Re: The one fight that got away
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Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
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Originally Posted by
bzkfn
Add Trinidad and Mayorga to that list as well. All 6 of those made 147/154 very entertaining to watch.
Add Vernon Forrest in as well then. Just on this whole why Oscar thing, people always say that he didn't duck the best, but in truth he never fought any of the best guys at 147 or 154 if they weren't bringing a load of cash. That's cool it is a business after all, but it gets on my nerves when people say he always went after the best, then he should of focused on fighting one of Forrest or Winky at 154 at some point this decade. He always went after the Pound For Pound champ (Shane, B-Hop, PBF, Pac) because of the money it brought rather than fight legitimate threats around those weights. I'm a big fan of Oscar but it seems since he retired people are looking at him through rose-tinted spectacles. Personally I give Mosley the most credit, I think he was always a weight division behind Trinidad (ie Shane 135:Tito 147, Shane 147: Tito 154, Shane 154: Tito 160) and that's why that never happened.
certainly did
people moaned about oscar fighting sturm despite the fact oscar was moving up the weights, had just been beat and was fighting a current world champion for his title :confused::confused::confused:
Other than that ODLH has pretty much gone after the best all the time much like gatti did despite the endless beatings he took!!
Disagree mate, the Sturm fight seemed about making some legacy, him being the first 6 weight world champion & all that, it was set before the fight began that he would win it. Was setting him up for a big money Hopkins fight. He's only gone after the best if it made financial sense. I mean don't get me wrong, he's been a great, but if the guy wasn't a big enough name or didn't have a title he wasn't interested.
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Add Vernon Forrest in as well then. Just on this whole why Oscar thing, people always say that he didn't duck the best, but in truth he never fought any of the best guys at 147 or 154 if they weren't bringing a load of cash. That's cool it is a business after all, but it gets on my nerves when people say he always went after the best, then he should of focused on fighting one of Forrest or Winky at 154 at some point this decade. He always went after the Pound For Pound champ (Shane, B-Hop, PBF, Pac) because of the money it brought rather than fight legitimate threats around those weights. I'm a big fan of Oscar but it seems since he retired people are looking at him through rose-tinted spectacles. Personally I give Mosley the most credit, I think he was always a weight division behind Trinidad (ie Shane 135:Tito 147, Shane 147: Tito 154, Shane 154: Tito 160) and that's why that never happened.
certainly did
people moaned about oscar fighting sturm despite the fact oscar was moving up the weights, had just been beat and was fighting a current world champion for his title :confused::confused::confused:
Other than that ODLH has pretty much gone after the best all the time much like gatti did despite the endless beatings he took!!
Disagree mate, the Sturm fight seemed about making some legacy, him being the first 6 weight world champion & all that, it was set before the fight began that he would win it. Was setting him up for a big money Hopkins fight. He's only gone after the best if it made financial sense. I mean don't get me wrong, he's been a great, but if the guy wasn't a big enough name or didn't have a title he wasn't interested.
the fight was completely split down the middle 50/50 despite all these supposed conspiracy theorys i genuinely believe it was a genuine call from the 3 judges mixed with a tad of reluctancy not to score the fight for ODLH and secure a mega million hopkins-ODLH showdown
felix can count himself very unlucky...but it was no eugene williams scoring round 5 for holyfield against lewis type robbery!!
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Add Vernon Forrest in as well then. Just on this whole why Oscar thing, people always say that he didn't duck the best, but in truth he never fought any of the best guys at 147 or 154 if they weren't bringing a load of cash. That's cool it is a business after all, but it gets on my nerves when people say he always went after the best, then he should of focused on fighting one of Forrest or Winky at 154 at some point this decade. He always went after the Pound For Pound champ (Shane, B-Hop, PBF, Pac) because of the money it brought rather than fight legitimate threats around those weights. I'm a big fan of Oscar but it seems since he retired people are looking at him through rose-tinted spectacles. Personally I give Mosley the most credit, I think he was always a weight division behind Trinidad (ie Shane 135:Tito 147, Shane 147: Tito 154, Shane 154: Tito 160) and that's why that never happened.
certainly did
people moaned about oscar fighting sturm despite the fact oscar was moving up the weights, had just been beat and was fighting a current world champion for his title :confused::confused::confused:
Other than that ODLH has pretty much gone after the best all the time much like gatti did despite the endless beatings he took!!
Disagree mate, the Sturm fight seemed about making some legacy, him being the first 6 weight world champion & all that, it was set before the fight began that he would win it. Was setting him up for a big money Hopkins fight. He's only gone after the best if it made financial sense. I mean don't get me wrong, he's been a great, but if the guy wasn't a big enough name or didn't have a title he wasn't interested.
Isn't that what you want though? A fighter going after the big names and thus getting the casual fan interested in boxing? In todays boxing society, few have as many big name fights on their record as Oscar.
