Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
All these age things and etc didn't surface when everyone was picking Mosley to knock out Berto...
But I don't think Berto is all that good either. Does anyone think Mayweather wouldn't box Berto's ears off?
It's a valid point that Mosely is old because he is very old for a top level fighter in the smaller weights, but whether Mosley gets old in this fight is another question.
I'm backing Mosley and hoping he can shock everyone, but to pretend he is 30 would be a bit silly. He isn't. Only Hopkins in recent memory has been fighting well at this kind of age, all the others such as Toney and Jones Jr have faded. Everyone must fade at some point. It's only natural and if he loses it will be cited as one of the reasons.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
Berto is shit... Devon Alexander proved that last night ;)
I like Rozzy's & Teaths debate. I think Rozzy is seriously underrating Mayweather's jab.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jimboogie
Berto is shit... Devon Alexander proved that last night ;)
I like Rozzy's & Teaths debate. I think Rozzy is seriously underrating Mayweather's jab.
It works pretty well when he jabs at the body of midgets:)
Floyd has a different type of jab than Cotto, Winky, and Forrest. They all throw long jabs from a conventional high guard. That type of jab, in additon to controlling distance, swells the eyes, hides the right hand, and creates opportunities to hook of the jab.
Floyd's most effective jab is an up-jap and he targets it at the body. Throwing the jab from his low guard is different. He controls may opponents by using that body jab to keep them off. Taeth is right about that. Against some guys, he can stop them with that jab. I don't think it will have that effect on Mosley.His jab wasn't the deciding factor against Oscar. It didn't stop him in his tracks. He strafed Oscar with right crosses over Oscar's jab, rolled when he was on the ropes, and countered with clean hooks and uppercuts while Oscar flailed at his body. Oscar is the only decent fighter he's beaten who has comparable size and strength to Mosley. And Mosley is stronger.
He could do that against JMM, Judah, at points against Hatton. If he beats Mosley, it will be with the right hand, defense, and counterpunching. The jab won't be the deciding factor.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
I still agree to disagree, Floyd fought Baldomir who was 162 pounds when they came into the ring which is bigger than Mosley is even at 154. Its the easiest punch to land on Mosley, and the second is the straight right, but I think the first few rounds Floyd will maintain and gage distance with his jab until he finds a home for his right hand. It sounds like Mosley is going to try and employ a similar strategy as to what Oscar did vs Floyd, but with a less dominant jab and more speed. I know Mosley was great at coming forwad as a welterweight, but I remember how hard of a time he had trying to be offensive against Oscar in their second fight, and Oscar doesn't move or box like Floyd does.
All in all I really hope Mayweather wins this and stays in the sport. He will have some good guys to further establish his legacy over the next few years. If Mike JOnes learns to be more authoritative with his jab, if Andre Berto turns that corner, and if Bradley and/or Alexander move up after dominating the 140pound division.
Devon Alexander is a truly special fighter with apparently all of the necessary attributes, and he actually reminds me a lot of a younger Floyd. Just different style.
The scary thing is apparently Devon had a brother who is now in Jail that was significantly better than him.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
Mosley would be a fool to follow Oscar. Oscar kept a nice tight guard for 80% of the fight... I wouldn't be surprised if Floyd's accuracy level were at an all time low... He sure did seem to be hitting a lot of glove earlier in the fight.
Mosley wouldn't know the 1st thing about a tight guard.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jimboogie
Mosley would be a fool to follow Oscar. Oscar kept a nice tight guard for 80% of the fight... I wouldn't be surprised if Floyd's accuracy level were at an all time low... He sure did seem to be hitting a lot of glove earlier in the fight.
Mosley wouldn't know the 1st thing about a tight guard.
Baldomir was bigger than Mosley, but Mosley is stronger. You can't judge anything from the Baldomir fight. Also, Oscar's tight, HIGH guard (like Winky, like Forrest, even Cottos) limits the effectiveness of Mosley's right hand. Against Cotto and Oscar, Mosley was forced to "hook with the hookers." Mayweather defends against the right hand primarily by rolling and slipping. That works great when you are much faster then the other guy and the right hands are coming from the same angle.
When a conventional, high guard fighter jabs, he protects his chin by tucking it into his left shoulder and snaps his left hand back to protect against the right hand counter. If the jab is properly executed, can only be countered with superior speed with a right hand, anticipation and timing of the jab, or slipping and countering. Floyd was able to do this to Oscar because of his speed, timing, and accuracy. Mosley doesn't throw that pin-point, sniper right hand (like Floyd). Floyd had the perfect answer for Oscar's jab.
