Printable View
The 24/7 shows were all shown before fight night. How could it show something that happened on fight night?Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Think so.. can't really remember.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise24/7 showed Hatton getting his hands wrapped and Floyd not being there?Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Pretty sure they said Floyd had been showing up late for training.
err.. what? I'm talking about training not fight night. Gym shots. 24/7 said Floyd had been showing up late for training.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent DemiseThe 24/7 shows were all shown before fight night. How could it show something that happened on fight night?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterThink so.. can't really remember.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Pretty sure they said Floyd had been showing up late for training.
The night of the fight it was revealed Floyd showed up late on that night. But problems in the camp were well known by then.
I was referring to them crying about Mayweather not showing up until Hatton was getting his hands wrapped.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenstererr.. what? I'm talking about training not fight night. Gym shots. 24/7 said Floyd had been showing up late for training.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent DemiseThe 24/7 shows were all shown before fight night. How could it show something that happened on fight night?Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
The night of the fight it was revealed Floyd showed up late on that night. But problems in the camp were well known by then.
ahrr righto.. I thought you meant the training in the build-up.. Wires crossed. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent DemiseI was referring to them crying about Mayweather not showing up until Hatton was getting his hands wrapped.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenstererr.. what? I'm talking about training not fight night. Gym shots. 24/7 said Floyd had been showing up late for training.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
The night of the fight it was revealed Floyd showed up late on that night. But problems in the camp were well known by then.
Exactly, it's interesting how many lesser fighters manage without their trainer there for handwraps, in fact sometimes for the whole fight. An example, Ola Afolabi went into his fight with Enzo Maccarinelli as a heavy underdog & without a Freddie Roach in his corner yet still knocked him out. Why? Because a good fighter copes, & is able to follow instructions & doesn't need to be spoon-fed. So, as the legend in his own mind that Hatton is, he surely should've been able to cope without Floyd nursing him through getting his handwraps & its still no excuse for ignoring instructions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent DemiseIt should be no reason. Like I said Ricky's been a pro long enough. He doesn't need his trainer present while he's getting his hands wrapped. It's obvious this is some lame ass attempt at damage control. Trying to shift a little blame onto Floyd. Nobody would even of known there was "alleged" problems in camp or that Floyd was late if it wasn't for the Hatton camp. Why bring it up? Accept that the relationship didn't work and move on. In case Ricky has forgotten. He went to Floyd. Floyd didn't go to him. Ricky needs to take his loss like a man and not like a biitch. A crying biitch. Him and Cintron must be relatedQuote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
not the primary reason no
but small things can all add up and it was quite clear on the night ricky was not in the right frame of mind
Also, I like this quote of Hatton's from that BBC piece before the PBF fight.
Hatton said: "In his first fight, was Castillo's footwork as good as Ricky Hatton's? Was his body punching as good? Is he as big a hitter? Does he have as much boxing ability? "I would have to say no to all of them. I think even in his prime I am better in every department."
I know who I think deserves to be in Canastota more, although no doubt most would favour Hatton, as the more popular fighter
Thats ridiculous and preposterous Steelie!!!! How was Ricky undertrained and not prepared? I know you guys get the inside track on Hattons official forum but Ricky is full of excuses in both losses or should I say 3 with Colazzo.Quote:
Originally Posted by steelie
You mean to tell me that on the biggest fight of Ricky's career, the redemption after the floyd KO, he wasnt prepared? Seriously?????
So Graham is a chump because Floyd Ko'd him
Mayweather sr is a chump because Pac knocked him 10 shades of out.
1) Did Ricky move his head.... NO
2) Did Ricky Jab his way in...... NO
3) Did Ricky look scared after the 1st Pac right hook... Yes
4) Did Ricky become unraveled and bottled it hoping to walk into a KO punch because he wasnt willing to go to war with Pac.... Yes
Ricky and his family need to suck it up and take accountability for his losses and stop blaming people.
Mayweather Sr is an easy target do to his ebonics, slurring and flamboyancy but the man knows the sport well, and even if he was 5 min late here and there, Iam sure Ricky could have jumped rope or hit the heavy bag while he was waiting:rolleyes:
Jesus could have trained Ricky Hatton and it wouldn't have helped....Manny just owned him that's all there is to it.
