Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Speaking of opponents. Froch's highest opponent to date is Jermain Taylor, and Andre Ward's is Edison Miranda. Have any of the other guys beaten someone better then those two? Well Kessler beat Mundine so I'd say thats about it.
To be honest, you could even make a case that Jean Pascal is a better opponent than most of them have faced.
Is Mundine, or an old Beyer better than Pascal? I don't know?
Is Mundine even a world champion? I think he's only ever held a title when Kessler has been promoted to super champ, not sure he's actually won a real belt.
Pascal has go to be on the same level as Miranda, considering he's a legit 175 light heavyweight world champ now and Miranda never won a world title at all.
No question Froch has the best resume going into this, at least as far as recent form goes.
Will that mean anything when the tournament starts, we'll have to wait and see.
Certainly only Kessler and Froch have beaten any world champs. Ward, Dirrell, Abraham have never faced another world champ past, present or futue I don't believe.
Taylor has, but Froch ko'd him hence his status as favourite.
Kessler's onesided win over Librado Andrade was better than Froch's lucky KO over Taylor, for one it was against a fighter who was an established Super Middleweight, and secondly he dominated from start to finish, not get horribly outboxed for the first 8 to 9 rounds then get a lucky ko in the 12th
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Speaking of opponents. Froch's highest opponent to date is Jermain Taylor, and Andre Ward's is Edison Miranda. Have any of the other guys beaten someone better then those two? Well Kessler beat Mundine so I'd say thats about it.
To be honest, you could even make a case that Jean Pascal is a better opponent than most of them have faced.
Is Mundine, or an old Beyer better than Pascal? I don't know?
Is Mundine even a world champion? I think he's only ever held a title when Kessler has been promoted to super champ, not sure he's actually won a real belt.
Pascal has go to be on the same level as Miranda, considering he's a legit 175 light heavyweight world champ now and Miranda never won a world title at all.
No question Froch has the best resume going into this, at least as far as recent form goes.
Will that mean anything when the tournament starts, we'll have to wait and see.
Certainly only Kessler and Froch have beaten any world champs. Ward, Dirrell, Abraham have never faced another world champ past, present or futue I don't believe.
Taylor has, but Froch ko'd him hence his status as favourite.
Kessler's onesided win over Librado Andrade was better than Froch's lucky KO over Taylor, for one it was against a fighter who was an established Super Middleweight, and secondly he dominated from start to finish, not get horribly outboxed for the first 8 to 9 rounds then get a lucky ko in the 12th
I like Andrade, he's a good honest pro who never gives up, but let's be real, he can't box for shit.
He gets outboxed by everybody decent and Kessler, a boxer with tremendous fundamentals and jab was always going to pummel him all night.
I think Jermain Taylor would beat him like a drum for 10 rounds at least also.
Taylor is a MUCH better boxer than Andrade, not as tough and durable for sure, but being outboxed by Jermain Taylor in the early rounds is a whole ball park away from being outboxed by Librado Andrade.
Froch's win over Taylor has been greatly underestimated by many. First off it was big step up in class for Froch, secondly he was away from home, fighting one of boxings superstars, and thirdly he came back from the worst start to a fight in his pro career being floored in the third round.
If you actually watch the fight without your blinkers on you'd see that Froch had Taylor in trouble from about round 5 on, it was a very even fight from that moment on with Taylor gradually wilting to Froch's pressure.
It was a great win from Froch, sloppy early on for sure, but from round 5 onwards he was in no way outclassed or embarrassed.
He will be a force in this tournament for sure.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Carl Froch
7/4
Mikkel Kessler
11/4
Arthur Abraham
7/2
Jermain Taylor
5/1
Andre Ward
10/1
Andre Dirrell
14/1
I think Taylor is the only one that CAN'T win it!!
You think Abraham, who's never fought at the weight before has a better shot than Taylor?
Yep. I think Kessler or Abraham will win - I haven't seen as much of Ward or Dirrell so they may be better than I am giving them credit for.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Carl Froch
7/4
Mikkel Kessler
11/4
Arthur Abraham
7/2
Jermain Taylor
5/1
Andre Ward
10/1
Andre Dirrell
14/1
I think Taylor is the only one that CAN'T win it!!