The up-jab, to the body from from a shell fighter like Mayweather presents opportunities for a fighter with a fast right hand or great jab. Here's the problem with that jab. If you use your jab to take advantage of the opening, Mayweather will counter your counter with a straight, powerful, and accurate right cross. A fighter can land the jab against Mayweather for a few rounds, but eventually, you get countered so much you stop throwing it.
So that leaves the straight right as plan 'B' once Mayweather times your jab and finds his range and starts counter you. Oscar has a decent right hand, but it's not his bread and butter. It has some pop if he lands, but it's pretty standard and predictable and it comes from only one angle. Mayweather could roll it off and counter.
Mosley has a different and stronger right. He can throw his right hand with power from a variety of angles. Mosley can counter the up-jab to the head or body with an overhand right to Floyd's left eye, a short direct straight, or an uppercut. . If you only throw a classic cross, it will be blocked with the shoulder, but a fast right from a higher angle can find a mark. Not a KO blow, but a mark. So will an uppercut. If you start to defend those, the short straight can land. Over the course of rounds, it will take it's toll.
Now the left hook comes into play. Normally, you can't hit Floyd with a a left hook to the head, and he can deflect the right hand with a shoulder roll. If he's getting hit in the left eye with right hands, he will need roll more to his right or start slipping to the left. Rolling more opens you up to a left hook. Slipping opens you up to a different spots, depending on where he shifts his guard.
Mosley is not a bad matchup for Mayweather, but he's more intereting and challenging. IMHO, these fighters are bad matchups for Floyd. Judah was a bad matchup on paper. Pacman is a bad matchup in reality. Historically his nightmares would be Benny Leonard, Ray Robinson, Ray Leonard, Pernell Whitaker, and a prime Duran. Maybe a few others, but those are the ones that come to mind immediately.
If Shane was still training with his father, I wouldn't give him much chance, but if anybody can devise a plan to beat Mayweather and convince Mosley to execute that plan, it's Naseem. Richardson will be able to give him a plan A, B, and C, and for most of Shane's career, he's only had plan A, his usual way of doing things.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
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Originally Posted by
RozzySean
Mosley can counter the up-jab to the head or body with an overhand right to Floyd's left eye
Given Mosley's apparent reach advantage (which surprisingly is very rare against lil' Floyd) I'm hopeful that this is true.
I just don't think it's that simple.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
In my opinion Mosley can box till end of 12 rounds as pre ODLH 1 and 2 even with the late Forest with a decent K.O. From then on from Fernando Vargas till Margarito he's relying on his power thru knock outs.
Well i guess he didnt looked good in Mayorga, boxed by Cotto, could be the age definitely, and can forget Margo he aint definitely known as defensive fighter as well he's slow.
I would give Mosley up to 4-6 rnds with K.O. But Floyd is a different animal had a decent stamina till end. Floyd would box him through out the night.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jimboogie
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RozzySean
Mosley can counter the up-jab to the head or body with an overhand right to Floyd's left eye
Given Mosley's apparent reach advantage (which surprisingly is very rare against lil' Floyd) I'm hopeful that this is true.
I just don't think it's that simple.
I'm not saying it's simple. For Mosley to win, he'll need to more than just land some right hands and swell up Mayweathers eye, but I believe Mosley can land that punch, and it COULD create a some different offensive opportunities for Mosley.
Here's an example. Nate Campbell has a great up-jab and he uses it much like Mayweather does. Against Diaz (slow of foot, not a great right hand, he controlled distance. Funeka was able to land the right on him, but Campbell could control distance with jabs to his skinny body, aka Floyd vs Chico. Against Bradley, quicker, stronger, better right hand, he wasn't able to control distance and he was frustrated.
Re: Is Mosley too old to beat Floyd?
It's not age it's skill. At any age shane has never had the skill set to beat floyd. This will be a boring fight. Shane has speed that is close to floyds other than that.....i said it before. Shane will paw paw paw with the jab throw quick hard wide shots and get countered and potshotted all night. Vernon beat shane, cotto beat shane, mayorga damn near did. If all these guys found a way floyd sure as shit will. Even collazo looked decent against the guy. I'll buy like everyone else...but with low expectations. Floyd by easy decision. How easy is the only question.