It was the ground beef taco's fault why Ricky got ktfo. Floyd Sr is clean. Hatton obuiously completely underestimated Pac's power. He had no respect at all.
...and really who thought Ricky could be changed so dramatically after 1 damn fight?!?!?! Let's be honest, it took Oscar De la Hoya a LOOONG time to get used to fighting the way Floyd Sr. trained and before he got used to it he just got by on his own skill....look at the Vargas fight, Oscar damn near lost trying to use Floyd's techniques which Oscar hadn't perfected yet and if Oscar didn't revert back into the old warrior De la Hoya he would have lost. And De la Hoya comes from a much higher boxing pedigree than Ricky Hatton, I'm not hating on Ricky, I'm just saying it even took Oscar a long time to pick up that system.
I thought Ricky might be taught to BOX a bit more but that just ain't his style, he's a pressure fighter and he's at home when he can attack at will and guys who can fire back faster, stronger, and straighter are not his friends.
There semmed to be a bit of disrepect on both parts. When your'e the head trainer, people expect you to guide the fighter to victory. Start to finish. Arriving late and leaving early aren't really good form.
That being said, when the head trainer runs the camp. He makes the decisions, no questions asked. The few things I got from the 24/7 and things that have been said since the fight is.
- Floyd Sr. is used to a fighter with the athletic abilities on par (well, close) with his son. Training star fighters who have the ability on tap to follow his instructions and get it right the first time is almost a requirement. That doesn't make a guy a trainer as much as it makes him a strategist.
- Ricky thought just having Mayweather there made him instantly better. There was still an employer/employee thing going on that gave ricky and whoever had his ear, ultimate parity in the decisions. Thats fine. He pays the money, he can ultimately decide to hire or fire. But still the head trainer runs the camp. If you like what hes teaching, commit to it, learn it and practice it. If you don't, fire him and get someone else who can have your focus 100%. You can't really pick and choose the things you like and disregard the rest or turn the guy off and bring in someone else and then half@$$ what that guy teaches you too.(most trainers dont bring a few tactics, punches or methods...but systems)
-Disrespect brings disrespect. If I am the head trainer and you dont listen, I have nothing left to tell you. Why bother showing up on time so you can ignore me. Its not me that will be getting my head caved in if you slack, fail to focus and then fail to execute. There are other people willing to pay for my time.-- On the flipside of that, the fighters seeing that the trainer shows up when he wants and doesnt feel like they are in it together. He getting his money anyway, so I should be able to change the equation where and how i feel like it as long as he still gets paid. Ultimately its a money equation and both guys felt like they did enough to get their money. Floyd sr. in the corner and Hatton in the ring. The consequences are steeper for Hatton and he should have made sure he was getting his moneys worth (either by listening to his trainer or hiring someone in his place that he was more comfortable with... enough at least to stick to a plan and execute it to get within reach of victory).
- Some fighters and trainers build special relationships. Others well... Its a business relationship and works better that way. The trainer doesnt want to be a father and the fighter wants to be able to separate work from play and not have the trainer hovering over their every move.... so they keep it strictly professional. Sounds like like floyd was a little disappointed in how well Hatton could follow his plans and Ricky was dissapointed in Floyd not fitting in the mold of his last trainer.
Glad a Hatton fan realized that Ricky lost bigtime to PAC mainly because he doesn't have the right frame of mind...Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by Violent DemiseRicky's been in the game long enough to know what to do before a fight. To say Floyd's actions had anything to do with Hatton getting knocked the fukk out even in the slightest is stupid. Why are they even brought up?Quote:
Originally Posted by XaduBoxer
not the primary reason no
but small things can all add up and it was quite clear on the night ricky was not in the right frame of mind
I said it before the the fight that Ricky has the wrong mentality as early as the fight was signed in January/February and this could be the reason of his downfall...
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Undisputed
very good points.
If I don't have trust in my trainer I'm not going to do what he says 100%. If they seem I'm not committed they can feel frustrated with my actions in the gym.
