https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CZcE0OdWEAARiyn.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
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https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CZcE0OdWEAARiyn.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Sorry Tito, do you mean Tete's opposition at 118 is lacking compared to the other 3? Or that's his is better?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Rodriguez has the weakest opposition in my opinion, but like I said, I rate him only behind Inoue based on a P4P/ who beats who sense.
Although all 4 seeds could easily be interchangeable on their best nights.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSorry Tito, do you mean Tete's opposition at 118 is lacking compared to the other 3? Or that's his is better?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Rodriguez has the weakest opposition in my opinion, but like I said, I rate him only behind Inoue based on a P4P/ who beats who sense.
Although all 4 seeds could easily be interchangeable on their best nights.
No, what I mean is that Tete has the weakest opposition by far. To me, the other three opponents are almost interchangeable. Also, if Rodriguez beats Moloney, which admittedly he should, he gets Inoue, who arguably should've been the #1 seed, in the semis. IMO Rodriguez has an excellent chance against either Burnett or Tete... but they're on the other half of the bracket.
Yea Inoue vs Rodriguez should have been set up to be able to reach the final.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSorry Tito, do you mean Tete's opposition at 118 is lacking compared to the other 3? Or that's his is better?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Rodriguez has the weakest opposition in my opinion, but like I said, I rate him only behind Inoue based on a P4P/ who beats who sense.
Although all 4 seeds could easily be interchangeable on their best nights.
No, what I mean is that Tete has the weakest opposition by far. To me, the other three opponents are almost interchangeable. Also, if Rodriguez beats Moloney, which admittedly he should, he gets Inoue, who arguably should've been the #1 seed, in the semis. IMO Rodriguez has an excellent chance against either Burnett or Tete... but they're on the other half of the bracket.
Nah, Rodriguez has the weaker record for me. Tete really only has one loss. That was to the extremely talented Mthalane at 112.
Manny only really has Butler, Tete beat an undefeated version, plus Narvaez, Villanueva is solid. Plus some decent guys between 112 to 115.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaYea Inoue vs Rodriguez should have been set up to be able to reach the final.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSorry Tito, do you mean Tete's opposition at 118 is lacking compared to the other 3? Or that's his is better?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Rodriguez has the weakest opposition in my opinion, but like I said, I rate him only behind Inoue based on a P4P/ who beats who sense.
Although all 4 seeds could easily be interchangeable on their best nights.
No, what I mean is that Tete has the weakest opposition by far. To me, the other three opponents are almost interchangeable. Also, if Rodriguez beats Moloney, which admittedly he should, he gets Inoue, who arguably should've been the #1 seed, in the semis. IMO Rodriguez has an excellent chance against either Burnett or Tete... but they're on the other half of the bracket.
Nah, Rodriguez has the weaker record for me. Tete really only has one loss. That was to the extremely talented Mthalane at 112.
Manny only really has Butler, Tete beat an undefeated version, plus Narvaez, Villanueva is solid. Plus some decent guys between 112 to 115.
I meant in the tournament. Tete has the easiest opponent by far. The opponents of the other 3 guys are interchangeable IMO.
Oh ok got ya, Payano is definitely the toughest of the 4 unseeded for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaYea Inoue vs Rodriguez should have been set up to be able to reach the final.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSorry Tito, do you mean Tete's opposition at 118 is lacking compared to the other 3? Or that's his is better?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Rodriguez has the weakest opposition in my opinion, but like I said, I rate him only behind Inoue based on a P4P/ who beats who sense.
Although all 4 seeds could easily be interchangeable on their best nights.
No, what I mean is that Tete has the weakest opposition by far. To me, the other three opponents are almost interchangeable. Also, if Rodriguez beats Moloney, which admittedly he should, he gets Inoue, who arguably should've been the #1 seed, in the semis. IMO Rodriguez has an excellent chance against either Burnett or Tete... but they're on the other half of the bracket.
Nah, Rodriguez has the weaker record for me. Tete really only has one loss. That was to the extremely talented Mthalane at 112.
Manny only really has Butler, Tete beat an undefeated version, plus Narvaez, Villanueva is solid. Plus some decent guys between 112 to 115.
I meant in the tournament. Tete has the easiest opponent by far. The opponents of the other 3 guys are interchangeable IMO.
Yea I agree Tete had the easiest 1st round opponent.
Aloyan can box, but I don't like him because he was done for PEDs as an amateur.
Looks like Tete vs Aloyan is set for October 13th in Russia.
Tete has the least chance of getting through to the next round according to bookies.
1/4 to beat the former Amateur star in Russia.
Inoue is 1/25 to beat Payano.
Burnett is 1/6 to beat Donaire.
Rodriguez is 1/14 to beat Maloney.
Tete might regret not picking Payano, he had no choice in the others.
Fighting in Russia, Tete will need to win the rounds clear if it goes to the cards. Aloyan may have enough skill to make it to the final bell, but I believe he'll mostly be in survival mode if it goes late.
I was expecting better from Aloyan but hes looked pretty poor since going pro. I think it should be easy work for Tete. Stops him in 5 or 6Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha
Why Russia? They seem to have the money.
Aloyan
Naoya vs Payano is set for Oct-7 in Japan.
Inoue just fought a 3 round exhibition on the 19th of August with Genesis Servania.
I'd like to see more P4P guys doing this. It's quite common in Japan.
http://youtu.be/3vKyRASuJIk
I am suprised that they allowed it because he could get injured, alphabet boys get angry and good money is not always made.
It used to be quite common, I remember Porter doing one after one of his fights was cancelled.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
For guys fighting once or twice a year this would be good for them.
Great stuff, got a bit spiteful too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
You've never heard of sparring? Some fighters don't even wear head guards.
Or gym wars?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
You've never heard of sparring? Some fighters don't even wear head guards.
Servania was landing, it was only an exhibition tho. Also Servania is now a featherweight and Inoue has just moved to 118.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
This is different, too public for the fighter to stop, rest, and quit if it got out of hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaOr gym wars?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
You've never heard of sparring? Some fighters don't even wear head guards.
Seen any of that Mayweather gym sparring? Wasn't he getting sued for some of that from Rahman's kids?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterThis is different, too public for the fighter to stop, rest, and quit if it got out of hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaOr gym wars?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
You've never heard of sparring? Some fighters don't even wear head guards.
Have you watched the footage? You could make an argument Servania came out on top, again it is only an exhibition but they were going at it.
I saw something of 24/7 when a fighter beats up a younger fighter and his older brother fights him for family pride.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSeen any of that Mayweather gym sparring? Wasn't he getting sued for some of that from Rahman's kids?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterThis is different, too public for the fighter to stop, rest, and quit if it got out of hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaOr gym wars?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
You've never heard of sparring? Some fighters don't even wear head guards.
Have you watched the footage? You could make an argument Servania came out on top, again it is only an exhibition but they were going at it.
It's as common as sin for sparring to get naughty, always has, always will and many of the best tales in boxing come from sparring sessions. I've never read a boxing book without a tale of a spiteful spar.
Like when Lennox got knocked the fuck out by Jeremy Williams, a rumour which lasted for donkey years until footage was finally revealed, thanks to this modern internet age, showing Williams taking Lewis down MMA style which prompted Manny Steward and crew to save him from Lewis going berserk.
Guys fighting once or twice a year though is in most circumstances inexcusable. Yes the game changes as does the world, things move on but 3, 4,5,6 fights even a year was common place for so long that it is inconceivable that unless injured any fighter can defend fighting only once a year. I don't mind exhibitions it is part of the core and history of boxing but a decent spar is more useful for fighters. I have seen spars that were far more entertaining and useful for the fighters involved than the fight they were preparing for. It's an inexact science but in a short career fighting more regularly makes a lot of sense. Getting out of condition and being inactive can often lead to more injuries than those sustained in fights.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaIt used to be quite common, I remember Porter doing one after one of his fights was cancelled.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
For guys fighting once or twice a year this would be good for them.
Thanks for the link. Always a pleasure to watch Inoue.
And many a career has been cut short by sparring.
You said yourself “in a short career”, that’s exactly the point of fighting less. To prolong the career. Nobody can really say what is better for their health. Sure you stay in better shape if you fight more often. But you also don’t have as much time for your brain to heal. It’s a very complex topic.
I don’t mean to sound argumentative if I do. Just talking.
You are right it is a tricky balancing act and no two fighters are alike.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Swanson
The thing I like is that Inoue had already entered the tournament and has his fight with Payano set for October, he'll be sparring for sure, but still put on this exhibition for the public.
From the 60s you'll find heavyweight champions had generally the same amount of fights as those today.Quote:
Originally Posted by BeanzGuys fighting once or twice a year though is in most circumstances inexcusable. Yes the game changes as does the world, things move on but 3, 4,5,6 fights even a year was common place for so long that it is inconceivable that unless injured any fighter can defend fighting only once a year.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaIt used to be quite common, I remember Porter doing one after one of his fights was cancelled.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
For guys fighting once or twice a year this would be good for them.
I'd like to see stats for lighter divisions, i'm sure they fought more as they earned peannuts compared with todays stars.
Ken Shiro ds Milan Melinda has been added to the Inoue/ Payano undercard.
There is also talk that Relikh/ Troyanovsky will also be on the card.
“We will be doing doubleheaders this time on the quarter-finals,” said Comosa’s Chief Boxing Officer, Kalle Sauerland.
“You will be seeing action from not always the same weight class on the same night, but you will always get doubleheaders. So twelve fights, six weeks, all over the world; Asia, US, UK, Europe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterFrom the 60s you'll find heavyweight champions had generally the same amount of fights as those today.Quote:
Originally Posted by BeanzGuys fighting once or twice a year though is in most circumstances inexcusable. Yes the game changes as does the world, things move on but 3, 4,5,6 fights even a year was common place for so long that it is inconceivable that unless injured any fighter can defend fighting only once a year.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaIt used to be quite common, I remember Porter doing one after one of his fights was cancelled.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
For guys fighting once or twice a year this would be good for them.
I'd like to see stats for lighter divisions, i'm sure they fought more as they earned peannuts compared with todays stars.
It would be interesting to find out. I agree that Heavyweights have always followed a similar pattern lots of fights at the start of their careers then 3 or 4 a year leading up to a belt challenge then twice a year once they have a world belt. At lower weights even when holding an international belt 3 times a year seems to be a pattern until about 2000ish when it dropped to about two a year as well.
That is a very cursory guestimation.
I like that much better. No reason to separate them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha
That first Japanese card is fire:Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherI like that much better. No reason to separate them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha
Kiryl Relikh vs Eduard Troyanovsky, WBA World Super Lightweight Title
Ken Shiro (who I feel is the lineal champ) vs Milan Melindo, WBC Light Flyweight Title
Naoya Inoue vs Juan Carlos Payano, WBA World Bantamweight Title
Isn’t that card on DAZN?Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaThat first Japanese card is fire:Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherI like that much better. No reason to separate them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha
Kiryl Relikh vs Eduard Troyanovsky, WBA World Super Lightweight Title
Ken Shiro (who I feel is the lineal champ) vs Milan Melindo, WBC Light Flyweight Title
Naoya Inoue vs Juan Carlos Payano, WBA World Bantamweight Title
Yea every WBSS season 2 fight will be on DAZN.Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherIsn’t that card on DAZN?Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaThat first Japanese card is fire:Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherI like that much better. No reason to separate them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha
Kiryl Relikh vs Eduard Troyanovsky, WBA World Super Lightweight Title
Ken Shiro (who I feel is the lineal champ) vs Milan Melindo, WBC Light Flyweight Title
Naoya Inoue vs Juan Carlos Payano, WBA World Bantamweight Title
Two championship fights per card is brilliant. And that Japanese card is excellent.
At the odds I like Tete (6/1) and Josh Taylor (11/4) to win each divison. I think Flanagan is being underated against Pograis, it's a good style matchup for him.
Flanagan is definitely being underrated, he took Hooker to the brink. Prograis is a different beast tho. Both won't be hard to find, I see Prograis breaking Flanagan down mid to late rounds.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
The winner of 118 is a P4P high roller, does the 140 winner claim a spot in the P4P?
I think the winner of both will definitely boost their rating a ton. If Inoue wins 118, he becomes another fighter that fights for that #1 spot. 140 I think the winner gets in most p4p rankings but not the top half. I think 140 has a lot of solid guys but nobody special.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaFlanagan is definitely being underrated, he took Hooker to the brink. Prograis is a different beast tho. Both won't be hard to find, I see Prograis breaking Flanagan down mid to late rounds.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
The winner of 118 is a P4P high roller, does the 140 winner claim a spot in the P4P?