Fighters Who Never Ducked Anyone.

Still dont see how he ducked them fought guys that were just as acomplished and the fighters you metioned did not have any right to fight. He stop both Benitez and Hearns i dont think he owed them anything. And as for Hearns i dont remeber him asking for one neither do i Benitez. I dont remeber any articles of any of this fighters asking SRL out why would they he was far past it when the got there names out there so no i dont think he avoid them think the timelines if you look at the careers make sense why they did not fight i mean you cant fight ever one does not mean you ducked them means you had guys with just as much and fought them.

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by CGM

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Originally Posted by ICB

Wilfredo Gomez
Ricardo Lopez
Julio Cesar Chavez
Muhammad Ali
Erik Morales
Marco Antonio Barrera
Evander Holyfield
Bob Foster
Charles Burley
Ezzard Charles
Carlos Monzon
Mike McCallum
Salvador Sanchez

Few examples to get us started.

---

Holyfield ducked Lennox Lewis for years, in order to milk all he could out of his title. Eventually he pretty much had to fight him though.

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If Evander Holyfield would of beat Riddick Bowe in there 1st meeting, he would have fought Lennox Lewis. Evander Holyfield between 1992-1994, was too busy with wars against Riddick Bowe, and when Lennox Lewis started to get a name he was upset by Oliver McCall which set him back a few years.

Then his controversial win against Ray Mercer didn't do him any favors either, i really don't believe Evander Holyfield would of ducked Lennox Lewis. Especially since the older Lennox Lewis was a better fighter than the early 90s version.

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Yea can't argue with that. Holyfield would've had a much better shot if he fought Lennox before he faced Tyson than afterwards.

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Originally Posted by leftylee

What about Ricky Hatton ?

Or does Junior Twitter count against him :rolleyes:

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Yes it does.

He'll always be scarred by dodging Witter where neutral Brit fans are concerned.

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Originally Posted by Fenster

Quote:

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Originally Posted by leftylee

What about Ricky Hatton ?

Or does Junior Twitter count against him :rolleyes:

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Yes it does.

He'll always be scarred by dodging Witter where neutral Brit fans are concerned.

---

Not actually sure if that is sarcasm or not, as I obviously don't know what the British sentiment may be; Witter was definetly the clear cut best challenger and most sensible matchup for Hatton to take for a period of time though. I suppose it would have been a tough ask following the loss to Mayweather, but he could've done a lot more to prove his worth by following that up with Junior instead of a good rest then facing Juan Lazcano:-\ Now without bothering to look it up, did Witter lose to Bradley before, or(if so how long) after Hatton lined up the Malignaggi fight? And I don't mean signed the contract, even deciding that he would fight N'dou on the undercard of his Lazcano fight was as good as deciding who his next opponent would be..

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by leftylee

What about Ricky Hatton ?

Or does Junior Twitter count against him :rolleyes:

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Yes it does.

He'll always be scarred by dodging Witter where neutral Brit fans are concerned.

---

Not actually sure if that is sarcasm or not, as I obviously don't know what the British sentiment may be; Witter was definetly the clear cut best challenger and most sensible matchup for Hatton to take for a period of time though. I suppose it would have been a tough ask following the loss to Mayweather, but he could've done a lot more to prove his worth by following that up with Junior instead of a good rest then facing Juan Lazcano:-\ Now without bothering to look it up, did Witter lose to Bradley before, or(if so how long) after Hatton lined up the Malignaggi fight? And I don't mean signed the contract, even deciding that he would fight N'dou on the undercard of his Lazcano fight was as good as deciding who his next opponent would be..

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I'm serious. MANY a Brit fan is disappointed this fight didn't happen from back when they were at Brit title level (2000/1). There were periods when the fight didn't matter, and Hatton had other business, but it was always lingering. Paulie-Hatton was already happening before Witter lost to Bradley. Hatton just blatantly refused to fight Witter. Shame.

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Originally Posted by ICB

Wilfredo Gomez
Ricardo Lopez
Julio Cesar Chavez
Muhammad Ali
Erik Morales
Marco Antonio Barrera
Evander Holyfield
Bob Foster
Charles Burley
Ezzard Charles
Carlos Monzon
Mike McCallum
Salvador Sanchez

Few examples to get us started.