It is two way but damn, find out whether you can work together well in advance of your biggest fight.
FDloyd Sr. is a classless asshole, he deserves a little of the blame, but Hatton is just over the hill he is the same anymore. Hatton didn't follow the gameplan and Pacquiao was just too quick. Hatton didn't jab and move his head and he wasn't patient. It was clear from the beggining that Pacquiao was respecting power and agression. Hatton didn't respect Pacquiao's speed and power. As soon as Hatton got knocked down he should have told himself that ok this guy is going to be tough I'm not at my peak anymore and I need to start trying to box this dude. He didn't and he and his fans payed the price for it.
You're missing the point, mon ami. I'm not blaming Floyd for the loss, nor am I saying the outcome would of been any different had he had a 100% perfect trainging camp. I'm saying that Floyd takes no responsibility for the loss, at all. I put it to you again that he would be telling all and sundry he was the mastermind behind it all had Ricky caught Manny cold.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockThats ridiculous and preposterous Steelie!!!! How was Ricky undertrained and not prepared? I know you guys get the inside track on Hattons official forum but Ricky is full of excuses in both losses or should I say 3 with Colazzo.Quote:
Originally Posted by steelie
You mean to tell me that on the biggest fight of Ricky's career, the redemption after the floyd KO, he wasnt prepared? Seriously?????
So Graham is a chump because Floyd Ko'd him
Mayweather sr is a chump because Pac knocked him 10 shades of out.
1) Did Ricky move his head.... NO
2) Did Ricky Jab his way in...... NO
3) Did Ricky look scared after the 1st Pac right hook... Yes
4) Did Ricky become unraveled and bottled it hoping to walk into a KO punch because he wasnt willing to go to war with Pac.... Yes
Ricky and his family need to suck it up and take accountability for his losses and stop blaming people.
Mayweather Sr is an easy target do to his ebonics, slurring and flamboyancy but the man knows the sport well, and even if he was 5 min late here and there, Iam sure Ricky could have jumped rope or hit the heavy bag while he was waiting:rolleyes:
It's his hypocrisy, not the manner of the loss, that I take umbridge with.
My sincerest apologies than. I had become a fan of Ricky's a few years back and I dont see the shame in losing to the past 2 PFP#1'sQuote:
Originally Posted by SteelieYou're missing the point, mon ami. I'm not blaming Floyd for the loss, nor am I saying the outcome would of been any different had he had a 100% perfect trainging camp. I'm saying that Floyd takes no responsibility for the loss, at all. I put it to you again that he would be telling all and sundry he was the mastermind behind it all had Ricky caught Manny cold.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockThats ridiculous and preposterous Steelie!!!! How was Ricky undertrained and not prepared? I know you guys get the inside track on Hattons official forum but Ricky is full of excuses in both losses or should I say 3 with Colazzo.Quote:
Originally Posted by steelie
You mean to tell me that on the biggest fight of Ricky's career, the redemption after the floyd KO, he wasnt prepared? Seriously?????
So Graham is a chump because Floyd Ko'd him
Mayweather sr is a chump because Pac knocked him 10 shades of out.
1) Did Ricky move his head.... NO
2) Did Ricky Jab his way in...... NO
3) Did Ricky look scared after the 1st Pac right hook... Yes
4) Did Ricky become unraveled and bottled it hoping to walk into a KO punch because he wasnt willing to go to war with Pac.... Yes
Ricky and his family need to suck it up and take accountability for his losses and stop blaming people.
Mayweather Sr is an easy target do to his ebonics, slurring and flamboyancy but the man knows the sport well, and even if he was 5 min late here and there, Iam sure Ricky could have jumped rope or hit the heavy bag while he was waiting:rolleyes:
It's his hypocrisy, not the manner of the loss, that I take umbridge with.
Just feel like Ricky and his camp should be more graceful in defeat, just seems like a huge insecurity and damage control.