You think Abraham, who's never fought at the weight before has a better shot than Taylor?
Yep. I think Kessler
or Abraham will win - I haven't seen as much of Ward or Dirrell so they may be better than I am giving them credit for.
Part of me is actually thinking he may prove to be the big disappointment of the whole tournament.
We've yet to see him in with anybody really decent, even at middleweight let alone at super.
It honestly wouldn't suprise me one bit if in his first fight with Jermain he got completely outboxed and dominated.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
I have agreed with literally almost nothing you said but I agree I don't think Abraham matches up well with any of these guys.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
I actually think it was a bad move for Abraham, siging up for this.
Kessler will win it in style :cool:
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
To be honest, you could even make a case that Jean Pascal is a better opponent than most of them have faced.
Is Mundine, or an old Beyer better than Pascal? I don't know?
Is Mundine even a world champion? I think he's only ever held a title when Kessler has been promoted to super champ, not sure he's actually won a real belt.
Pascal has go to be on the same level as Miranda, considering he's a legit 175 light heavyweight world champ now and Miranda never won a world title at all.
No question Froch has the best resume going into this, at least as far as recent form goes.
Will that mean anything when the tournament starts, we'll have to wait and see.
Certainly only Kessler and Froch have beaten any world champs. Ward, Dirrell, Abraham have never faced another world champ past, present or futue I don't believe.
Taylor has, but Froch ko'd him hence his status as favourite.
Kessler's onesided win over Librado Andrade was better than Froch's lucky KO over Taylor, for one it was against a fighter who was an established Super Middleweight, and secondly he dominated from start to finish, not get horribly outboxed for the first 8 to 9 rounds then get a lucky ko in the 12th
I like Andrade, he's a good honest pro who never gives up, but let's be real, he can't box for shit.
He gets outboxed by everybody decent and Kessler, a boxer with tremendous fundamentals and jab was always going to pummel him all night.
I think Jermain Taylor would beat him like a drum for 10 rounds at least also.
Taylor is a MUCH better boxer than Andrade, not as tough and durable for sure, but being outboxed by Jermain Taylor in the early rounds is a whole ball park away from being outboxed by Librado Andrade.
Froch's win over Taylor has been greatly underestimated by many. First off it was big step up in class for Froch, secondly he was away from home, fighting one of boxings superstars, and thirdly he came back from the worst start to a fight in his pro career being floored in the third round.
If you actually watch the fight without your blinkers on you'd see that Froch had Taylor in trouble from about round 5 on, it was a very even fight from that moment on with Taylor gradually wilting to Froch's pressure.
It was a great win from Froch, sloppy early on for sure, but from round 5 onwards he was in no way outclassed or embarrassed.
He will be a force in this tournament for sure.
Can't stand Froch, but I agree with your assessment on the Taylor fight, I read the reports before watching the replay and was expecting a complete washout until the final 30 seconds, but that simply wasn't the case.
Lot of unknowns in this tourney which makes it fun, and will depend on who gets who in the round robin, where losing just one will still see you through. Still don't think you need a genius to get Froch out of there, his determination and stamina gives him a shot at anyone, yet his dire skills gives anyone a shot against him.
Abraham depended a lot on strength and toughness at 160, have to wait and see if it'll carry.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Speaking of opponents. Froch's highest opponent to date is Jermain Taylor, and Andre Ward's is Edison Miranda. Have any of the other guys beaten someone better then those two? Well Kessler beat Mundine so I'd say thats about it.
To be honest, you could even make a case that Jean Pascal is a better opponent than most of them have faced.
Is Mundine, or an old Beyer better than Pascal? I don't know?
Is Mundine even a world champion? I think he's only ever held a title when Kessler has been promoted to super champ, not sure he's actually won a real belt.
Pascal has go to be on the same level as Miranda, considering he's a legit 175 light heavyweight world champ now and Miranda never won a world title at all.