---

All respect to a legend in JCC but he certainly did not rush back with eagerness to what should have been MUST with Frankie Randall after that convenient "Technicality" of an ending in the second fight.Some might say he even "ducked" him during that fight :-X......;D

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

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Originally Posted by Markusdarkus

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Naseem Hamed? The same Hamed that didn't fight Juan Manuel Marquez?

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Hamed ducked no-one.

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Markus, you blow my mind! After seeing your posts and how you get defensive on fighters you like is appaulling! Seriously...you believe Hamed never ducked Marquez?!?!

Boxingfanatics.com
This one is a long article but it says "He quickly climbed his way up the rankings with wins over Julian Wheeler, Darryl Pickney, and Agapito Sanchez, until he finally became the WBO Featherweight #1 contender. Soon, he became known as the fighter Naseem Hamed shamelessly ducked for 22 months. Tired of waiting for a crack at The Prince, Marquez moved on..."

ESPN - The champ most avoid meets king without a crown - Boxing
In this article Rafael says, "When Naseem Hamed was featherweight champ, he ducked Marquez for years, even when he became the mandatory challenger."

Hamed Under Fire | British Boxing Heroes
In this article:

Bruce Williams, writer, Boxing Update: “Juan Manuel Marquez was screwed out of his too-long-overdue mandatory with WBO feather champ Naseem Hamed, who didn’t even have the huevos to come to Puerto Rico and make his own appeal for more dispensations to seek world title unifiers.

Ivan Goldman, writer, KO Magazine: “Should Hamed ultimately forsake his WBO belt to go after another title, it won’t be because he suddenly decided the WBO belt was beneath his dignity. It will be because he’s run out of ways to duck Marquez.”

Teddy Atlas, ringside analyst, ESPN: “Juan Manuel Marquez is a very good fighter. You can tell how good he is by the way Naseem Hamed won’t fight him.”

Anymore rebuttals for this debate?

---

Still waiting on you Markus...

I don't know if anyone mentioned him, but I don't recall Corrales ducking anyone. All though, most of his career took place before I was a boxing fan, so I may be mistaken. I know there was talk of him not wanting to fight Casa for the 3rd time, but the fight was still made.

Food for thought...

Lopez did not fight Carbajal, Gonzalez. Ducked or just part of history?
ODLH did not fight "Maestrito" Lopez. Ducked or just part of history?
Sanchez did not fight Pedroza. Ducked or just part of history?


I gotta laugh at the SRR ducked Burley.
A man who fought all the way to LHW and had 200 fights.
That one I think is just part of history...

You have to say Hector Camacho didn't duck anybody, his resume is impressive. From Rosario through to Chavez, Trinidad, ODLH but no Whitaker?

Julio Gonzalez.

Winky , Shane, Tito, Morales, Barrera, Marquez and Pac that I know for sure.

So far so good: Pavlik, Cotto, J. Taylor, Miranda, H. Soto, Malignaggi (cant believe I said that), Zab, C. Dawson, wow I'm gonna stop. takes too long

Didn't mention P Williams because he doesn't want Quintana trilogy and I still think Carlos has chance beat him.

Didn't mention any old time guys because I wasn't there and I don't believe all I hear. It's just like some of the ridiculous stuff I hear even today that when I see it I'm like, "What the hell are they talking about?". So I'm not gonna make believe I know what was going on in those times.

Like right now I know some of those good underdog guys that I know for a fact are being ducked. Media can't hide those from me. Back then , who knows?

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

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Originally Posted by Markusdarkus

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Naseem Hamed? The same Hamed that didn't fight Juan Manuel Marquez?

---

Hamed ducked no-one.

---

Markus, you blow my mind! After seeing your posts and how you get defensive on fighters you like is appaulling! Seriously...you believe Hamed never ducked Marquez?!?!

Boxingfanatics.com
This one is a long article but it says "He quickly climbed his way up the rankings with wins over Julian Wheeler, Darryl Pickney, and Agapito Sanchez, until he finally became the WBO Featherweight #1 contender. Soon, he became known as the fighter Naseem Hamed shamelessly ducked for 22 months. Tired of waiting for a crack at The Prince, Marquez moved on..."