IMO I feel no matter the weight or the trainer, Ricky could never outbox Floyd jr. I was 100% convinced Ricky would maul and grind Pac down. I know he has a bout of Red a$$ and embarrassment but I feel like it rubs poo on Ricky's nice guy persona when the excuses come a flying
This stuff is hillarious, during the 24/7 and all that crap, everyone was hyped, floyd and ricky looked great, hell they even had time to crack jokes, learn about the cops and kool aid, wear thongs so on and so forth. No one had a problem. But after ??!!!......look everyone looses. It cracks me up how fans act after a loss, like they thought it could never happen. Even i'm not all that excited about the little floyd coming back and potshot/countering marquez all night but damn if pac was off all this time would he jump right in with floyd that had been fighting this whole time ? He deserves a easy fight. Hell all this pac floyd talk is way premature anyways, pac could get beat by shane and all everyone will do is erase pac's name and put in shane's and re-post. Whoa i'm getting off topic, anyhow bottom line floyd did his job gave hatton the tools, hatton got in the ring took his tool belt off said screw it got ko'ed fight over. I can't belive anyone really expected floyd sr to be bedside feeding him applesauce after.
Floyd Mayweather Sr had nothing to do with Ricky losing this fight.
I said in January when the fight was announced that Ricky had no chance. But I UNDERSTOOD why he had to fight Pac.
Ricky's mission in life was redemption at Floyd Jr. He had exactly one avenue to secure a rematch: Beat Manny Pacquaio. So even though myself and much of the boxing world, (and likely Ricky himself) knew the fight was not winnable, you tell me what other choice he had to avenge his loss?
Whoever said "Jesus could have trained Ricky and it wouldnt have mattered" was spot on. This whole fight boiled down basically to 'could Ricky land some crazy body shot from nowhere and crumple Manny?'.
He was never in it, and as much as I hate to say it, since Im a MASSIVE Hatton fan, I dont really rate Ricky much higher than Arturo Gatti. Both guys are a ball to watch fight, and when you put them in with other scrappers of equal caliber its a joy to behold.
Put either against any type of elite fighter, and its game over.
Ricky peaked against Kostya and headbutted his way through many defenses after. I knew floyd woudl beat him, I knew pac would beat him. But he had no choice but to fight both.
its funny how people say ricky wasn't jabbing when he is coming in...
ricky actually landed a jab coming in right on pacs face at the same moment pac was throwing and knocking hatton out cold.
Just cause ricky look horrible didn't mean he didn't try the things he was suppose to do. NOthing worked for him because pac was too fast and ricky couldn't take pacs power. end of.
It really didn't matter who rickys trainier was, hell oscar had like 10 trainiers on his corner when he fought pac. did it help?
for f*** sake just blame pac on what happen to ricky...
Pac use right roll under all the time.. hell ricky knows thats 1 of the secret recipe.. i blame pac for putting ricky to sleep without warning using his devastating left hand.. by the way i also blame floyd jr for making ricky's punch resistance gone and crack his chin 1 year ago.. damn..
Seems like there are a lot of people here jumping in saying Floyd Sr. had no blame in Ricky's lose.
He get's "part" of the blame just like every other member of Hatton's team.
He accepted the job and proclaimed load and clear in a boastful manner that his fighter "Ricky Hatton" would be ready. He wasn't!
He even stated it doesn't matter if Ricky uses his jab or not Pacquiao can't handle Ricky's pressure.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cub8gpQmL34
He get's what he gets! :pissing:
At the end of the day the fighter shows up to get prepared for a fight. The fighter and his trainer develop a plan for the fight while getting into shape. The plan, if it works correctly, becomes instinctual and is carried out by the fighter as a reflex from all of the hard work in the gym. This is no different than our military practicing over and over to "condition" certain behavior under battle conditions. While Ricky Hatton did get knocked out by Manny it was clear that the game plan (if there really was one) was not ingrained into Ricky as it should have been by Floydd Sr... While so many are quick to point out that Ricky was his own worst enemy, Ricky did come into camp in very good shape and all that was really needed was a good fight plan and lot's of practice with that plan. Maybe Ricky is unable to "change" as so many have pointed out, but for Floydd to so quickly throw Ricky Hatton under the bus is ridiculous. Just as ridiculous as it would have been for Floydd to take all of the credit if Ricky had won the fight.
The Promoter