No question Froch has the best resume going into this, at least as far as recent form goes.
Will that mean anything when the tournament starts, we'll have to wait and see.
Certainly only Kessler and Froch have beaten any world champs. Ward, Dirrell, Abraham have never faced another world champ past, present or futue I don't believe.
Taylor has, but Froch ko'd him hence his status as favourite.
Kessler's onesided win over Librado Andrade was better than Froch's lucky KO over Taylor, for one it was against a fighter who was an established Super Middleweight, and secondly he dominated from start to finish, not get horribly outboxed for the first 8 to 9 rounds then get a lucky ko in the 12th
How was it lucky?? It was very close on the scorecards, do you not think Frochs gameplan was to bring the heat in the last third of the fight as he new what Taylor was like? To call it lucky is pathetic mate, you also forgot to mention he beat the current WBC 175 lb champ, personally Froch imo is probably second fav behind Kessler as like others said he has proven against two world class fighters and beat them the two younger Americans have basically done nothing and were still unsure how they will be when they step it in at world level.
Kessler
Froch
Abraham
Taylor
Ward
Dirrell
Is about right with what they have all done so far in there career.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skel1983
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
To be honest, you could even make a case that Jean Pascal is a better opponent than most of them have faced.
Is Mundine, or an old Beyer better than Pascal? I don't know?
Is Mundine even a world champion? I think he's only ever held a title when Kessler has been promoted to super champ, not sure he's actually won a real belt.
Pascal has go to be on the same level as Miranda, considering he's a legit 175 light heavyweight world champ now and Miranda never won a world title at all.
No question Froch has the best resume going into this, at least as far as recent form goes.
Will that mean anything when the tournament starts, we'll have to wait and see.
Certainly only Kessler and Froch have beaten any world champs. Ward, Dirrell, Abraham have never faced another world champ past, present or futue I don't believe.
Taylor has, but Froch ko'd him hence his status as favourite.
Kessler's onesided win over Librado Andrade was better than Froch's lucky KO over Taylor, for one it was against a fighter who was an established Super Middleweight, and secondly he dominated from start to finish, not get horribly outboxed for the first 8 to 9 rounds then get a lucky ko in the 12th
How was it lucky?? It was very close on the scorecards, do you not think Frochs gameplan was to bring the heat in the last third of the fight as he new what Taylor was like? To call it lucky is pathetic mate, you also forgot to mention he beat the current WBC 175 lb champ, personally Froch imo is probably second fav behind Kessler as like others said he has proven against two world class fighters and beat them the two younger Americans have basically done nothing and were still unsure how they will be when they step it in at world level.
Kessler
Froch
Abraham
Taylor
Ward
Dirrell
Is about right with what they have all done so far in there career.
Factoring in achievements AND form (otherwise Taylor would be higher) I totally agree with your list. Just remembered that Abraham-Miranda 2 happened at SM, or 166 at least, SO I think Abraham and Wards respective performances are somewhat relevant, and that Abraham should be able to absorb and give solid punches in this tourney, but outbosing some of the slicker fighters may be a problem.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RP33
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Carl Froch
7/4
Mikkel Kessler
11/4
Arthur Abraham
7/2
Jermain Taylor
5/1
Andre Ward
10/1
Andre Dirrell
14/1
I think Taylor is the only one that CAN'T win it!!
Taylor had Froch (the favorite) BEAT if he lasted another 12 seconds.. how can you say he "CAN'T" win it? Seems crazy to me.
TBH i see Kessler and Abraham as the favorites. I don't see Froch beating Kess and i think Abraham has a safer style for the rest of the fighters. Abraham Froch would be a HELL of a fight.
