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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Lewis was scared in the Holyfield fight???! what Utter rubbish, Holyfield was the one who did not want to get hit flush by Lewis and fought two defensive fights staying in close not wanting to be hit from long range.
Mike was nocking everyone out in 1988 sure, I've seen all of Mikes fights, and I see Lewis winning 60% of the time if they fought. When ever anyone tied up Mike, punched him back, was not scared by his bullyboy tactics. Mike lost heart, and I think the punching power of lewis would have broke Mikes heart and focus.
The victories over Holmes and tucker were hardly impressive either, Holmes was ring rusty and old. Michael spinks is the only one that is impressive out of the three really.
I think you really have somthing against Lewis Ross, you're not that Cowardzage person off youtube are you?
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Lewis wins hands up.
Lewis size mixed with the Kronk Style is one of the worst thing ever for Mike. I could see Lewis frustrating him with his piston like jab and grabbing him when Tyson would be able to close the distance,doing so for 4-5 rounds (as Tyson was known to spend a lot of gaz and to fade a bit passed the fifth) and then mixing up the jab with even more power shots. It would be a very interesting match up and the HW division being the HW, one punch can make all the difference, sure Tyson could technically have"some chance" but I really believe that LEwis would win this one in a dominating fashion, especially because not only did he have a better technique and a better size but was much smarter and able to adapt in the ring than Tyson.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Snakey
Your not trying to claim Holmes was in his prime for that fight are you?
That same Holmes that Mike wiped the floor with beat Mercer 4 years later, the same fighter who Lewis got a gift decision against;D
Holmes also fought McCall and pushed him close and also didnt get knocked out like Lewis just had;D
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mctaggert
Lewis was scared in the Holyfield fight???! what Utter rubbish.
The victories over Holmes and tucker were hardly impressive either, Holmes was ring rusty and old. Michael spinks is the only one that is impressive out of the three really.
I think you really have somthing against Lewis Ross, you're not that Cowardzage person off youtube are you?
In the 5th round I think it was, Lewis had Holyfield hurt but didnt have the balls to go in and finish it.
Tucker is an impressive win. He was an undefeated defending champ. Just because I can see that Mike Tyson of 88 has a hell of lot better chance against a fighter called Lennox Lewis than anyone else is willing to give him credit for. That means I have something against him?
After taking people to court to get fights, he accepts money to not fight for a title. He didnt want it until Mike said he was retired.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Tyson beat an undefeated Tucker comfortably on points, Tucker landed an uppercut in the first round and then he could do very little afterwards except take the bombs from Tyson. Lewis was very cautious by nature and I believe he would have tried to out box Tyson from distance and hold when Tyson got in close. Tyson would have been too aggressive for him and whilst I think Lewis would survive to see the bell because of his ring experience he would lose a decision in similar fashion to Tucker.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
I think Lewis power might of stopped Tyson in its tracks Lewis was a hard hitting dude.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
In fantasy fights against the greatest HW champs at their peak supposedly MIke Tyson kos all of them from Ali, Lewis, Holyfield, Foreman, etc. Because when you beat guys like Trevor Berbick and blownup LHWs like Spinks and bums like Michael Jack Johnson this makes you the greatest in terms of fantasy fights.:rolleyes:
Tyson couldn't beat a 37 year old Lewis and a 34 year old Holyfield with lots of wear and tear, what makes you think he can beat the best versions of them?
And this whole crap about Mike Tyson past his prime at 23 years old with minimal wear and tear in the Douglas fight is another long line of excuses.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
I do think that some fighters get ruined after certain fights from certain fighters. Look at Vernon Forrest, if he hadnt have met Mayorga, he had just smashed the top pound for pound fighter. I also think those fits took a little from Mayorga too.
My point is, that Tucker was a very good, decent skilled heavy weight that just happened to have to defend his title against one of the most phenominal fighting machines ever.
You will see alot of people refer to Tyson in similar fashion. You will never get the same reverence and fondness for Lewis because unless a fighter pushed him, he didnt do a great deal. He certainly didnt have the same skill level as that Tyson. The one that could bob and weave and avoid being hit.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
In fantasy fights against the greatest HW champs at their peak supposedly MIke Tyson kos all of them from Ali, Lewis, Holyfield, Foreman, etc. Because when you beat guys like Trevor Berbick and blownup LHWs like Spinks and bums like Michael Jack Johnson this makes you the greatest in terms of fantasy fights.:rolleyes:
Tyson couldn't beat a 37 year old Lewis and a 34 year old Holyfield with lots of wear and tear, what makes you think he can beat the best versions of them?