ESPN - The champ most avoid meets king without a crown - Boxing
In this article Rafael says, "When Naseem Hamed was featherweight champ, he ducked Marquez for years, even when he became the mandatory challenger."

Hamed Under Fire | British Boxing Heroes
In this article:

Bruce Williams, writer, Boxing Update: “Juan Manuel Marquez was screwed out of his too-long-overdue mandatory with WBO feather champ Naseem Hamed, who didn’t even have the huevos to come to Puerto Rico and make his own appeal for more dispensations to seek world title unifiers.

Ivan Goldman, writer, KO Magazine: “Should Hamed ultimately forsake his WBO belt to go after another title, it won’t be because he suddenly decided the WBO belt was beneath his dignity. It will be because he’s run out of ways to duck Marquez.”

Teddy Atlas, ringside analyst, ESPN: “Juan Manuel Marquez is a very good fighter. You can tell how good he is by the way Naseem Hamed won’t fight him.”

Anymore rebuttals for this debate?

---

Hang on a minute. There's more to the story than that.

1. Marquez TURNED DOWN the Naz fight in 2000. Fact.

2. Marquez wasn't a BIG name back when he was the WBO mandatory. HBO weren't interested in him.

It's the WBO that treated Marquez unfairly.

Boxing Coverage updated 24/7 at MaxBoxing.com

;)

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Markusdarkus

Quote:

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Naseem Hamed? The same Hamed that didn't fight Juan Manuel Marquez?

---

Hamed ducked no-one.

---

Markus, you blow my mind! After seeing your posts and how you get defensive on fighters you like is appaulling! Seriously...you believe Hamed never ducked Marquez?!?!

Boxingfanatics.com
This one is a long article but it says "He quickly climbed his way up the rankings with wins over Julian Wheeler, Darryl Pickney, and Agapito Sanchez, until he finally became the WBO Featherweight #1 contender. Soon, he became known as the fighter Naseem Hamed shamelessly ducked for 22 months. Tired of waiting for a crack at The Prince, Marquez moved on..."

ESPN - The champ most avoid meets king without a crown - Boxing
In this article Rafael says, "When Naseem Hamed was featherweight champ, he ducked Marquez for years, even when he became the mandatory challenger."

Hamed Under Fire | British Boxing Heroes
In this article:

Bruce Williams, writer, Boxing Update: “Juan Manuel Marquez was screwed out of his too-long-overdue mandatory with WBO feather champ Naseem Hamed, who didn’t even have the huevos to come to Puerto Rico and make his own appeal for more dispensations to seek world title unifiers.

Ivan Goldman, writer, KO Magazine: “Should Hamed ultimately forsake his WBO belt to go after another title, it won’t be because he suddenly decided the WBO belt was beneath his dignity. It will be because he’s run out of ways to duck Marquez.”

Teddy Atlas, ringside analyst, ESPN: “Juan Manuel Marquez is a very good fighter. You can tell how good he is by the way Naseem Hamed won’t fight him.”

Anymore rebuttals for this debate?

---

Check out the kind of level Marquez was operating at circa 1997 -2001. He fought a list of nobodies and lost to the only A grade fighter he faced. He didn't deserve a shot. And what on earth had he done that would make Hamed (who fought MAB) Duck him.

JMM is a legend, but at the time we are talking about I don't get it!

Zab is one guy who comes to mind. There are plenty of things you can criticize Zab for, but one thing you have to give him credit for is that he's willing to fight anyone/anywhere.

Sweatpea Fought The Very Best

Not 100% on these but they've not been mentioned yet, thought I'd throw them in.

Marvin Hagler.
Mike Tyson.

Jerry Quarry, not in taking fights,and certainly not in the ring;D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CutMeMick

Food for thought...

Lopez did not fight Carbajal, Gonzalez. Ducked or just part of history?
ODLH did not fight "Maestrito" Lopez. Ducked or just part of history?
Sanchez did not fight Pedroza. Ducked or just part of history?


I gotta laugh at the SRR ducked Burley.
A man who fought all the way to LHW and had 200 fights.
That one I think is just part of history...

---

Sanchez supposedly ducking Pedroza was just apart of history, Sanchez would have fought him had he not died tragically.

Mick i brought this up in another thread about Lopez not fighting Carbajal, Gonzalez, and i seem to remember you bringing up a legit argument for that ?

When i said SRR was ducking Burley that was a bit of sarcasm, but there are still strong rumors to suggest than SRR did indeed avoid Burley. As did many fighters at that time.

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Originally Posted by Fenster

Quote:

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Markusdarkus

Hamed ducked no-one.

---

Markus, you blow my mind! After seeing your posts and how you get defensive on fighters you like is appaulling! Seriously...you believe Hamed never ducked Marquez?!?!

Boxingfanatics.com
This one is a long article but it says "He quickly climbed his way up the rankings with wins over Julian Wheeler, Darryl Pickney, and Agapito Sanchez, until he finally became the WBO Featherweight #1 contender. Soon, he became known as the fighter Naseem Hamed shamelessly ducked for 22 months. Tired of waiting for a crack at The Prince, Marquez moved on..."

ESPN - The champ most avoid meets king without a crown - Boxing
In this article Rafael says, "When Naseem Hamed was featherweight champ, he ducked Marquez for years, even when he became the mandatory challenger."

Hamed Under Fire | British Boxing Heroes
In this article:

Bruce Williams, writer, Boxing Update: “Juan Manuel Marquez was screwed out of his too-long-overdue mandatory with WBO feather champ Naseem Hamed, who didn’t even have the huevos to come to Puerto Rico and make his own appeal for more dispensations to seek world title unifiers.

Ivan Goldman, writer, KO Magazine: “Should Hamed ultimately forsake his WBO belt to go after another title, it won’t be because he suddenly decided the WBO belt was beneath his dignity. It will be because he’s run out of ways to duck Marquez.”

Teddy Atlas, ringside analyst, ESPN: “Juan Manuel Marquez is a very good fighter. You can tell how good he is by the way Naseem Hamed won’t fight him.”

Anymore rebuttals for this debate?

---

Hang on a minute. There's more to the story than that.

1. Marquez TURNED DOWN the Naz fight in 2000. Fact.

2. Marquez wasn't a BIG name back when he was the WBO mandatory. HBO weren't interested in him.

It's the WBO that treated Marquez unfairly.

Boxing Coverage updated 24/7 at MaxBoxing.com

;)

---

Them turning the fight down in 2000 was about Nacho being spiteful not because they were afraid to fight.

I'll take he wasn't a big name back then. But I honestly do believe he was ducked...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Markusdarkus

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by caleoh12

Naseem Hamed? The same Hamed that didn't fight Juan Manuel Marquez?

---

Hamed ducked no-one.

---

Markus, you blow my mind! After seeing your posts and how you get defensive on fighters you like is appaulling! Seriously...you believe Hamed never ducked Marquez?!?!

Boxingfanatics.com
This one is a long article but it says "He quickly climbed his way up the rankings with wins over Julian Wheeler, Darryl Pickney, and Agapito Sanchez, until he finally became the WBO Featherweight #1 contender. Soon, he became known as the fighter Naseem Hamed shamelessly ducked for 22 months. Tired of waiting for a crack at The Prince, Marquez moved on..."

ESPN - The champ most avoid meets king without a crown - Boxing
In this article Rafael says, "When Naseem Hamed was featherweight champ, he ducked Marquez for years, even when he became the mandatory challenger."

Hamed Under Fire | British Boxing Heroes
In this article:

Bruce Williams, writer, Boxing Update: “Juan Manuel Marquez was screwed out of his too-long-overdue mandatory with WBO feather champ Naseem Hamed, who didn’t even have the huevos to come to Puerto Rico and make his own appeal for more dispensations to seek world title unifiers.

Ivan Goldman, writer, KO Magazine: “Should Hamed ultimately forsake his WBO belt to go after another title, it won’t be because he suddenly decided the WBO belt was beneath his dignity. It will be because he’s run out of ways to duck Marquez.”

