merged...
Do I see Miguel Cotto on that list? :o
Canto, not Cotto... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
Canto was a brilliant boxer.
Could be as slick as Locche and Pernell.
actually Chavez was a damn good technical fighter and he showed it on various occasions that he could box, he did so in the Randall rematch, he could move well even though he was no Roy Jones and he had a good jab, Barrera IMO did have a bit more technical ability but that's the only thing he edges over Chavez. JCC has a record that pretty much neither, Morales, Barrera,no Marquez can compete with, he's taken on more big names than either of them, although not winning them all, but he has plenty of big name wins on his record as well, over better talent than that of Barrera IMOQuote:
Originally Posted by GAME
Chavez:
Ruben Castillo
Roger Mayweather (2X)
Rocky Lockridge
Juan Laporte
Edwin Rosario
Rafael Limon
Jose Luis Ramirez
Meldrick Taylor (2X)
Hector Camacho
Greg Haugen
Pernell Whitaker (even though a draw, he took the fight)
Frankie Randall (W2 L1)
Tony Lopez
Oscar De La Hoya (L-2)
Kostya Tzyu (L-1)
Barrera:
Agapito Sanchez
Kennedy Mckinney
Junior Jones (L-2)
Erik Morales (W2-L1)
Naseem Hamed
Johnny Tapia (and he was passed his best)
Kevin Kelly
Manny Pacquiao (L-2)
Paulie Ayala
Mzonke Fana :-X
Robbie Peden (decent fighter that KO'd Campbell twice)
Rocky Juarez (2X)
Juan Manuel Marquez (L-1)
Amir Khan (L-1 should have been a NC)
If you take apart the fighters they faced, Chavez actually has had the better opposition
and as for the Morales/Barrera deal...
Morales:
Daniel Zaragoza
Junior Jones (WTKO-4)
Angel Chacon (fought plenty of big names and gave them good fights)
Wayne McCullough
Marco Antonio Barrera (W-1 L-2)
Kevin Kelly (WTKO-7)
Gutty Espadas Jr (tough close UD, then blew him out in 3 in the rematch)
In Jin Chi
Paulie Ayala
Jesus Chavez
Carlos Hernandez
Manny Pacquiao (W-1 L-2)
Zahir Raheem (L-1)
David Diaz (L-1, was complete bullshit loss)
and you can argue who's fought the best between them, me? i say Morales has had the better opposition, and never sacrificed his way of fighting to win, ultimately i feel this is what led to Morales' downfall at such a young age of 30 but taking so many blows to the head for over 14 yrs will do that to you, i say Barrera's longevity gives him a boost to compete against Morales for greatest Mexican Fighter of all time, but honestly the same way that i scored their trilogy is where i'll put both of them, tied
I am surprised Tito Trinidad didnt make your list.
JK - I would say Julio Caesar Chavez.....
no that would be TITOFAN :-XQuote:
Originally Posted by Hunter
Julio Caesar Chavez, was the Mexican fighter with the greatest achievements, Who's knows can say what others would have done....;D
Certainly could be. Here is a little article I found on him.Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMickCanto, not Cotto... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
Canto was a brilliant boxer.
Could be as slick as Locche and Pernell.
Miguel Canto - A defensive master, he's the Mexican version of Willie Pep. He successfully defended the flyweight title a record 14 times, winning all but one of those fights by 15-round decision, a record that will never be approached for dominance by virtue of pure boxing skill.
Canto finished 61-9-4 with only 15 knockouts with four of those losses coming at the end of his career and most of the rest in the first two years of it. He was more difficult to hit than Sandy Koufax.
I am an avid Erik fan so I will always have him over Barrera. But to be factual you can see he has the better resume and he has beaten Jones and Pacquiao, both of which knocked Barrera out badly. Their three fights were too damn close to be brag of by either of them. I also think the comparisons wouldn't be this close if Erik had been the one who won twice..styles makes fights and Erik's style seem to make all fights close whoever he's up against with.that's is why he's been part of ATG fights and all those unforgettable wars. I can't get enough of this guy. he's a warrior.
I noticed most Brits seem to adore Barrera. I have no problem with that. But what I don't get is why Erik Morales doesn't get the same love??
Im a great fan of Morales but I know he isn't the greatest overall.
I picked JCC.
If Salvador Sanchez didn't pass away at such early age he might have accomplished more.
*I think older fans will say Sanchez... folks in the 40 yr old range will say Chavez... and quiet honestly,JMM should be in the mix... For me, i don't see how u don't pick Salvador Sanchez as the greatest...
Chavez, Barrera,Morales... they have great names in their list... but Salvador Sanchez had killers on his list... and he beat them all before the age of 23yrs old.
Do u guys remember what Little Red Lopez was doing to people? Red Lpez was a buzzsaw. Sanchez fought him at his peak... then beat him again to put him into retirement.
Sanchez beat Wilfredo Gomez...Perto rico's greatest champion... and Sanchez almost KO'ed him in 1. to this day,perto rico can't get over the loss. Gomez had KO'ed almost all his opponenets... in and all time list Gomez sits at the top of his div.
Azuma Nelson got ko'ed by Sanchez... Azuma fuken Nelson was an animal. Azuma would never get ko'ed or even come close to being schooled like he was schooled againsy Sanchez.
to me,it's not even close.
I think Sanchez gets a break because he died at the top of his game. If he had not had his car crash and lost his next fight before disappearing into obscurity we wouldn't be having this discussion, and people would be slating him for saying he didn't dominate a division.
His victory over Nelson was hardly that great, as Nelson was very inexperienced and his mouthguard was stolen so he had a shop bought one that didn't fit.
For what it is worth, I have JMM ahead of Barrera and Morales.
Two fights from losing..etc..etc... Ridiculous. Azuma got beat..no excuses... And Azumas not even close to his toughest fight.... Was sanchez ever in trouble?
Pat Cowdell gave Sanchez a hard time and Azumah wiped him out quickly.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstinkybug
Gave who a hard time? Sanchez systemtically broke fighters down... U can see alot of Sanchez in Pac's atyle of fighting... RicardoLopez. .The same thing... Sanchez wasnt a one punch KO artist...
People say"sanchez got hit alot"..well,look who he fought! Sanchez beat all time great fighters... Or coarse hes gunna get hit... Its what happens after u get hit that makes a difference.
Julio Cesar Chavez for the win!
No such thing. Horses for courses. A fighter is more than his record. It depends what you like.