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bzkfn
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
certainly did
people moaned about oscar fighting sturm despite the fact oscar was moving up the weights, had just been beat and was fighting a current world champion for his title :confused::confused::confused:
Other than that ODLH has pretty much gone after the best all the time much like gatti did despite the endless beatings he took!!
Disagree mate, the Sturm fight seemed about making some legacy, him being the first 6 weight world champion & all that, it was set before the fight began that he would win it. Was setting him up for a big money Hopkins fight. He's only gone after the best if it made financial sense. I mean don't get me wrong, he's been a great, but if the guy wasn't a big enough name or didn't have a title he wasn't interested.
Isn't that what you want though? A fighter going after the big names and thus getting the casual fan interested in boxing? In todays boxing society, few have as many big name fights on their record as Oscar.
No that's definitely true, but what it meant was that guys who'd really come up the hard way like Winky didn't get the opportunities they deserved. It also created the problem that casual fans would only be interested if there was a 'superfight', generally involving Oscar. Almost no one has as many big fights on their record as Oscar, but most times these fights were all based in his favour (not a problem he's the star), and he could have given guys like Winky who were unknown outside the sport a chance. Let's face it Oscar could have fought a punchbag, and the MGM Grand would of still been packed & PPV sales through the roof. On the Sturm fight, I do feel it was a robbery, not of Holyfield-Lewis proportions, but more than other alleged robberies like ODLH-Tito. I thought Sturm was taking it handily, it just seemed that as his career went on, Oscar was always getting that bit of help from the judges (see scoring against PBF, Forbes, hell even against Pacquiao he was somehow getting given rounds). I'm having quite a random rant against him here, normally like him :confused:, I'm not even a Winky Wright fan.
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bzkfn
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Disagree mate, the Sturm fight seemed about making some legacy, him being the first 6 weight world champion & all that, it was set before the fight began that he would win it. Was setting him up for a big money Hopkins fight. He's only gone after the best if it made financial sense. I mean don't get me wrong, he's been a great, but if the guy wasn't a big enough name or didn't have a title he wasn't interested.
Isn't that what you want though? A fighter going after the big names and thus getting the casual fan interested in boxing? In todays boxing society, few have as many big name fights on their record as Oscar.
No that's definitely true, but what it meant was that guys who'd really come up the hard way like Winky didn't get the opportunities they deserved. It also created the problem that casual fans would only be interested if there was a 'superfight', generally involving Oscar. Almost no one has as many big fights on their record as Oscar, but most times these fights were all based in his favour (not a problem he's the star), and he could have given guys like Winky who were unknown outside the sport a chance. Let's face it Oscar could have fought a punchbag, and the MGM Grand would of still been packed & PPV sales through the roof. On the Sturm fight, I do feel it was a robbery, not of Holyfield-Lewis proportions, but more than other alleged robberies like ODLH-Tito. I thought Sturm was taking it handily, it just seemed that as his career went on, Oscar was always getting that bit of help from the judges (see scoring against PBF, Forbes, hell even against Pacquiao he was somehow getting given rounds). I'm having quite a random rant against him here, normally like him :confused:, I'm not even a Winky Wright fan.
I see what your saying. I think its created a problem in now that he's gone, casual fans are wondering who to watch. I don't think he invisaged Pacquiao making such a name for himself from that fight. Still, I have no problem with Oscar. Yeah he avoided Winky, but he fought everyone else and considering the number of fights he has on his record, I find it stunning how many big names are on it.
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bzkfn
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bzkfn
Isn't that what you want though? A fighter going after the big names and thus getting the casual fan interested in boxing? In todays boxing society, few have as many big name fights on their record as Oscar.
No that's definitely true, but what it meant was that guys who'd really come up the hard way like Winky didn't get the opportunities they deserved. It also created the problem that casual fans would only be interested if there was a 'superfight', generally involving Oscar. Almost no one has as many big fights on their record as Oscar, but most times these fights were all based in his favour (not a problem he's the star), and he could have given guys like Winky who were unknown outside the sport a chance. Let's face it Oscar could have fought a punchbag, and the MGM Grand would of still been packed & PPV sales through the roof. On the Sturm fight, I do feel it was a robbery, not of Holyfield-Lewis proportions, but more than other alleged robberies like ODLH-Tito. I thought Sturm was taking it handily, it just seemed that as his career went on, Oscar was always getting that bit of help from the judges (see scoring against PBF, Forbes, hell even against Pacquiao he was somehow getting given rounds). I'm having quite a random rant against him here, normally like him :confused:, I'm not even a Winky Wright fan.