And this whole crap about Mike Tyson past his prime at 23 years old with minimal wear and tear in the Douglas fight is another long line of excuses.
Everyone has peaks that was his, Lewis was when he was older, Benitez was young so was Vargas why do you find it hard to accept that was not his peak. My peak was 21 or down hill from there for me. :)
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
Expand on your last post.
Its hard to debate 1 word.:rolleyes:
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
Expand on your last post.
Its hard to debate 1 word.:rolleyes:
2009 says it all.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
Expand on your last post.
Its hard to debate 1 word.:rolleyes:
2009 says it all.
O yes:rolleyes::(:(.
I see your point.:p
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
Expand on your last post.
Its hard to debate 1 word.:rolleyes:
2009 says it all.
O yes:rolleyes::(:(.
I see your point.:p
First time iv read that on here;D
The Lewis of 99 struggled with Holyfield twice. Thats no better than what Ruiz did;D
At least Ruiz managed to win their first fight and he dropped Holyfield! So much for Lewis's big power eh;)
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
Expand on your last post.
Its hard to debate 1 word.:rolleyes:
2009 says it all.
O yes:rolleyes::(:(.
I see your point.:p
First time iv read that on here;D
The Lewis of 99 struggled with Holyfield twice. Thats no better than what Ruiz did;D
At least Ruiz managed to win their first fight and he dropped Holyfield! So much for Lewis's big power eh;)
Tyson went 19 rounds with Razor Rudock and did not come close to stopping him what ever Richard Steele thought.But Lewis took him out clean in 2 rounds.
Does this mean Lewis is a harder puncher?
No,it mean that different styles are suited to certain styles.
Also Lewis may have struggled with Holyfield twice but Tyson got beat and humilated by Holifield twice.;D
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
Expand on your last post.
Its hard to debate 1 word.:rolleyes:
2009 says it all.
O yes:rolleyes::(:(.
I see your point.:p
First time iv read that on here;D
The Lewis of 99 struggled with Holyfield twice. Thats no better than what Ruiz did;D
At least Ruiz managed to win their first fight and he dropped Holyfield! So much for Lewis's big power eh;)
Tyson went 19 rounds with Razor Rudock and did not come close to stopping him what ever Richard Steele thought.But Lewis took him out clean in 2 rounds.
Does this mean Lewis is a harder puncher?
No,it mean that different styles are suited to certain styles.
Also Lewis may have struggled with Holyfield twice but Tyson got beat and humilated by Holifield twice.;D
Right;D
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
porkypara
Have not read all the posts but I think if Tony Tucker can give Tyson a hard fight with only 1 hand then I think Lewis would beat Tyson from ANY year.
This thread comes around every year or so and starts an almighty slagging match.;D
LOL read my reply 2 posts ago about Tucker who was similar to Lewis in many ways.
Just read it.;)
Lewis of 2009 was a compleate boxer.
Every part of his game was A or A+ apart from his chin which why Tyson would alway have a small chance.
Really;D
Expand on your last post.
Its hard to debate 1 word.:rolleyes:
2009 says it all.
O yes:rolleyes::(:(.
I see your point.:p
First time iv read that on here;D
The Lewis of 99 struggled with Holyfield twice. Thats no better than what Ruiz did;D
At least Ruiz managed to win their first fight and he dropped Holyfield! So much for Lewis's big power eh;)
Tyson went 19 rounds with Razor Rudock and did not come close to stopping him what ever Richard Steele thought.But Lewis took him out clean in 2 rounds.
Does this mean Lewis is a harder puncher?
No,it mean that different styles are suited to certain styles.
Also Lewis may have struggled with Holyfield twice but Tyson got beat and humilated by Holifield twice.;D
Right;D
Your point...:confused:
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Tyson had been in jail for 3 plus years when he faced Holyfield, he had been out of boxing for various reasons for 5 plus against Lewis. Those wins don't mean all that much as Tyson was done. Tyson had years of skills erosion, whilst those other two were refining their craft. They never met at equal junctures in their careers.
Tyson beats both of them prime on prime.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Timberrrrrrrrrr Tyson by KO in 2, Lewis was as slow as a 3 toed sloth in the ring, Tyson would've been in and under and Lewis knocked out inside 2 rounds. The 86-88 Tyson was an awesome force, there were those that survived the onslaught, but they never had any intention of winning. Lewis would simply just get hit and get hit bigtime.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NuthaPug
I don't think Lewis really had a questionable chin. The fact that he got knocked out doesn't demonstrate a weak chin. Let Rahman hit anyone that hard and it doesn't take a weak chin to achieve a KO.
Lewis didn't always have the "fire in the belly" when he stepped into the ring. So he loses even when at his prime (I would consider him in his prime both when he lost to Rahman and later when he beat him) because he didn't prepare for the fight. He looked soft, doughy, lazy.
I've always thought that a prime Tyson might take out Lewis if he did it early; a prime Lewis who came sharp and prepared, and weathered the first three or four rounds, should be able to outbox and win either on decision or KO.
Tyson was probably not in best form against Douglas, but regardless, Douglas provides a template for a tall, strong heavyweight to outbox Tyson.
Im with you, also Douglas did beat Tyson fair and square full points to him massive effort and he did template how to do so in the later rounds.
Douglas was also very lucky that night if his own knock down had happened at any time other than right at the end of the round as it did ,Tyson would have finished him on rising up to face him. As it happened Douglas had the balls and heart to think; wow I've taken his best shots, Im still here, right its my turn and he went at him with no trepidation, not something Tyson was ever used to facing.
Could Lewis have dug that deep if clocked maybe the real question?
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Tyson had been in jail for 3 plus years when he faced Holyfield, he had been out of boxing for various reasons for 5 plus against Lewis. Those wins don't mean all that much as Tyson was done. Tyson had years of skills erosion, whilst those other two were refining their craft. They never met at equal junctures in their careers. Tyson beats both of them prime on prime.
:cwm13: Revisionanist history much ;D Hindsight is a wonderful thing but ya just can't have it both ways. After a "shot" Holyfield who was being called a walking dead man going in, then yes, Tysons skills had hastily eroded.
I'd have loved a prime for prime Holyfield vs Tyson...if only Mike had not backed out years earlier.
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Tyson had been in jail for 3 plus years when he faced Holyfield, he had been out of boxing for various reasons for 5 plus against Lewis. Those wins don't mean all that much as Tyson was done. Tyson had years of skills erosion, whilst those other two were refining their craft. They never met at equal junctures in their careers. Tyson beats both of them prime on prime.
:cwm13: Revisionanist history much ;D Hindsight is a wonderful thing but ya just can't have it both ways. After a "shot" Holyfield who was being called a walking dead man going in, then yes, Tysons skills had hastily eroded.
I'd have loved a prime for prime Holyfield vs Tyson...if only Mike had not backed out years earlier.
Yeah, many people were worried for Holyfield's life because he didn't look that good in the Bobby Cyz fight. Holyfield was considered to be a shot fighter with stamina and heart problems going into that 1st Tyson fight. Also Tyson was quickly regaining his aura of invincibility after knocking out 2 hw title holders in Bruno and Seldon in spectacular fashion and had 2 of the 3 hw titles.
Here's a fun fact. Jose Torres and Floyd Patterson gave the opinion that Mike Tyson would always lose to a Evander Holyfield no matter when they would have fought because Holyfield had the right style and tools to beat Tyson. 2 Cus Damato fighters said that.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Tyson had been in jail for 3 plus years when he faced Holyfield, he had been out of boxing for various reasons for 5 plus against Lewis. Those wins don't mean all that much as Tyson was done. Tyson had years of skills erosion, whilst those other two were refining their craft. They never met at equal junctures in their careers. Tyson beats both of them prime on prime.
:cwm13: Revisionanist history much ;D Hindsight is a wonderful thing but ya just can't have it both ways. After a "shot" Holyfield who was being called a walking dead man going in, then yes, Tysons skills had hastily eroded.
I'd have loved a prime for prime Holyfield vs Tyson...if only Mike had not backed out years earlier.
Yeah, many people were worried for Holyfield's life because he didn't look that good in the Bobby Cyz fight. Holyfield was considered to be a shot fighter with stamina and heart problems going into that 1st Tyson fight. Also Tyson was quickly regaining his aura of invincibility after knocking out 2 hw title holders in Bruno and Seldon in spectacular fashion and had 2 of the 3 hw titles.
Here's a fun fact. Jose Torres and Floyd Patterson gave the opinion that Mike Tyson would always lose to a Evander Holyfield no matter when they would have fought because
Holyfield had the right style and tools to beat Tyson. 2 Cus Damato fighters said that.
The fight was proposed years after Mikes skills were declining but even then, much lesser fighters were dropping Holyfield, like Bert Cooper. Mike had very fast hands, even after he stopped moving his head and if you could be hit like Holyfield, then you were in trouble.
In the first fight after a 4 year lay off, there are really only a couple of points in that fight where Mike throws combinations. In the 5th and in the 9th, I think. He lands a couple of nice combinations and Holyfield looks as much confused as he does hurt. The version from 88 would have done that the entire fight, for as long as it lasted and he certainly wouldnt have been there to be hit back.
Holufields heart problem was to to his steroid use;)
Since the Evan Fields thing cropped up, where drugs were being sent to his address and he answered the number that had been given, he hasgiven the shit excuse that the growth hormone was for his dad!!!!;D
What a twat!
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
55-45 overall in Lewis' favour I feel.
But once the first three rounds over with and Lewis was still around then that increases to 80-20 at least.
Tyson wasn't used to being in a tough fight back then. Lewis would have given him it
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
55-45 overall in Lewis' favour I feel.
But once the first three rounds over with and Lewis was still around then that increases to 80-20 at least.
Tyson wasn't used to being in a tough fight back then. Lewis would have given him it
This is something else that gets me, look at the fights Mike had that went 12 rounds back then. He didnt tire or get gift decisions. He made fighters fight scared.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
no he didn't but Lewis wouldn't have got scared.
I only remember the Tucker and Smith fights that went distance from back then. Both pretty comfortable if I remember correctly. Then there was that Green bloke who he also punched in a nightclub or something a couple of years before. Not sure how that one went but I'm guessing it was again pretty comfortable.
I just think Lewis could have done what Douglas did a couple of years earlier thats all.
But a Tyson KO inside of 30 seconds wouldnt surprise me in the slightest.
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
I just think Lewis could have done what Douglas did a couple of years earlier thats all.
But a Tyson KO inside of 30 seconds wouldnt surprise me in the slightest.
Me too, although Lewis would have controlled him rather than battered him like a man possesed.
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
I just think Lewis could have done what Douglas did a couple of years earlier thats all.
But a Tyson KO inside of 30 seconds wouldnt surprise me in the slightest.
Me too, although Lewis would have controlled him rather than battered him like a man possesed.
Lewis couldnt "control" Mercer, who hadno where near the speed or skill of Tyson. He was also alot easier to hit. This is the same Mercer that Holmes beat;D
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
I just think Lewis could have done what Douglas did a couple of years earlier thats all.
But a Tyson KO inside of 30 seconds wouldnt surprise me in the slightest.
Me too, although Lewis would have controlled him rather than battered him like a man possesed.
Lewis couldnt "control" Mercer, who hadno where near the speed or skill of Tyson. He was also alot easier to hit. This is the same Mercer that Holmes beat;D
Your right, I've changed my mind due to the fact that you keep repeating the same fucking thing over and over again.
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
I just think Lewis could have done what Douglas did a couple of years earlier thats all.
But a Tyson KO inside of 30 seconds wouldnt surprise me in the slightest.
Me too, although Lewis would have controlled him rather than battered him like a man possesed.
Lewis couldnt "control" Mercer, who hadno where near the speed or skill of Tyson. He was also alot easier to hit. This is the same Mercer that Holmes beat;D
Your right, I've changed my mind due to the fact that you keep repeating the same fucking thing over and over again.
Inception; it works! :cool:
I agree with GeneralBulldog about Holyfield. Having thought about it, I think he beats Tyson 7/10 at any point of their respective careers.
But in regards to Lewis, I have to call it 50/50.
Then again I already make an exception for Tyson. It's kinda hard to explain but obviously Lewis was more consistent where as Tyson was a short fuse so true odds are Lewis is more likely the winner but if were talking prime4prime, although Tyson's physical peak barely lasted a summer, that was still his prime and so at that point I'm more inclined to say 50/50 if not 60/40 Tyson.
I'm not making any sense, I literately have no idea?! :-\
-
Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Tyson had been in jail for 3 plus years when he faced Holyfield, he had been out of boxing for various reasons for 5 plus against Lewis. Those wins don't mean all that much as Tyson was done. Tyson had years of skills erosion, whilst those other two were refining their craft. They never met at equal junctures in their careers. Tyson beats both of them prime on prime.