Well if Taylor hd've lasted 12 more seconds (which is completely irrelevant coz he didn't and he got KTFO) I would've given a 10-7 round to Froch and scored it a draw ;)
actually what is "completely irrelevant" is the fact that he got KO'd.. Also what is irrelevant is your scorecard.
what IS relevant is that Taylor would have won on the score cards if he didn't get KO'd. This isn't about the outcome of the fight, it's about the actual fight. I don't care who actually won, but i'm using this fight as a reference to the upcoming fights, and if Froch is the favorite, then i don't see how Taylor, who took him to the last round, winning on the cards, "CAN'T" win the tournament. It's actually a ludicrous statement.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skel1983
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
To be honest, you could even make a case that Jean Pascal is a better opponent than most of them have faced.
Is Mundine, or an old Beyer better than Pascal? I don't know?
Is Mundine even a world champion? I think he's only ever held a title when Kessler has been promoted to super champ, not sure he's actually won a real belt.
Pascal has go to be on the same level as Miranda, considering he's a legit 175 light heavyweight world champ now and Miranda never won a world title at all.
No question Froch has the best resume going into this, at least as far as recent form goes.
Will that mean anything when the tournament starts, we'll have to wait and see.
Certainly only Kessler and Froch have beaten any world champs. Ward, Dirrell, Abraham have never faced another world champ past, present or futue I don't believe.
Taylor has, but Froch ko'd him hence his status as favourite.
Kessler's onesided win over Librado Andrade was better than Froch's lucky KO over Taylor, for one it was against a fighter who was an established Super Middleweight, and secondly he dominated from start to finish, not get horribly outboxed for the first 8 to 9 rounds then get a lucky ko in the 12th
How was it lucky?? It was very close on the scorecards, do you not think Frochs gameplan was to bring the heat in the last third of the fight as he new what Taylor was like? To call it lucky is pathetic mate, you also forgot to mention he beat the current WBC 175 lb champ, personally Froch imo is probably second fav behind Kessler as like others said he has proven against two world class fighters and beat them the two younger Americans have basically done nothing and were still unsure how they will be when they step it in at world level.
Kessler
Froch
Abraham
Taylor
Ward
Dirrell
Is about right with what they have all done so far in there career.
I wouldn't call the KO of Taylor luck at all. Froch was definitely starting to land more in the later rounds, and watching the fight i knew that Taylor had to run and survive the last round, or two, to win the fight.. and Froch didn't allow him to do that.. It wasn't one lucky shot or anything.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jimboogie
I actually think it was a bad move for Abraham, siging up for this.
Kessler will win it in style :cool:
Totally agree. Kessler is the man to beat for me. He has experience, all round decent skills and a good boxing brain. Only Calzaghe could beat him the way he did.
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Carl Froch
7/4
Mikkel Kessler
11/4
Arthur Abraham
7/2
Jermain Taylor
5/1
Andre Ward
10/1
Andre Dirrell
14/1
I think Taylor is the only one that CAN'T win it!!
With me being british im going with Froch,but i will have a few ££s on Abraham,he's at great odds,he's tough as old boots,for me he's the hardest out them all!!
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RP33
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RP33
Taylor had Froch (the favorite) BEAT if he lasted another 12 seconds.. how can you say he "CAN'T" win it? Seems crazy to me.
TBH i see Kessler and Abraham as the favorites. I don't see Froch beating Kess and i think Abraham has a safer style for the rest of the fighters. Abraham Froch would be a HELL of a fight.
Well if Taylor hd've lasted 12 more seconds (which is completely irrelevant coz he didn't and he got KTFO) I would've given a 10-7 round to Froch and scored it a draw ;)
actually what is "completely irrelevant" is the fact that he got KO'd.. Also what is irrelevant is your scorecard.
what IS relevant is that Taylor would have won on the score cards if he didn't get KO'd. This isn't about the outcome of the fight, it's about the actual fight. I don't care who actually won, but i'm using this fight as a reference to the upcoming fights, and if Froch is the favorite, then i don't see how Taylor, who took him to the last round, winning on the cards, "CAN'T" win the tournament. It's actually a ludicrous statement.
I didn't say "he can't win" I said..........
"I think Taylor is the only one that CAN'T win it!!
It is a an opinion ;)
Re: Froch is the favourite for Super Six Tournament
Saying that it is irrelevant that he got KTFO, now that really is a ludicrous statement ;)