Teddy Atlas, ringside analyst, ESPN: “Juan Manuel Marquez is a very good fighter. You can tell how good he is by the way Naseem Hamed won’t fight him.”

Anymore rebuttals for this debate?

---

I dont like Hamed! lol. Fact is the WBO refused to make Marques his mandatory and big money was else where.

Felix Trinidad
Oscar De La Hoya
Evander Holyfield
Julio Caesar Chavez
Roberto Duran
Tommy Hearns
Ray Leonard
Shane Mosley
Miguel Cotto
Marvin Hagler
Pernell Whitaker
Mike Tyson
Lennox Lewis
Marco Antonio Barrera
Zab Judah


Damn there are so many names

Quote:

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fenster

Quote:

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Originally Posted by caleoh12

Markus, you blow my mind! After seeing your posts and how you get defensive on fighters you like is appaulling! Seriously...you believe Hamed never ducked Marquez?!?!

Boxingfanatics.com
This one is a long article but it says "He quickly climbed his way up the rankings with wins over Julian Wheeler, Darryl Pickney, and Agapito Sanchez, until he finally became the WBO Featherweight #1 contender. Soon, he became known as the fighter Naseem Hamed shamelessly ducked for 22 months. Tired of waiting for a crack at The Prince, Marquez moved on..."

ESPN - The champ most avoid meets king without a crown - Boxing
In this article Rafael says, "When Naseem Hamed was featherweight champ, he ducked Marquez for years, even when he became the mandatory challenger."

Hamed Under Fire | British Boxing Heroes
In this article:

Bruce Williams, writer, Boxing Update: “Juan Manuel Marquez was screwed out of his too-long-overdue mandatory with WBO feather champ Naseem Hamed, who didn’t even have the huevos to come to Puerto Rico and make his own appeal for more dispensations to seek world title unifiers.

Ivan Goldman, writer, KO Magazine: “Should Hamed ultimately forsake his WBO belt to go after another title, it won’t be because he suddenly decided the WBO belt was beneath his dignity. It will be because he’s run out of ways to duck Marquez.”

Teddy Atlas, ringside analyst, ESPN: “Juan Manuel Marquez is a very good fighter. You can tell how good he is by the way Naseem Hamed won’t fight him.”

Anymore rebuttals for this debate?

---

Hang on a minute. There's more to the story than that.

1. Marquez TURNED DOWN the Naz fight in 2000. Fact.

2. Marquez wasn't a BIG name back when he was the WBO mandatory. HBO weren't interested in him.

It's the WBO that treated Marquez unfairly.

Boxing Coverage updated 24/7 at MaxBoxing.com

;)

---

Them turning the fight down in 2000 was about Nacho being spiteful not because they were afraid to fight.

I'll take he wasn't a big name back then. But I honestly do believe he was ducked...

---

Spiteful? Could be, Nacho has made some shocking career choices on Marquez behalf.

But it's not like Naz needed Marquez, is it?

So.. i would say it was either stupid or sensible. If Marquez and Nacho believed they could beat Naz, then why turn down half-a-million (a HUGE payday for Marquez)? That's just stupid.

If they thought they weren't ready for Naz, then turning down the fight is clearly sensible. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by leftylee

What about Ricky Hatton ?

Or does Junior Twitter count against him :rolleyes:

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He ducked Miguel Cotto.... Well they ducked each other really. They were both guided so, you know...


Btw has anyone got the stones to mention the Pretty one? ;D

Juan LaPorte:

How about a fighter that "ONLY" fought HOF Salvador Sanchez, HOF Eusebio Pedroza, HOF Wilfredo Gomez, HOF Barry McGuigan, Future HOF Julio Cesar Chavez, Future HOF Kostya Tszyu, HOF Azumah Nelson, Ex World Champ Rocky Lockridge, Ex World Champ John John Molina, Ex World Champ Zack Padilla, Ex World Champ Billy Costello, Ex World Champ Charles Murray.... besides EX World Title Challengers Ruben Castillo, Dwight Pratchet, Johnny de la Rosa, Lupe Suarez, Hector Lopez,.... beat some and NEVER NEVER NEVER was knocked off his feet!!! Who? Juan "Tony" La Porte, that's 'WHO'!!!! Laporte faced them all. Had alot of class. NEVER a bad word, NEVER a trash talker, NEVER belittled his victims, NEVER a bad influence on the younger fighters, ... AND NEVER KNOCKED OFF HIS FEET. Spends his days training youngsters in the Bronx. A real 'good guy' of the sport

Won't go all ape shit on this...