I see what your saying. I think its created a problem in now that he's gone, casual fans are wondering who to watch. I don't think he invisaged Pacquiao making such a name for himself from that fight. Still, I have no problem with Oscar. Yeah he avoided Winky, but he fought everyone else and considering the number of fights he has on his record, I find it stunning how many big names are on it.
Yeah, I was just itching to have a go at him. I think the problem we know face is that the only two really recognizable names in world boxing, Floyd Mayweather & Manny Pacquiao probably have five fights left at most between them, one of which may well be against each other. I would say to the average person in the US & UK (at least my age) Mayweather is the bigger name, partly because of his being in WWE & his association with rappers & such. I know people who know nothing about boxing (ie don't know who Oscar is in some cases) who know PBF for those reasons. Anyway its still only those two guys, and I don't see anyone who can make a global impact bar them. David Haye maybe if becomes HW champ.
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CutMeMick
Salvador Sanchez vs. Eusebio Pedroza
That's the one I always think of first. It'd be interesting. People are very quick to rank Sanchez as an ATG featherweight, but not Pedroza. Pedroza had a great title reign and fought some tough opponents. And he could box with the best of them when he wanted to, in addition to his rep for being a dirty fighter. A rep which I'd say was based on only a few fights btw.
I'd give Pedroza a pretty good chance against Sanchez.
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bzkfn
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
No that's definitely true, but what it meant was that guys who'd really come up the hard way like Winky didn't get the opportunities they deserved. It also created the problem that casual fans would only be interested if there was a 'superfight', generally involving Oscar. Almost no one has as many big fights on their record as Oscar, but most times these fights were all based in his favour (not a problem he's the star), and he could have given guys like Winky who were unknown outside the sport a chance. Let's face it Oscar could have fought a punchbag, and the MGM Grand would of still been packed & PPV sales through the roof. On the Sturm fight, I do feel it was a robbery, not of Holyfield-Lewis proportions, but more than other alleged robberies like ODLH-Tito. I thought Sturm was taking it handily, it just seemed that as his career went on, Oscar was always getting that bit of help from the judges (see scoring against PBF, Forbes, hell even against Pacquiao he was somehow getting given rounds). I'm having quite a random rant against him here, normally like him :confused:, I'm not even a Winky Wright fan.
I see what your saying. I think its created a problem in now that he's gone, casual fans are wondering who to watch. I don't think he invisaged Pacquiao making such a name for himself from that fight. Still, I have no problem with Oscar. Yeah he avoided Winky, but he fought everyone else and considering the number of fights he has on his record, I find it stunning how many big names are on it.
Yeah, I was just itching to have a go at him. I think the problem we know face is that the only two really recognizable names in world boxing, Floyd Mayweather & Manny Pacquiao probably have five fights left at most between them, one of which may well be against each other. I would say to the average person in the US & UK (at least my age) Mayweather is the bigger name, partly because of his being in WWE & his association with rappers & such. I know people who know nothing about boxing (ie don't know who Oscar is in some cases) who know PBF for those reasons. Anyway its still only those two guys, and I don't see anyone who can make a global impact bar them. David Haye maybe if becomes HW champ.
If they didn't know who ODLH is, then the man supplying there bomb shelter/commune must have been the one to tell them of PBF.
Re: The one fight that got away
bet most of my mates dont know who ODH?:o
Re: The one fight that got away
One from left field:
It would of cost us Holmes/SpinksI and Hearns/Hagler, but what about Tommy Hearns Vs Michael Spinks at 175 in 85?
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Britkid
One from left field:
It would of cost us Holmes/SpinksI and Hearns/Hagler, but what about Tommy Hearns Vs Michael Spinks at 175 in 85?
Sorry bud losing Hearns v Hagler killed your dream fight ;)
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CGM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CutMeMick
Salvador Sanchez vs. Eusebio Pedroza
That's the one I always think of first. It'd be interesting. People are very quick to rank Sanchez as an ATG featherweight, but not Pedroza. Pedroza had a great title reign and fought some tough opponents. And he could box with the best of them when he wanted to, in addition to his rep for being a dirty fighter. A rep which I'd say was based on only a few fights btw.
I'd give Pedroza a pretty good chance against Sanchez.
I was inclined to agree with you until i re watched Sanchez V Wilfredo Gomez and Azumah Nelson.
Re: The one fight that got away
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pacman79
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Britkid
One from left field:
It would of cost us Holmes/SpinksI and Hearns/Hagler, but what about Tommy Hearns Vs Michael Spinks at 175 in 85?
Sorry bud losing Hearns v Hagler killed your dream fight ;)
LOL, sure it was a huge price to pay, but Tommy still could of come down to 160 in 86.
And lets remember Hagler was even more damaged going into the Mugabi fight, whilst Tommy showed against Shuler [rip], he still was the Hitman.
Re: The one fight that got away
Morales vs. Marquez Duh!:cool:
