Just another one of Wacko's Drunken Round by Rounds James Toney vs Sam Peter

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wacko3205

...certain posters that I consider to complete idiots...

---

It werent an attack wack :bawling: honest
meowza's post above makes good sense

I like Peter and was hoping he won more convincingly but I had Toney winning narrowly. Those rounds were really tought o score and most of them could have gone either way. I'm glad though cause Peter has a much better chance of cleaning out the division than Toney does. By the way, now that Peer probably gets to fight for the WBC title, Wlad should have no excuses since he's saying he wants to unify and of course Peter wants that rematch badly. Wlad should have been DQed in that fight. He did all that Illegal stuff and still almost got KOed in a fight that he won very narrowly. If Wlad really got more confidence in knowing he can hurt Peter with the left hook, then why didn't go after him when he did hurt him with it. It's because he's a coward.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bilbo

Actually going into the 12th round Roach was telling Toney to knock Peter down. But it wasn't coming from a point of view that he needed the knockout to win, it sounded more like Roach was just pumped by what Toney was doing to Peter. I have to admit from about round 7 or 8 onwards I thought Toney was going to kncok Peter out.

You guys who say Peter never looked hurt are crazy, he's got a great chin but he looked like he was going to collapse and die after about 6 rounds, he could hardly breath.

---

This is just a difference in opinion.

Everyone needs to see this fight. Toney bruised up Peter's face...but Peter was never REALLY hurt IWO.

There were times that he was caught...but anyone that see's the fight & sees Toney shaken & holding on to ropes & then clenching...you might see my points.

While I respect my guy bilbo's opinions...I just disagree here. ;D

Yes bilbo...I respect you & your opinions...but it aint the morning yet...& I might just chew off me arm to get away from you. ;D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NuthaPug

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wacko3205

...certain posters that I consider to complete idiots...

---

It werent an attack wack :bawling: honest
meowza's post above makes good sense

---

I wasn't talking about you or meowza...you both are always respectful on dicussions.

Just ignore what I said...because it only applies to one douche bag...& you Nutha...you have never been a DB towards me...so you are in the clear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyle

Sam fought vs a short little fat man...Wlad simply won't let Sam get inside and if he does he'll tie him up...do you not agree???

Plus Wlad has the esteem boost knowing he could have KO'd Peter had he thrown the hook more

---

I will certainly agree that Sam fought a "short little fat man" and I believe that the "short little fat man" won a close fight...The reason for my opinion on Peter is that, this time he fought a "compact" fight throwing tighter straighter punches than I have ever seen him throw before....gone were the wide looping and wild right hands that Wlad timed pretty well and made Peter pay...I also saw for the first time a counter left hook which he was able to land on James Toney who is no easy target...

If Peter can continue getting better as he get's through Oleg, I believe his next Wlad fight has the potential to be a different fight than the first one...Not claiming that he will KO Wlad or vice versa, but I believe it will look much differently from a boxing perspective....It's a fight that has become more interesting to me based on the improvement I've seen in Sam Peter....Yes Wlad has the knowledge he can land and hurt with the left hook, but I think Sam will be able to land more significant punches as well....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Promoter

If Peter can continue getting better as he get's through Oleg, I believe his next Wlad fight has the potential to be a different fight than the first one...Not claiming that he will KO Wlad or vice versa, but I believe it will look much differently from a boxing perspective....It's a fight that has become more interesting to me based on the improvement I've seen in Sam Peter....Yes Wlad has the knowledge he can land and hurt with the left hook, but I think Sam will be able to land more significant punches as well....

---

:coolclick: later...yet again.

An Error Has Occurred!
Sorry the Promoter, Wacko can't repeat a karma action without waiting 24 hours...but I agree.

He was a bit sharpish against the sharpest opponent possible.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wacko3205

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NuthaPug

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wacko3205

...certain posters that I consider to complete idiots...

---

It werent an attack wack :bawling: honest
meowza's post above makes good sense

---

I wasn't talking about you or meowza...you both are always respectful on dicussions.

Just ignore what I said...because it only applies to one douche bag...& you Nutha...you have never been a DB towards me...so you are in the clear.

---

Aw Wacks I thought you loved me...I prefer to be referred to as a Prik or an AssHole though...LOL!!!!!!!

Hey I for one appreciate the RBR....I know its a labor of Love for you..and always entertaining.. ;) I for one was very passionate about this fight and feel that there have been quite a few questionable desicions recently.....Maybe its always been the case with these desicions and I am more aware of it lately...Who Knows??? I love this sport it is near and dear to me but it is extremely flawed in alot of ways...It seems like it is steered and manuvered, manipulated by the sanctioning bodies OH WELL........OF course I'll be watching the next fight anyway :-\

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by quammi

Toney was screwed from the moment he walked into the staples center... he doesnt have the power to knock out peter, and the judges were never gonna give him a fair round. he shouldnt have taken the fight. the way his luck has been, he should not take a fight that he knows will go to the cards.

I just moved to a new area, and when I hooked up my cable I got showtime free with my HBO package. I am sure glad I didnt pay for this crap.

---

BAD LUCK?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

toney was handed a draw in his last fight, a fight where rahnman beat the shit out of him

and before that he was allowed to fight again after needing to roid on john ruiz to get a victory

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wacko3205

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Devol

Those score margins and 1 of the fact that 1 judge had it opposite of the other 2 makes you wonder doesn't it? How F****** long will it take for us to see a change in the sport we love, and sometimes hate to love. Quartey - Forrest anyone hell the Green fight on espn last night ? blehhhh

---

Holy S***.

Please...that was not remotely close to Quartey Forrest.

Peter stood toe to toe with the most technical fighter out there & shook him 4 out of 12 rounds & traded shot for shot with him...that fight was close.

Close enough to scratch the robbery.

---

It's a perfect example, nearly everyone and their grandmother had it for Ike, same as with Toney. It's seems quite clear on this board that it would be sufficient to say a wide majority saw it for Toney, and I realize not all watched it. I'm just getting tired of the bad scoring this past year. My problem with this particular fight is the fact that one judge goes balls out to Toney adn the others were well the other way. In fact 1 judge had Peter win what 9 rounds to 3 factoring in the pt deduction ? THATS MY PROBLEM WITH JUDGING, and yes Oscar beat Felix, Nard beat Jermain, Sweet Pea the Lennox draw with Holy1 where Lathan I think it was scored a rd for Holy when he in fact landed single digit punches and almost got knocked cold.

There should be something valid in scoring. We could go on and on on on on ...... I don't see a punchstat scoring happening nor would I want it, but how about 5 fucking judges ? 5 judges might help out more since we didn't have the issues quite as much in my mind back when 15 rds were in place, those 13-15 really decided a lot of fights and ended some careers early. I dunno what the answer is, I'm no Ratner or employed in Nevada but you have to agree we have to put up with a lot of reallllly questionable bullshit.

... oh and thanks for the sad click, keep em rolling in ~

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Devol

... oh and thanks for the sad click, keep em rolling in ~

---

#11 was your sad click.

Changed it back for you to #10 & upped your :coolclick: rating to #18...so your'e welcome. ;)

That'll be your second :coolclick: from me on this thread...so stop that gotdam crying. ;D

I gotta to agree with Bilbo all the way here. James was hurt bout 3-4 times, but only seriously hurt once, when he grabbed the rope, and had to shake off a monster clubbing right hand. I also agree that James stiffened out Peters leg for him and hurt him as well. I had it 115-112 for james Toney, and I was kinda rootin for Peter to least do something, not just get embarassed. Toney won, we all know it. Peter gave a good account of himself, but thats it. Bad decisions are ruining the sport, how can it be taken seriously when crap like this and the Quartey robbery are allowed to take place???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wacko3205

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Devol

... oh and thanks for the sad click, keep em rolling in ~

---

#11 was your sad click.

Changed it back for you to #10 & upped your :coolclick: rating to #18...so your'e welcome. ;)

That'll be your second :coolclick: from me on this thread...so stop that gotdam crying. ;D

---

lol Wacko, you've been doing a good job with the rd by rds. You started with Tyson Williams or Tarver RJJ2, at any rate I think you've done a pretty good job scoring them.

Back at ya brother.

Ok, I just got finished watching the fight. Watching the Toney interview, watching him talking shit about Larry Holmes ;D Toney's a class act ::** Good bad guy to have though, just has to work on the whole having his audience actually being able to understand what he says thing down.

Anyways, VERY tough fight to score. I know the argument is probably, volume versus power. But I don't buy that. I really don't. I mean, maybe recapping the fight, and the fight styles that is the case, but as for the decision I don't think it comes into play much. Boxing is scored round by round and when you talk about volume vs power, you're talking about the overall fight. What are the punch stat numbers for this fight? I wouldn't doubt that it isn't more then 5-7 punches a round for Toney, and it could be argued that Peter's big punches made up for that difference. So that's just getting that out of the way.

But I was pretty impressed by both fighters. It went very different then I expected it to but still turned out to be an exciting fight. I was expecting Toney to come out, fight a little bit in the center before ultimately falling back on the ropes and countering as Peter swung wide over top of Toney's shoulder. Always seems to happen when these two styles meet.

However, first round on, Peter showed discipline. He was outstanding in setting up that right hand and has straightened it out considerably since the last time I saw him against Hawkins. Plus his balance has greatly improved this time around. He was actually able to double up on some of his punches, unlike versus Klitschko where he would land something big and have to wait a bit to reset before going again. A lot of people questioned his mental make up after taking two fights with relative nobodies after the Wlad fight and not chasing the real big names but he didn't let Toney in his head. The only frustration I saw was the point deduction, which was a big one but still wasn't a meltdown. Then they questioned his stamina after the weight gain, he says he feels less weight drained now and that's what allowed him to take the championship rounds. He looked real good. He definitely looked like a guy who has spent his time in the gym fixing his problems. Still on the bandwagon folks.

As for Toney, I think he knew that if he let Toney manhandle him on the ropes and Peter got a few shots in, that the judges would give it to Peter for pushing the fight. So he stayed off the ropes and in the center of the ring. He looks quicker and sharper then he ever has since the Jirov fight imo. I really was impressed, I think he showed up in the proper shape to give himself a chance to win the fight. That wasn't the case with Rahman, and even at 233 he was fit enough to outland a younger heavweight and look good doing it. I mean seriously, it wasn't a blowout win, it wasn't an overwhelming win, but it was a solid performance for Toney. I don't think he has much to hold his chin(s) down about. Though I'm sure even if he got sparked in the 1st round he would find some reason to beleive he won the fight.

As for the actual decision. I had Toney winning. Yup. Not by much though. 114-113 with the point deduction. The evenflow of this fight was incredible. For the first 5 or 6 they traded every other round, then Toney went on to have 3 good rounds and then Peter closed out very strong. But all of these rounds were incredibly tough to score. I think that if I watched the fight a second time, I would probably have the final tally give or take a round or two, but the order would be completely different. There were very few rounds where you could rest easy thinking only one fighter could be given that round. Even the 12th, a big round for Peter, could have conceivably gone to Toney. So while the 116-111 scorecards do make me wince a bit, I could understand how they were scored that way.

One thing we don't realize at home, live it's a hell of a lot harder to score fights. The below the ring perspective, the giant bodies in there tend to make you miss a punch or two (especially with someone with short inside punches like Toney). Not providing an excuse to the judges, just a possible explanation. If the fight had everyone at home having a tough time to score, you can imagine what it's like for the judges who don't have the benefits of us.

I like both fighters but James got SCREWED. It's that simple. There is no arguing that with the point deduction Samuel Peter won more rounds, and thus points than James Toney. Just didn't happen.