:cwm13: Revisionanist history much ;D Hindsight is a wonderful thing but ya just can't have it both ways. After a "shot" Holyfield who was being called a walking dead man going in, then yes, Tysons skills had hastily eroded.
I'd have loved a prime for prime Holyfield vs Tyson...if only Mike had not backed out years earlier.
Yeah, many people were worried for Holyfield's life because he didn't look that good in the Bobby Cyz fight. Holyfield was considered to be a shot fighter with stamina and heart problems going into that 1st Tyson fight. Also Tyson was quickly regaining his aura of invincibility after knocking out 2 hw title holders in Bruno and Seldon in spectacular fashion and had 2 of the 3 hw titles.
Here's a fun fact. Jose Torres and Floyd Patterson gave the opinion that Mike Tyson would always lose to a Evander Holyfield no matter when they would have fought because
Holyfield had the right style and tools to beat Tyson. 2 Cus Damato fighters said that.
The fight was proposed years after Mikes skills were declining but even then, much lesser fighters were dropping Holyfield, like Bert Cooper. Mike had very fast hands, even after he stopped moving his head and if you could be hit like Holyfield, then you were in trouble.
In the first fight after a 4 year lay off, there are really only a couple of points in that fight where Mike throws combinations. In the 5th and in the 9th, I think. He lands a couple of nice combinations and Holyfield looks as much confused as he does hurt. The version from 88 would have done that the entire fight, for as long as it lasted and he certainly wouldnt have been there to be hit back.
Holufields heart problem was to to his steroid use;)
Since the Evan Fields thing cropped up, where drugs were being sent to his address and he answered the number that had been given, he hasgiven the shit excuse that the growth hormone was for his dad!!!!;D
What a twat!
The fight was 1st proposed in 1990 not years later when Tyson's skill was declining, let's not make stuff up.
In 1990 for a warmup fight against Douglass, Tyson got his ass whooped where Don King and Tyson fans till this day were trying to discredit Douglass as some bullshit long count. Holyfield and Tyson was suppose to fight in the fall of 1990 but Tyson got his ass ko.
And in 1991 after the 2nd RUddock fight Tyson was suppose to fight Holyfield in the fall but got a rib injury then caught a rape case.
And Styles make fights, who cares if Cooper dropped Holyfield? Holyfield was even backed by Cus D'amato fighters like Torres and Patterson that he just has Tyson's number and would kick his ass at any point in time. Even Teddy Atlas agreed with them. Tyson didn't have it to ever beat Holyfield.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by
miles
Tyson had been in jail for 3 plus years when he faced Holyfield, he had been out of boxing for various reasons for 5 plus against Lewis. Those wins don't mean all that much as Tyson was done. Tyson had years of skills erosion, whilst those other two were refining their craft. They never met at equal junctures in their careers. Tyson beats both of them prime on prime.
:cwm13: Revisionanist history much ;D Hindsight is a wonderful thing but ya just can't have it both ways. After a "shot" Holyfield who was being called a walking dead man going in, then yes, Tysons skills had hastily eroded.
I'd have loved a prime for prime Holyfield vs Tyson...if only Mike had not backed out years earlier.
Yeah, many people were worried for Holyfield's life because he didn't look that good in the Bobby Cyz fight. Holyfield was considered to be a shot fighter with stamina and heart problems going into that 1st Tyson fight. Also Tyson was quickly regaining his aura of invincibility after knocking out 2 hw title holders in Bruno and Seldon in spectacular fashion and had 2 of the 3 hw titles.
Here's a fun fact. Jose Torres and Floyd Patterson gave the opinion that Mike Tyson would always lose to a Evander Holyfield no matter when they would have fought because Holyfield had the right style and tools to beat Tyson. 2 Cus Damato fighters said that.
You are forgetting that Tyson was avoiding fighting Lewis and relinquished the WBC title so he could fight Holyfield because he thought Holyfield was an easier option and it also implied that Tyson felt he was not able to beat Lewis. Tyson was not the same fighter when he came out of jail, he had manoeuvred his way to get a title but he had nothing left.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
I'm still scratching my head on when this great erosion of skill happened in Tyson within the devistating ko of Spinks till the Douglas 1st bell a yr and few months later? Was it the 6,7 rounds in between vs chinny Williams or a deer in the headlights Bruno? I think it had more to do with finally running into a fluid mobile combination puncher who didn't shit himself when Mike yelled "boo" and had superior mental make up. All things Holyfield owned. That Cooper shot gets greatly blown out of proportion and it doesn't translate to Mike whacking him that easily if he had not pulled out. What, if it was Evander instead of Douglas vs a 'slipping' Tyson that Feb night the result would have same as well? Holyfield recovered btw and almost ripped Berts head off his shoulders, Mike, ehh, not so much.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Tyson should have fought Holyfield earlier with hindsight, and fought him instead of Williams, Holyfield beat a Brazilian fighter in good fashion. Tyson would have won then but as Tyson's life unraveled, so did his discipline, skills and conditioning. It took years to get to that stage and months for it to fall apart.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
I'm still scratching my head on when this great erosion of skill happened in Tyson within the devistating ko of Spinks till the Douglas 1st bell a yr and few months later? Was it the 6,7 rounds in between vs chinny Williams or a deer in the headlights Bruno? I think it had more to do with finally running into a fluid mobile combination puncher who didn't shit himself when Mike yelled "boo" and had superior mental make up. All things Holyfield owned. That Cooper shot gets greatly blown out of proportion and it doesn't translate to Mike whacking him that easily if he had not pulled out. What, if it was Evander instead of Douglas vs a 'slipping' Tyson that Feb night the result would have same as well? Holyfield recovered btw and almost ripped Berts head off his shoulders, Mike, ehh, not so much.
Kevin Rooney said Mike wasnt training fully for the Spikns fight and just bulldozed in during the fight. He noticed as soon as King was in his head that Mike wasnt fully focused any more. Look at the Bruno fight, all those better fighters he fought but the laughing stock of the heavyweight division is the first to have a punch have any effect on him, as well as even land a decent shot.
Anyone that cant acknowledge that Mikes skills were not the same are just trying too hard to discredit his achievments and why I dont know. The Tyson that fought Douglas was nothing like the fighter that fought and beat Tucker, Tubbs and Holmes. Big difference in the skills on show.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
The question should really be whether a Mike Tyson full of himself walked in the ring or A Lewis with his mind somewhere strolled in. Mike was a body in perpetual motion in his younger day with a cast iron chin and perpetual motion. the loser would be the guy that was full of himself that evening. Mike whenever he listened to Rooney was a well oiled machine when he came into the ring and Lewis was fantastic when he remembered to not stay still so toss a coin based opn their weaknesses and someone will have to give because there's no draw in this fantasy battle. One thing is for sure If Lewis day dreams, it would be a short fight and if Tyson didn't prepare mentally and physically, the restaurant where he eats will be serving jabs Ala Lewis all night.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Reason i can not back Tyson is that he never beat a elite in his life. Maybe Holmes and Spinks i well give him but one was Lhw great the other coming off a long layoff and kinda old but still good win. Tyson just didn't have balls or heart or what ever it was he was missing to be greatest. Say what want about Holyfield and Lewis but they won there big fights and also kicked the shit out of Tyson. I mean Tyson was a fucking mental midget compared to Holyfeild and Lewis was a to skilled a fighter at his best.
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Re: Tyson of 1988 versus Lewis of 1999
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
I'm still scratching my head on when this great erosion of skill happened in Tyson within the devistating ko of Spinks till the Douglas 1st bell a yr and few months later? Was it the 6,7 rounds in between vs chinny Williams or a deer in the headlights Bruno? I think it had more to do with finally running into a fluid mobile combination puncher who didn't shit himself when Mike yelled "boo" and had superior mental make up. All things Holyfield owned. That Cooper shot gets greatly blown out of proportion and it doesn't translate to Mike whacking him that easily if he had not pulled out. What, if it was Evander instead of Douglas vs a 'slipping' Tyson that Feb night the result would have same as well? Holyfield recovered btw and almost ripped Berts head off his shoulders, Mike, ehh, not so much.
Kevin Rooney said Mike wasnt training fully for the Spikns fight and just bulldozed in during the fight. He noticed as soon as King was in his head that Mike wasnt fully focused any more. Look at the Bruno fight, all those better fighters he fought but the laughing stock of the heavyweight division is the first to have a punch have any effect on him, as well as even land a decent shot.
Anyone that cant acknowledge that Mikes skills were not the same are just trying too hard to discredit his achievments and why I dont know. The Tyson that fought Douglas was nothing like the fighter that fought and beat Tucker, Tubbs and Holmes. Big difference in the skills on show.
Sounds like your saying his skills were still there really but he just didnt give a shate to stay focused and trained then? Thats on him.