Do me a favor and someone check who was Naz #1 challenger and who held the WBO NABO title which is the title that's held by the closest/#1 challenger to their title... :)

It's a well known fact JMM should have fought Naz.
Naz turned it down and after JMM lost to Norwood THEN and only then did Naz return the offer.

But anyway regardless of how it went JMMs legacy and continious career has overshowed everything that went bad for him in the past.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CutMeMick

Won't go all ape shit on this...

Do me a favor and someone check who was Naz #1 challenger and who held the WBO NABO title which is the title that's held by the closest/#1 challenger to their title... :)

It's a well known fact JMM should have fought Naz.
Naz turned it down and after JMM lost to Norwood THEN and only then did Naz return the offer.

But anyway regardless of how it went JMMs legacy and continious career has overshowed everything that went bad for him in the past.

---

But why did Marquez then turn down Naz?

It don't make sense :-\

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jimafee

Quote:

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Originally Posted by leftylee

What about Ricky Hatton ?

Or does Junior Twitter count against him :rolleyes:

---

He ducked Miguel Cotto.... Well they ducked each other really. They were both guided so, you know...


Btw has anyone got the stones to mention the Pretty one? ;D

---

It's a shame Cotto and Hatton didn't meet at 140 but like you said Cotto was being guided and groomed perfectly to flourish as a Welterweight. Hatton was champion so I would have liked him to persue Cotto.

Mayweather did well at 130-135. As he moved up he really bacame more business oriented. He prepared himself for retirment and judging by his last two fights he did a hell of a job. Although there is a rumor that he's coming back for money.

Floyd really did have a hell of a chance to cement a legacy for himself at 140 after he beat Corley and demolished Gatti. A victory over Hatton would have looked much better had it happened at 140lbs for the Linear title at that weight.

Filipino Roger Monserto (0-6)

Medgen Sinsurat 55-5
Chatchai Sasakul 60-3
Ratnchaie Sor Vorapin 69-9
Medgoen Singsurat 45-4
Medgoen Singsurat 42-4

He fought Sod Looknongyangtoy, 36-2, in his last fight.

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned Glen Johnson. The Road Warrior has always sought the best, IMO.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAWGSWIN

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned Glen Johnson. The Road Warrior has always sought the best, IMO.

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He ducked Calzaghe for years ;D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jimafee

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAWGSWIN

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned Glen Johnson. The Road Warrior has always sought the best, IMO.

---

He ducked Calzaghe for years ;D

---

LOL classic;D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by irons

Not 100% on these but they've not been mentioned yet, thought I'd throw them in.

Marvin Hagler.
Mike Tyson.

---

Agreed with Hagler fo'sure.

But in my opinion Mike Tyson pretty much ducked all the good heavyweights of the 90's aside from Lewis and Holyfield, both of whom whipped his ass.

And I'm a Tyson fan.

Lot of old fighters -

Harry Greb
Maxie Rosenbloom
Barbados Joe Walcott
Sam Langford
Joe Grim
Battling Nelson
Joe Gans
Archie Moore
Fritzie Zivic
Henry Armstrong

etc etc

Love him or hate him...no denying that Delahoya's resume is pretty damn good.

Froch
Whitaker
Hearns
Hagler
Duran
Cotto
Benitez
Sanchez
Napoles
Greb
Burley and the entire Murderers row crew
Ali
Wilde
Ambers
Pep
Langford
Arguello
Gans
Gharles
Foster
Louis
Marciano
Saldivar
Olivares
Lopez
Tito
Saddler
Walker
Jofre

Ricardo Mayorga never ducked anyone.

Unfortunately my boy forgot to duck in many of his fights as well...:-\

Pongsaklek Wongjongkam never ducked anyone. That man only ever fought the best.

harrison

Arturo Gatti!!